Atheism and Oneness

[3DMonkey]

It was too much of a stretch for me as well. I refrained from "being monkey" so I wouldn't stop down the thread.

[native]

Invoking a 'creative potential' is substantiating the first unsubstantiated thing with another similarly unsubstantiated thing. The same where's why's, how's etc crop up again

It's possible that belief will never occur in the course of a lifetime, or is the point should I say. It's rather related to experiencing the opposite.

[Ens Entium]

Failing to acknowledge the negativity is one plausible explanation of the dynamics of their psyche. It wasn't intended to imply to all.

Oh yeah I see now. I think I can agree keeping in mind what's comes to be agreed upon that atheism and fundamentalist religion are two sides of the same coin; there are religious types that have those same dynamics of psyche.

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Invoking a 'creative potential' is substantiating the first unsubstantiated thing with another similarly unsubstantiated thing. The same where's why's, how's etc crop up again

It's possible that belief will never occur in the course of a lifetime, or is the point should I say. It's rather related to experiencing the opposite.

Certainly, what do you think, specifically, the reasons behind needing to have that imbalance of experience would be?

[native]

The purpose of balance is to recognize the opposite and find the middle ground. As a fundamentalist, there is an extreme lack of acceptance in others. They perhaps develop a strong bias over several lifetimes, in which the only opportunity for balance exists through incarnating with the polar opposite bias as an atheist. They would then be able to view the lack of acceptance of fundamentalism through different eyes, and in general, most atheists are compassionate while also recognizing a moral life can be established without dogma.

[Namaste]

When you hint at the point there is a reason for this all happening, they start to get uncomfortable.

Have you brought up the idea of being God directly? What did they say?

I have indeed :¬)

Most take it seriously when you explain we're part of the same energy that manifests this reality. You can speak in terms of quantum physics referencing proven concepts (non locality, wave/particle duality). Some of course show little interest in the notion that we're energetically based at all.

Accepting that energy is connected by the label that "You are God" however, is quite a leap! There is a journey in between those two states of being, and it takes time (usually) :¬)

[Oceania]

i think they're afraid. i know i am. the veil makes it so we don't know what it's all about. and maybe knowing isn't great. and seeing the suffering in the world is enough to tell a person there's something wrong. why wpuld a perfect god allow that? there is no reason. that means either god doesn't care or can't help it. both are scary.

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Icaro, good point.

[3DMonkey]

I think, for all intents and purposes, I am an atheist. Something I would not have claimed until this year.

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What do you call an atheist who believes extraterrestrials exist?

.... Right!

Badumpum chhhhnn

[Diana]

I think, for all intents and purposes, I am an atheist. Something I would not have claimed until this year.

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What do you call an atheist who believes extraterrestrials exist?

.... Right!

Badumpum chhhhnn

An alienist. .

[Oceania]

Monkey what do you mean you're an atheist? do you not believe in a creator god or that there is a good god or that the aliens are spiritual? or that we have a spirit?

[3DMonkey]

We might "package" that for a thread "3DM's thoughts..."

Huh. Now that you ask, I can see that my answer will be met with "Logos talk". Thinking about that, I guess I don't take that any more literal than I did the Christian God. My view is difficult to explain. I don't think there is a God separate that created us, as a potter would make a pot. To me, it's more similar to say nervousness creating butterflies in my stomach. Something that is just part of the rest of everything. As for spirit, I think that is....hmmmm....not easy to put into words....frankly, it's everything that can't seem to find words for.

[native]

Accepting that energy is connected by the label that "You are God" however, is quite a leap!

Sure is..at least they're open to consideration.

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that means either god doesn't care or can't help it. both are scary.

In my experience of infinite awareness, there is the attitude of indifferent humor in all things. Without the veil there was the quality of enjoying the absurdity of the drama, and all that can be done is to laugh at it all.

[native]

I don't think there is a God separate that created us, as a potter would make a pot.

I'm not sure I understand..I think we would all agree with this.

[Namaste]

I think 3DM is pointing at the unity of the creation within the Self (Logos), whereas the potter uses external substance for the creation itself, and hence distinct/separate.

[Meerie]

3DM cannot answer you since he is not allowed outside treehuggers section anymore

[native]

I think 3DM is pointing at the unity of the creation within the Self (Logos), whereas the potter uses external substance for the creation itself, and hence distinct/separate.

Yes..I meant I don't understand the ultimate point being made as it doesn't sound atheist.

[Namaste]

Acknowledged :¬)

[Oceania]

if the great Godhead concerned itself with every little thing, it would break off into individuals. or would it?

[native]

Rephrase that.

[Oceania]

well if my head is a Godhead, and some of my molecules or cells or infinite universes inside me are fighting, should i or could i stop it? or would i have to become as small as them? you know i don't really care if a few of my skin cells dies if i get a scratch. but i can't really know what happens to them personally. if all my cells contain universes, what happens to them?

[native]

I imagine you're referring to your beef with suffering..I know you've brought it up a few times. There is no reasoning to be sought as to the "why's" for the sorrowful conditions here. The creator learns/experiences through principles, and its infinite aspects will manifest according to its local personality and decision making. The creator doesn't know what will happen..it is simply experiencing itself as the story unfolds. The creator (us) witnesses the story through our being. So, no one is going to step in and fix things.

So for instance, Ra said our Logos has a "bias towards kindness", yet a heavy veil was chosen to see what would happen. Because the positive/negative interaction is emphasized through such a veil, that kindness seems to deteriorate and the negative tendencies of the creator's personality shine through. Various lessons are being learned.

No one is to blame for our conditions except ourselves though, because they are the result of our personal choices. Since the veil emphasizes separation and complacency, suffering is exaggerated but could be easily be resolved.

[Oceania]

i wouldn't call it my beef. just because you disagree on the necessity of it doesn't make it some thing whose glory i just can't see.

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i was genuinely wondering what our connection to our Godhead is.

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and someone CAN step in and fix things. that's part of god as well. and in an infinite universe it IS possible.

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as is the fact we create our universe so who are you to say i can't create one i like with rules i like? i could wake up and find myself Dwayne Dibbley.

[native]

Not saying that is a necessity, just that it is natural. You can fix things through acceptance and action. It's our job to create harmony. The next octave should improve on the veiling concept.

I think our connection is relative to the idea that we each carry all of the densities within us. Our movement of consciousness through the sub-densities is symbolic of the process of the octave. As we do that, we manifest the properties of each density through our very being.

[Oceania]

it's mercury retrograde so i'll be retiring from this thread. and many others.

[Observer]

I was previously an atheist. Then I considered myself a deist. Then I found the word of Ra.

[native]

Glad to hear it!

[native]

What are the philosophical arguments in regards to nothingness? I grasp it myself, but I'm just wondering what the traditional answer/responses are aside from Diana's comment.

As I see it, it's valid to believe that a state of non-being could have always existed..and I don't mean in the sense of the creative potential remaining forever unaware, but that there would be no potential in the first place..no infinity, just nothing. That's not the case of course. That tells me manifestation inherently has significance. It points towards a creative principle and its need to become aware for the sole purpose of experience..that consciousness (the present moment) is the point of existence. Infinity and finity are equal and dependent on each other.

[Meerie]

Icaro, you might find the following video interesting. D R Hawkins talks about the void, or nothingness.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5fgG74TnWk

[native]

To be honest, he made no sense He confused the poor woman. She definitely had an intelligent infinity experience though.

[Meerie]

Lol yes she was rather nervous, wasn't she?
To me he made sense, because I had a similar experience like that woman and it went away after some time. And like her I asked my self "did I blow it? I had it, and then I lost it?"
So it would make sense that it was that contact with the void, or nothing-ness. Since there was only me, as well.
I think once you reach the stage of "all there is" or final enlightenment, and feel the all-encompassing love, you probably won't lose it again.
Imo. Just speculating of course.

[AnthroHeart]

That would be awesome Meerie, to experience bliss like that. My enlightening experiences haven't been fun, but they have been learning. They've been quite challenging in fact. At one point it felt like there was a black hole in my head, around the 3rd eye. That hurt, and made my skull make crunch sounds.