3D to 4D: Sudden or Gradual? A great read...(David Wilcock interview)

[Raman]

Seems to me: wandereres are (for harvest practical purposes) vibrating on 3d bodies; dual-activated not...

At this end of the cycle, we are talking about the quantum jump that takes place 3d-4d change in vibrations in space-time and dual activated are able to vibrate at this level or at least withstand it while a purely 3d cannot.

Then wanderers should be "harvested" as they vibrate on purely 3d bodies and any karmic debts resolved at harvest...unless you are a wanderer who incarnated in dual activated bodies but then you are 4d...

6d wanderers unless I'm mistaken, are incarnated in 3d bodies.

Any karmic issues for dual activated should be deal with after harvest when 3d death ("according to 3d necessities") occur, as usually is deal with (after death)...

Any other ideas?

[3DMonkey]

Karma is so detailed and connected by a vast web, it's really not something necessary to consider. Those 'crews' in time/space sort that out.

[kycahi]

you shouldnt look at any study guides etc while reading Ra material. especially for the first time. a 'study guide' contains the biases and perceptions of the entity who wrote it, regardless of who s/he is.

you should find a calm, silent place in which you wont be disturbed by anyone, and then read the material in physical form (maybe getting books or downloading the free pdfs and printing them) by yourself.

When I first read the Material, I didn't have no stinking study guide (think Blazing Saddles). In fact, after I kind of fell into place with it, I thought of writing one myself. I then understood that my guide would reveal more what I didn't get yet than help anybody else.

I had paper copies because the net didn't exist yet and, for a long time I wanted to treat the books with the respect that they deserved. Later I decided that margin notes and highlighters customized the material just for me. I did make the notes in pencil though.

If you can highlight your pdf file, that probably will do the trick. Otherwise, print it out a session at a time to mark up.

---

Karma is so detailed and connected by a vast web, it's really not something necessary to consider. Those 'crews' in time/space sort that out.

Exactly right. In fact, the "karma" baggage that you have in this life is your own programming. Then, in the subsequent time/space, you are the captain of that crew. :idea:

[3DMonkey]

That was to be inferred. Cap'n

[native]

I'm leaning towards the notion that the shift in perception involves seeing more clearly the noumenal underpinnings of reality vs that of the phenomenal. Indeed, it seems that 4d 'matter' is of this noumenal nature, which corresponds to the realm of ideas. Increased clarity means increased utility, so more and more formative.

I'd agree. I didn't mean to necessarily say that 4d beings would be responsible for manifesting the reality, but rather, as a collective with increased clarity the experience becomes more rooted as you put it, and in this way the collective perception gradually shifts.

In relation to form, it's interesting how in an altered state you view the exterior illusion entirely as form. Things can become symbolic, or you look at an object and understand how consciousness went into creating its being.

[Etude in B Minor]

"As the green-ray cycle or the density of love and understanding begins to take shape the yellow-ray plane or Earth which you now enjoy in your dance will cease to be inhabited for some period of your space/time as the space/time necessary for fourth-density entities to learn their ability to shield their density from that of third is learned."

Note that the Ra quote does not say that 4D "entities" learn to shield themselves from 3D, but learn how to shield the density. So this is a property of the sphere, and presumably the collective effort of the 4D entities living in the sphere.

Also, the quote above says that the 3D sphere will be "uninhabited" for the time needed for the 4D entities to learn to shield the density. This argues against any transitional 3D/4D bodies being present. It implies that right now (before harvest) there are dual 3D/4D entities present on this 3D sphere which can presumable also function on the 4D sphere but that after harvest, only the 4D sphere will be inhabited.

[zenmaster]

In relation to form, it's interesting how in an altered state you view the exterior illusion entirely as form. Things can become symbolic, or you look at an object and understand how consciousness went into creating its being.

That's 'gnosis', a natural consequence of 'polarity'.

[3DMonkey]

"As the green-ray cycle or the density of love and understanding begins to take shape the yellow-ray plane or Earth which you now enjoy in your dance will cease to be inhabited for some period of your space/time as the space/time necessary for fourth-density entities to learn their ability to shield their density from that of third is learned."

Note that the Ra quote does not say that 4D "entities" learn to shield themselves from 3D, but learn how to shield the density. So this is a property of the sphere, and presumably the collective effort of the 4D entities living in the sphere.

Also, the quote above says that the 3D sphere will be "uninhabited" for the time needed for the 4D entities to learn to shield the density. This argues against any transitional 3D/4D bodies being present. It implies that right now (before harvest) there are dual 3D/4D entities present on this 3D sphere which can presumable also function on the 4D sphere but that after harvest, only the 4D sphere will be inhabited.

It doesn't necessarily argue against transitional space/time. It is not exact at which point the learning begins. It is also not clear that at some point in the transitional evolution that the dual-bodies slowly begin to exist on a plane that is technically not this Earth that we now enjoy.

Don't forget how technical Ra is, and we certainly aren't understanding what a plane is or how many there are in the planetary influence.

[native]

That's 'gnosis', a natural consequence of 'polarity'.

What do you mean natural consequence of polarity? I went off on a tangent making the connection on how objects are first created in the mind, then we physically create them thus melding a thought form with it. So in the altered state you look at a chair, and understand that there is a conscious thought form flowing through it. You see how everything is a manifestation of the mind..everything is a creation.

Maybe this is why Ra says man-made 3d artifacts will vanish, because the yellow ray consciousness that created them is going to deactivate for a period.

But I understand what you're saying about forms (not thought forms) being hierarchical and we'll see these concepts begin to manifest as we perceive and work with them.

[zenmaster]

That's 'gnosis', a natural consequence of 'polarity'.

What do you mean natural consequence of polarity?

To see the nature of a thing requires seeing the nature of the self to same degree. Ra calls that 'polarity'.

I went off on a tangent making the connection on how objects are first created in the mind, then we physically create them thus melding a thought form with it. So in the altered state you look at a chair, and understand that there is a conscious thought form flowing through it. You see how everything is a manifestation of the mind..everything is a creation.

Yes, that's 'gnosis'.

Maybe this is why Ra says man-made 3d artifacts will vanish, because the yellow ray consciousness that created them is going to deactivate for a period.

But I understand what you're saying about forms (not thought forms) being hierarchical and we'll see these concepts begin to manifest as we perceive and work with them.

There things we observe, and the more fundamental principles or 'ideas' of these things, from which they arise to our senses (as exterior or space/time objects) 'Seeing' at that gnostic level we can see the object as an 'interior' (time/space). That's where the notions of realm of forms, or symbolism, comes from. Intention or will influences the principles, prior to their manifestation as things. The influence itself is also a 'thing' or an energy, prior to form.

[unity100]

Note that the Ra quote does not say that 4D "entities" learn to shield themselves from 3D, but learn how to shield the density. So this is a property of the sphere, and presumably the collective effort of the 4D entities living in the sphere.

if this is a property of sphere, then it reinforces what has been discussed before - 4d entities shape their own sphere. the 4d sphere coincides with 3d sphere now, because the 3-4d entities that are vibrating in 4th spectrum are currently living in the 3d sphere 3d entities have created before.

so, it seems, entities create the sphere.

Also, the quote above says that the 3D sphere will be "uninhabited" for the time needed for the 4D entities to learn to shield the density. This argues against any transitional 3D/4D bodies being present. It implies that right now (before harvest) there are dual 3D/4D entities present on this 3D sphere which can presumable also function on the 4D sphere but that after harvest, only the 4D sphere will be inhabited.

that wouldnt be a necessity if 3-4d bodies are populated with harvested 4d entities. the entities already are 4d, and 3-4d bodies can withstand 4d vibrations, but, what's more,

3-4d entities are forming the 4d sphere and 4d bodies that support that sphere.

[Etude in B Minor]

If entities create a sphere, then how could a sphere be uninhabited? Wouldn't the sphere disappear rather than be uninhabited? In my opinion, the sphere exists independently of the entities inhabiting it. Also, I don't believe that the 3D and 4D spheres are coincident. I believe that they are separate, but 3D entities could perceive the 4D sphere unless it is shielded from view. Dual 3D/4D can exist in either one.

[unity100]

the sphere consists of a lot of things, including, but not limited to, artefacts and thought forms in that sphere. (and also vibration).

in regard to 3d and 4d spheres being congruent :

http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...c=1&ss=1#8

Meanwhile there is another sphere, congruent to a great extent with yellow ray, forming. This fourth-density sphere coexists with first, second, and third. It is of a denser nature due to the rotational core atomic aspects of its material. We have discussed this subject with you.

moreover, 3 consecutive quotes in the below link express that 4d sphere is being populated indeed, and those populating it are 3-4d transitionary entities :

http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...=1&ss=1#21

also below :

http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...=1&ss=1#25

btw the below means 2d consciousness complexes being possible, despite there are none on this planet as of now :

http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...=1&ss=1#17

about planetary consciousness being orange ray :

http://lawofone.info/results.php?session...=1&ss=1#11

40.11 Questioner: Starting then, forty-five years ago, and taking the entire increase of vibration that we will experience in this density change, approximately what percentage through this increase in vibrational change are we right now?

Ra: I am Ra. The vibratory nature of your environment is true color, green. This is at this time heavily over-woven with the orange ray of planetary consciousness. However, the nature of quanta is such that the movement over the boundary is that of discrete placement of vibratory level.

the boat experience i relayed, pertains to this situation.

[3DMonkey]

If entities create a sphere, then how could a sphere be uninhabited? Wouldn't the sphere disappear rather than be uninhabited? In my opinion, the sphere exists independently of the entities inhabiting it. Also, I don't believe that the 3D and 4D spheres are coincident. I believe that they are separate, but 3D entities could perceive the 4D sphere unless it is shielded from view. Dual 3D/4D can exist in either one.

Oh yeah! I forgot about all the time/space entities. It's one of the mysteries.

Look at, there's gotta be 4D entities in time/space for the green Ray sphere to begin, right. Ra says the current green Ray exists majority in time/space. Another great question would be did the 4Ds in t/s all come from this harvest or did the first ones arrive from other areas of universe?

Get it? Uni verse. One original thought.

[Oceania]

how can the dual entities exist in either when they have the veiled 3d? i mean i guess they can exist in it but can they fully see it with the veil?

[Etude in B Minor]

after harvest the veil goes away and the dual 3d/4d can see/act in both spheres.

[3DMonkey]

If entities create a sphere, then how could a sphere be uninhabited? Wouldn't the sphere disappear rather than be uninhabited? In my opinion, the sphere exists independently of the entities inhabiting it. Also, I don't believe that the 3D and 4D spheres are coincident. I believe that they are separate, but 3D entities could perceive the 4D sphere unless it is shielded from view. Dual 3D/4D can exist in either one.

Oh yeah! I forgot about all the time/space entities. It's one of the mysteries.

Look at, there's gotta be 4D entities in time/space for the green Ray sphere to begin, right. Ra says the current green Ray exists majority in time/space. Another great question would be did the 4Ds in t/s all come from this harvest or did the first ones arrive from other areas of universe?

Get it? Uni verse. One original thought.

[zenmaster]

after harvest the veil goes away and the dual 3d/4d can see/act in both spheres.

How long after? A couple thousand years, perhaps?

[Oceania]

3d can't stay alive without the veil. the body would die.

[zenmaster]

3d can't stay alive without the veil. the body would die.

The 'veil' is just a function of the mechanics of the 3D brain.

[Oceania]

well i still maintain without the veil we'd leave the 3d body.

[zenmaster]

well i still maintain without the veil we'd leave the 3d body.

Doesn't make much sense. The veil is responsible for the catalytic (and therefore polarizing) opportunities of 3D. It doesn't sustain the body. Without the veil, and after death, when we can see the broad scope of things, we would necessarily choose to incarnate in a space/time that would allow for further learning. If it's more 3D, then it's more 3D elsewhere.

[Etude in B Minor]

there are/were 3D types without the veil, e.g. near the galactic center. Also, adepts that go through the gateway to intelligent infinity pierce the veil.

[Bring4th_Steve]

Guys, something strange is happening every time I reference the Law of One, every time I wrote it with a capital L small o and large O together, after I post it becomes all caps....

Hi Tom, we have word formatters on the forum to help spruce up certain terminology. The "Law of One" is a proper noun, so that particular word gets revamped if someone writes it in lower case. It is solely to improve legibility and maintain consistency across the thousands of messages written by everyone to date.

Steve

[3DMonkey]

Ocean, even if you are correct, there is still an idea out there that the veil will be thinning over time.
Just an idea; nothing directly from Ra.

[Oceania]

thin veil is still a veil, what i mean is if you understand it all you pop out of space/time.

[zenmaster]

thin veil is still a veil, what i mean is if you understand it all you pop out of space/time.

That doesn't make any sense either. The entire 4th density is learning to understand, without the veil, and that takes about 30 million years.

[3DMonkey]

thin veil is still a veil, what i mean is if you understand it all you pop out of space/time.

That doesn't make any sense either. The entire 4th density is learning to understand, without the veil, and that takes about 30 million years.

I know. It's essential to keep in mind that the next step isn't so grand as we might think.

Something will most definitely "pop" if the veil vanished. Taking it that way, it makes sense.

[Oceania]

well Bashar says something to that effect. Zen, i'm not talking about 4d, of course we have no veil there. i'm saying 3d people without a veil would pop out of space/time afaics.

[Bring4th_Steve]

3d can't stay alive without the veil. the body would die.

The 'veil' is just a function of the mechanics of the 3D brain.

Zenmaster, not sure that the veil has anything to do with mechanics of the brain. Consider what Ra had to say on the matter:

Questioner: This veil then occurs between what we now call the unconscious and conscious minds. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct.

Ra: I am Ra. Firstly, let us establish that both before and after the veil the same conditions existed in time/space; that is, the veiling process is a space/time phenomenon.

It can be inferred that the veil is a noun/state, not a verb/function.

Food for thought...
Steve