The victimization of men

[Jade]

I'm going to zoom out here finally now that I am able to, and express some sincere empathy for the other side of the equation, which is definitely needed. It's in here, I promise, I just haven't expressed it yet.

Men in our society are victims, too. Very much so. Within hours of birth, most men have experienced and many men still do experience genital mutilation. This is not something that we talk about ever, at all, and a huge problem. Why do we do this? It is so obviously beyond traumatic to a newborn child that I can't even fathom. I have definitely seen much more public outcry about this act being performed in indigenous cultures and towards women than I have about addressing it happening all day every day still in modern societies. It's barbaric, period, and I'm so sorry that so often one of your very first experiences upon entering this planetary sphere was extreme physical trauma to your red ray.  

The second instance where men are brutally traumatized by society is when they are around the age where the earliest memories start to form, soon after you began to develop the ability to rationalize. Some other self, who doesn't want to deal with whatever trauma or pain you are experiencing, tells you, upon your experiencing trauma, that "boys don't cry". I can't imagine the shock that this causes you as a small, little, exposed darling angel baby. So full of life and desire to experience things, and you are forced to shut down the connection to the way your body reacts to events to the way your mind reacts towards events. This is dissociative trauma. I am so sorry.

From then on, you are given other subtle and not so subtle cues from media, your elders, and your peers, that showing feminine traits in yourself was subjecting yourself to ridicule. Getting called "pussy" as a taunt, reminding you that having a vagina is a weakness, or "fag", reminding you that it's not just good enough to be a man, but you have to be a specific kind of man.

What kind of man? Well, advertising will tell you over and over in all sorts of confusing ways. Certainly, you must be the kind of man who can afford to buy frivolous things to impress flighty females. She will only talk to you if you use this hygiene product. She will only want to date you if you have a fancy enough car. She will only want to have sex with you if you look like (insert hot a-list celebrity from your peer group). What products does HE buy??

We have to go to our b-s public education system which is just a machine to feed the extremely profitable higher education machine, the prison-industrial complex, and to make drones willing to work 40+ hours a week of their whole lives as a corporate wage slave, to bosses who make salaries who multiply their own. Two days a week to call your own out of seven. And heaven forbid if you want to pursue some type of career that is artistic - you must always have a back up plan, a real job, just in case you fail!

I am heavily biased towards viewing this in an archetypical manner. I see all of these things, from the first removal of the hood of the genitals, as ways that men are forced by society to place their subconscious, their maiden, their feminine side, in a state of subjugation. First goes the "hood", the High Priestess' only protection. Next, the emotions - the way she communicates to you through the body. Next, any identity with feminine traits is discouraged, and then artistic expression is shunned for more "productive" means of contributing to society.

I believe it's possible that a lot of us here were more or less immune to a lot of these things in a lot of ways, or at least today can look back and see how ridiculous all of this was. I know I must have had some kind of immunity to the abuse I experienced in my childhood because I know it's not normal to come out of a situation like that the way I did. But we can't deny the way this affects the whole social memory complex of Earth, and therefore how it affects us as citizens of Earth. And when the seeming way of dealing with it is to say, "Go away! I don't want to look at it!" we revert all the way back to the act of telling you not to cry when you're hurt. We revert all the way back to when we mutilate you at birth to conform you to an acceptable standard.

But the reason I keep pushing the Q'uo channeling is because one thing Q'uo said is that as physically incarnated beings in polarized genders, we are meant to embody and reflect the ideas of gender polarity in the group consciousness. This is why when I see the repression of the feminine by the will of the masculine, it is triggering. It triggers a recognition of something that still needs to be healed, a barb that needs removed from a limb, so that the festering infection from lack of attention can finally heal and go away. This is why I felt the call more to empathize with the pain of the High Priestess, told to go away because no one wants to look at her or hear what she has to say, that none of it has value. This is a deeply rooted pain, it redounds beyond the personal egos of confused feminists. It redounds to all of us.

I feel I have watched this experience through the eyes of my husband, watching him reclaim his relationship with his High Priestess. When I met him, he was full of machismo and had committed many pretty heinous acts over the course of his teens and early twenties. He quit drinking right when we meant and had a major shift but it there was a more profound shift that occurred. He got injured. He had chronic pain for over 3 years that prevented him from riding in a car, sitting in a chair, basically anything. It was awful. He was also subjected to horrible abuse and torment from my father because he was forced into a position where his wife had to take care of him. It wasn't fair. He started pursuing his true talent (writing) and has been somewhat successful, and through all of this, he has had to learn how to accept parts of himself, weaknesses and judgements that he had against himself. He's also always been much more emotional than me, and accepting and understanding his emotions (and mine) has been a big part of this journey, too. Before, he would just drink until he blacked out so he wouldn't have to deal with his emotional outbursts (though everyone else would).

I know, as part of conditioning, it's hard for men to look at themselves as victims. That's partly why the voice of earth_spirit is valuable - it does bring attention to the trauma that has occurred to subjugate men. It's occurred to subjugate all of us. If we can look honestly at these things, see them, feel them without judging ourselves, and then, through that process, are able to transmute it into acceptance, that is when we are able to truly work in consciousness with this catalyst.

One thing I think is also important for women to recognize is that, while we have also been forced to repress our masculine side (as well as our feminine sides, but more so the masculine side) for millennia, in recent times, we have been able to gain a voice - to recover a piece of our masculine identity and will. I mean, it wasn't but 70 years ago that it was still almost unheard of for a woman to have a job of her own. It's still very fresh, but now that the momentum has started, there isn't any going back to where we were.

Men, though, haven't had the same kind of "revolution" of "reclaiming their feminine". I think this is the genesis of a lot of the pain in males in our society, and why women are viewed as no longer being repressed. What does that even look like, though? For women, reclaiming the masculine is obvious - marches, protests, speeches, gaining new/equal rights - these are tangible things that manifest, the masculine. Reclaiming the feminine, the hidden, is a much more subtle prospect.

I think one of the first steps of reclaiming the feminine might look like acknowledging that the oppression exists and has existed for a long time and is bigger than all of us.

I think then enacting a strict regiment of love, compassion, acceptance, and forgiveness for the self, in all the ways you have been personally victimized by our society, or as a repercussion of the effects of our society.

I think another step might be trying to understand/feel the emotions that women feel about this situation, even if you have no proof of any of their claims.

I guess that's how I feel and why I have been reacting the way I do. What I feel perpetuates the problem (repression of the feminine) is active repression of the feminine - even seemingly innocuous posts like Nick's original OP still feed into the narrative of repressing the feminine. Why can't we let the feminine speak up for once? I know it may seem like she's been yelling at you for a long time, but maybe that's because she has yet to feel truly heard and understood. Maybe the catalyst is symbolic, I guess, is what I'm trying to boil it down to, so maybe let's try to look at it from that angle.

I love you all, thank you all for working on this with me. I'm sorry for the awful things we all have experienced, incarnated on this planet. Let's talk about them. It's not weak. It's awareness.

[Night Owl]

Reading your post, I had this image where a a male repressing a woman is actually trying to repress himself (the feminine side) within. The external appearance of the external woman is the actual symbolism. It must be so the other way around too. Maybe women who try to voice their masculine side is kind of hurting the repressed feminine side inside all men who still haven't looked at this issue. It has potential for many misunderstandings as the external appearance may make this look like it's male vs female while in fact it's in an internal battle for each repressed side to come out to the light. And it hurts. This social environnement is a real mess.

[isis]

"You have great power...It can be wasted by an entity’s dislike of his shadow side. It can be forgotten as an entity identifies itself as a victim. And it can be turned, as the Star War movies often say, to the dark side by fear." -Q'uo




"You are not a victim. You are an entity observing the sweep of a tremendous storm that is moving through your emotions and your chakras." -Q'uo




"You must refrain from seeing the self as victim, and, instead, see the self as student, student of life itself." -Q'uo

[Jade]

Yes, it is very true that victimization can be turned "to the dark side".  But if people are in pain, which they seem to me obviously to be here, then we should be able to talk about it. That's all I'm saying. There is a balance to be found. There has been a lot of pain expressed, unconsciously, so let's talk about it, and bring it to consciousness, so that we are able to rise above the victimhood, together. Maybe telling people that they aren't a victim, that they are a student, works on some occasions. Sometimes stuff like this helps "snap people out of it". Other times people just need to express their pain, and be heard. Giving other people that space to express themselves is also a great service, a service to those who are unable to instantly clear their chakras and rise above victimhood in moments of great pain.

There are a lot of third density entities on this planet left who are not going to graduate. Some of these entities will never be able to rise above victimization while incarnated on this planet. They need a voice, too. I mean, imagine going into a trauma survivor's therapy meeting and saying to someone, "You are not a victim. You are an entity observing the sweep of a tremendous storm that is moving through your emotions and your chakras." That's not going to cut it for most people. If it were that easy to heal, I think we would have been able to ascend into fourth density long ago.

And just as when your own difficulties and your own traumas are given the opportunity to be expressed, to be felt, to be loved, you can find also that those that have entered the general admixture of energies which constitute your social matrix can find themselves also healed, and sometimes in a rather abrupt way. To be sure, not always is the healing so sudden, and it can be the case that one layer of trauma merely conceals another, and another yet again, so that you have maybe worked assiduously in order to make progress only to discover that the progress that you have made opens the door to much more progress still in need of being made, and you can find yourself utterly overwhelmed at that moment of first recognition.

Then, my friends, it is sometimes well to step back and to admit to yourself that you cannot do everything all at once, that you cannot heal all difficult energies, all troubled emotions, all traumatic fragments of personality that seem to be so utterly dis-integrated. Each here is a work in progress. Each here has volunteered to take on, shall we say, a certain portion of the processing of the planetary energies.

This will not be work that is done in a day—this is work that you have undertaken with some degree of ambition.

http://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/is..._0402.aspx

[earth_spirit]

-----

[Aion]

This is a unique issue for me. I feel I am not so troubled by a repression of my natural feminine energy, as I was raised by my Mom and have a high degree of respect for the feminine elements. Rather, more frustrating for me through my life has been the acceptance of my masculine aspects which have always felt and been presented by many around me as 'tainted' and often an effort to 'diffused' a certain tenacity I tend to have.

I like to fight. I don't get in to fights, only one ever and I chose not to fight, but I love martial arts, the arts of war and mastery of strategy. I don't like these things turned towards innocence, they are meant for individuals who desire to use them.

War is Hell, I am not interested in War to wage it. However I am interested in the martial development and self-defense. In this way, I am forced to engage the concepts of War. I came from War, before this life and in many other lives I have bathed deep in blood, both my own and those whom I struggled against. My earliest memories in this life were of combat in other places and on other worlds. Those memories seem closer than the experiences of my body as a child.

I have always seen myself as a warrior, it is in my blood but when I became a teenager and was being introduced to the warrior I encountered this very strong message that this was wrong. That warriors were unacceptable and violent and the only way to be a good person is to be peaceable in all ways. Instead I acted out in ways which made me arrogant and essentially uninterested in learning from others. All that energy for combat had to move somehow and so I put it in to my ego.

Then I had my psychedelic breakthroughs and suddenly I was 'militantly' peaceful. I was so in to my 'oneness' spirit states that I pretty much couldn't empathize with regular people, I was totally out of touch with consensus reality. I believed a total pacifism to life essentially was the same as surrendering to it. Slowly I was growing a demon within me, the masculine energy that had been so repressed and unbalanced was fighting back and urging me towards suicide, which had begun with deep depression years earlier.

I was heavily involved with the metal community at that time which was my way of balancing my aggression within with a pacifism outside since I am more in to doom and downtempo metal as well as epic things. However, it was eating my up inside and I was literally starting to go inside with the energy trying to release. Eventually I hit rock bottom. My Dad pulled me out.

I spent about three months in a totally lethargic, isolated state. I didn't know what else to do with myself until I discovered this Awakening the Illuminated Heart workshop which is based on Drunvalo Melchizedek's work, the Flower of Life. There I learned some things but most importantly I met my Reiki Master who took me under her wing for three months and taught me everything she knew. I did so much healing in that time. I cried and scream in ways I never would have permitted myself before, but I also learned to honour my masculine and the warrior within me.

One of the ways it was repressed was particularly in my sexuality. I have always been rather Roman, being very proper on the outside while having a rather intense sexual fascination on the inside, most particularly because it has been a difficult experience to have in my life. There is a reason my masculine was repressed there and why that became the crux of my self-consciousness. I am gonna tell you one of my 'darkest' secrets. It is one of the things I am most ashamed of. I later realized that it had been influenced by the vile boyfriend my Mom was with at the time but all the same.

When I was about 11 years old I was hanging out at my elementary school for some reason after school, pretty much everyone was gone. I was going through puberty at the time and I was just discovering sexuality in a more defined way (I would even kiss dolls as a toddler, I had a 'girlfriend' in Grade 2 and we kissed, I like girls and I rsrely, rarely admit that) and had some exposure to porn since the internet was a thing. I always felted dejected because I, due to my upbringing, always felt that girls would never like me because of my own self-perceived strangeness. Not only that, I couldn't fathom how to approach girls because I was told to respect them, but not how to be a boy since my parents split when I was 6 and was mostly with my Mom. Plus my Dad was an alcoholic then and wasn't really tenable as a teacher. So I had some bad examples and one day as I was saying I was there after school and I saw a young girl around my age across the field and I don't even remember registering that she was cute but suddenly I was overwhelmed by this mental image whereby I essentially took dominance over her. This horrified me and honestly still does. This single moment has done so much to shape my mental landscape because it was at that moment I realized I couldn't trust my own mind. It wasn't always a good thing.

I never felt any impulse to follow through with it, it was more of a vision but it disturbed me to the core. If I was capable of such a horrendous act even in thought then I could be capable of anything. That's when I became obsessed with morbidity and wanted to know everything about it so that when it aroused within me I could counter it or stamp it out. This is where the warrior in me became frozen because it saw me as the enemy and so I turned on myself and started to systematically destroy my personality.

At first I didn't realize that's what was happening but now I realize that I slowly began to reject everything that I felt made me, me. I wasn't good. I was evil. My masculinity was evil and needed to be destroyed by the warrior within me which always appeared as Bast, a female warrior and guardian. It was always the female that was the warrior and protector and the man who was the corrupted beast. In that I thought I needed the femine to subdue and master the masculine, to put it under its thumb so that it could not act out inappropriately.

The truth is that these things all played out in my life, in my relationships. I have never been abusive, but I have had moments of gross ignorance and at times indecency. It took me a long time to begin to divest both male and female of the biases I had so thoroughly put in to them. It's funny now to think that as I was destroying my personality I was also breaking down the illusions which had held me for so long.

After a lot of work I have slowly reshaped the images within my mind that represent the relationship between the masculine and the feminine. They get along much better now and usually work together, although the masculine is still quite shy to come out in any show of force. Even when I am doing my best to be peaceable I still get people saying I come across aggressive. What I am learning is that I don't have to feel guilty for that. I don't have to be more soft, gentle and feminine in order to 'be a good man' because the qualities which define goodness transcend personality. I may be a little pushy and rough around the edges at times but my interest is always towards positivity, even when I'm embracing negativity. It's all about balance for me and well, I still have some big imbalances to work out, but I've made some progress.

Realizing that I don't have to give up my love of Kung Fu, martial arts and war strategy in order to be compassionate and empathetic was a first step to accepting both the masculine and feminine within me. I like fighting for fun and for sport, there are healthy (mutually consenting individuals engaging in sport) ways to exercise these energies as well as use them for self-defense and protection.

However, what I am learning is that softness, gentleness and subtly are also essential to the arts I am attracted to and so having finally achieved some measure of inner peace I am attempting to learn a bit more gentility in my interactions. Sometimes I go too far and end up being disconnected and aloof, but usually because I am trying to balance out my own sometimes judgemental intensity. There is a time and a place for each things. Some things require firmness and others require a soft touch.

There are many tools in the toolbox of life and I think many of our distortions are like not understanding how to use the tools so we use them poorly and in weird ways. Once we begin to figure what the tool is used for we begin to learn to use it more proficiently. This is like the balance between masculine and feminine I think. Hard to imagine anybody just starting off with that balance down.

[smc]

Though I've protected myself from the stress of engaging in an argument with you about your ideas; I wish the very best for you, earth_spirit.

(NB: If this ^ is an irritating, unbelievable and/or unwelcome thing for me to say to you; I offer (in advance) acceptance of that reaction.)

[Agua del Cielo]

I like to view this whole subject in a differentiated way, considering different parts differently!

I think it's useful to Look at the different layers:

On a social level, there are certain qualities a man is "supposed" to have. he should be strong, in control, fearless and so on, unaffected by those "wimpy emotions" and a rather controlled thinker.
Thats the way it has been for centuries and it is deeply engrained in our collective subconsciousness.
Men are still being raised in these "values".
Although i never felt obliged to followed that maxime, i still realize sometimes, that i still have this in me, deep down.

It is not necessarily that men are denied emotions, but only certain emotions are "allowed":
anger, aggression, hate are perfectly fine for a man.
Helplessness, sadness, affection are "forbidden"

I think one just has to be aware that this makes it hard to discover early experiences where one was helpless for example.

Another difficulty is that paradigms are shifting, the "old"way of being a man is not accepted anymore, the "new" way is not yet accepted.
There arme not yet enough "role models" available, so wie have to figure it out ourselves.
I guess this is especially hard for Boys and men who do not yet Trust inner guidance.
On the other hand, it gives a lot of freedom, since there is no "set" way at the moment, i am free to explore.
Personally, my family didnt give a s*** about me. While this left me with much to heal, it had one big advantage:
I always could live and develop just the way i wanted, much freedom


As for the victim side, i think considering the various layers is very important!

When im dealing with the Little boy in me, i have to carefully watch where he is at.
Is he in a helpless State, being hurt and victimized?
Then it's important to acknowledge this. Just be with it.
You wouldnt want to tell a baby that just has been raped or whatever "come on, get up, youre not a victim", that would be highly dissociative!
When the emotions of the victimized boy or child have subsided however, it is important to claim back responsability and NOT staying stuck in a victim identity.

I think the same is true if youre being discriminated for example. Lets say youre black,transsexual and live in a highly oppressive society.
When youre facing the emotions that arise from discrimination, you should acknowledge it.
But you wouldnt want to built an identity around it!

I am white, Male, had a horrible past and so on, but this is not what i am.
I am an ageless, timeless being without gender, and i should not forget about that!


Concerning childhood and those vicious cycles of hurt, violence and abuse.
Usually mothers can do Most good and Most bad, a fathers role is not Even comparable.
For nine months the body as well as the consciousness is intimately connected, this is beyond our imagination!!
Then after birth due that connection, the mother plays the Most important role.
This is an enourmous challenge and tesponsability. And much harm can be done.

I guess anybody who has children knows what i mean.

Now, considering our parents ( Mine for sure) have also been traumatized (and did not heal), it is obvious that this will lead to more trauma.
And Most likely there parents were also traumatized...and so on.

So, do i pass this on?
I have been treated horribly, is it not understandable that i become a horrible father?

Who will stop this? Who will Break this cycle?
It is me! I will fucking stop that s***!
If i dont do it, how can i expect anyone to so it?
I am here to heal, heal myself and so heal the world!

And i am not alone! I have this beautiful Family here, People who went through the same, People that will listen, understand and help and are on the same mission!

[Night Owl]

@Aion: Some of the things you said resonate on my side. You're not alone bro. And you're not crazy. Maybe just too damn dense for this world.

@Agua: I'll just say the exact same.

[smc]

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

[smc]

nb: I think the word "victimization" is always problematic - but 'survivor of (xyz)' doesn't quite work either...

[Aion]

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

Okay. Not exactly what I meant, but whatever works for you.

[Aion]

@Aion: Some of the things you said resonate on my side. You're not alone bro. And you're not crazy. Maybe just too damn dense for this world.

@Agua: I'll just say the exact same.

Not sure if you mean dense in consciousness or dense of skull but suppose either could apply.

[Agua del Cielo]

@Aion

Thank you for sharing this
I can really relate to that!

I hate a deep hate for my father when i was young. My mother had a deep hate for men, i believe she actually loved me, but hated me for being a man ( since men have done horrible things to her).

When i was between 10 and 11 and started to become a man physically, i had a severe accident that destroyed a testicle (very painful). I dissociated it, three Hours later i had completely forgotten that this ever happened.
Many years later the memory came back (around mid thirty). Upon investigating this irealized i had dont this on purpose, since the "combined hate" in myself and the system surrounding me for the masculine climaxed in trying to prevent myself from becoming a man through this accident :/

[Night Owl]

dense in consciousness of course haha

[isis]

http://www.realsexism.com/

[Aion]

@Aion

Thank you for sharing this
I can really relate to that!

I hate a deep hate for my father when i was young. My mother had a deep hate for men, i believe she actually loved me, but hated me for being a man ( since men have done horrible things to her).

When i was between 10 and 11 and started to become a man physically, i had a severe accident that destroyed a testicle (very painful). I dissociated it, three Hours later i had completely forgotten that this ever happened.
Many years later the memory came back (around mid thirty). Upon investigating this irealized i had dont this on purpose, since the "combined hate" in myself and the system surrounding me for the masculine climaxed in trying to prevent myself from becoming a man through this accident :/

The only thing I've ever hated is myself and 'everything', all or nothing I suppose. I can't hate people or anything really, I hate circumstances sometimes, and I am increasingly growing to hate physical pain. When I was younger I had a condition with my manhood (slight phimosis) which resulted in tearing one of the first times I had sex. Its like my body has been built to cause me physical trauma and in some ways though I see the utility behind it all in my spirit. I am a clever spirit at times, perhaps too much for my own liking. It has shaped much of this life.

I was lucky my Mom was always of the attitude that if she raised us right we would be good men. I'd say we are all quite decent individuals as far as it goes but my older brother who spent more time with our Dad definitely has more of a regular masculine leaning than my younger brother and I, but we're all pretty big kittens.

[Aion]

dense in consciousness of course haha

It is my interest and interaction and intent throughout this life to 'decompress' the density of my consciousness, for that is what it is to manifest yourself. I am manifesting all the pain I have held within my being over all my lives right now but not forever. Once I heal it will be a new manifestation, one which the world will see.

[smc]

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

Okay. Not exactly what I meant, but whatever works for you.

lol-

I identify as balanced female/male since birth

was in reply to:

There are many tools in the toolbox of life and I think many of our distortions are like not understanding how to use the tools so we use them poorly and in weird ways. Once we begin to figure what the tool is used for we begin to learn to use it more proficiently. This is like the balance between masculine and feminine I think. Hard to imagine anybody just starting off with that balance down.

.

[Aion]

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

Okay. Not exactly what I meant, but whatever works for you.

lol-

I identify as balanced female/male since birth

 was in reply to:

There are many tools in the toolbox of life and I think many of our distortions are like not understanding how to use the tools so we use them poorly and in weird ways. Once we begin to figure what the tool is used for we begin to learn to use it more proficiently. This is like the balance between masculine and feminine I think. Hard to imagine anybody just starting off with that balance down.

.

I know it was and that still wasn't what I meant. I'm not talking about masculine and feminine gender roles but the dynamic energies that give rise to life. No, I don't believe anybody has this 'down' at birth, even someone who identifies equally 'male/female', that isn't the same thing. It's an ongoing process for all beings, dynamic and fluid, not static. If you believe you are perfectly balanced being from birth, well that's your own identity to work with. I don't believe it.

Further, if I'm being completely honest, the fact that out of the entirety of my post which was admittedly deeply personal and emotional you chose to focus on that one element and make it about yourself gives me the impression you don't really care to listen to what I was actually sharing and instead just found where you could make a 'counter-point', which doesn't make me feel particularly 'engaged' while contemplating my traumas. Instead it makes me want to be short with you because I don't feel listened to, so why say anything at that point?

Sorry if that seems like a 'cold shoulder' but that's just how I felt.

[Jade]

Here is another really good Q'uo I stumbled upon about the balancing of masculine and feminine principles at the cultural level: http://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/is..._1121.aspx

Thank you for sharing, Aion, about your experience with the distortion of the masculine principal. I think as long as we can keep moving the conversation towards the archetypical view, we can move past blaming each other/the opposite sex for these problems, and instead, see the much larger and more profound act that is currently unfolding. I think it's a valiant effort for us to make to learn to recognize and reconcile the imbalance and the distortions of the masculine/feminine that we have internalized, so that we can then project a healthier balance forward into the group consciousness.

[smc]

Aion - you're right - it was a fairly trivial response to such a personal and complex sharing... I've always been hindered by caution and trust issues re B4 and it was a brainless moment created by feeling relief that it seemed some warmth was happening amongst people...
there's so much I could reply to your post - perhaps after I've had some sleep...
sincere apologies

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

Okay. Not exactly what I meant, but whatever works for you.

lol-

I identify as balanced female/male since birth

 was in reply to:

There are many tools in the toolbox of life and I think many of our distortions are like not understanding how to use the tools so we use them poorly and in weird ways. Once we begin to figure what the tool is used for we begin to learn to use it more proficiently. This is like the balance between masculine and feminine I think. Hard to imagine anybody just starting off with that balance down.

.

I know it was and that still wasn't what I meant. I'm not talking about masculine and feminine gender roles but the dynamic energies that give rise to life. No, I don't believe anybody has this 'down' at birth, even someone who identifies equally 'male/female', that isn't the same thing. It's an ongoing process for all beings, dynamic and fluid, not static. If you believe you are perfectly balanced being from birth, well that's your own identity to work with. I don't believe it.

Further, if I'm being completely honest, the fact that out of the entirety of my post which was admittedly deeply personal and emotional you chose to focus on that one element and make it about yourself gives me the impression you don't really care to listen to what I was actually sharing and instead just found where you could make a 'counter-point', which doesn't make me feel particularly 'engaged' while contemplating my traumas. Instead it makes me want to be short with you because I don't feel listened to, so why say anything at that point?

Sorry if that seems like a 'cold shoulder' but that's just how I felt.

[isis]

Even when I am doing my best to be peaceable I still get people saying I come across aggressive. What I am learning is that I don't have to feel guilty for that. I don't have to be more soft, gentle and feminine in order to 'be a good man' because the qualities which define goodness transcend personality. I may be a little pushy and rough around the edges at times but my interest is always towards positivity, even when I'm embracing negativity.

beautiful

[APeacefulWarrior]

What kind of man? Well, advertising will tell you over and over in all sorts of confusing ways. Certainly, you must be the kind of man who can afford to buy frivolous things to impress flighty females. She will only talk to you if you use this hygiene product. She will only want to date you if you have a fancy enough car. She will only want to have sex with you if you look like (insert hot a-list celebrity from your peer group). What products does HE buy??

Interestingly, Marshall McLuhan spotted this all the way back in the 1950s. One of his earliest books, "The Mechanical Bride," is basically a series of short essays analyzing\deconstructing elements of pop culture - particularly advertising - and the unhealthy gender roles and stereotypes they were creating. At the time, he was dismissed (or just ignored) because no one wanted to believe some adverts were causing societal-wide shifts, but in retrospect, the book is depressingly accurate in a lot of its observations. At one point he even directly says that he sees men in the future becoming "infantilized" and emotionally stunted due to superficial consumerism gone out of control.

Although at least in my own view, that didn't really happen until the 1970s-80s. Even through the 1960s, a "man's man" was one who still had a wide range of interests, appreciated the arts, could express his emotions, etc. But then by the mid-80s, suddenly a "real man" was basically a one-dimensional stereotype in the vein of He-Man or Rambo. Or that infamous book "Real Men Don't Each Quiche" which actually attempted to classify foods as being manly or not, and usually based on the most spurious of reasons. (Does it have French in the name? Then it's not manly.)

Either way, I feel like man-kind, so to speak, has really never recovered from that period. There are still millions out there who honestly think that a real man is basically just a lunkhead brute who's proud of his ignorance and reliance on violence.

[Aion]

Aion - you're right - it was a fairly trivial response to such a personal and complex sharing... I've always been hindered by caution and trust issues re B4 and it was a brainless moment created by feeling relief that it seemed some warmth was happening amongst people...
there's so much I could reply to your post - perhaps after I've had some sleep...
sincere apologies

...

Aion - I identify as balanced female/male since birth - I can happily wear make up (or not), wear dresses, cuddle animals, buy flowers, play pool in Biker pubs, learn Aikido, Tai Chi, Wing Chun Kung Fu, wear mens clothing, be listening, soothing, be passive, be assertive - I'm feminine and masculine in the one Self - and I feel really comfortable about it

..

Okay. Not exactly what I meant, but whatever works for you.

lol-

I identify as balanced female/male since birth

 was in reply to:

There are many tools in the toolbox of life and I think many of our distortions are like not understanding how to use the tools so we use them poorly and in weird ways. Once we begin to figure what the tool is used for we begin to learn to use it more proficiently. This is like the balance between masculine and feminine I think. Hard to imagine anybody just starting off with that balance down.

.

I know it was and that still wasn't what I meant. I'm not talking about masculine and feminine gender roles but the dynamic energies that give rise to life. No, I don't believe anybody has this 'down' at birth, even someone who identifies equally 'male/female', that isn't the same thing. It's an ongoing process for all beings, dynamic and fluid, not static. If you believe you are perfectly balanced being from birth, well that's your own identity to work with. I don't believe it.

Further, if I'm being completely honest, the fact that out of the entirety of my post which was admittedly deeply personal and emotional you chose to focus on that one element and make it about yourself gives me the impression you don't really care to listen to what I was actually sharing and instead just found where you could make a 'counter-point', which doesn't make me feel particularly 'engaged' while contemplating my traumas. Instead it makes me want to be short with you because I don't feel listened to, so why say anything at that point?

Sorry if that seems like a 'cold shoulder' but that's just how I felt.

No worries, I understand, I don't hold it against you I just wanted to be up front about what I was feeling. It's not that there was anything with your response in and of itself, I just happened to be in a vulnerable state and it rubbed me the wrong way, which is also partly my responsibility. This is a heavy issue for me because I have always been a 'turn the other cheek' kind of person and learning to express my feelings even when they're not good is an ongoing experience for me. I appreciate your consideration in retrospect.

I am certainly open to share warmth, and indeed my sharing was intended to open up that avenue of vulnerability, but in there I admit there is also some sensitivity as I still often have negative feelings towards myself.

[Night Owl]

I think part of this victimization thing has also a root in that we only deal with the external while in fact, the external is a reflection of the internal. So when we think any X situation where a man or a woman experience a catalistic experience, it is easy to blame on external, pretend like it's not part of us. For exemple when a woman is raped, all blame goes to the man, and indeed the man has done a very bad action. But there is strong symbolism here in that I really think most men who are accused of being dominating are actually very dominated inside. There is a side of the feminine energy that is very cruel. It is a bit like a blackhole where it attracts endlessly. The man is in fact enslaved by the attraction of the woman who sees her beauty as something very bening while in fact it is destructive and a bit like torture to be enslaved that way and some men do not find any other way to express to the woman, what she's doing to him on the inside. And that's true both ways. I think on the external we see men as creatures of violence and war, dominance, force, all these ideas are attributed to them. But in fact I don't know(personally) any men competitive enough, or having desires strong enough to even compete with the desires of a woman. The stereotypes where girls who are friends can turn against each other for the attraction of a male for exemple, even though is only a stereotype, has deep root in the archetypal feminine energy. I do think on the inside, the warrior is actually the feminine energy.


Just to be clear I'm not speaking of ''women in general'' but about the feminine energy itself and that clears a lot of misconceptions as indeed, the balance between the two energies kind of makes that a lot less extreme and more relative. I think inside most men is actually the reflection of the beautiful women they are attracted to. There is within a beautiful flower, innocent and pure. I think one of the basic principle of the male energy is that it simply wants to please, and that reflects itself on the woman that the man is attracted to. This reflection thing makes very hard to dissociate which part of the energy belongs to who. And for that reason it is important to see any interaction between two individiuals as a single entity, like they are both eyes of a same face, one more logical, analytic, rational, radiant and the other more emotional, subconscious driven and absorbing. And this relationship can be turned upside down infinitely, it's not always the man who embodies the man description and not always the female who embodies the female description while on the external they all seem to just fit the description if we want to look at them on the first degree.

[Night Owl]

Might I also point out just in case the word warrior is triggering that it could as well may just be substituted by ''conflicted''. I found the word warrior fitting for an archetypal context but it may be easier to see this as more of an inner conflict. We both have that but it appears to me like the male energy experience more like short burst of inner conflict which could be the inner female energy resurfacing while the female energy seems to have some kind of constant conflict between reflecting the male's desire to please and her own desire to be pleased. And there's no denying that must be one hell of a catalyst as well. It can really spread throughout both energies as men do reflect the desire to be pleased as well. This is some hardcore work to dissociate the two energies when they conflict in real time.

[Aion]

Here is another really good Q'uo I stumbled upon about the balancing of masculine and feminine principles at the cultural level: http://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/is..._1121.aspx

Thank you for sharing, Aion, about your experience with the distortion of the masculine principal. I think as long as we can keep moving the conversation towards the archetypical view, we can move past blaming each other/the opposite sex for these problems, and instead, see the much larger and more profound act that is currently unfolding. I think it's a valiant effort for us to make to learn to recognize and reconcile the imbalance and the distortions of the masculine/feminine that we have internalized, so that we can then project a healthier balance forward into the group consciousness.

Well, I would say it is a distortion of both masculine and feminine principle, they are not in balance with eachother. My feminine is not very capable of being gentle because it has taken on so many masculine traits. In short, I think that there is no way you can have a distortion in one and not in the other. They are a unified duality and they are defining of eachother, so I think that if there is imbalance in one, there is imbalance in the other, because the 'ground' state is them being in balance together. This is why I honestly don't really believe someone can be balanced in one and not the other. Either your masculine and feminine are in balance together (not static balance, but dynamic, meaning they work as a unit rather than against eachother), or they are out of balance due to distortion. If one is skewed it skews the other. Again, I don't mean in terms of gender role identities, but in terms of the passive and active modes of energy itself and the way it expresses itself through interactions. Each balance as such is unique, so I don't think there is a set manner of identity which can be applied to it.

It is true that socially there are many impressions regarding what is an 'proper' man or woman and this consensus can colour many things. I think this is why it can be good to look more at abstracts, but it's challenging. For example, in the archetypes of the Tree of Life and Kabbalah there are masculine and feminine attributions to the Sephiroth. They designate Binah (Understanding) as feminine and Chokhmah (Wisdom) as masculine. Of course they acknowledge that both have both but that certain archetypes are more dominant one way or the other. Notably, Ra also makes this assessment of the Tarot and that certain cards have masculine and feminine attributions. Thus it is strongly suggested to me that masculine and feminine are 'more primal' distortions than the Archetypes, however, what we see is that these things actually only emerge in second-density.

30.9 Questioner: Now, in second density the concept of bisexual reproduction first originates. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct.

30.10 Questioner: Can you tell me the philosophy behind this mechanism of propagation of the bodily complex?

Ra: I am Ra. The second density is one in which the groundwork is being laid for third-density work. In this way it may be seen that the basic mechanisms of reproduction capitulate into a vast potential in third density for service to other-self and to self; this being not only by the functions of energy transfer but also [by] the various services performed due to the close contact of those who are, shall we say, magnetically attracted, one to the other; these entities thus having the opportunities for many types of service which would be unavailable to the independent entity.

30.11 Questioner: Was the basic reason, the original reason for this then to increase opportunity for experience of the One Creator? Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is not merely correct but is the key to that which occurs in all densities.

This was already established in humans according to Ra since we had been second-density apes which were then modified. This means that we carried the ancestral data and awareness of ourselves as bisexual through the primate form and that the roots of our consciousness are tied to that collective, as our 'racial memory' as Ra might put it.

31.9 Questioner: Why does density of population create these confusions?

Ra: I am Ra. The bisexual reproductive urge has as its goal, not only the simple reproductive function, but more especially the desire to serve others being awakened by this activity.

In an over-crowded situation where each mind/body/spirit complex is under a constant bombardment from other-selves it is understandable that those who are especially sensitive would not feel the desire to be of service to other-selves. This also would increase the probability of a lack of desire or a blockage of the red-ray reproductive energy.

In an uncrowded atmosphere this same entity would, through the stimulus of feeling the solitude about it, then have much more desire to seek out someone to whom it may be of service thus regularizing the sexual reproductive function.

We have also had the consciousness of the Maldekians added to our collective consciousness, whom Ra described as quite 'bellicose'. This means that we have not just been working on our own planet's karma per se, but we are also resolving all the issues developed on Maldek. So, there is a lot of trauma spread across our planet.

However, there are things I have seen regarding Atlantis which have become part of this all. Most people focus on the technology and the fall of Atlantis as being the great tragedy of that civilization. That is actually only the outcome of the true tragedy which is the subjugation of the Goddess.

[Night Owl]

However, there are things I have seen regarding Atlantis which have become part of this all. Most people focus on the technology and the fall of Atlantis as being the great tragedy of that civilization. That is actually only the outcome of the true tragedy which is the subjugation of the Goddess.

Is this mother earth/gaia you are speaking of? Like using her ressources without consideration until it turns against men?

[Aion]

Might I also point out just in case the word warrior is triggering that it could as well may just be substituted by ''conflicted''. I found the word warrior fitting for an archetypal context but it may be easier to see this as more of an inner conflict. We both have that but it appears to me like the male energy experience more like short burst of inner conflict which could be the inner female energy resurfacing while the female energy seems to have some kind of constant conflict between reflecting the male's desire to please and her own desire to be pleased. And there's no denying that must be one hell of a catalyst as well. It can really spread throughout both energies as men do reflect the desire to be pleased as well. This is some hardcore work to dissociate the two energies when they conflict in real time.

That's not really how I view the Warrior archetype. A strong warrior is at peace with themselves and does not wage war. Strength not being about brawn, but about wisdom. The Warrior doesn't just represent conflict or that of defense or struggle, but rather represents an attitude towards life and the way one chooses to interact. A warrior is meant to be honourable, honest and to uphold the highest principles. This is different from a 'fighter' or a 'soldier'. Now of course, historically these things haven't been differentiated much, but I think that one can have the attitude of a warrior without necessarily being a fighter. It is, to me, more about standing in your own strength. This is a balanced Warrior archetype in my mind. I suppose I would call the imbalanced one the 'fighter' and the 'soldier', those who engage warriorship only for its superficial values of the exercise of power.