Harvest: Do The Math

[3DMonkey]

Hey go for it...

23.6 Questioner: Then at this time you did not contact them. Can you answer the same question that I just asked with respect to your next attempt to contact the Egyptians?
Ra: I am Ra. The next attempt was prolonged. It occurred over a period of time. The nexus, or center, of our efforts was a decision upon our parts that there was a sufficient calling IN OTHER WORDS- A MASSIVE AMOUNT OF HUMAN MINDS WANTING TO SEE THE SAME OUTCOME to attempt to walk among your peoples as brothers.

We laid this plan before the Council of Saturn In other words- THE IDEA WAS APPLIED WITH COGNITIVE REASONING TO MANIFEST THE OUTCOME OF THE CALLING, offering ourselves as service-oriented Wanderers of the type which land directly upon the inner planes without incarnative processes In other words- THE APPLIED CONCEPT TOOK ROOT AS A VALID IDEA. Thus we emerged, or materialized, in physical-chemical complexes representing as closely as possible our natures THE COLLECTIVE CALLING UNCONSCIOUSLY AGREED THAT THEY WOULD APPLY THE APPROVED IDEA IN PHYSICALLY IMPLEMENTING FORM, this effort being to appear as brothers and spend a limited amount of time as teachers of the Law of One, for there was an ever-stronger interest in the sun body, and this vibrates in concordance with our particular distortions VIBRATES BECAUSE IT WAS PART OF THE COLLECTIVE CALLERS TO SEE CREATION IN THE SAME LIGHT WITH ONE ANOTHER.

We discovered that for each word we could utter, there were thirty impressions we gave by our very being, which confused those entities we had come to serve TYPICAL OF EVERY MANIFESTATION OF THE MIND AMONGST OTHER MINDS. After a short period we removed ourselves from these entities and spent much time attempting to understand how best to serve those to whom we had offered ourselves in love/light. WHEN THE COLLECTIVE MINDS BEGAN TO BUMP HEADS, AS USUAL, THE CONCENTRATION TOWARD THE SAME OUTCOME DISSIPATED

The ones who were in contact with that geographical entity, which you know of as Atlantis, HERE IS ATLANTIS THE ENTITY, OR THE COLLECTIVE MINDSET OF A DIFFERENT LOCATION had conceived of the potentials for healing by use of the pyramid-shape entities. OR METHOD OF ACHIEVING LIKE MIND In considering this and making adjustments for the difference as in the distortion complexes of the two geographical cultures, as you would call them, we went before the Council again , offering this plan to the Council as an aid to the healing and the longevity of those in the area you know of as Egypt.THE CALLERS WENT BACK TO THE CHALKBOARD TO DEVISE AN ADDITIONAL METHOD In this way we hoped to facilitate the learning process as well as offer philosophy articulating the Law of One THE ORIGINAL COLLECTIVELY DESIRED OUTCOME. Again the Council approved. THEY UNDERSTOOD HOW THEY WERE GONNA MANIFEST THE PLAN



HERE'S THE REST OF THIS ONE ANSWER. I THINK I'VE WRITTEN ENOUGH TO STIR YOU ALL UP

Approximately 11,000 of your years ago we entered, by thought-form, your—we correct this instrument. We sometimes have difficulty due to low vitality. Approximately 8,500 years ago, having considered these concepts carefully, we returned, never having left in thought, to the thought-form areas of your vibrational planetary complex and considered for some of your years, as you measure time, how to appropriately build these structures.

The first, the Great Pyramid, was formed approximately 6,000 of your years ago. Then, in sequence, after this performing by thought of the building or architecture of the Great Pyramid using the more, shall we say, local or earthly material rather than thought-form material to build other pyramidal structures. This continued for approximately 1,500 of your years.

Meanwhile, the information concerning initiation and healing by crystal was being given. The one known as “Ikhnaton” was able to perceive this information without significant distortion and for a time, moved, shall we say, heaven and earth in order to invoke the Law of One and to order the priesthood of these structures in accordance with the distortions of initiation and true compassionate healing. This was not to be long-lasting.

At this entity’s physical dissolution from your third-density physical plane, as we have said before, our teachings became quickly perverted, our structures once again went to the use of the so-called “royal” or those with distortions towards power.

[Richard]

Richard, what do you mean?
(I would blindly say that if a 6th density being "pisses you off", the problem lies within you, but I do not get what did they mess up, and what did they create?)

Irony doesn't communicate in text all that well, it seems. It was tongue in cheek statement Oldern.

Richard

---

Wonder where we'd be societally if Ra and his bunch hadn't tinkered around with us and inadvertantly created the Elite?

I know they are sorry and all. The Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow weep while we bleed.

How about fixing what you screwed up?

Sometimes Ra pisses me off if they catch me on a bad day.

Richard

LOL.

What if? Well, I think the only thing that would be different is the name Ra. They didn't create this earth, neither did they turn it upside down. They just didn't achieve what they expected to. Nobody in the past did!

---

History repeating. That's why we understand one thing- that if this world is gonna change then a complete change in chemical structure will need to occur. Otherwise, same old $hit different day

Its all conjecture at this point, but...

For super duper technologically and spiritually advanced entities? They totally failed to take in the utter perverseness of the human race. And this, after observing us for centuries?

Not cool.

Richard

[3DMonkey]

hehehe no, it isn't cool.

They aren't super duper technologically and spiritually advanced though. Why the heck would they be indebted to us if they were? We'd be just another driving range golf ball to them.

[hogey11]

hehehe no, it isn't cool.

They aren't super duper technologically and spiritually advanced though. Why the heck would they be indebted to us if they were? We'd be just another driving range golf ball to them.

Ah, but that is where I think you are wrong. I think we are unique, and in that way, we are valuable to a larger community.

I've heard from many accounts, one notable one being from Eisenhower's son who was told by his father on his deathbed that we humans are way more special and powerful than we could ever imagine - even in our current bodies. He claimed we had hidden powers that were undisclosed and kept away from us. I've read in some channels that it is our resilience that is especially admirable; we continuously toe the line with wars and religions and all this crap that puts us all on edge. We hold an arsenal of nuclear weaponry that could blow up the entire earth hundreds of times over... and yet we somehow make it work. Not perfectly, not all the time, but for the most part, we are making it work. We just need to make it work better, and I think once our rite of passage is over, we will be welcomed into the galactic community that 4D brings and that will be the way in which we repay all of the help we receive. Maybe that's a place 4D catalyst is derived from; helping lesser beings rise in their own vibrations through which we gain the wisdom to enter 5D and perfect it.

Think of this logically: if there was a 'Confederation', they would be following the LOO (that's why we're at this forum). The LOO tells us to treat all others with acceptance and love - why would they diminish us as a 'driving range ball' if they were enlightened beings? I would think it would be obvious why they would want an entire planet full of souls to be released from the reigns of duality when the time came for them.

Sometimes I think the harvest is a really hard topic to discuss. On one hand, it's being told to be some wondrous event that will change reality as we know it. On another hand, it's one of those that can not materialize as we would expect and instill doubts. If we're sitting here in 2015 and continents are being renamed with corporate branding, it's going to be hard to accept that this is the new 4D world coming into existence. That being said, I believe harvest is going to happen, and I think it's going to be more than just a few current events and G20 summits. Once harvest comes, we have to remember the rules have changed completely. Once the quarantine drops, the planet is in control of those who work with 4D positive, one would assume.

[3DMonkey]

hehehe no, it isn't cool.

They aren't super duper technologically and spiritually advanced though. Why the heck would they be indebted to us if they were? We'd be just another driving range golf ball to them.

Ah, but that is where I think you are wrong. I think we are unique, and in that way, we are valuable to a larger community.

I've heard from many accounts, one notable one being from Eisenhower's son who was told by his father on his deathbed that we humans are way more special and powerful than we could ever imagine - even in our current bodies. He claimed we had hidden powers that were undisclosed and kept away from us. I've read in some channels that it is our resilience that is especially admirable; we continuously toe the line with wars and religions and all this crap that puts us all on edge. We hold an arsenal of nuclear weaponry that could blow up the entire earth hundreds of times over... and yet we somehow make it work. Not perfectly, not all the time, but for the most part, we are making it work. We just need to make it work better, and I think once our rite of passage is over, we will be welcomed into the galactic community that 4D brings and that will be the way in which we repay all of the help we receive. Maybe that's a place 4D catalyst is derived from; helping lesser beings rise in their own vibrations through which we gain the wisdom to enter 5D and perfect it.

Think of this logically: if there was a 'Confederation', they would be following the LOO (that's why we're at this forum). The LOO tells us to treat all others with acceptance and love - why would they diminish us as a 'driving range ball' if they were enlightened beings? I would think it would be obvious why they would want an entire planet full of souls to be released from the reigns of duality when the time came for them.

Sometimes I think the harvest is a really hard topic to discuss. On one hand, it's being told to be some wondrous event that will change reality as we know it. On another hand, it's one of those that can not materialize as we would expect and instill doubts. If we're sitting here in 2015 and continents are being renamed with corporate branding, it's going to be hard to accept that this is the new 4D world coming into existence. That being said, I believe harvest is going to happen, and I think it's going to be more than just a few current events and G20 summits. Once harvest comes, we have to remember the rules have changed completely. Once the quarantine drops, the planet is in control of those who work with 4D positive, one would assume.

Hogey, when you speak to the global perspective of the here and now, it is inspiring. I think you have a knack for the broad perspective. But when you add in literalism of LOO, it sounds like a balloon, blown but not tied off.

At first, your example makes me sigh with ' another story with no true substance' and I shout 'show me! Don't give me fifth person stories of he said she said. Show me!'. But then your eloquent style of perspective shines through, and I see possibility. Then, you bring in Confederation "blah blah" and it deflates for me. You have a good thing in you to manifest. You have a good thing in you with ability to manifest. It is in you, and not coming from elsewhere. You are an active member of the "Confederation" whether you realize it or not. Please, activate your duty. I believe in you.

[hogey11]

Think of it like a team or something like it. You will have your straight shooters like Ra who pass through 3D harmoniously and with a great harvest. You need those type of guys on your team.

Earth is more like the rough-and-tumble pseudo-alcoholic character in the group. Not always dependable, but when s*** goes down, it has a funny ability to come out of it somewhat unscathed. You also needs characters like that on your team.

The truth is that there is only one earth in which the events that have come to pass have come to pass. We are unique. We have learnt lessons on behalf of the universe that are worth transmuting into something greater than it is. I feel it will come!!!

(ok, i'll stop railing on and on about aliens now )

[Tenet Nosce]

Personally, I don't see what would be the advantage of "ships appearing in the skies" en masse to a population that has repeatedly chosen to hit the snooze button. I don't see how a positive outcome could come of this- and I really don't see the urgency to "increase the harvest". Certainly, Ra downplays this objective in the material and states that if an effort reaches one, it reaches all.

The truth of the matter is that "Disclosure" has already happened, and is happening now. All of the relevant information is out there for anybody who is willing to look for it. Shoving Disclosure down the throats of those who would rather be more concerned with professional sports and celebrity gossip is clearly against the principle of free will.

Now I can't really speak for others, but as for myself I can attest that the process of life has given me more than enough catalyst to help me grow and awaken to new possibilities in life. I can only assume that, by now, everybody else has ALSO been given more than enough catalyst as well. If they have repeatedly refused such catalyst and chosen to remain in denial of what has really been going on, who am I to interfere with their choice?

It concerns me that there appear to be so many nonphysical entities, most notably Hatonn, that still appear to be jockeying for some kind of mass landing before the end of 3D. Look- what we know about 4D is that it COULD be visible to 3D, but CHOOSES not to be. Perhaps there is some very good reason for this? In my opinion, anyone that is trying to map 4D onto 3D (decloaking the UFOs, performing "miracles", manifesting light bodies, etc.) is moving against the direction of the natural flow of things.

Bringing 4D possibilities into 3D requires the use of technology, which is always a double-edged sword. One the one hand it can show us what is possible within ourselves, but on the other hand tends to result in dependence upon said technology. Whomever created the technology is in control of those who use it, and control of others is an STS concept.

While there might be something akin to "technology" in 4D, it being a density of variable physicality would require one to completely rethink what it means to have an engine or computer chip performing tasks. In such a world, any kind of "machine" imaginable could be physically manifested- however in the manifestation of said machine it would become glaringly obvious that the desired task can be accomplished without any machine, whatsoever.

So right there that tells me something about the level of spiritual development one might have who steps out of a physical spacecraft, having traveled physically through space, in order to come to Earth. :idea:

Neo: Are there other programs like you?

The Oracle: Oh, well, not like me. But... Look, see those birds? At some point a program was written to govern them. A program was written to watch over the trees, and the wind, the sunrise, and sunset. There are programs running all over the place. The ones doing their job, doing what they were meant to do, are invisible. You'd never even know they were here. But the other ones, well, we hear about them all the time.

Neo: I've never heard of them.

The Oracle: Of course you have. Every time you've heard someone say they saw a ghost, or an angel. Every story you've ever heard about vampires, werewolves, or aliens is the system assimilating some program that's doing something they're not supposed to be doing.

If there is anything at all to this graduation/harvest phenomenon, it is important to understand that it is a natural process. Sure, we can assist and guide, offer reassurance and support, etc. But to attempt to forcefully awaken an entity before it is ready would be akin to preemptively performing a C-section for fear that a baby would not survive a natural birth.

If part of this natural process involves a number of souls repeating 3D- then there are going to be some who were right "on the edge" of graduation, but didn't quite make it. It would seem to me that such souls would be a great boon to have at the beginning of the 3D experience.

Forcefully attempting to "increase the harvest" would actually make it easier for negative forces to co-opt the next round of 3D by depriving the population of those who would naturally be their leaders and guides and making them more susceptible to the exact same kind of manipulation that went on at the beginning of this round of 3D.

In 4D, I imagine there would be a clear distinction between through who arrived via the "rainbow bridge" and those who have been there all along. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that those having come via the bridge would realize, upon reaching the graduation point between 4D and 5D, that they have to go back to 3D to recapitulate lessons before they can pass to 5D. This is because they would see a missed opportunity to have made the "choice" without the "aid" of technology.

So that is my long-winded way of saying that I support an attitude of non-intervention.

[unity100]

depriving the population of those who would naturally be their leaders and guides and making them more susceptible to the exact same kind of manipulation that went on at the beginning of this round of 3D.

the very 'leaders and guides' you speak of, have been the doom of this experiential nexus.

the very concept of 'leader' is something that is contradictory to the positive vibration in the first place.

[Oldern]

"Technology" is just a more sophisticated way of controlling the plane around us.
Hell, even our body can be considered a technology, where DNS is the software engineered by our higher selves and the brain/heart being the processor/power core. We could even have an Intel vs AMD fight every day, just replacing that with skin color and/or any other issue with where we come from or what we believe in.

I do not really know what will happen if the majority of us have an eye-opener "mass landing" with 4d beings. Should that be considered interference to the Law of Free will? Well, not if they somehow mask it as simply being more technologically advanced - that surely wont bother any atheist at all. The question remains: what would they do with this limited appearance? Last time something like that happened, it was Ra and Egypt story - and from Law of One and history, we all know how that went.

[Tenet Nosce]

the very 'leaders and guides' you speak of, have been the doom of this experiential nexus.

the very concept of 'leader' is something that is contradictory to the positive vibration in the first place.

Is one to take these as statements of opinion, or as statements of fact?

[unity100]

the very 'leaders and guides' you speak of, have been the doom of this experiential nexus.
the very concept of 'leader' is something that is contradictory to the positive vibration in the first place.

Is one to take these as statements of opinion, or as statements of fact?

if taken historically, they are statements of fact.

if taken in regard to philosophies, future and potentials, they may be taken as opinions supported by historical facts.

---

"Technology" is just a more sophisticated way of controlling the plane around us.

actually technology is the act of using (generally) 1d entities to affect environment and have them perform services. so then, it is an effected control of external entities if taken in a philosophical sense. hence, controlling, and therefore negative.

this is probably one of the reasons why travel with external technology is universally abandoned into 5d.

[Tenet Nosce]

if taken historically, they are statements of fact.

Please expand on the historical basis of these statements.

if taken in regard to philosophies, future and potentials, they may be taken as opinions supported by historical facts.

Given those opinions, what would you recommend as a solution?

[Raman]

the very 'leaders and guides' you speak of, have been the doom of this experiential nexus.

the very concept of 'leader' is something that is contradictory to the positive vibration in the first place.

Is one to take these as statements of opinion, or as statements of fact?

There is technology based on Nikola Tesla's work that could allow free energy to be used for many things including space travel, food production, transportation, etc. However, it is being kept secret thanks to our governments, elites, etc. because then they can use money, petroleum, etc, to keep their power going unaltered.

They even have according to Ra vehicles capable of traveling half the speed of light, bases on the moon, etc.

Even 3d civilizations can do space travel as evidenced by the 3d entities from Sirius that interacted with Charlie Hixson.

---

this is probably one of the reasons why travel with external technology is universally abandoned into 5d.

Or gathered in timespace as opposed to spacetime by 'request'. Akin to Ra building the great pyramid.

[hogey11]

I must not have been clear enough earlier; I don't think Disclosure will 'increase the harvest' in any way. I think it will be a part of the harvest; not the moment of ascension, but a cog in the process. The reason that all these 3D limitations and restrictions won't apply is because we're ending the 3D cycle here and entering the 4th. Do any of us believe that we truly know how the quarantine is governed? Can it change? If so, when? I think disclosure will act as an opportunity for the world to put up or shut up. If you want to live in a higher vibrational spectrum than you do, you get one last good push. Like you said, we've all been given our lessons and catalyst; how we respond to something like disclosure would be a real test of those lessons. The window to respond in a positive way may be far shorter than any of us think (or longer, for that matter )

As far as the whole technology thing, I feel that it will be balanced with a shift in consciousness. That being said, if all needs were wiped out and like Raman says Free energies like those Tesla came up with were implemented, we probably wouldn't have near the problems we do now. I personally believe that if people have their needs covered and are able to do what they are passionate about (financial success or not), they are happy. This is possible for us if we are able to grasp the concept. Maybe a global financial collapse is what we need to achieve that; it could certainly be around the corner as well.


At some point, we have to accept that things are going to increasingly skew towards a 4D positive future. The last 30 years have been dark as the strongest of the STS on earth flexed their strength for their own harvest, but the time of learning and catalyst is coming to a close soon. When it does, the game will change, and i'm starting to get a little anxious trying to figure out how exactly :S

Anyone else out there getting kinda nervous? It seems like things are kinda coming to a point; the next 3 months or so will be very telling of our direction in the future.

[3DMonkey]

Maybe a global financial collapse is what we need to achieve that; it could certainly be around the corner as well.


At some point, we have to accept that things are going to increasingly skew towards a 4D positive future. The last 30 years have been dark as the strongest of the STS on earth flexed their strength for their own harvest, but the time of learning and catalyst is coming to a close soon. When it does, the game will change, and i'm starting to get a little anxious trying to figure out how exactly :S

Anyone else out there getting kinda nervous? It seems like things are kinda coming to a point; the next 3 months or so will be very telling of our direction in the future.

In all of our studies, one thing is constant- that things like financial crises don't happen by accident. In that sense, they will be a sign of changing times.
The game? One option for the new game will be to apply (not announce) a pseudo disclosure. This will be the kind fabricated that government and science together have found a way to contact extraterrestrial people. This will shape new policies and new organizational motivations. This is why I am very firm that any disclosure, other than in my very own back yard, will be bullshit.

As for fourth density, I don't feel it. I don't see it. There comes a point in my time where I must put my foot down and say "show me". This time is fast approaching. Everything to this point is hearsay, from near death experience to past life regression to alien contact to telekinesis. .... Show me.

[Oceania]

you can find out for yourself. they can't force that on you. but i agree, i'm skeptical as well just cuz we could be played. Ra could be a sham of the dark forces.

[3DMonkey]

Ra could be. But here is another idea. Ra, if we give them the stature of alien from another planet, could be motivated only to shift our thinking because in shifting our thinking they provide a nudge of the Earth. What I mean by this is that they could have had no interest in telling us the future. BUT, if there is only now (as we like to say), then what they were truly doing was affecting the Now by changing the way we view the future. The future need not happen at all like what Ra said, we only need to THINK it will to affect the now that we experience. And THIS could very possibly be the entire focus by Ra...... Making us puppets.... again

---

I can find out for myself? How? Show me.

[Confused]

Ra could be a sham of the dark forces.

What??!!!

If you really meant that, dear Oceania, then it is the most radical statement out here at b4th! Ra may have definitely been very clumsy in dealing with us Gaians. They might have even been wanting on the research front, unlike the thorough research the Orion folks seem to do. However, it does not definitely seem like they are a decoy for the forces of darkness. Their intentions were definitely good, I guess, but the implementation was awful. That is a pity, given how much they seem to know even about specific psychological motivations of various individuals. At this point, we can only put it down to mystery. I still trust Ra, for I believe they had the best of intentions for us. However, may be the dedication of the Orion to their task and their discipline trumped many of Ra's interventions (probably).

---

Show me.

Is this some sort of a new mantra!!

Let me coin it like this -- "Om Show Me Namaha"

[3DMonkey]

We all have the best of intentions, don't we?

[Confused]

We all have the best of intentions, don't we?

I understand. During the Cold War, the Americans had the best of intentions for their country and the Soviets for their own. However, for an American, the intentions of the Soviets would have definitely appeared not 'so friendly' and vice versa!

[3DMonkey]

Exactly. This is why I gave you "the answers" in the treehouse. I said "Everyone is a genius". Look at us, ALL. We each have the answers for the world. We all know what is best. But, as you point out, everybody else is wrong. This is the dynamic of human existence from the very beginning. There is nothing new under the sun. We haven't changed one single bit. We love to argue. We love to say if, if, if. This world is what it is because we are who we are, the "good", the "bad", and the indifferent.

[unity100]

if taken historically, they are statements of fact.

Please expand on the historical basis of these statements.]

aside from what raman said regarding a specific case in our time (free energy), if one is affiliated with history in any way, be it education or hobby, s/he would see that entire known human history is one of controlling of masses through various means by minorities. these minorities may be any kind of minority that gains power through any means. the 'leadership' or qualified to lead theme is a recurring one that keeps repeating through various reasons and justifications. entities in power then proceed to profit self, or impose their world view on the masses.

and the result is history being a story of endless series of problems and troubles that this have brought. the former is more common - profiting and betterment of the groups perceived as the elite. the latter is rarer - imposition of world view for philosophical reasons.

Given those opinions, what would you recommend as a solution?

this much technology and mental capacity should not have been given to 3d entities. especially quite early like it happened on this planet. it enables a minority to hold power over the masses - something which they would not be able to do if it was otherwise.

the solution is to take technology away from this planet, including mental capacity to create such technology. this civilization needs to have only as much as their spiritual advancement average (negative or positive) allows. now there is too much.

---

We all have the best of intentions, don't we?

I understand. During the Cold War, the Americans had the best of intentions for their country and the Soviets for their own. However, for an American, the intentions of the Soviets would have definitely appeared not 'so friendly' and vice versa!

ironically intentions of americans had done worse damage to americans than intentions of soviets.

[Confused]

Exactly. This is why I gave you "the answers" in the treehouse. I said "Everyone is a genius". Look at us, ALL.

True, 3. I agree. If we are all holograms of the ONE containing its entire infinite essence, then what you say is a simple logical extension. One that is difficult to understand and implement under the current veil, especially due to the grossness of the human frame. The human frame is the most dense form of separation, in my opinion. As Ra said, it permitted growth!! :-/

---

ironically intentions of americans had done worse damage to americans than intentions of soviets.

In geo-political games motivated by the most purest form of STS type behaviour, no one comes out unscathed, I guess. Yet, I believe the US has been a force for good in the world. However, I might be singing a different tune altogether if I happened to be a mother in Iraq, who lost her little child to an arbitrary US raid. It is a sad state of affairs.

[3DMonkey]

it permitted growth!! :-/

That sounds like layman's term for cancer - "it's a growth"

[Tenet Nosce]

aside from what raman said regarding a specific case in our time (free energy), if one is affiliated with history in any way, be it education or hobby, s/he would see that entire known human history is one of controlling of masses through various means by minorities. these minorities may be any kind of minority that gains power through any means. the 'leadership' or qualified to lead theme is a recurring one that keeps repeating through various reasons and justifications. entities in power then proceed to profit self, or impose their world view on the masses.

So, in consideration of these distortions/tendencies, what can be done to reduce the recurrence of this pattern in the next round of 3D? I am thinking that those who have already gained experience on a previous cycle would polarize more rapidly in the next round.

Assuming no "outside" interference from higher densities, how could those 3D entities with previous incarnations be of service to others who are new to 3D, while avoiding the trap of elitism? It just seems completely outside the bounds of human behavior for people not to mimic one another, and to form some kind of consensus around behavior based upon the example of others.

Even if those with extensive 3D experience had no conscious awareness of said experience, I can only assume that they would learn certain lessons more rapidly, resulting in an increase of harmony in their personal lives, which would naturally be emulated by others. Are you suggesting to attempt to avoid this completely? If so, I am not sure how it could be accomplished.

the solution is to take technology away from this planet, including mental capacity to create such technology. this civilization needs to have only as much as their spiritual advancement average (negative or positive) allows. now there is too much.

What comes to mind would be for those who did not graduate to reincarnate into pre-Adamic bodies, more like the Neanderthal-type, such that certain thought patterns are simply not able to be received by the brain. Then, simply wait however long it takes for higher functions to develop on their own, naturally. Is this similar to what you have in mind? Or if not, please describe.

Also, what would be done with respect to the degree of veiling? How would a lighter or heavier veil affect the process?

[Oldern]

Just some comments to this huge argument.
There are no puppets. There are no puppet masters at that level.
You can be told otherwise, you can even be told that you will be manipulated by "dark forces" (that is never even a word.."dark". What is dark?)

The whole assumption that anything Ra did was "wrong" is mind-boggling to me. It is the thinking that people like to use even when someone hands them a helping hand. "Do you want something in return? Or you will want something later? Stop mainpulating me! I HATE YOU!"

Really, sometimes we have to realize and love, and be thankful to others without twists. Just look at our dogs, for "god's sake". They can love their owners without any "but"'s. No but's. They just love and serve, even when the owner is an alcoholic dog-beater lost soul. Even then. I have seen it, and it was painful to see. Yet the love is unconditional.

The best things in this world come from unconditional faith and love. I do not care about the mistakes of Ra, if any, in that regard. I am simply thankful for them for trying to help us all. Analyzis can come when I am at their level, and that, in the non-distant future could be only achieved when between incarnations, or not even then. Right now, I am just a spark of what they truly are.

[unity100]

Yet, I believe the US has been a force for good in the world. However, I might be singing a different tune altogether if I happened to be a mother in Iraq, who lost her little child to an arbitrary US raid. It is a sad state of affairs.

that is short sighted back towards into history. what happened in iraq is a very recent endeavor compared to endless number of similar or worse situations created by the 'force for good', in an endless number of ways. i will cite one below.

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/US_Thi...ators.html

So, in consideration of these distortions/tendencies, what can be done to reduce the recurrence of this pattern in the next round of 3D?

the mental capacity of entities should be lower, or the capacity to effect this mental capacity to physical or other manipulation of environment should be lower. however since higher mental capacity with less capacity to use it would create an imbalance and create various problems, the mental capacity and the capacity to reflect this mental prowess to outside environment should be equal, but their combination lower.

external messing from any source at any point should not be allowed - positive or negative, in regard to technology or genetic modification. this would probably require that the body used in the cycle where these entities go be compatible with its environment, as opposed to the intentionally weaker body that this logos chose to push entities to positive by forcing them to help each other against the environment to survive.

appropriateness is an important concept. everything is fit, perfect and beautiful in their proper place and time. something early, or late, creates issues and sticks out.

additionally veil should be thinner. too thick a veil is illogical. why not go all the way with totally blocking conscious/subconscious interaction ? you cant - because that would create dysfunctional entities to utmost degree, probably even for 2d, even if it resulted in entities which could survive. and that is also questionable.

entities should choose their path not with random circumstances happening in a heavy veiled, therefore, spiritually devoid environment, but an environment in which they can feel different instreaming energies and choose what they want to pursue. this would eliminate need for stuff like channeling and whatnot - they are not actually efficient - one entity brings in information, and it disperses to other entities through words. 1 entity receives instreamings as opposed to millions. then it is hoped that the other entities will choose whatever they want with resonating with the words that are written, and then try to tune with the energies of that source to the best of their ability.

it is nonsensical, and also an act like showing one's left ear with the right hand. by lightening the veil entities will not need intermediaries and then a game of hope for the best to choose and pull energies they desire.

of course, all this talk is balooney. since the conditions that will be there in the place these entities will go, will be dependent on what the logos of that locale chose for archetypes, veil thickness, this and that, and also the spiritual history of the planet up to that point. if we look at what Ra says, these people will be placed in experiential nexuses compatible with their biases as much as possible. considering also close logoi tend to choose similar archetypes, we can say that these entities will go somewhere near, to a logos not too unlike us, if available. their conditions will approximate with their biases as much as possible, probably.

I am thinking that those who have already gained experience on a previous cycle would polarize more rapidly in the next round.

that is dependent on circumstances wherever they incarnate.

Assuming no "outside" interference from higher densities, how could those 3D entities with previous incarnations be of service to others who are new to 3D, while avoiding the trap of elitism? It just seems completely outside the bounds of human behavior for people not to mimic one another, and to form some kind of consensus around behavior based upon the example of others.

one entity should not be able to be power over many entities through any means. technology or other means. the more disparage allowed in between capacities of entities through internal or external means, the more imbalance there is.

the necessity here is something like communism - entities should be equal in everything, but the power of their spirit. actually spirits too powerful compared to others should not be allowed to incarnate with weaker populations than themselves, this is also a problem. that would create any kind of imbalance in positive, or negative way.

instead what needs to happen would be entities being only as much powerful as the numbers of entities following their particular chosen path. (not only in a positive/negative way, including any kind of vibrational preference in regard to energies). in short, entities should have to be members of their society by participating.

Even if those with extensive 3D experience had no conscious awareness of said experience, I can only assume that they would learn certain lessons more rapidly, resulting in an increase of harmony in their personal lives, which would naturally be emulated by others. Are you suggesting to attempt to avoid this completely? If so, I am not sure how it could be accomplished.

positive/negative preference (and the extent of that polarization) is a choice and bias of spirit. it is not something that is relevant to particulars of past experiences of the entity than it is relevant to the distilled spiritual meaning of those experiences. and when you transplant an entity to another 3d planet, what play that is being staged there is same with what play that was being played here, albeit with different costumes and decor. the gist of the act is the same. what is needed would be to place the entity in an environment that is most compatible with its mind/spirit biases, however these may be. granted, there may be some preference of entity in these highest biases, like maybe it may be more comfortable in a body that lives in sea than land, or vice versa or similar.

[Confused]

that is short sighted back towards into history. what happened in iraq is a very recent endeavor compared to endless number of similar or worse situations created by the 'force for good', in an endless number of ways. i will cite one below.

Thanks for the link, unity100. Includes the most oppressive men in history in recent times.

A common thread runs through in all the support given -- Corporate Interests and Greed for money.

[Raman]

Unity wrote.
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....[...]the mental capacity of entities should be lower, ....[...]

etc...

Those are many conclusions, ideas, etc...that possibly each need a thread of its own..

However, Venus had same veil characteristics and the 3d evolution was harmonious. So the veil situation appears to be not so clear here. It is true that their social complex was composed of 'Ra people' as opposed to this planet's diverse composition, however, Maldek and Mars as far as I know were also fairly homogeneous, at least there is nothing in The Ra Material to suggest otherwise.

So the homogeneity of the population does not seem a big factor neither...although the conditions on Maldek and Mars that led to what occurred in both of those planets are different, with much more negativity or service to self in Maldek.

But it seems there was no quarantine in Maldek and or Mars.

So here was earth a third density planet just begun its fresh first cycle and it was seeded with 3d life forms not originally from the planet.

Denebians also formed part and who knows who else. And it seems Deneb is about 1300-1500 light years away. Not from this sublogos for sure (although relatively close).

Another factor is the opposable thumb.

So the quarantine was created by the guardians because seemgly there was an infraction of free will by seeding this earth with a different planet's 3d entities, maybe becasue they were already in the middle cycle instead of the very beginning, and also the genetic manipulation that occurred with that transplantation.

But this seemingly also occurred because Mars destruction (or atmosphere paralyzing 3d in the planet) was (seemingly) [i/accidental[/i] not intentional.

Maldekians resolved the issue by karmic restitution, Martians?----it seems the SMC that transplanted them did not respect(?) their free will.

So is/are the situation/s that you are portraying just referring to earth's?

Would have been a better idea to have transferred Martians to another planet in a 3d environment that does not allow opposable thumbs, etc?

It was a GUARDIAN who did this. A positive entity, by the way.

Nonetheless, in spite of all this, earth will be a 4d positive planet. Although the harvest is mixed.

It seems to me that the 3d unharvestables would have more opportunity to graduate in a planet where 3d entities are plants, water based or amphibians without possibility of developing nuclear weapons or contamination that could destroy a biosphere.

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that is short sighted back towards into history. what happened in iraq is a very recent endeavor compared to endless number of similar or worse situations created by the 'force for good', in an endless number of ways. i will cite one below.

Thanks for the link, unity100. Includes the most oppressive men in history in recent times.

A common thread runs through in all the support given -- Corporate Interests and Greed for money.

I find interesting that the Confederation gave technological information to the Soviets at the time to balance what the US had from Tesla.

[Raman]

Seems to me those conditions are (or most possibly are ) limited to this 'galaxy' (solar system ---> sub-Logos).