Harvest as Salvation

[Raman]

well lo and behold!...

So here we are a group of supposedly 'experienced' wanderers (most of us here) or so it seems, aware of advanced information, that has for many years been available, in not a very popular site (what is the average 15-20 users at a given time of the day? many of the us same users over and over?

So here we are many not getting to the minimum excited about the prospect of an harvest (final harvest) after what is going on in the world. I would presume the close to 1 million people that would die of starvation in Somalia would be very excited indeed if a 'harvest' is coming their way...

Seems we are afraid like little kids trying to escape of the reality of whatever possible scenarios. Well doom and gloom is ALREADY happening. Look at he wars, the unemployed the people unable to pay the rent at the end of the month, the homeless at the end of the street with a cardboard sign sayin' "Will work for food"...

Doom and gloom?

So the info is there, and it tells a lot about what kind of people we are. " Oh you mean there is gloom and doom already?" "Sure, gloom and doom but not for me, bud!" "Yeah but that is in Africa, or Libya or Palestine or,,," You know, you watch too much TV, (that does not tell you what is going on by the way).

How funny...

---

I will add destruction of forests, ecosystems, mining destroying 1st, 2nd and in the case of diamonds slave labor, other slave labor, risk of nuclear holocaust, so no doom and gloom, eh?

[Bring4th_Austin]

well lo and behold!...

So here we are a group of supposedly 'experienced' wanderers (most of us here) or so it seems, aware of advanced information, that has for many years been available, in not a very popular site (what is the average 15-20 users at a given time of the day? many of the us same users over and over?

So here we are many not getting to the minimum excited about the prospect of an harvest (final harvest) after what is going on in the world. I would presume the close to 1 million people that would die of starvation in Somalia would be very excited indeed if a 'harvest' is coming their way...

Seems we are afraid like little kids trying to escape of the reality of whatever possible scenarios. Well doom and gloom is ALREADY happening. Look at he wars, the unemployed the people unable to pay the rent at the end of the month, the homeless at the end of the street with a cardboard sign sayin' "Will work for food"...

Doom and gloom?

So the info is there, and it tells a lot about what kind of people we are. " Oh you mean there is gloom and doom already?" "Sure, gloom and doom but not for me, bud!" "Yeah but that is in Africa, or Libya or Palestine or,,," You know, you watch too much TV, (that does not tell you what is going on by the way).

How funny...

---

I will add destruction of forests, ecosystems, mining destroying 1st, 2nd and in the case of diamonds slave labor, other slave labor, risk of nuclear holocaust, so no doom and gloom, eh?

An instant harvest which would take all of these problems away would be an awesome scenario. But we can't rely on the idea of a harvest as a savior.

If we feel like things need to be changed...starving people in Africa, destruction of forests and ecosystems, slave labor, risk of nuclear destruction...then we must take action ourselves. Every second we spend waiting for harvest as a glorious day of salvation is a second which could have been used putting our energy and will to help solve these problems.

[Raman]

You are missing the whole point.

[drifting pages]

Doom and gloom heh

i say whatever and continue with my life.

Really because what say do i have on how others relate to themselves ? None

The only say i have is in how i relate to reality existence etc

Not that i am scoffing in their faces or anything, it is just how i want to live.

I think opening up to infinite possibilities does that to someone.

I think i can have my cake and so do others in any way they would like.

Infinity is big enough you know...

[Bring4th_Austin]

In a scenario where harvest is instant and we are all taken from our existence here and guided towards a new path while Earth is instantly reborn is a very comforting thing to think about. Looking at the "problems" in our world, some seem to be getting better while some seem to get worse. The amount of work and energy it might take to overcome these problems seems staggering and discouraging. The idea that these problems will be instantly cast away and suffering will no longer be a problem on Earth gives one some peace where it may otherwise not be found.

But is it appropriate to put our belief into such an idea? Why would we bother working towards solving these problems if we feel like their solution will come from divine intervention? If world hunger will no longer be a problem because of an instant cleansing of the Earth in a year's time, what would the point be in searching for solutions to this hunger? If society as we know it will simply be shaken from this Earth like fleas from a dog, why would we work towards a more STO-based society?

It's easier to think that the suffering people all over the world will instantly and magically no longer suffer than to think that their suffering will continue until we do something about it. It's relieving to place the responsibility of ending this suffering upon the shoulders of the Universe rather than our own. What a huge burden this is!

But is it safe to do this? Is it safe to escape into a notion of instant salvation? Is it safe to remove this responsibility from human-kind?

I think the implications are extremely dangerous. No matter how we believe harvest will happen, if we don't take responsibility for healing this Earth, this society, and our brothers and sisters who are suffering in this reality we share, then progress is stunted and suffering continues. How nice it would be to have the Universe intervene and take care of the job. How naive it would be of us to wait for this to happen.

[Bring4th_Austin]

You are missing the whole point.

Could you spare some elaboration?

[BrownEye]

But we can't rely on the idea of a harvest as a savior.

No kidding.

[Monica]

Very astute points. I was just thinking today that, how would entities suddenly go from this messed-up 3D reality to a 4D reality that is all peachy? As Edgar Cayce said, "You don't go to Heaven; you grow to Heaven!" It makes more sense that the 3D entities would need to learn how to live in 4D.

[StormShadow]

I like to think of it not so much as everything getting fixed automagically for us so much. More like those efforts that we make from that point on will be more effective due to the greater momentum behind and lessened friction ahead of them due to the removal of so much negative energy from the earth. Things today are thus and so because certain people want them thus and so. And they expend an incredible amount of energy keeping them from changing. Imagine trying to get a car running, gunning the engine, putting it into 2nd gear, but it doesn't budge. Then you notice - aha! You forgot to release the parking brake!

ZOOM

That's what I'm looking forward to.

[Raman]

In a scenario where harvest is instant and we are all taken from our existence here and guided towards a new path while Earth is instantly reborn is a very comforting thing to think about. Looking at the "problems" in our world, some seem to be getting better while some seem to get worse. The amount of work and energy it might take to overcome these problems seems staggering and discouraging. The idea that these problems will be instantly cast away and suffering will no longer be a problem on Earth gives one some peace where it may otherwise not be found.

But is it appropriate to put our belief into such an idea? Why would we bother working towards solving these problems if we feel like their solution will come from divine intervention? If world hunger will no longer be a problem because of an instant cleansing of the Earth in a year's time, what would the point be in searching for solutions to this hunger? If society as we know it will simply be shaken from this Earth like fleas from a dog, why would we work towards a more STO-based society?

It's easier to think that the suffering people all over the world will instantly and magically no longer suffer than to think that their suffering will continue until we do something about it. It's relieving to place the responsibility of ending this suffering upon the shoulders of the Universe rather than our own. What a huge burden this is!

But is it safe to do this? Is it safe to escape into a notion of instant salvation? Is it safe to remove this responsibility from human-kind?

I think the implications are extremely dangerous. No matter how we believe harvest will happen, if we don't take responsibility for healing this Earth, this society, and our brothers and sisters who are suffering in this reality we share, then progress is stunted and suffering continues. How nice it would be to have the Universe intervene and take care of the job. How naive it would be of us to wait for this to happen.

You are ignoring the Ra material almost in its totality.

[Raman]

You are missing the whole point.

Could you spare some elaboration?

Yeah no kidding.

I don't understand why I have 'to elaborate'.

People are seeing harvest as a doom and gloom unless it just goes 'little by little' not affecting current situation at all we die telling stories to our grandchildren about "once upon a time i read what was the book? Oh yeah the Ra material.."

I'm just reminding that we do not need a doom and gloom situation ...it already exists.

As for salvation, that is your own background. It is simply from 3d to 4d if you want to call that salvation you can call that whatever you want.

[unity100]

it is indeed funny how people talk about an instant harvest as a 'doom and gloom' scenario, when 1 billion are hungry, an entire population of 100 million people are irradiated in japan (and radiation going around), people are slavering their lives away, even starting life with debt on their back and so on.

it indeed seems that if the circumstances are appealing to some people, and their families and close ones, they think that things are good. and desire for the continuation of this situation undisturbed, and getting only better. this seems so strong a desire that, it can cause selective refusal of the information they trust, and extreme hypocrisy.

actually this is not uncommon and unseen. it is the general practice of orange consciousness on this planet. self-involvement, self-interest of the childish kind.

.................

'taking responsibility' is a funny concept in that respect. take responsibility of what ? stuff that OTHER people need to live, to complete their 3d ? you cant live others' lives for them. that means, they will live out what they need to live out. this may be war, this may be discrimination, this may be discriminating, this can be any of the stuff they have missing from 3d lessons. and if they live those here, you will get caught up in its wind.

this is why they have to go to a 3d planet, where all of the population lives these lessons. even more so, when the planet is ceasing 3d vibrations to provide for these lessons.

............

any positively oriented individual wouldnt be able to stomach 1 billion people going hungry every year they stand on this planet. 'we need to change that' -> this is an extremely naive, and spiritually uninformed wishful thinking ; the only way you can change that, would be to change the people on this planet and raise their vibratory and progress level. which is something you can not do, as per the above principles. they are souls with their own sovereignty and they will live out their 3d experiences -> noone is going to barge in and 'educate' them or 'raise their vibrations' or do anything else with pyramids and provide them for skipping 3d lessons. therefore, as long as the 3d entities stay on this planet, the 3d problems will stay. these are problems from our perspective, lessons from their perspective.

[3DMonkey]

I'm just reminding that we do not need a doom and gloom situation ...it already exists.

<--- That is the "doom and gloom" approach.

[StormShadow]

I agree with you Raman - I think this is a rather gross oversimplification of what was covered in the material. Could you provide more detail for us? I'd like to hear more of your opinion on the matter.

[unity100]

Very astute points. I was just thinking today that, how would entities suddenly go from this messed-up 3D reality to a 4D reality that is all peachy? As Edgar Cayce said, "You don't go to Heaven; you grow to Heaven!" It makes more sense that the 3D entities would need to learn how to live in 4D.

noone will 'go' to heaven. noone will go from suddenly messed up 3d reality to a 4d reality.

the entities which need 3d reality, will go to other 3d realities to get 3d lessons. they wont 'grow' in just a decade or 100 years, regardless of what anyone does. that goes against the nature of spirit. if things were that easy, there would be no densities spanning billions of years.

and those who have actually grown to 4d, do not have to relive the stages and lessons of 3d. because, they graduated from them. they are here, for doing exactly what their level requires - living lessons and pleasures of 4d. its as simple as that.

noone has to come from millions of lightyears away in order to go through 4d, only to end up reliving the lessons of 3d which they already graduated from. and no - going through the problems and crap of 3d with 3d entities, is not among the lessons of 4d. if it was, 4d would be named '3d', not '4d'.

so, 3d entities need 3d, 4d entities need 4d, this planet is as of now a 4d planet in vibration, and 3d vibrations cease this year or a few years time.

there is nothing 'salvation' or 'pity' or 'unfortunate' or anything else in that - this is how this octave was planned, this is how it will work. not unlike how you have taken in and given out a few breaths while reading this sentence.

[Raman]

I agree with you Raman - I think this is a rather gross oversimplification of what was covered in the material. Could you provide more detail for us? I'd like to hear more of your opinion on the matter.

It seems unity100 explains this well here in this thread:

http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=3232

I want add that harvest date is almost like a wake up call for us to use. Like: 'lets get ready, our job here is almost over, lets go home'...any unfinished business? Any karma you got to get rid of? Any 3d attachments that you need to meditate upon and release them...?

What are your final thoughts here? Gotta get rid of this absurd idea of death on 3d...things like that.

[Richard]

Very astute points. I was just thinking today that, how would entities suddenly go from this messed-up 3D reality to a 4D reality that is all peachy? As Edgar Cayce said, "You don't go to Heaven; you grow to Heaven!" It makes more sense that the 3D entities would need to learn how to live in 4D.

noone will 'go' to heaven. noone will go from suddenly messed up 3d reality to a 4d reality.

the entities which need 3d reality, will go to other 3d realities to get 3d lessons. they wont 'grow' in just a decade or 100 years, regardless of what anyone does. that goes against the nature of spirit. if things were that easy, there would be no densities spanning billions of years.

and those who have actually grown to 4d, do not have to relive the stages and lessons of 3d. because, they graduated from them. they are here, for doing exactly what their level requires - living lessons and pleasures of 4d. its as simple as that.

noone has to come from millions of lightyears away in order to go through 4d, only to end up reliving the lessons of 3d which they already graduated from. and no - going through the problems and crap of 3d with 3d entities, is not among the lessons of 4d. if it was, 4d would be named '3d', not '4d'.

so, 3d entities need 3d, 4d entities need 4d, this planet is as of now a 4d planet in vibration, and 3d vibrations cease this year or a few years time.

there is nothing 'salvation' or 'pity' or 'unfortunate' or anything else in that - this is how this octave was planned, this is how it will work. not unlike how you have taken in and given out a few breaths while reading this sentence.

Got it all figured out then, Unity? How the whole thing works, how it was planned even...down to the very way we should all feel and think?

Richard

[Namaste]

Austin was merely proposing a concept, none need propose he's misunderstood. Stating another self as incorrect, especially out of context, is a means of polarising negatively.

No one here can claim to understand exactly what happens during harvest. No one. If one did, I would imagine they had fully pierced the veil, and were out spreading the message of peace and unity among as many as they could. Rather than engaging in intellectual debate about it :¬)

Austin - I do believe that, as a species/civilisation, we're responsible for own own actions. We may indeed recieve guidance, which can come form inwards, as we coast - as a planet - into the transmuting energies of fourth density. Those who are unprepared, and unwilling to make the difference and take action, will simply not make it to fourth density, and will live yet another great cycle in which to learn the lessons of love.

Having said that, in a world where the material collapses from infinite potential, I do believe that anything is possible. I hope that we, as a species, undergo a transformation from within, becoming aware - albeit gradually - of the Dvinity within each other and our surroundings/experience.

I haste to add, 'ascending' with Earth as she progresses to fourth density is not weighted by ones intellectual knowledge. It's by the thought/woods and deeds that polarise positively. That's all there is to it, which is why, even the most uneducated on the planet, have the ability to graduate by listening to their hearts. Education only supports and encourages this opening, it doesn't permit it.

Much love, brothers and sisters :¬)

[kycahi]

...is it appropriate to put our belief into such an idea? Why would we bother working towards solving these problems if we feel like their solution will come from divine intervention? If world hunger will no longer be a problem because of an instant cleansing of the Earth in a year's time, what would the point be in searching for solutions to this hunger?

I interpret STO as one-on-one (or small group) helping of other selves rather than spending long hours in a lab looking for a hunger solution. I might choose to travel to a starving nation and work with them to plant and tend and harvest, showing dedicated STO, and do real good for my own polarity and for them. This would be better, looking through the LOO prism, than inventing some kind of nutricio-gruel solution for hunger. I can do this up until the harvest clock strikes 12.

Not that I advocate those who have long been dedicated, to quit the hunger solution search. As much as I accept the LOO, for me to carry that "belief" to the extreme would be as some others have, through the ages, done absurd things because of the imminent return of Jesus or Armageddon or whatever.

We may already be in the "end times," but they might take generations to conclude. Let's get busy today improving the Harvest.

Wow, while I wrote and previewed this, Namaste posted much the same thoughts in better words.

[Namaste]

To add, those souls experiencing homelessness, poverty and the very dark aspects of life, may have indeed done so by choice. An eternal soul must experience all, if it is to really understand and integrate the infinite.

I'm sure everyone here has been though that kind of life many, many times. Just not this one. This time, we're here to help raise planetary vibrations and those around us. Is that not what defines a Wanderer? :¬)

[hogey11]

I was thinking of starting a thread on a similar topic but I will include it here instead:

This thread, for myself, perfectly captures the interplay that is troubling me so much right now. On one hand, I can understand all of us who want to define harvest as a tipping point, not as a tipping point, a social evolution, a spiritual shift, etc. All of these ideas are fine and well. My issue is with the overriding sentiments of many here. I feel Raman touched on it very well in the original post:

"So here we are many not getting to the minimum excited about the prospect of an harvest (final harvest) after what is going on in the world."


In lurking through the forums the last few weeks, I feel very little hope from the community regarding harvest. Like Raman has stated, I see many shuffling the deck chairs allowing themselves for a soft fall should we see no difference in the world post-2012.


"Oh, it was just all figurative anyways, that harvest talk. It really has to do with our INNER peace, not world peace! Once we figure out inner peace, the rest will follow, right?!?"




I am here to argue against this line of thought because it bleeds hope. We have to make a decision, or maybe more aptly, a choice (shout out to Carla!). Are we going to put our energies into the creation of a 4D world or the continuation of our old? This is where, once again, I feel we are all right. Those who feel harvest is directed by our own individual actions and intentions are right because that is exactly how it works; however, by not seeing the possibility of the 4D world coming into balance in a short time, there is no positive intention going into the idea. By creating our escape routes, we take away from the intention of what we ask for. What are each of us asking for in regards to harvest? Where are we lending our intentions?


I hope I am way off base here. I see a lot of posturing, definition, and debate. These are all good things. That being said, I am also seeing far too much 3D-based empirical thinking, in my opinion. The reason harvest makes so little sense to so many of us is that it is rooted in the start of 4D - not 3D. In this way, it will never make sense to us. It will never follow the rules of our logic or intellect. This is something to rejoice, not condemn.


If a new world is coming, we must accept it will not be like our old world. This also means letting go of the thought process in which we base our prudence now; I invite you all to lose yourself in optimism and hope. I don't know if I'll be right about my own thoughts on the harvest, but I do know that I am putting my entire being into intending it for the rest of us. The more I have tried to debate and define the harvest, the more I realize that it is futile with my 3D understanding. All of my doubts and hedges against the harvest are rooted in 3D deficiencies. I don't know what 4D entails (unless i'm 5D+ wanderer I suppose...) nor do I know what an energetic and social shift would feel or look like...


This is why I have learnt to let go and purely hope. The best part is this: if I am wrong, I am in the same spot as the rest. I see no downside to the risk. if 4D resides within myself, I'll find it after i'm sure I am not hiding it from anyone else.

[unity100]

Very astute points. I was just thinking today that, how would entities suddenly go from this messed-up 3D reality to a 4D reality that is all peachy? As Edgar Cayce said, "You don't go to Heaven; you grow to Heaven!" It makes more sense that the 3D entities would need to learn how to live in 4D.

noone will 'go' to heaven. noone will go from suddenly messed up 3d reality to a 4d reality.

the entities which need 3d reality, will go to other 3d realities to get 3d lessons. they wont 'grow' in just a decade or 100 years, regardless of what anyone does. that goes against the nature of spirit. if things were that easy, there would be no densities spanning billions of years.

and those who have actually grown to 4d, do not have to relive the stages and lessons of 3d. because, they graduated from them. they are here, for doing exactly what their level requires - living lessons and pleasures of 4d. its as simple as that.

noone has to come from millions of lightyears away in order to go through 4d, only to end up reliving the lessons of 3d which they already graduated from. and no - going through the problems and crap of 3d with 3d entities, is not among the lessons of 4d. if it was, 4d would be named '3d', not '4d'.

so, 3d entities need 3d, 4d entities need 4d, this planet is as of now a 4d planet in vibration, and 3d vibrations cease this year or a few years time.

there is nothing 'salvation' or 'pity' or 'unfortunate' or anything else in that - this is how this octave was planned, this is how it will work. not unlike how you have taken in and given out a few breaths while reading this sentence.

Got it all figured out then, Unity? How the whole thing works, how it was planned even...down to the very way we should all feel and think?

Richard

yeaaaa i got it all 'figured out'. me little know-it-all me. i also got help from da 'boyz in da hood'.

if you want a serious response, provide a serious reply next time.

[3DMonkey]

I love you, hogey.

I don't agree. I think the focus on the inner transition is the only thingthat WILL affect the outer world. Focus on the outer world is to neglect the inner world.

It sounds like you are just hoping that car will appear at your front door.nthis is delusional and dishonest.

Much like putting away money for the purpose of purchasing a car, putting effort into personal transitions will save up enough personal transitions to affect the outer world.

Pretending we already have money that we do not, and waiting for a car that will not come is silly to me.

There is no 4D World about to come crashing down on our heads. This is why we argue- because some people are dead set that it is.

I don't think humans are capable of predicting what will happen. I do think humans are capable of creating scenarios that formulate future predictions in order to create their current inner world.

We are not Gods literally.

[Richard]

Very astute points. I was just thinking today that, how would entities suddenly go from this messed-up 3D reality to a 4D reality that is all peachy? As Edgar Cayce said, "You don't go to Heaven; you grow to Heaven!" It makes more sense that the 3D entities would need to learn how to live in 4D.

noone will 'go' to heaven. noone will go from suddenly messed up 3d reality to a 4d reality.

the entities which need 3d reality, will go to other 3d realities to get 3d lessons. they wont 'grow' in just a decade or 100 years, regardless of what anyone does. that goes against the nature of spirit. if things were that easy, there would be no densities spanning billions of years.

and those who have actually grown to 4d, do not have to relive the stages and lessons of 3d. because, they graduated from them. they are here, for doing exactly what their level requires - living lessons and pleasures of 4d. its as simple as that.

noone has to come from millions of lightyears away in order to go through 4d, only to end up reliving the lessons of 3d which they already graduated from. and no - going through the problems and crap of 3d with 3d entities, is not among the lessons of 4d. if it was, 4d would be named '3d', not '4d'.

so, 3d entities need 3d, 4d entities need 4d, this planet is as of now a 4d planet in vibration, and 3d vibrations cease this year or a few years time.

there is nothing 'salvation' or 'pity' or 'unfortunate' or anything else in that - this is how this octave was planned, this is how it will work. not unlike how you have taken in and given out a few breaths while reading this sentence.

Got it all figured out then, Unity? How the whole thing works, how it was planned even...down to the very way we should all feel and think?

Richard

yeaaaa i got it all 'figured out'. me little know-it-all me. i also got help from da 'boyz in da hood'.

if you want a serious response, provide a serious reply next time.

LOL....I'll think about that and get back to you

Richard

[native]

I do think humans are capable of creating scenarios that formulate future predictions in order to create their current inner world.
We are not Gods literally.

Yes. That's how infinity and possibility/probability works. It's called creation. We are creators.

[3DMonkey]

@Richard, I would take that as a "yes".

[Namaste]

Your wordly actions, without inner peace, will not be peaceful. Finding inner peace is the way to change the world. Once you do that, you can share that peace with the world. One person at a time.

Each and every person is responsible for the advancement of mankind. Each person who finds inner peace is an integral part of said advancement.

I agree on hope; intention is a fundamental mechanism of this reality. Dream the most positive outcome you can, and you're doing a service in terms of vibrational influence. Not to mention, we each perceive our own reality. You may experience that marvellous harvest, while others experience nothing new.

There comes a point when the intellectual satisfaction in debate has passed its usefulness, and becomes a distraction. Rather than discussing Ra's words, the opportunity for both growth, polarisation and service lies in putting them into practice. That's where true power lies.

The moment contains love

Full quote:

10.14 Questioner: For the general development of the reader of this book, could you state some of the practices or exercises to perform to produce an acceleration toward the Law of One?
Ra: I am Ra.

Exercise One. This is the most nearly centered and useable within your illusion complex. The moment contains love. That is the lesson/goal of this illusion or density. The exercise is to consciously see that love in awareness and understanding distortions. The first attempt is the cornerstone. Upon this choosing rests the remainder of the life-experience of an entity. The second seeking of love within the moment begins the addition. The third seeking empowers the second, the fourth powering or doubling the third. As with the previous type of empowerment, there will be some loss of power due to flaws within the seeking in the distortion of insincerity. However, the conscious statement of self to self of the desire to seek love is so central an act of will that, as before, the loss of power due to this friction is inconsequential.

Is that not Ra's most cherished piece of advice? And for such a Being to think so, perhaps it should be at the top of each persons to-do list :¬)

[Tenet Nosce]

well lo and behold!...

Whhaaa? I could have sworn the first time I saw this thread, abridgetoofar was listed as the author.

[hogey11]

@monkey

I am not excluding your sentiments. I understand the parameters of 3D and the initiative to make a choice and reach balance to become a harvestable soul; I think we all do. That is not the 4D reality though.

As far as the "car" appearing, I think your previous statement can be flipped: "Focus on the inner world is to neglect the outer world". It goes both ways. In this light, i'm saying we're all right. What you have pointed out is absolutely true; what it does NOT do is preclude me from my own conclusion.

The fact is that I believe the harvest is not for "us". For many of us, we have the opportunity to make our 4D lives a reality right now; our basic needs are met and we frivolously spend our time speaking of philosophy, meditation, and other things. As far as the inner shaping the outer, I implore you to think about the heart of a young African/Indian/Chinese/Russian/South American child who comes from nothing. Think of the dreams and ideas, of the solutions to problems, that these young minds undoubtedly come up with, and think how they are squashed in our current paradigm. Imagine the harvest is for these souls; those who are held down and back by the order of the world.

When I speak of this 'utopian' harvest, I understand the hesitation, but my response to it is "WHY?!?!?" Do we not want this? What do we gain by reinforcing that things must stay the same? Aren't we just reinforcing the 3d world and thought-forms that many of us seek respite from? Sometimes I feel like this is what it all comes down to: If harvest is not for you, can you still be excited for it? Can you get on board with others being lifted up rather than yourself?

[3DMonkey]

Isn't the inner transformation a place where self is "lifted up" beyond what others or the outside world can effect?

If, IF, inner transformation is attainable, then their "world" is transformed out of whatever anyone else sees it to be.

IMO, densities are only, ONLY, a state of mind. IMO, the idea that Ra was communicating and Carla was not there is fantasy.

It is all a concept of the mind, created of the mind, relevant to the mind, symmetrical to the mind, and IS the mind.

"4D" isn't coming, it is here... If you know how to "obtain" it.