Wisdom Run Amok
04-18-2018, 04:24 PM,
#31
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
What an interesting thread, Peregrine, thank you so much.

I so concur with Louisabell, and the many times I have read so many different threads and felt so moved and not saying it out loud, though I tend to click 'like' easily.

I wonder Peregrine if the conversation doesn't veer more to the wisdom just because love is so much an immediate known concept that it is harder to debate it in depth, even though both are linked f course and their balance. By the way I have loved your comments and this thread in particular.
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04-18-2018, 05:41 PM,
#32
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-18-2018, 04:24 PM)flofrog Wrote:  What an interesting thread, Peregrine, thank you so much.

I so concur with Louisabell, and the many times I have read so many different threads and felt so moved and not saying it out loud,  though I tend to click 'like' easily.  

I wonder Peregrine if the conversation doesn't veer more to the wisdom just because love is so much an immediate known concept that it is harder to debate it in depth, even though both are linked f course and  their balance. By the way I have  loved your comments and this thread in particular.

i think thats another good point. How do you have a discussion without getting into the mechanics of it? I guess i have to see an example of what peregrine wants to talk about.

When i watch my wife participating in her forums, everything is about gossip. Gossip doesnt interest me much.
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04-18-2018, 08:52 PM,
#33
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-18-2018, 07:01 AM)Sprout Wrote:  
(04-18-2018, 06:35 AM)MangusKhan Wrote:  
(04-18-2018, 05:46 AM)Sprout Wrote:  And on a side note, I think we are all here because we simply do not want to be alone.  Undecided

I don't know about you, but I'm totally 100% emotionally satisfied by my pigeons and heroin addicts, and the idea that I would come to a spiritual forum on the internet in order to curb some kind of loneliness distortion is just preposterous.   Big Grin  Dodgy

I may have not put it in the right order, I've always had problems expressing myself. I understand what you mean by, I think, loving and serving your space/time reality and feeling satisfied by it.
But in my opinion, here is where you can be most comfortable being with people alike. Where you can share your favorite songs, your dreams, synchronicities, and have an opportunity to open your heart without being judged. The outside world is waiting for us to serve and see it's beauty, and in some parts it's even ready for this spiritual connection that we are all having..but not in most parts, not yet. And so one might feel lonely, and is it that wrong to see all these teach learning's to be of a social loving nature? Aren't we merely brothers and sisters? Is there anything else but to be friends and help one another?

(04-18-2018, 12:21 PM)Diana Wrote:  
(04-18-2018, 06:35 AM)MangusKhan Wrote:  
(04-18-2018, 05:46 AM)Sprout Wrote:  And on a side note, I think we are all here because we simply do not want to be alone.  Undecided

I don't know about you, but I'm totally 100% emotionally satisfied by my pigeons and heroin addicts, and the idea that I would come to a spiritual forum on the internet in order to curb some kind of loneliness distortion is just preposterous.   Big Grin  Dodgy

Perhaps you don't come here for that reason, MangusKhan, and neither do I, but some people might and it's not preposterous for them to seek community. I think you mentioned you come from wealth somewhere. If that means you can go home anytime back into physical comfort and have choices, then, I would think it's a bit easier to say you don't get lonely. Maybe that's not the case, and if not, then it's great the way you accept and thrive in whatever circumstances you're in.

I like your sense of adventure.  Smile

This world can feel like a lonely place, since it's based on separation and polarities. As Louisabell pointed out:

"I think it takes a certain emotional courage to face head-on the uncomfortable criticisms of others, even suspending one's own biases for a moment to see the world from their point of view and to respond to them where they are at." 

For some, who feel a heavy burden functioning in this world, I encourage (en courage). I like to think that when leaving this life, wherever I go, I will give a high-five, laughing with glee, to some companion on the other side" because I stuck it out and completed what I came here do.

I guess the self-satiric tone I intended in that post wasn't wholly apparent... I'm amazed how wise and accepting these responses are regardless. Absolutely this is a place where someone who feels like a misfit can come and feel understood and accepted. I don't think that's preposterous at all.

(04-18-2018, 12:38 PM)johncarson698 Wrote:  I'm not sure what you mean by alone. If you mean "alone in discussion", then yes, i'm here because noone else wants to talk to me about this stuff lol

This is very real though. It's one thing to have friends, and another to have friends who you can talk about 6th-density eternal soul-bonding with.
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04-18-2018, 09:31 PM,
#34
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-18-2018, 08:52 PM)MangusKhan Wrote:  
(04-18-2018, 12:38 PM)johncarson698 Wrote:  I'm not sure what you mean by alone.  If you mean "alone in discussion", then yes, i'm here because noone else wants to talk to me about this stuff lol

This is very real though. It's one thing to have friends, and another to have friends who you can talk about 6th-density eternal soul-bonding with.

Hahaha yeah im around too many "ordinary" people. I was chatting with this guy once, and i told his that telepathy was the universal language - he about just laughed at me.
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MangusKhan
04-19-2018, 02:41 AM,
#35
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Sometimes catalyst just grabs you in an undertow and sweeps you beneath the surface so that keeping up normal activities becomes difficult.  My mother's first cousin's impending death has been having that effect on me for the past week or more, and that's my excuse for being largely AWOL from this conversation.  (I, uh, haven't had time to look into that Bump thing either.)

I must say, though, I have very much enjoyed reading people's thoughts revolving around these related topics.  It's been a well rounded chat, to be sure.  Some time soon I hope to try to split apart some of these strands and try to isolate some of what I consider the more interesting material, especially concerning, what does it mean to balance love and wisdom?

One quick note I'll throw out along those lines is the following.  To be heavily active in the fifth and maybe sixth chakra without having much going on in the fourth sounds a lot like Ra's description of an sts profile.  Now I am NOT--repeat: NOT--saying that those with this profile are necessarily sts.  What I am trying to say, from personal experience, is that being formatted that way can lead one to casually acting in a more sts manner if one is not paying attention.  For instance, if you're looking mainly at behavior patterns with someone, say, it can be easy to overlook that person's suffering in favor of your concern with the shape of the patterns as abstract things of interest.  In other words, your babbling could be actually accentuating another's suffering because your fondness for the abstract is overlooking their more basic needs for support.**

Okay, that's a clumsy, long-winded way of saying that one element of balancing w & l may have something to do with the degree of heart activation in proportion to the upper energy centers.  There's a lot to be unpacked and scrutinized in just that assertion alone, and I hope to do more of that with you as time goes on.


**PS:  I do recognize that only worrying about another's person's basic needs and not paying attention to the larger patterns can create its own set of problems.  But I don't see why this business of taking one position to an extreme and counter-posing the opposite extreme in order to discredit the first survives around here as such a common logical device.  Either example in extreme is unbalanced, and one imbalance neither justifies nor negates another if your intended goal is Truth, not mere rhetorical conquest.  (Heh heh, I guess I'm ranting again.)

 
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04-19-2018, 12:05 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-19-2018, 12:06 PM by rva_jeremy.)
#36
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Assertion: wisdom is transmitted in the "what" of the forum post, but love is transmitted in the "how" of the forum post. Wisdom is the information communicated, whereas love is the way that communication draws both parties together and brings out the best in them as unique entities. Since the latter is, as flofrog said, a matter of the immediacy of the moment and the particularity of the individual-to-individual relation, it cannot be codified in a manner that wisdom-oriented folks would quite understandably desire.

I think the biggest thing we can do to improve communications on the forum is to understand that when people trigger us, that is a condition we bring to the table, not simply (or even substantially sometimes) a condition the poster whose piece we read is imposing on us. If we can take the basic responsibility, we will build a safe space for people to open up more and be more vulnerable, and that is what will allow for more of the loving perspective to shine through in everything we post here.

Just my $0.02.

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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04-19-2018, 01:37 PM,
#37
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
I have to bump this post by Elros. It's so beautiful and poetically describes how I myself feel about words, the love of words and explorative conversation and philosophy.

(04-16-2018, 07:09 PM)Elros Wrote:  I do not know of anyone that is wisdom-oriented without being driven by passion. To me, spending all-nighters with a friend, under the stars as our muses, where we let our intellectual minds become mediums for Creation to express itself, is one of the things in life on Earth that makes me most feel alive and animated by powerful energies. I love existing. I love Creation. I love understanding the beauty of the ways and mechanics of expression that allow both me and Creation to be what we are. I love to share these insights with others. I love to see my own understanding being reflected in other seekers, just as to come myself to echo the understanding of others also. I love to both teach and learn, of the melodies and rhythms of the intelligent cosmos we are a part of, of its laws and cycles enabled in will, love and light. I think those who write a lot here about these things do little so to convince, and often more to offer the faith to attempt to touch and see for oneself, the words then are just an attempt to paint a picture of the glory of what is.

To me writing about wisdom is like writing music to a musician, it is a medium to express passion and high energies. I don't expect each and every person to read my words and resonate with them, just like a musician should not expect each and every person to resonate with the love found and expressed in their music, such expectations are just a sure way to block the energies that are moving through you and fail at expressing them freely, and so I think it's best to express as you are driven in your subjectivity and let it resonate with whom it does. To appreciate art often requires to let it sink in, so that you can feel with it its vibe, while at first you are plain unable to. I've known myself and friends to be repulsed by certain music at first, only to come to see the genius of it later on and feel nothing but awe and appreciation for the same thing. To me all of this is about the same, there are some's words you don't resonate with just like you wouldn't resonate with perhaps the music made by the same person, but it does not make it lifeless because you feel it to be that, it's just that you don't connect to their passion in resonance with how they do themselves.

Wisdom to me is all about lessons of love. What drives my seeking of wisdom is to understand the beauty and love of each thing, that's what animates me to seek and there is no seeking without a drive.
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04-19-2018, 02:45 PM,
#38
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
I strongly suspect you are talking about me here and my "venting" post, so I answer here.

(04-17-2018, 03:20 PM)unity100 Wrote:  There is just another thread i just read, in a similar direction. A long post, tells a lot of stuff, but when you cut to its core points, what it basically says is that 'You are not thinking like i think, you are not doing like i do, i asked you to do so, but you didnt do it, therefore i am leaving'. It also has a lot of generalizations about how 'other people' lived or not lived their life and experiences, on top of that telling them what to do and how to feel or how to walk through their spiritual path.

Actually the thread was about "I have the impression nobody is interested in what I offer, so I stop offering it"
And i wanted to share in a very short version, what I have tried to convey so far (regarding the intellect).
This is simply because for me and most people I know this has been the most important step in their evolution, and I wanted to leave some food for thought before I go.


(04-17-2018, 03:20 PM)unity100 Wrote:  Without any references to any usable material, leave aside Ra material, without any explanation of why, without any references or reason backed by any fundamental existential or spiritual laws that affect everyone equally, even without any context or reason stemming from our contemporary culture.

Nothing except a push of personal preferences and how other people do not follow suit.

It is questionable why someone who has preferences like that would read and study Ra material in the first place.

As for the references:
Thats not along the lines of my seeking. I only believe what I have personally experienced, the rest is only a working theory.
So I find providing references a little pointless…

I have my own experiences and my own view. And I dont want to instrumentalize Ra material to support my point.
Not sure how many of my posts you read, but I dont expect anybody to believe what I say, just because I said it.
That would be just as stupid as believing in the Ra material just because Ra said it.

I was regularly trying to convey methods and exercises so you can make your own experience and judge by the results!

And the Ra material resonated with me for several reasons:
first, it confirmed many things I found out by myself,
it supplied some new and fascinating information,
but mostly it was the, I would call it "vibration" or "energy" of it, that activated something deeper in me that hasnt been active yet.

For me the Law of One is about oneness, maybe that´s why they call it the Law of One.
And the energy is strongly pointing in that direction.

And, since the Ra material at its very core is about oneness, "studying" the Ra material would mean, for me, experiencing oneness as a goal,wouldnt you agree?


(04-17-2018, 03:20 PM)unity100 Wrote:  Actually i'd say that that thread reads very suspiciously like the work of a very old forum member who used to register/deregister continuously with many psuedonyms, and create conflict among people through posts and by directly emailing them, but as there is little evidence in that direction and that's something the forum management should investigate.

I have to say, this a serious insult and a major de-valuation of my contribution here!

I dont know if you read any of my posts.
My former account was agua del cielo, this is a new one after a year of break.

Maybe you want to read a couple of my post and see, if this insult is justified!
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04-19-2018, 04:15 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-19-2018, 04:16 PM by flofrog.)
#39
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-19-2018, 01:37 PM)Diana Wrote:  I have to bump this post by Elros. It's so beautiful and poetically describes how I myself feel about words, the love of words and explorative conversation and philosophy.



(04-16-2018, 07:09 PM)Elros Wrote:  I do not know of anyone that is wisdom-oriented without being driven by passion. To me, spending all-nighters with a friend, under the stars as our muses, where we let our intellectual minds become mediums for Creation to express itself, is one of the things in life on Earth that makes me most feel alive and animated by powerful energies. I love existing. I love Creation. I love understanding the beauty of the ways and mechanics of expression that allow both me and Creation to be what we are. I love to share these insights with others. I love to see my own understanding being reflected in other seekers, just as to come myself to echo the understanding of others also. I love to both teach and learn, of the melodies and rhythms of the intelligent cosmos we are a part of, of its laws and cycles enabled in will, love and light. I think those who write a lot here about these things do little so to convince, and often more to offer the faith to attempt to touch and see for oneself, the words then are just an attempt to paint a picture of the glory of what is.

To me writing about wisdom is like writing music to a musician, it is a medium to express passion and high energies. I don't expect each and every person to read my words and resonate with them, just like a musician should not expect each and every person to resonate with the love found and expressed in their music, such expectations are just a sure way to block the energies that are moving through you and fail at expressing them freely, and so I think it's best to express as you are driven in your subjectivity and let it resonate with whom it does. To appreciate art often requires to let it sink in, so that you can feel with it its vibe, while at first you are plain unable to. I've known myself and friends to be repulsed by certain music at first, only to come to see the genius of it later on and feel nothing but awe and appreciation for the same thing. To me all of this is about the same, there are some's words you don't resonate with just like you wouldn't resonate with perhaps the music made by the same person, but it does not make it lifeless because you feel it to be that, it's just that you don't connect to their passion in resonance with how they do themselves.

Wisdom to me is all about lessons of love. What drives my seeking of wisdom is to understand the beauty and love of each thing, that's what animates me to seek and there is no seeking without a drive.

Diana, totally agree with you !! And Elros expresses so well why this life is so awesome with peaks and valleys and why  I can reread Ra any number of times because I find him so poetic and beautiful.  Thank you to you both Big Grin Heart

Agua, I am so glad you are Agua Del Cielo !!!
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04-19-2018, 07:43 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-19-2018, 07:51 PM by xise.)
#40
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Has anyone found any good material on what defines the divine masculine versus the divine feminine? I did not find Ra to speak on the subject in detail, but I may have missed something.

My guess is that what most think they are doing when they knowingly embrace divine masculine is actually embracing a non-masculine distortion.

I have contemplated the subject somewhat but I believe the divine masculine and divine feminine may be more related to the fundamental mover versus moved concepts explored in the previous octave, and that the often discussed logic/intuition dichotomy may only be a secondary aspect of each energy. However, I've not convinced either way and my investigation into these concepts is still ongoing, though not a current priority.

STO is about universal love and therefore includes the self. All is acceptable. All. Every single thing. 
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04-19-2018, 11:26 PM,
#41
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-19-2018, 07:43 PM)xise Wrote:  Has anyone found any good material on what defines the divine masculine versus the divine feminine? I did not find Ra to speak on the subject in detail, but I may have missed something.

My guess is that what most think they are doing when they knowingly embrace divine masculine is actually embracing a non-masculine distortion.

I have contemplated the subject somewhat but I believe the divine masculine and divine feminine may be more related to the fundamental mover versus moved concepts explored in the previous octave, and that the often discussed logic/intuition dichotomy may only be a secondary aspect of each energy. However, I've not convinced either way and my investigation into these concepts is still ongoing, though not a current priority.

I believe you can study this through the archetypes. There is a reason why Ra says to study them in pairs - with the oppositional male/female energies. In short it is the Magician and the High Priestess. In application the archetypes are almost split in half, telling the tale of each quite intricately.
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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04-19-2018, 11:46 PM,
#42
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-19-2018, 07:43 PM)xise Wrote:  Has anyone found any good material on what defines the divine masculine versus the divine feminine? I did not find Ra to speak on the subject in detail, but I may have missed something.

My guess is that what most think they are doing when they knowingly embrace divine masculine is actually embracing a non-masculine distortion.

I have contemplated the subject somewhat but I believe the divine masculine and divine feminine may be more related to the fundamental mover versus moved concepts explored in the previous octave, and that the often discussed logic/intuition dichotomy may only be a secondary aspect of each energy. However, I've not convinced either way and my investigation into these concepts is still ongoing, though not a current priority.

As concerns the movers and the moved (the previous octave was a furniture moving company, maybe?), I expect that was just basic physical stuff and bipolar sexuality (female/male) does not become a concept until you get to 2d micro-organisms and plant forms (blue-green algae in particular).

Don and Ra Wrote:78.14 Questioner: But, in doing this, there was at the center of the galaxy, the lack of knowledge or the lack of concept of possibility of extending the first distortion, so as to allow for what we have experienced as polarity. Was there any concept of polarity carried through from the previous octave in the sense of service-to-others or service-to-self polarity?

Ra: I am Ra. There was polarity in the sense of the mover and the moved. There was no polarity in the sense of service to self and service to others.



As far as divine masculine & feminine models go, try this.

Don and Ra Wrote:74.4 Questioner: In a previous session there was a question on the archetypical mind that was not fully answered. I would like to continue with the answer to that question. Could you please continue with that, or would it be necessary for me to read the entire question over again?

Ra: I am Ra. As a general practice it is well to vibrate the query at the same space/time as the answer is desired. However, in this case it is acceptable to us that a note be inserted at this point in your recording of these sound vibratory complexes referring to the location of the query in previous workings.*

The query, though thoughtful, is in some degree falling short of the realization of the nature of the archetypical mind. We may not teach/learn for any other to the extent that we become learn/teachers. Therefore, we shall make some general notations upon this interesting subject and allow the questioner to consider and further refine any queries.

The archetypical mind may be defined as that mind which is peculiar to the Logos of this planetary sphere. Thusly unlike the great cosmic all-mind, it contains the material which it pleased the Logos to offer as refinements to the great cosmic beingness. The archetypical mind, then, is that which contains all facets which may affect mind or experience.

The Magician was named as a significant archetype. However, it was not recognized that this portion of the archetypical mind represents not a portion of the deep subconscious but the conscious mind and more especially the will. The archetype called by some the High Priestess, then, is the corresponding intuitive or subconscious faculty.

Let us observe the entity as it is in relationship to the archetypical mind. You may consider the possibilities of utilizing the correspondences between the mind/body/spirit in microcosm and the archetypical mind/body/spirit closely approaching the Creator. For instance, in your ritual performed to purify this place you use the term “Ve Geburah.” It is a correct assumption that this is a portion or aspect of the One Infinite Creator. However, there are various correspondences with the archetypical mind which may be more and more refined by the adept. “Ve Geburah” is the correspondence of Michael, of Mars, of the positive, of maleness. “Ve Gedulah” has correspondences to Jupiter, to femaleness, to the negative, to that portion of the Tree of Life concerned with Auriel.

We could go forward with more and more refinements of these two entries into the archetypical mind. We could discuss color correspondences, relationships with other archetypes, and so forth. This is the work of the adept, not the teach/learner. We may only suggest that there are systems of study which may address themselves to the aspects of the archetypical mind and it is well to choose one and study carefully. It is more nearly well if the adept go beyond whatever has been written and make such correspondences that the archetype can be called upon at will.

The part above about Jupiter bears some explanation.  The internet informs me that the two Hebrew phrases above refer to the power and the majesty (or the old familiar, the power and the glory), and the association with Jupiter is due to that planet's great size.  Jupiter (/Zeus) is the king of gods.  In Vedic astrology, Jupiter is the Guru.  To me, this is just a variation on the basic biological theme of the male inseminating and protecting while the female nurtures and is the vehicle and the host of the mystery of life.  My guess is that this whole business of divine masculinity/femininity is derivative of the biological structure and is used as convenient model to illustrate spiritual principles. 

 
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May all beings find peace.
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xise
04-20-2018, 12:04 AM,
#43
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-19-2018, 02:45 PM)Agua Wrote:  I strongly suspect you are talking about me here and my "venting" post, so I answer here.

Don and Ra Wrote:26.30 Questioner: And then, can you describe the mechanism of the planetary healing?

Ra: I am Ra. Healing is a process of acceptance, forgiveness.........

I was just thinking, if your current tack fails, you want a back up approach.

<smile> 
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May all beings find peace.
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04-20-2018, 01:42 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 01:44 AM by unity100.)
#44
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-19-2018, 02:41 AM)peregrine Wrote:  One quick note I'll throw out along those lines is the following.  To be heavily active in the fifth and maybe sixth chakra without having much going on in the fourth sounds a lot like Ra's description of an sts profile.  

And that is a fantastic example why one needs 'scientific' thought and 'wisdom' - or whatever you name it:
What you said is incorrect. Ra says that blue ray is not found in negative vibration spectrum. On top of that, 6th chakra is the chakra of unity and it doesnt have positive or negative specifics, moreover, it cannot be opened without a measure of green balancing the blue.

In short, someone who is heavily active in 6th chakra would be someone who has balanced that wisdom and love you speak of. 
This is an important example why knowledge of mechanics is needed. With the incorrect assumption you have, you could have easily approached situations, people and energies in your life in an incorrect fashion, mistaking positive, negative and the very concept of balance.

(04-19-2018, 02:45 PM)Agua Wrote:  As for the references:

Thats not along the lines of my seeking. I only believe what I have personally experienced, the rest is only a working theory.
So I find providing references a little pointless…

I have my own experiences and my own view. And I dont want to instrumentalize Ra material to support my point.
Not sure how many of my posts you read, but I dont expect anybody to believe what I say, just because I said it.
That would be just as stupid as believing in the Ra material just because Ra said it.

I was regularly trying to convey methods and exercises so you can make your own experience and judge by the results!

So, you were just using your own experiences and preferences and offering only them with no provided common basis with anyone else. 

Which would mean that only people who would be very specifically in line with your biases would be able to use them.

But, there werent any such person responding to your personal experiences.

Which made you think your offering was unwanted, and decide to leave the forum by telling other people to drop their own personal biases and experiences and adopt similar lines to you.

And

Quote:And the Ra material resonated with me for several reasons:

first, it confirmed many things I found out by myself,
it supplied some new and fascinating information,
but mostly it was the, I would call it "vibration" or "energy" of it, that activated something deeper in me that hasnt been active yet.

Ra material resonated with you, like how it resonated with many people here, but you are not interested in referencing or studying or talking Ra material, and you want other people to do the same, and adopt your practice.

.....

Excuse me - that doesnt make sense, its not reasonable, and a decent amount of what you said in your post is conflicting. 

Quote:I dont know if you read any of my posts.

My former account was agua del cielo, this is a new one after a year of break.

Maybe you want to read a couple of my post and see, if this insult is justified!

I read some of them, especially the relevant thread, i checked your profile, history, and based upon my personal experiences and my own personal biases without needing to provide any common basis just like you prefer to do in your offerings of your personal experiences and biases, i am still of the same opinion. Especially seeing how your location is germany and especially after how you just mentioned that you create and leave forum handles/personas, just like the person i talked about did...
can reach me@ unity100-gmail
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04-20-2018, 03:33 AM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 03:36 AM by peregrine.)
#45
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 01:42 AM)unity100 Wrote:  
(04-19-2018, 02:41 AM)peregrine Wrote:  One quick note I'll throw out along those lines is the following.  To be heavily active in the fifth and maybe sixth chakra without having much going on in the fourth sounds a lot like Ra's description of an sts profile.  

And that is a fantastic example why one needs 'scientific' thought and 'wisdom' - or whatever you name it:  Thank you.
What you said is incorrect. Oh, really?  Yikes!  Ra says that blue ray is not found in negative vibration spectrum. Yes, that's true in one response, but Ra says more about this topic elsewhere.  On top of that, 6th chakra is the chakra of unity and it doesnt have positive or negative specifics, moreover, it cannot be opened without a measure of green balancing the blue.  This appears to be over stated.  See below.

In short, someone who is heavily active in 6th chakra would be someone who has balanced that wisdom and love you speak of.  It can be balanced very heavily in favor of wisdom to the point of extreme selfishness by a naughty boy adept.  See below.
This is an important example why knowledge of mechanics is needed. In this context I would say, yes, but for an adept, not for most others.  With the incorrect assumption you have, you could have easily approached situations, people and energies in your life in an incorrect fashion, mistaking positive, negative and the very concept of balance.  Oh my!!!

Before going to work on this, in the spirit of the genesis of this particular thread I would note the annoying way you are determined to prove yourself right and me wrong.  How does that make you feel, unity100?  What thirst does such behavior slake for you?  Why not act like more of a gentleman, after all we're colleagues in this endeavor, right?


Behold.
Ra Wrote:11.8 Questioner: Is there anyone in our history that is commonly known who went to a fourth-density self-service or negative type planet or who will go there?
Ra: I am Ra. The number of entities thus harvested is small. However, a few have penetrated the eighth level which is only available from the opening up of the seventh through the sixth. Penetration into the eighth or intelligent infinity level allows a mind/body/spirit complex to be harvested if it wishes at any time/space during the cycle.
11.9 Questioner: Are any of these people known in the history of our planet by name?
Ra: I am Ra. We will mention a few. The one known as Taras Bulba, the one known as Genghis Khan, the one known as Rasputin.
11.10 Questioner: How did they accomplish this? What was necessary for them to accomplish this?
Ra: All of the aforementioned entities were aware, through memory, of Atlantean understandings having to do with the use of the various centers of mind/body/spirit complex energy influx in attaining the gateway to intelligent infinity.
11.11 Questioner: Did this enable them to do what we refer to as magic? Do paranormal things while they were incarnate here?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. The first two entities mentioned made little use of these abilities consciously. However, they were bent single-mindedly upon service to self, sparing no efforts in personal discipline to double, re-double and so empower this gateway. The third was a conscious adept and also spared no effort in the pursuit of service to self.

One more preliminary observation.  Please note that when I said above "active in 5 & 6" I didn't mean as an adept, I meant using qualities associated with these chakras the same way one may respond to catalyst with an open heart without being an adept so-called magician.  Now, on with the show!

It seems very reasonable to me to interpret all this as saying that a negative adept can mess around with a variety of energy centers however s/he chooses.  This may include some green (Rasputin "loved " his wine.  He was said to be capable of downing FIVE bottles in an evening, much to the chagrin of his hosts) and certainly including blue.  While its true that many sts-types lie their way into great self-confusion, if you're potent enough, there's absolutely no need for this because clarity is actually your trump card in a dicey situation.

Beyond these historically known figures, the literature in India and Tibet is loaded with accounts--down to modern times--of negative adepts capable of extraordinary feats of skill.  I'll just mention contemporary accounts of Aghori dudes who hang around cemeteries in order to entrap wandering souls and force them to do their bidding.  For this, clearly, mastery of higher level chakras is required.  Such fields of play are unavailable to those who are merely stressing out their first three chakras.

Further, I'm sure you noticed in 11.8 the mention of negative adepts penetrating the eighth center via the seventh via the sixth.  This would seem to be at odds with your assertion that wisdom and love would have to be balanced in the way I was speaking of earlier in order to attain mastery at the level of the sixth, would it not?

All that said, reaching back a few days to an earlier post of yours, I do take you point that it would be useful to try to clarify the meaning of terms like wisdom and love and balance in this particular context.  So, stay tuned.  As that happens it'll give you more catalyst to cut to shreds.

 
May all beings be happy.
May all beings find peace.
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MangusKhan
04-20-2018, 06:26 AM,
#46
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Quote:61.6 Questioner: I want to ask a few questions Jim had here about the healing exercises. The first is, in the healing exercise concerning the body, what do you mean by the disciplines of the body having to do with the balance between love and wisdom in the use of the body in its natural functions?

Ra: I am Ra. We shall speak more briefly than usual due to this instrument’s use of the transferred energy. We, therefore, request further queries if our reply is not sufficient.

The body complex has natural functions. Many of these have to do with the unmanifested self and are normally not subject to the need for balancing. There are natural functions which have to do with other-self. Among these are touching, loving, the sexual life, and those times when the company of another is craved to combat the type of loneliness which is the natural function of the body as opposed to those types of loneliness which are of the mind/emotion complex or of the spirit.

When these natural functions may be observed in the daily life they may be examined in order that the love of self and love of other-self versus the wisdom regarding the use of natural functions may be observed. There are many fantasies and stray thoughts which may be examined in most of your peoples in this balancing process.

Equally to be balanced is the withdrawal from the need for these natural functions with regard to other-self. On the one hand there is an excess of love. It must be determined whether this is love of self or other-self or both. On the other hand there is an over-balance towards wisdom.

It is well to know the body complex so that it is an ally, balanced and ready to be clearly used as a tool, for each bodily function may be used in higher and higher, if you will, complexes of energy with other-self. No matter what the behavior, the important balancing is the understanding of each interaction on this level with other-selves so that whether the balance may be love/wisdom or wisdom/love, the other-self is seen by the self in a balanced configuration and the self is thus freed for further work

Quote:61.11 Questioner: It says here it would seem the proper balancing exercises for all the sensations of the body would be some form of inactivity such as meditation or contemplation. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is largely incorrect. The balancing requires a meditative state in order for the work to be done. However, the balancing of sensation has to do with an analysis of the sensation with especial respect to any unbalanced leaning between the love and the wisdom or the positive and the negative. Then whatever is lacking in the balanced sensation is, as in all balancing, allowed to come into the being after the sensation is remembered and recalled in such detail as to overwhelm the senses


Quote:16.39 Questioner: I am assuming it is not necessary for an individual to understand the Law of One to go from third to fourth density. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. It is absolutely necessary that an entity consciously realize it does not understand in order for it to be harvestable. Understanding is not of this density

Quote:75.32 Questioner: The three aspects of the magical personality are stated to be power, love, and wisdom. Is this correct and are these the only primary aspects of the magical personality?

Ra: I am Ra. The three aspects of the magical personality, power, love, and wisdom, are so called in order that attention be paid to each aspect in developing the basic tool of the adept; that is, its self. It is by no means a personality of three aspects. It is a being of unity, being of sixth density and equivalent to what you call your higher self and, at the same time, is a personality enormously rich in variety of experience and subtlety of emotion.

The three aspects are given that the neophyte not abuse the tools of its trade but rather approach those tools balanced in the center of love and wisdom and thus seeking power in order to serve.

Quote:82.15 Questioner: Specifically, I am trying to grasp an understanding first of the process of experience in third density before the veil so that I can [have a] better understanding of the present process. Now, as I understand it, the mind/body/spirit complexes went through the process of what we call physical incarnation in this density but there was no forgetting. What was the benefit or purpose of the physical incarnation when there was no forgetting?

Ra: I am Ra. The purpose of incarnation in third density is to learn the ways of love.
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04-20-2018, 07:01 AM,
#47
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 01:42 AM)unity100 Wrote:  I read some of them, especially the relevant thread, i checked your profile, history, and based upon my personal experiences and my own personal biases without needing to provide any common basis just like you prefer to do in your offerings of your personal experiences and biases, i am still of the same opinion. Especially seeing how your location is germany and especially after how you just mentioned that you create and leave forum handles/personas, just like the person i talked about did...

Could you give an example of one of the usernames or threads? I think you are blaming it on someone else. Confused
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04-20-2018, 07:04 AM,
#48
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
It appears to me that we're quickly approaching the point where both love and wisdom would suggest bringing this thread to a conclusion, taking a deep breath and a moment to celebrate the Creator all around us, and moving on?
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04-20-2018, 10:30 AM,
#49
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Unity100 Wrote:What you said is incorrect. Ra says that blue ray is not found in negative vibration spectrum. On top of that, 6th chakra is the chakra of unity and it doesnt have positive or negative specifics, moreover, it cannot be opened without a measure of green balancing the blue.

In short, someone who is heavily active in 6th chakra would be someone who has balanced that wisdom and love you speak of.

Ra Wrote:The negative ray pattern is the red/orange/yellow moving directly to the blue [indigo?], this being only used in order to contact intelligent infinity.

Session 39

So it's a bit unclear whether blue is activated in the STS energy pattern. On the one hand, their penchant for deceptive communication seems to involve some blue ray faculty, but on the other hand, that's not the honesty that Ra ascribes to it elsewhere.

It seems to me that if the negative path involves any contact with intelligent infinity, the 6th chakra would have to be involved. What am I missing here, Unity100?

Jeremy
It is not that love will tell you what to do.
It is that love will tell you how to do it with love.
Q'uo 3/19/06
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04-20-2018, 11:02 AM,
#50
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
All this talk about love and wisdom makes me think of this Ra quote, which I believe is quite important:

Quote:[54.31]To answer your second question more fully we may say that it is correct that radiation without the necessity of response begins with blue ray although the green ray, being the great transitional ray, must be given all careful consideration, for until transfers of energy of all types has been experienced and mastered to a great extent, there will be blockages in the blue and indigo radiations.

Translation: Until the heart chakra is COMPLETELY unblocked, there will be blockages in the blue and indigo chakras. Subsequently, until the lower chakras are in a balanced state, there will be blockages in the heart.

To me, there seems to be a lot of discussion here about wisdom being something separate from love. Only on the negative path is wisdom a separate concept from love. Now, love can be separated from wisdom - if someone is still residing in the fourth chakra - but all wisdom springs from the cultivation of unconditional love. Otherwise, it's a wisdom separate from love, which shouldn't be so highly celebrated on the service to others path. People seem to think this state (wisdom without love) is much more desirable than the other state, (love without wisdom) - but spiritually, it's quite the opposite.

There is also a great misconception by many that they are using this lifetime to generate/balance wisdom. There is a reason why mostly 4th and 6th density entities incarnate as Wanderers - wisdom, as we conceive of it, is hard to come by, behind the veil. Just when you think you know something, the illusion will throw you a curveball, or even change the rules. Our Higher self is constantly moving the game pieces around to keep us on our toes. The real game is learning how to love unconditionally in each and every moment, regardless of the ruleset. Balancing wisdom comes after this practice, not before or during. To use wisdom to prevent oneself from experiencing unconditional love is 100% the wrong way (for STO) to use wisdom yet, this is how I see it applied.

At this hour of creation, we have all incarnated on a third density planet that is shifting into fourth density, albeit with much struggle, and many high level negative entities have also incarnated through seniority of vibration at this time. This world, at this critical juncture, does not need wisdom. This world needs selfless, unconditional love from every being who is able. Ra says that unbalanced love is "the salvation of third density". Yes, many of us are here to subtly balance love and wisdom, but I'm not sure any of us really know what that means - until we unblock the heart chakra entirely. Then we can begin to grasp wisdom. Luckily, most of us have many decades of our incarnation left to work on this process! No need to get ahead of ourselves worrying about our fifth and sixth chakras when we all can still use a lot of practice with the fourth (and first, second, and third!).
There is no magic greater than honest distortion toward love.
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04-20-2018, 11:52 AM,
#51
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
I'm going to muse a bit…

It is my understanding—and this will likely sound very elementary considering the in-depth discussion here regarding STS and STO energy centers, and I may be missing the point—but I imagine the pivotal energy center involved in the different paths to be the heart (4th).

An STS individual, especially an adept, will have great love for self. This is a controlled love, whereas the STO individual doesn't control the love in the same way (but may control it simply to handle the energy, not direct it). This might be likened to an aperture with a small opening (self-love) and the energy of infinite love pouring into self through that opening into the STS individual—and because the aperture is small the stream would be very intense. Whereas in the STO individual, an aperture opened wider would not have that controlled, intense, focused stream coming in, but rather an overwhelming (if one isn't used to it) presence. 

The STS individual utilizes the energy centers in a certain way for self and is actually driven by that intense stream of love. Certainly, because of self-love, s/he will have highly activated lower centers which correspond to life here on Earth and taking care of the body/physical self. But will also utilize any other centers—either deliberately or as the result of the energy created by the heart "aperture"—to honor and support the self-love. 

Respectively, for STO individuals, who, because the heart opening is wider and less defined, may have less defined uses and awarenesses of the other centers. Certainly this is true for the lower centers as many loving STO-oriented individuals seem to miss the point of taking care of self and some go to the lengths of martyrdom. And yet the wider opening of the heart allows a great embracing of many others beyond self, but focus can be a problem.

It seems to me that relatively speaking, dealing with the heart center is infinitely more painful, scary, overwhelming (and this goes both ways: concerning joy and sadness for example) than all the other energy centers. It may be difficult to deal with yellow ray concerns, survival concerns, sexual concerns—but opening the heart is exponentially more involved and complicated and huge. Speaking truth as we perceive it from the 5th center is an issue for many, but speaking what is in the heart is another bigger, more challenging thing altogether. It may be a crazy, deep experience to explore the 6th and 7th centers full of the unknown, but the heart opens up huge cans of cosmic worms (I know—terrible metaphor Tongue). It is no mistake it's in the middle.

So, arguing about the 5th and 6th centers may just be detail. I think it's the heart and it's functioning that is the director in this Earth play.

At least, this morning I do.  Tongue I often change my mind. 
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04-20-2018, 12:20 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 12:42 PM by xise.)
#52
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 10:30 AM)rva_jeremy Wrote:  
Ra Wrote:The negative ray pattern is the red/orange/yellow moving directly to the blue [indigo?], this being only used in order to contact intelligent infinity.

Session 39

So it's a bit unclear whether blue is activated in the STS energy pattern. On the one hand, their penchant for deceptive communication seems to involve some blue ray faculty, but on the other hand, that's not the honesty that Ra ascribes to it elsewhere.

It seems to me that if the negative path involves any contact with intelligent infinity, the 6th chakra would have to be involved. What am I missing here, Unity100?

Blue and Green ray are not activated in the STS individual (or rather are as closed as possible without causing death), all other centers are - red, orange, yellow, indigo, violet. This has been discussed and a consensus basically formed in other threads, when one looks at the entirety of the Ra material. 

Basically, STS individuals overdrive their red, orange, yellow centers to such an extent that they still force the energy through the indigo and violet despite very blocked green and blue centers.

STO is about universal love and therefore includes the self. All is acceptable. All. Every single thing. 
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unity100
04-20-2018, 05:57 PM,
#53
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 07:04 AM)Stranger Wrote:  It appears to me that we're quickly approaching the point where both love and wisdom would suggest bringing this thread to a conclusion, taking a deep breath and a moment to celebrate the Creator all around us, and moving on?

I see it a lot like how it is in the nature of the elements to teach one another in their differences, and so little is gained by not interacting.

I have the impression some may seem to see their other-selves as with their own mind, not perceiving how we all are working with a uniquely configured mind of our own as mind/body/spirit complexes. If you study astrology, then it is made apparent that everyone has various innate gifts and limits in their mind in resonance with the mind and body of the Universe, none greater or lesser, but instead reflecting different aspects of the Cosmos and of what Creator is. The struggle is that we each understand others through our own mind, in our subjective perception of them, not knowing what it is like to view and work with the gifts and limits that is their own, all because that is their honor/duty as your other-selves just like to work from your own is your own honor/duty as their other-self. To expand one's awareness on the nature of the mind requires interactions with others, to witness the differences and perhaps clash with them, so that a seeking may be enabled toward reaching understanding of what is not understood, and only then has one the ability to become more.

I personally cannot see a discussion as without purpose. A heated discussion can only be made of energies seeking balance, through willful people with each their unique drive and purpose in taking part. I think when someone feels fed up with a discussion they are a part of entertaining, then that shows they are not making use of it to work on what is highlighted in them to be worked upon, while still being drawn of themselves to seek this catalyst in their own need of it. If this was not so, they would either feel light about it, or feel a sense of purpose in the balancing that is occurring as it enables the potential for personal transformation in all actors. But I guess this is merely the ceaseless struggle to sincerely look at one's own feelings of separation, and non-acceptance, to turn toward acceptance. All is well, what is is and expresses itself, right?

If your wisdom and love suggests that you are done with it, then that is great, but why make it true for each and every actor taking part?

There is no self in the sense of separate individuality, yet there is one prevailing identity.
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04-20-2018, 08:58 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 08:59 PM by Stranger.)
#54
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Things seemed to be headed in an unproductive direction there for a while, prompting my post, but that has since greatly improved.

All of that is my personal view of course, but what else could I possibly have?
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04-20-2018, 09:21 PM,
#55
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 08:58 PM)Stranger Wrote:  Things seemed to be headed in an unproductive direction there for a while, prompting my post, but that has since greatly improved.

All of that is my personal view of course, but what else could I possibly have?

Kinda used your post to make a more general statement on a thematic found across many subjects and discussions, it is my personal view of unproductive/productive heated talk.

The most heated and heavy talks I've taken part into definitely were the ones with the most profound positive effect for transformation and reaching out within I had here. They're talks an external eye may have found as going nowhere and without purpose, yet they've enabled me to connect to my true heart and have forced me to distill a lot about myself. I think people tend to focus on having a specific reply written, what they want to hear despite it denying the uniqueness of another, when it's a lot about the inner work it generates. Energy moves from one to another, seeking to be resolved, and through it we gain the opportunity to realize ourselves in sincerity.

There is no self in the sense of separate individuality, yet there is one prevailing identity.
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04-20-2018, 09:36 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 09:38 PM by flofrog.)
#56
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 11:52 AM)Diana Wrote:  I'm going to muse a bit…
(...)
So, arguing about the 5th and 6th centers may just be detail. I think it's the heart and it's functioning that is the director in this Earth play.

At least, this morning I do.  Tongue I often change my mind. 


I love that Diana,  I feel like that too about 5th and 6th...  although I am sure they are eventful too ! Tongue

Elros, I agree on the usefulness of heated talks, lol although less heated can be quite interesting, depending...
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Minyatur
04-20-2018, 09:54 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 10:40 PM by Louisabell.)
#57
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 11:02 AM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:  Translation: Until the heart chakra is COMPLETELY unblocked, there will be blockages in the blue and indigo chakras. Subsequently, until the lower chakras are in a balanced state, there will be blockages in the heart.

To me, there seems to be a lot of discussion here about wisdom being something separate from love. Only on the negative path is wisdom a separate concept from love. Now, love can be separated from wisdom - if someone is still residing in the fourth chakra - but all wisdom springs from the cultivation of unconditional love. Otherwise, it's a wisdom separate from love, which shouldn't be so highly celebrated on the service to others path. People seem to think this state (wisdom without love) is much more desirable than the other state, (love without wisdom) - but spiritually, it's quite the opposite.

I tend to agree with this. In my personal experience love is felt and expressed as a continous energy flow, an essence of being that pours out. When one is talking in a 4th ray state of mind (love without wisdom), it usually revolves about the experience of love expression and it's refinement, so that it may become ever more unconditional and prominent in one's life.

This love also acts as a carrier wave, containing much information (and eventually the whole of the Creator in 7th ray). With the sharper focus of blue ray, one can start perceiving this information and speak inspirationally, creatively, and with greater clarity and deeper understanding. This type of communication is distinct from third ray communication which tends to come from recycled ideas that have been externally sourced from society, etc. One can still speak on spiritual topics at third-ray level, but it will reflect little true understanding and it certainly wouldn't contain any original thinking (just regurgitation - which is not bad, just a practicality of life)

I posit that to the extent that your love energy is blocked is to the extent that you will have access to incomplete information, often showing up in lacking context of the whole, little awareness of the larger implications and how they feed into what you are saying. So I believe wisdom can be incomplete. Maybe you're not conscious of an angry dynamic in your heart, in this area your love will be conditional and your wisdom will in toe be a mixture of what is and what is not.

Therefore I see much value in moving between 5th and 4th rays, as in 4th ray it is much simpler to find your blind spots - simply ask where and what am I not able to express love for? What is preventing me from doing so? What do I fear? What do I reject? ect.

Also the complete lack of love can open oneself to the experience of true separation (psychopathy), and apparently much can be learned in this state without an annoying (apparently) conscience.

Quote:87.7 Questioner: What is the environmental situation of this particular fifth-density negative entity, and how does he work with fourth-density negative in order to establish power and control; and what is his particular philosophy with respect to himself as Creator and his use of the first distortion and the extension of this use of the first distortion to the fourth-density negative? I hope that this isn’t too complex a question.
Ra: I am Ra. The environment of your companion is that of the rock, the cave, the place of barrenness, for this is the density of wisdom. That which is needed may be thought and received. To this entity very little is necessary upon the physical, if you will, or space/time complex of distortions.

Such an entity spends its consciousness within the realms of time/space in an attempt to learn the ways of wisdom through the utmost use of the powers and resources of the self. Since the self is the Creator, the wisdom density provides many informative and fascinating experiences for the negatively polarized entity. In some respects one may see a more lucid early attachment to wisdom from those of negative polarity as the nexus of positions of consciousness upon which wisdom is laid is simpler.

The relationship of such an entity to fourth-density negative entities is one of the more powerful and the less powerful. The negative path posits slavery of the less powerful as a means of learning the desire to serve the self to the extent that the will is brought to bear. It is in this way that polarity is increased in the negative sense. Thus fourth-density entities are willing slaves of such a fifth-density entity, there being no doubt whatsoever of the relative power of each.

I think from this we can infer that for whatever reason, the negative adept can raise their self high enough to pierce into awareness of themselves as Creator (graduating from 3D by doing this). It is only with this awareness of themselves as Creator that any true wisdom (truth) can be found, as they know they are the microcosm of the macrocosm. I am reminded by a quote from Genghis Khan - "I am the punishment of God."

However I believe the negative's "early attachment" to wisdom can be reflected in the way they appear "wise" in the ways of manipulation, control and dominance - wise in the ways of how the reality can create the illusion of seperateness.

So, in conclusion, I don't think it is so much a question of too much wisdom, but perhaps a mixture of tired ideas, incomplete wisdom and high-level deception that one requires great discernment in deciphering through, and love is a powerful ally in this undertaking.
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04-20-2018, 10:17 PM,
#58
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
(04-20-2018, 12:20 PM)xise Wrote:  
(04-20-2018, 10:30 AM)rva_jeremy Wrote:  
Ra Wrote:The negative ray pattern is the red/orange/yellow moving directly to the blue [indigo?], this being only used in order to contact intelligent infinity.

Session 39

Blue and Green ray are not activated in the STS individual (or rather are as closed as possible without causing death), all other centers are - red, orange, yellow, indigo, violet. This has been discussed and a consensus basically formed in other threads, when one looks at the entirety of the Ra material. 

Basically, STS individuals overdrive their red, orange, yellow centers to such an extent that they still force the energy through the indigo and violet despite very blocked green and blue centers.

This is a side point, but.......the Ra quote above describes a "a strongly polarized negative entity."  It does not describe an adept.  Please consider this distinction.

[/url]
Ra and Company Wrote:11.22 Questioner: Do you mean then that some scientists receive technical information, shall we say, telepathically that comes out then as usable gadgetry?
Ra: I am Ra. That is correct. However, very positively, as you would call this distortion, oriented so-called scientists have received information intended to unlock peaceful means of progress which redounded unto the last echoes of potential destruction due to further reception of other scientists of a negative orientation/distortion.
[url=https://www.lawofone.info/results.php?s=11]11
.23 Questioner: Is this how we learned of nuclear energy? Was it mixed, both positive and negative orientation?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. The entities responsible for the gathering of the scientists were of a mixed orientation. The scientists were overwhelmingly positive in their orientation. The scientists who followed their work were of mixed orientation including one extremely negative entity, as you would term it.
11.24 Questioner: Is this extremely negative entity still incarnate on Earth?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct.

How could Teller (presumably) be one of the world's leading nuclear scientists by simply driving the lower chakras?  Try it.  You won't get much smarter doing that.  Negative adepts are deep into the blue ray because that's where they learn to "crack safes" holding fundamental instruments of power.  And it's fine if that's not your cup of tea, I'm simply concerned with giving credit where it is due.  Why not?

To define a negative adept using that Session 39 description is to use a caricature.  And why should you care?  That depends upon your own relationship with truth (read: blue ray integrity).

 
May all beings be happy.
May all beings find peace.
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04-20-2018, 10:30 PM, (This post was last modified: 04-20-2018, 11:08 PM by xise.)
#59
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
Quote:47.3 Questioner: We chose the values of— or you were given the values of better than 50% service to others for fourth-density positive and better than 95% service to self for fourth-density negative social memory complexes. Do these two values correspond to the same rate, shall I say, of vibration?

Ra: I am Ra. I perceive you have difficulty in expressing your query. We shall respond in an attempt to clarify your query.

The vibratory rates are not to be understood as the same in positive and negative orientations. They are to be understood as having the power to accept and work with intelligent infinity to a certain degree or intensity. Due to the fact that the primary color, shall we say, or energy blue is missing from the negatively oriented system of power, the green/blue vibratory energies are not seen in the vibratory schedules or patterns of negative fourth and fifth rates of vibration.

The positive, upon the other hand, shall we say, has the full spectrum of true-color time/space vibratory patterns and thus contains a variant vibratory pattern or schedule. Each is capable of doing fourth-density work. This is the criterion for harvest.

Quote:47.4 Questioner: Did you say that blue was missing from fourth-density negative?

Ra: I am Ra. Let us clarify further. As we have previously stated, all beings have the potential for all possible vibratory rates. Thus the potential of the green and blue energy center activation is, of course, precisely where it must be in a creation of Love. However, the negatively polarized entity will have achieved harvest due to extremely efficient use of red and yellow/orange, moving directly to the gateway indigo bringing through this intelligent energy channel the instreamings of intelligent infinity.

Quote:34.16 Questioner: Would the red ray, an intense red ray, then be used as an index for seniority, the seniority system of incarnation, as well as the intense violet ray?

Ra: I am Ra. This is partially correct. In the graduation or harvesting to fourth-density positive, the red ray is seen only as that, which being activated, is the basis for all that occurs in vibratory levels, the sum of this being violet-ray energy.

This violet ray is the only consideration for fourth-density positive. In assessing the harvestable fourth-density negative, the intensity of the red as well as the orange and the yellow rays is looked upon quite carefully as a great deal of stamina and energy of this type is necessary for the negative progression, it being extremely difficult to open the gateway to intelligent infinity from the solar plexus center. This is necessary for harvest in fourth-density negative.

Quote:49.2 Questioner: Thank you. I have a question here from Jim first. He says: “For the past nine years I have [had] what I call frontal lobes experiences in the pre-consciousness state of sleep just before I wake up in the morning. They are a combination of pleasure and pressure which begins in the frontal lobes and spreads in pulses through the whole brain and feels like an orgasm in my brain. I have had over 200 of these experiences and often they are accompanied by visions and voices which seldom make much sense to me. What is the source of these frontal lobes experiences?”

Ra: I am Ra. We scan the questioner and find some pertinent information already available which regards the physiological disposition of this particular part of the brain. The experiences described and experienced are those distillations which may be experienced after a concentration of effort upon the opening of the gateway, or indigo, mind complex so that experience of a sacramental, or violet, ray may occur. These experiences are the beginnings of that which, as the body, the mind, and the spirit become integrated at the gateway, or indigo, level, may then yield not only the experience of joy but the comprehension of intelligent infinity which accompanies it. Thus the body complex orgasm and mind complex orgasm becoming integrated may then set forth the proper gateway for the spiritual complex integration and its use as a shuttle for the sacrament of the fully experienced presence of the One Infinite Creator. Thus there is much to which the questioner may look forward.

Quote:74.11 Questioner: Now, what I am trying to get at is how these disciplines affect the energy centers and the power, shall I say, of the white magician. Could you, will you tell me how that works?

Ra: I am Ra. The heart of the discipline of the personality is threefold. One, know yourself. Two, accept yourself. Three, become the Creator.

The third step is that step which, when accomplished, renders one the most humble servant of all, transparent in personality and completely able to know and accept other-selves. In relation to the pursuit of the magical working the continuing discipline of the personality involves the adept in knowing itself, accepting itself, and thus clearing the path towards the great indigo gateway to the Creator. To become the Creator is to become all that there is. There is then no personality in the sense with which the adept begins its learn/teaching. As the consciousness of the indigo ray becomes more crystalline, more work may be done; more may be expressed from intelligent infinity.


There's other quotes out there and if you are interested discussing this further, we can make another thread and I can go dig up some of the earlier threads. I think blue ray is commonly misunderstood. It's not just about knowledge or truth. It's about the universal and unconditional knowledge and truth. Since negatives focus so much on conditions and control and denying the inherent truth in universal love, their blue ray is as blocked as their heart. It doesn't mean they can't understand or manipulate blue ray energies - recall that negative entities often try to shut down positive entities by causing positive entities green ray to overactivate which means at some level they understand green ray energies despite having a blocked green ray. Recall also that negatives (or positives) far along the path can switch polarities - even negative entites with a closed green or blue ray understand at a conscious level what true open green ray or blue ray consists of, they just choose to close it off in their desire and pursuit for power over all and their choice to focus on exclusive self-love. It just means from an energy center perspective, negative's entities blue ray is blocked with their desire for control, power, and cannot begin to fully express the truth, knowledge, or wisdom that expresses the true unconditional oneness of the Creator as positive entities do. 

When I say express, I mean truly vibrate with unconditional wisdom. Negatives can read out loud from a Ra passage to a curious third-party about some positive concepts, and consciously believe it to be true, but their blue ray center is still going to be blocked while they reading it, because in their heart of hearts they have rejected that truth at the core of their being. Despite reading that 'true and wise' Ra passage out loud for third-party, they do not begin to open their blue ray by virtue of mechanically repeating a truth. They have to feel it while speaking it, but they don't, because they have rejected those concepts at the core of their being.

Which is fine, there's nothing wrong with that, just like there is nothing wrong with choosing to go negative and having a blocked green/blue ray. Each entity is free to pick their picnic, be it the morning sunshine and happiness for all, or pain and suffering of others, to paraphrase another passage.

STO is about universal love and therefore includes the self. All is acceptable. All. Every single thing. 
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04-20-2018, 11:09 PM,
#60
RE: Wisdom Run Amok
xise Wrote:It doesn't mean they can't understand or manipulate blue ray energies - recall that negative entities often try to shut down positive entities by causing positive entities green ray to overactive which means at some level they understand green ray energies despite having a blocked green ray. Recall also that negatives (or positives) far along the path can switch polarities - even negative entites with a closed green or blue ray understand at a conscious level what true open green ray or blue ray consists of, they just choose to close it off in their desire and pursuit for power over all and their choice to focus on exclusive self-love. It just means from an energy center perspective, negative's entities blue ray is blocked with their desire for control, power, and cannot begin to fully express the truth, knowledge, or wisdom that expresses the true unconditional oneness of the Creator as positive entities do.


Which is fine, there's nothing wrong with that, just like there is nothing wrong with choosing to go negative and having a blocked green and blue ray. Each entity is free to pick their picnic, be it the morning sunshine and happiness for all, or pain and suffering of others, to paraphrase another passage.


I take your point that there will be blockage in blue, and perhaps some high torque distortion.  Again, though, the discussion you quoted was mainly about qualifications for harvest and not about adepthood.

 I do appreciate your offer for a splinter thread, but this business isn't what I want to expend a lot more energy upon.  That said (heh heh), I think Ra's explanation of wisdom, continuing down the page in that session, is rather interesting.


Ra and Don Wrote:47.4 Questioner: Did you say that blue was missing from fourth-density negative?

Ra: I am Ra. Let us clarify further. As we have previously stated, all beings have the potential for all possible vibratory rates. Thus the potential of the green and blue energy center activation is, of course, precisely where it must be in a creation of Love. However, the negatively polarized entity will have achieved harvest due to extremely efficient use of red and yellow/orange, moving directly to the gateway indigo bringing through this intelligent energy channel the instreamings of intelligent infinity.
47.5 Questioner: Then at fourth-density graduation into fifth is there anything like the percentages you gave for third-density graduation into fourth for polarization?
Ra: I am Ra. There are, in your modes of thinking, responses we can make, which we shall make. However, the important point is that the graduations from density to density do occur. The positive/negative polarity is a thing which will, at the sixth level, simply become history. Therefore, we speak in an illusory time continuum when we discuss statistics of positive versus negative harvest into fifth. A large percentage of fourth-density negative entities continue the negative path from fourth- to fifth-density experience, for without wisdom the compassion and desire to aid other-self is not extremely well-informed. Thus though one loses approximately two percent moving from negative to positive during the fourth-density experience we find approximately eight percent of graduations into fifth density those of the negative.
47.6 Questioner: Well, what I was actually asking was if 50% is required for graduation from third to fourth in the positive sense, 95% is required for graduation in the negative sense, does this have to more closely approach 100% in both cases for graduation from fourth to fifth? Does an entity have to be 99% polarized for negative and maybe 80% polarized for positive graduation from fourth to fifth?
Ra: I am Ra. We perceive the query now.

To give this in your terms is misleading for there are, shall we say, visual aids or training aids available in fourth density which automatically aid the entity in polarization while cutting down extremely upon the quick effect of catalyst. Thus the density above yours must take up more space/time.

The percentage of service to others of positively oriented entities will harmoniously approach 98% in intention. The qualifications for fifth density, however, involve understanding. This then, becomes the primary qualification for graduation from fourth to fifth density. To achieve this graduation the entity must be able to understand the actions, the movements, and the dance. There is no percentage describable which measures this understanding. It is a measure of efficiency of perception. It may be measured by light. The ability to love, accept, and use a certain intensity of light thus creates the requirement for both positive and negative fourth to fifth harvesting.

So far as I understand it, the advanced negative 3d adept takes deep delight in that efficiency of perception and that usage of light.  But I'll try to be content just thinking that all by myself.

 
May all beings be happy.
May all beings find peace.
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