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    Bring4th Bring4th Community Olio The victimization of men

    Thread: The victimization of men


    Aion (Offline)

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    #31
    03-20-2017, 04:55 PM
    (03-20-2017, 04:38 PM)Night Owl Wrote:
    (03-20-2017, 04:34 PM)Aion Wrote: However, there are things I have seen regarding Atlantis which have become part of this all. Most people focus on the technology and the fall of Atlantis as being the great tragedy of that civilization. That is actually only the outcome of the true tragedy which is the subjugation of the Goddess.

    Is this mother earth/gaia you are speaking of? Like using her ressources without consideration until it turns against men?

    Yes that is one side of it, but again is more of a consequence in my eyes. This is hard to explain, it's something that happened because of the veil. The veil didn't cause it, but rather the veil was exploited. There are channels whereby cosmic energies flow from other solar systems to the Earth and these are relay stations for energy from the Central Suns. We are a link in a chain of planetary systems. We receive more masculine dominant energy from some systems and more feminine dominant energy from others. These all play in to the catalyst of the planet and the balance of masculine/feminine polarity within the planetary mind. These energies stream on to the planet through the Ley Line grid, a series of geometrically arranged points of electro-magnetic influx that surround the planet. These 'chakras' of the planet are connected to the Zodiac systems and the other star systems which we are connected to. They can be 'opened' or 'closed', depending on the direction of the spiral, positive or negative.

    The Sons of Belial learned that if you selectively close or open them you can control the tides of planetary consciousness by changing the balance of masculine and feminine influxes coming in to the planet. Aware of this they set out to make masculine energies dominant. The reason being that they felt they could take control of the planet more easily this way, a classic divide and conquer technique. This has, of course, been highly effective. They closed off all the portals that were connected to the Seven Sisters, the Pleiades which is the collective seat of the Confederation of Planets and which had been one of the most important sources of feminine dominant energy for the planet. Meanwhile they empowered the spirals which were connected to masculine dominant star systems. You can see then how the electro-magnetic field was distorted to wash the planet in masculine dominant energies, that of "will" and "wisdom", the things they desired.

    Everything we have seen is an outreach of this act. This is why certain groups control and care so much about specific geographic locations and the reason for the use of black magic in places of power. The struggle for power is truly over this 'web' of the Earth. I am capable of affecting and opening these portals, these gateways, and that is one of my purposes for being here now.
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      • Night Owl
    Night Owl (Offline)

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    #32
    03-20-2017, 04:59 PM
    I think that's basically the reason I felt compelled to substitute with an other word, like something felt wrong about using it in the first place and I didn't know which one to use. Your explanation makes sense to me. Are you okay with just using conflicted as a reflection of fighter or soldier? Or do you find something wrong about their implication of male/female energy?

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #33
    03-20-2017, 05:05 PM
    (03-20-2017, 04:59 PM)Night Owl Wrote: I think that's basically the reason I felt compelled to substitute with an other word, like something felt wrong about using it in the first place and I didn't know which one to use. Your explanation makes sense to me. Are you okay with just using conflicted as a reflection of fighter or soldier? Or do you find something wrong about their implication of male/female energy?

    That would make sense because the purpose of the fighter or soldier is to confront conflict. You might even say that a fighter who resolves their conflicted self becomes a warrior, if that context makes more sense. I would also say on that note that nobody really 'starts' a warrior. Most warriors start as fighters and eventually discover a sense of purpose that transcends merely the urge to engage conflict. Warriorship is something that develops with discipline of the personality.

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    Night Owl (Offline)

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    #34
    03-20-2017, 05:05 PM
    (03-20-2017, 04:55 PM)Aion Wrote: Everything we have seen is an outreach of this act. This is why certain groups control and care so much about specific geographic locations and the reason for the use of black magic in places of power. The struggle for power is truly over this 'web' of the Earth. I am capable of affecting and opening these portals, these gateways, and that is one of my purposes for being here now.

    I suppose Jerusalem to be one of these places?

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #35
    03-20-2017, 05:07 PM
    (03-20-2017, 05:05 PM)Night Owl Wrote:
    (03-20-2017, 04:55 PM)Aion Wrote: Everything we have seen is an outreach of this act. This is why certain groups control and care so much about specific geographic locations and the reason for the use of black magic in places of power. The struggle for power is truly over this 'web' of the Earth. I am capable of affecting and opening these portals, these gateways, and that is one of my purposes for being here now.

    I suppose Jerusalem to be one of these places?

    Yes, this is one of the masculine centers which has been empowered.

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    Night Owl (Offline)

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    #36
    03-20-2017, 05:08 PM
    Are you aware of all of them? I suppose they're all main economic centers.

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #37
    03-20-2017, 05:12 PM (This post was last modified: 03-20-2017, 05:13 PM by Aion.)
    (03-20-2017, 05:08 PM)Night Owl Wrote: Are you aware of all of them? I suppose they're all main economic centers.

    If I spent the time to look I would be, but I am not at that 'phase' yet. Right now I am still developing the skills and abilities necessary to accomplish the work and more importantly, seeking allies. I am aware of the one closest to me and the first which I am to open but the time has not yet come for that. I still need to balance myself more and gain more allies since though I will be a fulcrum of the work, the power will come from many. This is a life-long work that I imagine will take much of my time here to complete.

    You would find that many of the empowered masculine centers have drawn huge cities around them, while the distorted feminine centers are rather farther removed, harder to reach and less likely to be 'stumbled upon'.

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    Spooner (Offline)

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    #38
    03-20-2017, 06:29 PM
    (03-19-2017, 08:37 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: I'm going to zoom out here finally now that I am able to, and express some sincere empathy for the other side of the equation, which is definitely needed. It's in here, I promise, I just haven't expressed it yet.

    Men in our society are victims, too....

    Thank you sincerely for your acknowledgement of mens' pain. It is very rare that I hear women acknowledge it, even women I'm emotionally close to like my mother or significant other. I feel that just as womens' masculinity is threatening to men so too is mens' femininity threatening to women (in general). When I have tried to open up my emotions and pain to women in my life, after they have urgently sought to get me to open up emotionally, my true feelings have most often been met with apathy or even aversion.

    The idea that at my core I could be so hurt, wounded, uncertain and afraid seemed to challenge their preconception of masculinity. They couldn't let me be hurt because then I would not longer someone who could fix their problems and defend them against all the scary abuses of the world. They wanted a champion to stop other men from being abusers. But they didn't want their champion himself to be vulnerable. Maybe they were afraid I'd devolve into an adult baby they'd have to take care of. I'm not sure but it's a sort of catch 22.

    Men need to trust that an assertive woman won't be self indulgent. Women need to trust that a sensitive man can still be selfless.

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #39
    03-20-2017, 06:31 PM (This post was last modified: 03-20-2017, 06:31 PM by Aion.)
    (03-20-2017, 06:29 PM)Spooner Wrote:
    (03-19-2017, 08:37 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: I'm going to zoom out here finally now that I am able to, and express some sincere empathy for the other side of the equation, which is definitely needed. It's in here, I promise, I just haven't expressed it yet.

    Men in our society are victims, too....

    Thank you sincerely for your acknowledgement of mens' pain. It is very rare that I hear women acknowledge it, even women I'm emotionally close to like my mother or significant other. I feel that just as womens' masculinity is threatening to men so too is mens' femininity threatening to women (in general). When I have tried to open up my emotions and pain to women in my life, after they have urgently sought to get me to open up emotionally, my true feelings have most often been met with apathy or even aversion.

    The idea that at my core I could be so hurt, wounded, uncertain and afraid seemed to challenge their preconception of masculinity. They couldn't let me be hurt because then I would not longer someone who could fix their problems and defend them against all the scary abuses of the world. They wanted a champion to stop other men from being abusers. But they didn't want their champion himself to be vulnerable. Maybe they were afraid I'd devolve into an adult baby they'd have to take care of. I'm not sure but it's a sort of catch 22.

    Men need to trust that an assertive woman won't be self indulgent. Women need to trust that a sensitive man can still be selfless.

    This is actually something that happened with my fiance and I. She actually at one point apologized and admitted that she had this 'strong masculine' image that she was always projecting on to me and so any sign of weakness would make her feel threatened and uncomfortable. Once we worked it out and she determined that she wanted to stop holding me to that image there was a lot more peace as I felt less pressure to always be the strong one.

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    Agua del Cielo Away

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    #40
    03-21-2017, 04:30 AM
    (03-20-2017, 06:29 PM)Spooner Wrote: Thank you sincerely for your acknowledgement of mens' pain. It is very rare that I hear women acknowledge it, even women I'm emotionally close to like my mother or significant other. I feel that just as womens' masculinity is threatening to men so too is mens' femininity threatening to women (in general). When I have tried to open up my emotions and pain to women in my life, after they have urgently sought to get me to open up emotionally, my true feelings have most often been met with apathy or even aversion.

    The idea that at my core I could be so hurt, wounded, uncertain and afraid seemed to challenge their preconception of masculinity. They couldn't let me be hurt because then I would not longer someone who could fix their problems and defend them against all the scary abuses of the world. They wanted a champion to stop other men from being abusers. But they didn't want their champion himself to be vulnerable. Maybe they were afraid I'd devolve into an adult baby they'd have to take care of. I'm not sure but it's a sort of catch 22.

    Men need to trust that an assertive woman won't be self indulgent. Women need to trust that a sensitive man can still be selfless.

    I actually think, this is only remotely related to masculine/feminine.
    I also think that quite some of the stuff we relate to masculine/feminine energy are, in my opinion, actually related to relationship mechanisms.
    What i found to be true, is that our partners usually EXACTLY reflect us.
    Let me try to explain, what i mean.

    In intimate relationships people usually share the exact same issues, for example jealousy.
    Now, at the beginning of each relationship there is a Kind of "power struggle", this goes until the "roles" have been set.

    One person takes over the "independant" part, the other one the "dependant" part.
    this seems to indicate some sort of strength on the surface, but thats actually not true.

    The "independant" part does not experience freedom, but a kind "independance" that is actually a dissociation.
    The "independant" one then would be withdrawn a emotionally, feeling less.
    Actually he (or she) lives the dissociative energies of BOTH parts.
    This would then be the Part that is "in control".

    The dependant Part on the other side would live the combined energies of "dependance", this would be the one with more emotions.
    In a way, this is actually the " stronger" part, being willing to experience the combined emotional load.

    In the case of jealousy, the dependant Part would experience the combined jealousy while the other one experiences Little to none.
    The "independant" part has quite some advantages, for example, when you have a partner that feels dependant on you, the Risk to be left is being minimized for the "independant" part.

    In the case Spooner described, i would assume both have a certain fear concerning certain emotions, but at the Same time the desire to feel and Share them.
    One part would mainly feel the wish to share, the other Part would mainly experience difficulties in sharing.
    When you now openly share, the other part will suddenly be confronted with emotions it actually fears Deep down and then also experience the "refusal" Part!


    I think one important reason for many of these issues derive from the way we experienced relationship very early.
    Most often, parents are not really able to offer a real Heart to Heart contact.
    Most of the time there is a "power difference" involved, the parents are in control, their Love has conditions and so on.

    So we never learnt to love and connect on an "equal" basis.

    @nightowl
    In the case of domination or rape, i also think it's not all about masculine/ feminine energies.
    While it surely cannot ne generalized, i would just offer some Potential causes:

    It could well be thats it's more about ones mother.
    Lets say, them mother was not able or willing to give the Love needed and to allow the true connection the Child desired.
    She would have been in a Position of power, withholding her Love.
    This man in question could later in his life, when he has the strength and power, "pay back" so to say and forcefully try to get what he needed as a child and what he needs now as a man.
    It should be considered here that sexuality is not really about just superficially "fucking" but ultimately about deeply connecting energies and fusing them!

    Another reason could be a "twisted sexuality" through sexual abuse. When a child is being abused sexually, there is a mixture of pain and sexual excitement involved combined with a knowing that this is wrong.
    It is impossible for a child to understand and differentiate this. So when this is not being healed, there will always be a totally confusing and uncontrollable mix of emotions.
    This person would most likely associate sex with pain, dominance and violence, unable to seperate this.
    This holds true for women and men, so i think this would also be only remotely related to masculine/ feminine.

    And this would only be two examples.

    To the whole masculine/ feminine discussion i would like to add, we should be aware that we so not actually deal with masculine/ feminine energies here, but much more with theDISTORTED masculine and feminine.
    Both energies have not only to be brought into a State of balance, but each is the deeply wounded version that has to be healed!

    When i experienced the "Divine Masculine" for the First time, i was absolutely , hmm, surprised?
    It was so very different from how i perceived the "masculine" energy before!
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      • Jade, Spooner, Nicholas, Glow
    Night Owl (Offline)

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    #41
    03-21-2017, 05:05 AM
    Well it is true the archetype of divine masculine energy is not to rape indeed. I think all of that happens actually. I was more speaking in terms of tendancy to dominate where maybe rape is kind of a more traumatic thing that brings up lots of pass issues. I would think that anyway most people choose partners in relation to their parents and so there is definitely a link there between their family members and the tensions in their relationsip and the resulting emotional traumas resurfacing.

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    Agua del Cielo Away

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    #42
    03-21-2017, 05:17 AM
    Hmm, i still don't think so.

    I believe that tendency to dominate is a biographical issue, a distortion.
    I don't think there is any tendency to dominate in the Divine Masculine!

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    Night Owl (Offline)

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    #43
    03-21-2017, 05:32 AM (This post was last modified: 03-21-2017, 06:36 AM by Night Owl.)
    That's not what I'm saying though. I said some people tend to associate these things to the male energies, not that they are. What I'm describing with domiance is the way the attraction is expressed as an energy exchange and doesn't conflict the actual reason they are distorted in the first place in my view. I mean any negative and distorted or any positive and balanced relationship between the two energies start off by attraction at the core, and the way they are displayed is subject to so many external factors we could make a list and make a book about it, there's likely many of them already. That becomes a situational thing where each has his/her own personal version of their exchange, and like you said there is indeed an emotional relation to parents that is tied to it.

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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #44
    03-21-2017, 08:10 AM
    (03-20-2017, 04:34 PM)Aion Wrote: Thus it is strongly suggested to me that masculine and feminine are 'more primal' distortions than the Archetypes, however, what we see is that these things actually only emerge in second-density.

    Dear OIC, is not masculine/feminine the very core of every duality?

    Be it male/female, light/dark, STO/STS, positive/negative (poles of a magnet or electricity), outer reality/self, plenum/void, crown/root and so on. It's the entire mechanic of any dance that extends into infinity which is very well expressed by the Yin and Yang symbol.

    I guess the names can be interchangeable to describe poles of a duality but I think masculine/feminine carries well the essence of it all, whatever dimension of beingness is dualized.

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    Agua del Cielo Away

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    #45
    03-21-2017, 09:36 AM
    I hope this doesnt offend you, at least this is not my Intention!

    I think there is a certain danger in generalizing or abstractizing in these topics.
    While These are certainly deep spiritual truths one should consider that until fully realized and LIVED these truths are only intellectual constructs and not the truth actually.

    In that lies a danger to use it als a means of dissociation, of disconnecting from the actual experience and taking a perspective of indifference!

    For example:
    "Are we not all the creator?"
    While this is the deeper truth and also a helpful perspective, in the reality of at least my life it is nothing more than an intellectual construct and very far from the experienced truth.

    my life is not a series of godhead-experiences every time i meet a human being, i am definitely not experiencing intelligent infinity when i meet another person or when i deal with myself.
    And i guess this holds true for the vast majority of people on this planet.

    Not even Q'uo experiences other-selves as self, they "know" it is the truth and believe in it, but they don't actually experience it!

    When we re dealing with our biographical and emotional challenges, we actually deal with the "personaiity shell" or the portion of us that is NOT the creator.
    And i believe that is the level on which we have to heal and resolve this.
    The "creator" in us surely has no problems!

    to give a more recent example,the "feminism" thread:
    I highly doubt that smc, glow or jade perceived it as dance of energies, although this would ne the deepest underlying truth.

    There is a danger to use this perspective as a means of dissociation, to withdraw to a Place of indifference where there is no longer a Need or Even the possibility to Deal with the emotions involved, in my opinion.
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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #46
    03-21-2017, 10:17 AM
    I guess it is relative. The Ra material offers exercises to embody the Creator within the self which I do not believe are without purpose but simply gain purpose in relation to a strong eough seeking that will pierce through the barriers of one's veil. It's like literally all there to connect to, for one who sincerely whises as such.

    I think if you are truly able to feel within the dance I described, then it is quite powerful and colorful and contains the power to transmute any sense of separation into a sense of unity. You perceive everything in relation and never so much as separate.
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      • Agua del Cielo
    Agua del Cielo Away

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    #47
    03-21-2017, 10:41 AM
    Ah, Thank you for elaborating, i think i do understand better now!

    I agree, this is a useful approach or practice, indeed.
    A trans-personal view, so to say.

    The tricky question would then always be however:

    Did i transcend the "personal plane" or did i dissociate it?

    Or in other words, there should be no "problem" with dealing with the stuff, emotions, problems when one truly looks from a transpersonal point of view.

    What i mean is a "combined" approach, dealing fully with what arises in the personality in the moment while staying connected to that Sense of unity as much als possible.
    Otherwise i would really view it as dissociation.

    Struggling with english here a little, i hope its understandable what i mean...

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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #48
    03-21-2017, 11:35 AM (This post was last modified: 03-21-2017, 12:20 PM by Minyatur.)
    Well love/wisdom wisdom/love is a work of balance that remains even in 6D. To me they find balance when wisdom is what is felt and are unbalanced when what is known and what is felt is not in harmony.

    You know that all is One, yet you don't feel that all is One.
    You know that all is Unity, yet you don't feel like anything is much united.
    You know that others are you, yet you feel them as separate of your being.
    You know there is no polarity, yet you feel stuck within its duality.
    Etc.

    Pondering the mechanics of existence and of unity is where I find my highest passionate drive, so I'd have a hard time seeing it as dissociating when it does more of opening my emotional body to passion when I've always been somewhat dispassionate in my life. I see this leaning as strongly programmed though and not really how I would identify soul-wise, more like the parameters of this particular incarnation for distilling the kind of essence I want to manifest in this world through my life as a temporary measure I desired to grow up through. The main factors the messed up my energitical body are two accidents I had as a child from falling from a height where I messed up the lower portion of my vertebral column in the red and orange ray area, the first was just hitting too hard the lower area whereas the second one I feel on a piece of metal that hit my vertebral column, it made me grow in a somewhat weird posture that is off. I went from a over-energitic chaotic Gemini storm which probably was strongly disliked by many many people to a person with a really really energitically still inner flow over the years progressively, I still get mind blown somewhen at how intense that went, its like I entertained a lifeless body with no inner presence yet I still never got much sick despite tons of unhealthy habits. Guess even a weak presence still had strenght somehow.

    Now since like a few months I've been working on this somewhat daily but I find it quite hard to undo the red ray area physical disalignment. When I first opened my green ray in a psychedlic trip, I found a strong desire for a break (which this life is to me) which made me feel guilt toward my brothers and sisters lost in sorrow. I also found a very strong desire to be understood in why I needed this break and that its purpose is to emerge greater in my desire to be positive. Anyway I don't doubt I will transcend all these limitations whilst incaranted, a temporary measure they are like I said. I'm so used to a still inner state which is like a constant slight positive state, that I usually have quite some resistance to trigger willingly state changes although I do adapt very well to them and usually always find the experience positive. I also seem to have programmed little catalyst to trigger the opening and my incarnational plan instead seem built on an opening through conscious will and effort to work through the programmed layers of resistance that I set between myself and a purely open state.

    I guess all of this does bring the question that if I am good at distilling energy, does this give me a responsability to do the most I can? Or would this be somewhat of a paradox to impose such a responsability upon my being, whereas to let it flow naturally toward that end could perhaps bring out greater positive results? I seem to lean toward the later, to find peace for myself first and to then extend this peace rather than acting out of not finding peace within to radiate this lack of peace outwardly. Another interesting aspect is that I found this life to be a cummulation of desires from past lives where I did bleed myself out in service.

    I tend to think that what I wish for others I should wish for myself and I do not wish for others to torture themselves in a sense of duty but rather that they may experience, if it is what is desired, a most natural flow toward service.

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #49
    03-21-2017, 01:45 PM
    (03-21-2017, 08:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote:
    (03-20-2017, 04:34 PM)Aion Wrote: Thus it is strongly suggested to me that masculine and feminine are 'more primal' distortions than the Archetypes, however, what we see is that these things actually only emerge in second-density.

    Dear OIC, is not masculine/feminine the very core of every duality?

    Be it male/female, light/dark, STO/STS, positive/negative (poles of a magnet or electricity), outer reality/self, plenum/void, crown/root and so on. It's the entire mechanic of any dance that extends into infinity which is very well expressed by the Yin and Yang symbol.

    I guess the names can be interchangeable to describe poles of a duality but I think masculine/feminine carries well the essence of it all, whatever dimension of beingness is dualized.

    No, I don't think so, I think 'duality' is an Archetypal concept of which there are myriad manifestations. So, sure, you can say that, but as you say there are tons of words for it and they don't all intimate the same thing by their connotations. A more primal duality such as was developed in the previous octave would be 'The Mover and the Moved' which is I think more fundamental than 'masculine/feminine' conceptually.
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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #50
    03-21-2017, 01:54 PM (This post was last modified: 03-21-2017, 01:58 PM by Minyatur.)
    (03-21-2017, 01:45 PM)Aion Wrote:
    (03-21-2017, 08:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote:
    (03-20-2017, 04:34 PM)Aion Wrote: Thus it is strongly suggested to me that masculine and feminine are 'more primal' distortions than the Archetypes, however, what we see is that these things actually only emerge in second-density.

    Dear OIC, is not masculine/feminine the very core of every duality?

    Be it male/female, light/dark, STO/STS, positive/negative (poles of a magnet or electricity), outer reality/self, plenum/void, crown/root and so on. It's the entire mechanic of any dance that extends into infinity which is very well expressed by the Yin and Yang symbol.

    I guess the names can be interchangeable to describe poles of a duality but I think masculine/feminine carries well the essence of it all, whatever dimension of beingness is dualized.

    No, I don't think so, I think 'duality' is an Archetypal concept of which there are myriad manifestations. So, sure, you can say that, but as you say there are tons of words for it and they don't all intimate the same thing by their connotations. A more primal duality such as was developed in the previous octave would be 'The Mover and the Moved' which is I think more fundamental than 'masculine/feminine' conceptually.

    What I meant is that any dualistic principle emulates the same principle upon different dimensions of beingness.

    Mover does seem a whole lot like the male principle and moved the female principle within the duality. But I do get the common term of masculine/feminine speaks of a lower particular dimension of beingness yet I think any and every duality still emulates a core principle which could be termed as male/female as every duality expresses a separated yet joint relationship of yin and yang whatever the dimension is.

    I guess its more like a matter of semantics and each will resonate more with a different angle of perception of the same principles. It's like not the nature of these things are rooted in words to begin with.

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #51
    03-21-2017, 02:00 PM (This post was last modified: 03-21-2017, 02:00 PM by Aion.)
    (03-21-2017, 01:54 PM)Minyatur Wrote:
    (03-21-2017, 01:45 PM)Aion Wrote:
    (03-21-2017, 08:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote:
    (03-20-2017, 04:34 PM)Aion Wrote: Thus it is strongly suggested to me that masculine and feminine are 'more primal' distortions than the Archetypes, however, what we see is that these things actually only emerge in second-density.

    Dear OIC, is not masculine/feminine the very core of every duality?

    Be it male/female, light/dark, STO/STS, positive/negative (poles of a magnet or electricity), outer reality/self, plenum/void, crown/root and so on. It's the entire mechanic of any dance that extends into infinity which is very well expressed by the Yin and Yang symbol.

    I guess the names can be interchangeable to describe poles of a duality but I think masculine/feminine carries well the essence of it all, whatever dimension of beingness is dualized.

    No, I don't think so, I think 'duality' is an Archetypal concept of which there are myriad manifestations. So, sure, you can say that, but as you say there are tons of words for it and they don't all intimate the same thing by their connotations. A more primal duality such as was developed in the previous octave would be 'The Mover and the Moved' which is I think more fundamental than 'masculine/feminine' conceptually.

    What I meant is that any dualistic principle emulates the same principle upon different dimensions of beingness.

    Mover does seem a whole lot like the male principle and moved the female principle within the duality. But I do get the common term of masculine/feminine speaks of a lower particular dimension of beingness yet I think any and every duality still emulates a core principle which could be termed as male/female as every duality expresses a separated yet joint relationship of yin and yang whatever the dimension is.

    I think you're missing my point. "Duality" IS the principle. The concepts which may be examined within it are its manifestations. You can call the two sides of the duality whatever you want and use as your base definition whatever fundamental concept you wish, but the principle is of duality itself. All dualities will be naturally alike because they all partake of the principle of duality. What you are talking about are descriptions which are an attempt to describe the dualistic relationship that exists as the principle.

    As you say, the descriptions are unique to each in what will aid in understanding the principle.

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    Minyatur (Offline)

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    #52
    03-21-2017, 02:10 PM
    (03-21-2017, 02:00 PM)Aion Wrote: I think you're missing my point. "Duality" IS the principle. The concepts which may be examined within it are its manifestations. You can call the two sides of the duality whatever you want and use as your base definition whatever fundamental concept you wish, but the principle is of duality itself. All dualities will be naturally alike because they all partake of the principle of duality. What you are talking about are descriptions which are an attempt to describe the dualistic relationship that exists as the principle.

    As you say, the descriptions are unique to each in what will aid in understanding the principle.

    Well how would you define the poles of the core principle if not that way.

    I seem to have perceived male and female are used to define dualities well beyond just the masculine and femine energies we've been discussing in both the Ra material and outside the Ra material. Its been used to describe conscious and unconscious, greater sub-Logoi and lesser sub-Logoi, electrical charges, Yin and Yang and much more.

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    Aion (Offline)

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    #53
    03-21-2017, 02:20 PM (This post was last modified: 03-21-2017, 02:55 PM by Aion.)
    (03-21-2017, 02:10 PM)Minyatur Wrote:
    (03-21-2017, 02:00 PM)Aion Wrote: I think you're missing my point. "Duality" IS the principle. The concepts which may be examined within it are its manifestations. You can call the two sides of the duality whatever you want and use as your base definition whatever fundamental concept you wish, but the principle is of duality itself. All dualities will be naturally alike because they all partake of the principle of duality. What you are talking about are descriptions which are an attempt to describe the dualistic relationship that exists as the principle.

    As you say, the descriptions are unique to each in what will aid in understanding the principle.

    Well how would you define the poles of the core principle if not that way.

    I seem to have perceived male and female are used to define dualities well beyond just the masculine and femine energies we've been discussing in both the Ra material and outside the Ra material. Its been used to describe conscious and unconscious, greater sub-Logoi and lesser sub-Logoi, electrical charges, Yin and Yang and much more.

    I wouldn't say they define dualities but only describe them. I use a very simple concept of "push and pull" as my fundamental concept, kind of magnetic I suppose. However, ultimately for me the principle is that of the qualities of numbers. Duality is the principle of the number two which is the fundamental archetypal concept. What makes male/female a useful description is due to the degree of dynamic that is possible to describe with it, I'm not saying it's not a useful description or tool for teaching, but the tool for teaching should not be confused with the principle concept itself.

    By that token you could say that all those things have been used to described male/female, all dualities describing other dualities. However, in and of themselves none of those concepts are the principle of Duality itself but rather are encompassed by it in principle.

    Well, I will agree that in a way you can consider all of these things to also be duality itself 'in essence', since manifestations are not entirely separate from their spurring principles and so in a fractal sort of way we could say that any of these dualities can be and is 'Duality' in some expression. Just as your hand is still you while being a distinct thing in and of itself. I guess the reason I arrange it the way I do in my head is because I do believe that numbers are somewhat more abstract than words, despite being two parts of the same thing, a duality if you will. As such, I view the creative processes as a concretization of the abstract and so everything begins with abstract qualitative numbers and then is formulated in to a more concrete 'word' or image as such. Kind of like atoms forming molecules and so on.

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    Spooner (Offline)

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    #54
    03-21-2017, 02:44 PM
    I just wanted to thank Agua del Cielo for sharing their thoughts. I found them precise and helpful.
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      • Aion, Agua del Cielo
    smc (Offline)

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    #55
    03-23-2017, 06:48 AM
    Quote:Be Worried About Boys, Especially Baby Boys
    Allan Schore discusses the harmful effects of stressing baby boys.
    Posted Jan 08, 2017


    We often hear that boys need to be toughened up so as not to be sissies. Parent toughness toward babies is celebrated as “not spoiling the baby.” Wrong! These ideas are based on a misunderstanding of how babies develop. Instead, babies rely on tender, responsive care to grow well—with self-control, social skills and concern for others.

    A review of empirical research just came out by Allan N. Schore, called “All our sons: The developmental neurobiology and neuroendocrinology of boys at risk.”

    This thorough review shows why we should be worried about how we treat boys early in their lives. Here are a few highlights:

    Why does early life experience influence boys significantly more than girls?

    Boys mature slower physically, socially and linguistically.
    Stress-regulating brain circuitries mature slower in boys prenatally, perinatally and postnatally.
    Boys are affected more negatively by early environmental stress, inside and outside the womb, than are girls. Girls have more built-in mechanisms that foster resiliency against stress.

    How are boys affected more than girls?

    Boys are more vulnerable to maternal stress and depression in the womb, birth trauma (e.g., separation from mother), and unresponsive caregiving (caregiving that leaves them in distress). These comprise attachment trauma and significantly impact right brain hemisphere development—which develops more rapidly in early life than the left brain hemisphere. The right hemisphere normally establishes self-regulatory brain circuitry related to self control and sociality.
    Normal term newborn boys react differently to neonatal behavior assessment, showing higher cortisol levels (a mobilizing hormone indicating stress) afterward than girls.
    At six months, boys show more frustration than girls do. At 12 months boys show a greater reaction to negative stimuli.
    Schore cites the research of Tronick, who concluded that “Boys . . . are more demanding social partners, have more difficult times regulating their affective states, and may need more of their mothers support to help them regulate affect. This increased demandingness would affect the infant boys’ interactive partner” (p. 4).

    What can we conclude from the data?

    Boys are more vulnerable to neuropsychiatric disorders that appear developmentally (girls more vulnerable to disorders that appear later). These include autism, early onset schizophrenia, ADHD, and conduct disorders. These have been increasing in recent decades (interestingly, as more babies have been put into daycare settings, nearly all of which provide inadequate care for babies; National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, Early Child Care Research Network, 2003).

    Schore states, “in light of the male infant’s slower brain maturation, the secure mother’s attachment-regulating function as a sensitively responsive, interactive affect regulator of his immature right brain in the first year is essential to optimal male socioemotional development.” (p. 14)

    "In total, the preceding pages of this work suggest that differences between the sexes in brain wiring patterns that account for gender differences in social and emotional functions are established at the very beginning of life; that the developmental programming of these differences is more than genetically coded, but epigenetically shaped by the early social and physical environment; and that the adult male and female brains represent an adaptive complementarity for optimal human function." (p. 26)

    What does inappropriate care look like in the first years of life?

    “In marked contrast to this growth-facilitating attachment scenario, in a relational growth-inhibiting postnatal environment, less than optimal maternal sensitivity, responsiveness, and regulation are associated with insecure attachments. In the most detrimental growth-inhibiting relational context of maltreatment and attachment trauma (abuse and/or neglect), the primary caregiver of an insecure disorganized–disoriented infant induces traumatic states of enduring negative affect in the child (A.N. Schore, 2001b, 2003b). As a result, dysregulated allostatic processes produce excessive wear and tear on the developing brain, severe apoptotic parcellation of subcortical–cortical stress circuits, and long-term detrimental health consequences (McEwen & Gianaros, 2011). Relational trauma in early critical periods of brain development thus imprints a permanent physiological reactivity of the right brain, alters the corticolimbic connectivity into the HPA, and generates a susceptibility to later disorders of affect regulation expressed in a deficit in coping with future socioemotional stressors. Earlier, I described that slow-maturing male brains are particularly vulnerable to this most dysregulated attachment typology, which is expressed in severe deficits in social and emotional functions.” (p. 13)

    What does appropriate care look like in the brain?

    “In an optimal developmental scenario, the evolutionary attachment mechanism, maturing during a period of right-brain growth, thus allows epigenetic factors in the social environment to impact genomic and hormonal mechanisms at both the subcortical and then cortical brain levels. By the end of the first year and into the second, higher centers in the right orbitofrontal and ventromedial cortices begin to forge mutual synaptic connections with the lower subcortical centers, including the arousal systems in the midbrain and brain stem and the HPA axis, thereby allowing for more complex strategies of affect regulation, especially during moments of interpersonal stress. That said, as I noted in 1994, the right orbitofrontal cortex, the attachment control system, functionally matures according to different timetables in females and males, and thus, differentiation and growth stabilizes earlier in females than in males (A.N. Schore, 1994). In either case, optimal attachment scenarios allow for the development of a right-lateralized system of efficient activation and feedback inhibition of the HPA axis and autonomic arousal, essential components for optimal coping abilities.” (p. 13)

    NOTE: Here is a recent article explaining attachment.

    Practical implications for parents, professionals and policy makers:

    1. Realize that boys need more, not less, care than girls.

    2. Review all hospital birth practices. The Baby-Friendly Hospital Initiative is a start but not enough. According to a recent review of the research, there is lot of epigenetic and other effects going on at birth.

    Separation of mom and baby at birth is harmful for all babies but Schore points out how much more harm it does to boys:

    “Exposing newborn male . . . to separation stress causes an acute strong increase of cortisol and can therefore be regarded as a severe stressor” (Kunzler, Braun, & Bock, 2015, p. 862). Repeated separation results in hyperactive behavior, and “changes . . . prefrontal-limbic pathways, i.e. regions that are dysfunctional in a variety of mental disorders” (p. 862).

    3. Provide responsive care. Mothers, fathers and other caregivers should avoid any extensive distress in the child—“enduring negative affect.” Instead of the normalized harsh treatment of males ("to make them men") by letting them cry as babies and then telling them not to cry as boys, by withholding affection and other practices to “toughen them up,” young boys should be treated in the opposite way: with tenderness and respect for their needs for cuddling and kindness.

    Note that preterm boys are less able to spontaneously interact with caregivers and so need particularly sensitive care as their neurobiological development proceeds.

    4. Provide paid parental leave. For parents to provide responsive care, they need the time, focus and energy. This means a move to paid maternal and paternal leave for at least a year, the time when babies are most vulnerable. Sweden has other family-friendly policies that make it easier for parents to be responsive.

    5. One other thing I did not address that Schore does is the effects of environmental toxins. Young boys are more negatively affected by environmental toxins that also disrupt the brain’s right hemisphere development (e.g., plastics like BpA, bis-phenol-A). Schore agrees with Lamphear’s (2015) proposal that the ongoing “rise in developmental disabilities is associated with environmental toxins on the developing brain.” This suggests we should be much more cautious about putting toxic chemicals into our air, soil and water. That is a topic for another blog post.

    Conclusion

    Of course, we should not just worry about boys but take action for all babies. We need to provide nurturing care for all children. All children expect and need, for proper development, the evolved nest, a baseline for early care which provides the nurturing, stress-reducing care that fosters optimal brain development. My lab studies the Evolved Nest and finds it related to all the positive child outcomes we have studied.

    NOTE: Readers have raised questions about circumcision. The USA dataset reviewed by Dr. Schore did not include information about circumcision, so there is no way to know whether some of the findings might be due to the trauma of circumcision, which is still widespread in the USA. Read more about the psychological effects of circumcision here.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/mor...-baby-boys

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    smc (Offline)

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    #56
    03-23-2017, 07:28 AM
    Additional comments (caveat) to the above article:


    The imbalance of patriarchy has created a volatile damaging environment for all humans - and pregnant women and new mothers in particular. How the mother (and father) behave towards their infants and children is vitally important - and how a father treats the mother is essential in regard to how she will feel as a mother, as a woman, as the main person tasked with the immediate care and feeding of a new life. Whether she feels safe and supported or not will impact on the quality of her biology, breast milk, energy levels, responsiveness, sleep patterns, calmness (or otherwise)....

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    Billy (Offline)

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    #57
    03-23-2017, 08:02 AM
    (03-23-2017, 07:28 AM)SMC Wrote: Additional comments (caveat) to the above article:


    The imbalance of patriarchy has created a volatile damaging environment for all humans - and pregnant women and new mothers in particular. How the mother (and father) behave towards their infants and children is vitally important - and how a father treats the mother is essential in regard to how she will feel as a mother, as a woman, as the main person tasked with the immediate care and feeding of a new life. Whether she feels safe and supported or not will impact on the quality of her biology, breast milk, energy levels, responsiveness, sleep patterns, calmness (or otherwise)....

    I was speaking about this earlier today with my Mother.  Parenting can't be so compartmentalized where one parent is responsible for being the bread winner and the other raising the children almost exclusively.  That is very much how it was in my household and of course in many others, if not most.  It really does need to be a team effort where both parents are there for their children, physically and emotionally.  Closeness in body and closeness in heart.  Of course there will be one parent who spends more time away from the home, but for the sake of the stability and strength of the family unit and each individual member, partaking in all the different aspects of raising children, I think is vitally important for both parents.  You know, helping each other out.  I think as we move closer towards 4d, we will see big changes in the way we raise our children.  I think in fact that will be one of the main focuses, if not the main focus, in early 4d.  Raising children with love and grace.  They deserve it.
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      • Agua del Cielo, smc, sunnysideup
    smc (Offline)

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    #58
    03-23-2017, 10:26 AM
    (03-23-2017, 08:02 AM)Billy Wrote:
    (03-23-2017, 07:28 AM)SMC Wrote: Additional comments (caveat) to the above article:


    The imbalance of patriarchy has created a volatile damaging environment for all humans - and pregnant women and new mothers in particular. How the mother (and father) behave towards their infants and children is vitally important - and how a father treats the mother is essential in regard to how she will feel as a mother, as a woman, as the main person tasked with the immediate care and feeding of a new life. Whether she feels safe and supported or not will impact on the quality of her biology, breast milk, energy levels, responsiveness, sleep patterns, calmness (or otherwise)....

    I was speaking about this earlier today with my Mother.  Parenting can't be so compartmentalized where one parent is responsible for being the bread winner and the other raising the children almost exclusively.  That is very much how it was in my household and of course in many others, if not most.  It really does need to be a team effort where both parents are there for their children, physically and emotionally.  Closeness in body and closeness in heart.  Of course there will be one parent who spends more time away from the home, but for the sake of the stability and strength of the family unit and each individual member, partaking in all the different aspects of raising children, I think is vitally important for both parents.  You know, helping each other out.  I think as we move closer towards 4d, we will see big changes in the way we raise our children.  I think in fact that will be one of the main focuses, if not the main focus, in early 4d.  Raising children with love and grace.  They deserve it.

    I really agree with you.

    I'm referring to the overall relationship of the 2 people - then - the emotional environment during her 9 months of pregnancy, then her support during labour and the months soon after birth... if a woman is being stressed by a partner (or worse)... she will potentially mother very poorly....re a 'team effort' for the first few months.... unless a newborn is bottle fed - the mother link/proximity is very physically close... but yes it's vital for a father to be involved from the very beginning also - he should be helping in every way possible... what works best will be different for each couple - some men (legacy of patriarchy) avoid being home or are confused what to do when at home after a newborn arrives...
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    Spooner (Offline)

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    #59
    03-23-2017, 12:26 PM
    In light of the special sensitivity of infant boy brains to trauma, circumcision is an especially damaging practice.
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      • Agua del Cielo, Billy, rva_jeremy, zhaich
    Dekalb_Blues (Offline)

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    #60
    03-25-2017, 02:50 AM (This post was last modified: 03-25-2017, 10:17 PM by Dekalb_Blues.)
    (03-20-2017, 04:03 AM)isis Wrote: http://www.realsexism.com/



    [Image: mrw-female-genital-mutilation-is-in-the-news-199979.jpg]

    Just another bit of prankish mischief from the Orion group's exploitation, many moons ago, of Yahweh's initial lack of PR skills. Excruciatingly painful and degrading mutilation (with short-term trauma shock and long-term sensory deprivation leading to debilitating cortical change) allied with ancient elitist pseudo-religious (and more modern pseudoscientific) terroristic peer-pressure group rituals for mass control through culture-subversion. Par for the Crusader course.
    http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?q=y...0&l=30&o=r

    [Image: burningbush.gif] ... Say what?! Do which... to what?!?!

    [Image: tumblr_inline_mlacqiA0WI1qz4rgp.gif]

    http://www.hasofer.com/page.pl?p=mohel-supplies





    http://www.cirp.org/library/psych/immerman2/

    http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/horrif...u-s-n66226
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      • Nicholas
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