Tolerance and spirituality are not the same thing

[3-24-2022]

This is a thought I've had for a while that arose from reading older threads about the state of the Middle East, and in a way is relevant because a lot of discussion around here centers around Egypt.

I think that spirituality is a blanket term, often confused with religion when a significant number of people call themselves spiritual but not religious.

Exploration of your inner mind and being are not necessarily spiritual activities. I mean that the term is too broad to really define what meditation is about, not that it isn't relevant. Meditation does not need to be described as a spiritual or religious activity.

I only point this out to share a perspective. Not to dismiss the term, I just think that depending on who you talk to, it may be a better way of communicating your interest without being thought of as a religious person or a believer in fortune telling by calling meditation your way of developing inner awareness.

The Middle East today is not a tolerant place, however it is a very spiritual place. There are countless "spiritual" people if you count religion as spirituality.

Women do not have as many rights, and LGBT people are often attacked and killed far more frequently compared to other parts of the world. Many people do not tolerate each other on the basis of religion.

I think the world needs more tolerance, not necessarily more spirituality I think it needs more people exploring their inner awareness and choosing to not be followers.

Tolerance is accepting people even if they bother you and not behaving violently. There are places where women and LGBTs have rights but it does not mean those nations are perfect if there is violence. Tolerance does not mean being best friends with everyone in the world. It means living and letting live.

This is not a criticism of the term "spirituality" I just think it has too many meanings to be interpreted correctly.

I am not discriminating against any one group of people or part of the world, just sharing my thoughts about how things are today.

[jafar]

Middle East religion are predominantly:
1. The religion of Judaism
2. The religion of Christianity
3. The religion of Islam

And most of the dogmas from those 3 organized religions are primarily based on 'negative catalyst', using Ra's term.
Which are:
1. Fear
2. Control
3. Separation

The later is apparent as they view that "God" a.k.a "The Infinite Creator" lies outside of themselves (Yhvh, Jesus/Father, Allah)

In spirituality "dogmas" does not even exist.

Here's a video summarizing what Ra & Quo description on entity named "Yahweh", which I tend to agree.
(hint: the "Yahweh name" is later claimed as an identity by Orion group thus start broadcasting negative catalyst)

Q'uo and Ra on Yahweh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bu1Nv68vPX0&t=337s

Being "spiritual" and being "religious" is NOT the same thing.
Here's a good (although not perfect) summarization between "Spirituality" and "Religion"

[zedro]

Exploration of your inner mind and being are not necessarily spiritual activities.

I disagree, this is exactly what spirituality is, or at least where it starts.

I think the world needs more tolerance, not necessarily more spirituality I think it needs more people exploring their inner awareness and choosing to not be followers.

Spirituality can lead to 'true tolerance', that which comes from understanding one's inner morality, as opposed to only an external ethical parameter which could be cultivated ignorantly through cultural expectation, which is where intolerance mostly comes from. It is a more robust foundation, as tolerance/intolerance is merely action, whereas spirituality is thought. Spirituality gives tolerance meaning and a true inner anchor, rather than an external political reaction to various tropes/constructs. In fact, spirituality eliminates these constructs, making the concept of tolerance completely obsolete (I.e. Law of One)

This is not a criticism of the term "spirituality" I just think it has too many meanings to be interpreted correctly.

The only meaning that matters is the one you get from it. Worrying about a different interpretation being misused circles us back to intolerance.

Also people misappropriate the word spirituality with being 'good' or nice., it is not, it is neutral. Both polarizing positive and negative or STO/STS can be spiritually minded, and so a self aware/awakened negatively polarized individual may include a spiritual practice that uses intolerance as a tool.

So in respect of going towards 4d positive, tolerance alone without spiritual understanding is a half measure, and while it makes things more pleasant (when not weaponized into another form of intolerance like 'woke culture'), it alone may not be as significant is the Mind/Body/Spirit evolution as one might think.

[3-24-2022]

A therapist can devote his entire life to studying the inner mind of people and yet be a complete atheist in the fullest sense.

I am not implying anything negative, I say these things because many people have such a dismissive attitude if you describe yourself as spiritual, and if you have a message to share they may put you in to the same category as a missionary. I have recognized that different terms might be a better way to share your perspective.

I bet many people who are religious describe their lives as spiritual paths toward recognizing god and would be offended if you said otherwise, that if you claimed their spirituality was not authentic they would shake their head. I'd rather not be confused for a religious person even though I recognize they may find similar fulfillment in their approach. It reminds me of the thought lately I've had that I doubt Buddhist monasteries and orthodox Christian monasteries are much different from each other, but I imagine few people are interested in both because of biases people have.

[zedro]

A therapist can devote his entire life to studying the inner mind of people and yet be a complete atheist in the fullest sense.

Atheism and spirituality are not mutually exclusive. And the example given of "studying the inner mind" is highly subjective on what that means. That atheist therapist could inadvertently be more spiritually minded than a neophyte Monk even if they reject the concept.

Note that you could argue the Law of One material is not necessarily theistic either. How do you qualify it if everything in existence is the creator, or one thing? When someone asks me if I believe in God, it's virtually impossible to answer them because the question itself shows the limitations of their understanding, so giving an honest thoughtful and meaningful answer is probably impossible, at least in short order.

[jafar]

Ra and Quo gives a good advice on how to interact with those who deeply entangled in a dogmatic authoritarian organized religion.
Reach to them by focusing on the heart of the work. Torah, Gospel, Quran.

The way the 'negative' works on 'sharing' their negative catalyst are usually putting an additional layer on top of the heart / core of the work.

And then establishing an elite group which shall dictate to the masses thus ensuring the masses will focus on the 'additional layer' and not the heart / core of the work.
Ra and Quo explicitly mentioned "The Levites" as an example of the "elite group" that happened in Judaism.
But we now also aware about other label for the 'elite group', Priest or Church in Christianity, Mullah/Imam/Ulema in Islam.

They all share the exactly the same pattern and characteristics.
The flock (borrowing from Xtianity terminology) will then blindly obey anything that these 'elite group' said.
Thus "Dogma" was born...

Ra and Quo cite an example of how Jesus did it.
Being incarnated in the middle of Judaism tradition and grew up in it, he focuses on the core of the work in the Torah, which is:
"Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind…
the second is Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.”
-- Matt 22

[3-24-2022]

I wish that were true, that you could just get someone to adopt a tolerant attitude by referring to their book, but I am skeptical of that.

I think a lot of religious people with a dogmatic attitude have the idea that you following them or their leader would be the best outcome even after you said "sure you're 100% right about your beliefs." That is what I meant by criticizing being a follower.

Most of the older people I've spoken to have firmly pointed out that religion is used to control people to try to steer me away from being too interested, and I understand why.

I'm not trying to contradict you, just stating my opinions and there is an irony to thinking you need to "fix" anyone. I don't speak about these topics to people much, as the pandemic has isolated many people and I realized long ago that I am not going to be "saving" people.

[zedro]

I wish that were true, that you could just get someone to adopt a tolerant attitude by referring to their book, but I am skeptical of that.

I think a lot of religious people with a dogmatic attitude have the idea that you following them or their leader would be the best outcome even after you said "sure you're 100% right about your beliefs." That is what I meant by criticizing being a follower.

Most of the older people I've spoken to have firmly pointed out that religion is used to control people to try to steer me away from being too interested, and I understand why.

I'm not trying to contradict you, just stating my opinions and there is an irony to thinking you need to "fix" anyone. I don't speak about these topics to people much, as the pandemic has isolated many people and I realized long ago that I am not going to be "saving" people.

Your title talked of spirituality, but the above quote pertains to religion, which is a political construct. This is a spiritual based forum, not religious, so I'm not sure what your issue truly is, except for perhaps misunderstanding what spirituality is and what can be expected by it. The concept of tolerance is not rigid, it is also a social construct that can be manipulated, and the point is its value is only relevant through the spiritual lens.

While there are always great discussions to be had, it is amusing that this feels like someone joined a literary forum to extol the virtues of sports. It's all well and fine, but maybe further investigation and understanding is warranted into the material to which we are centered around here.

[jafar]

Try it, reorient the focus towards the heart of the teaching, some will adopt tolerant attitude and some will not.
What you're doing is offering your version of 'catalyst'.
The law of free will is paramount, the reception of the catalyst being offered is entirely up to every self.

Even 'negative' catalyst can resulted in positive reception, when the self decided to seek out the opposite.
Fear catalyst can be transmuted to trigger courage
Hatred catalyst can be transmuted to trigger love
Thus in it strange way, 'negative' catalyst can also act as a guidance to uncover the positive.

We do not need to 'fix' anyone, as the one infinite creator created everything based on the concept of 'opposing pair of polarity'.
Through opposite contrast;
Darkness makes the light recognizable.
Hatred makes the love recognizable.
Intolerance makes tolerance recognizable.

Thus there will always be someone who will be attracted to the negative while there will also always be someone who will be attracted to the positive.
Or in Ra's word, STS and STO, both are valid path, which will merge at one point.

[3-24-2022]

I think the point I am making is flying past you.

I don't remember which thread it was, but I was reading a thread where someone said the Middle East needs more spirituality in order to solve its problems

I was reading responses and someone said their heritage is very spiritual, their music their lifestyle.

I have a question do you think the world needs more and more spirituality to solve all of the problems people have? I do not think it is working or has worked. Maybe people find some common attitudes and peace but I am simply stating I think it is a confusing term because it is used too broadly. I am not the anti-spirit-christ.

I am simply stating that maybe tolerance or a combination of spirituality and tolerance is really what is needed. 

A religious preacher would be very in agreement saying the world needs more spirituality, and very offended if you did not consider them spiritual. This thread might sound ironic but I'm not dismissing spirituality I'm saying it is like saying the world needs more food when that food could be pure lard, pork and sugar OR olives and pomegranates. Sure some people might think their daily pork and candy might be great but truthfully there is so much variation in perspective that it doesn't work for everyone.

It is semantics I am pointing out. These days I do not use the term spiritual, I say your inner being or your inner self is what I think is interesting when it comes to reading about these topics.

An atheist, a therapist, and a monk would all agree that an inner mind exists but they'd argue endlessly about a spirit or what that even is.

[LeiwoUnion]

It hasn't worked partially because people are not honest with themselves what spirituality even means to them. It cannot be a means to an end.

[jafar]

All conflict in the world are caused by "Limited / Small Scoped Identity".
Whether the "Identity" is formed by nationality, religion, race, ethnicity, political party, ideology or even as menial as favorite football club or neighborhood.

From made up "Aryan identity" by the Nazis, "Chosen People" as defined by Judaism to "Believer/Devotee" as defined by other religion.

Through identity the self recognize "others" and label it as "THEM", and through shared identity the self label it as "US".
Separation is then being created, between US vs THEM.

What the world need to be peaceful and harmonious is to break those barrier of small scoped identity, or at least expand it to include as many as possible.

In Ra's Law of One context this mean start forming a 'social memory complex' (SMC).
Which naturally start to happened in 4th density.

A positive (STO) social memory complex respect the free will and uniqueness of each entity, thus 'tolerance' attitude is inherently implemented.

On the opposite side, negative (STS) social memory complex is based on forceful control, free will is vanquished replaced by total obedience, and maintained through fear, thus 'intolerance' attitude is inherently implemented.

Recognizing STO and STS can only be done through recognizing it's characteristic, and not merely label of "spirituality" or "not spirituality".
There are many STS agents / entities who actively lead a cult under the label of "spirituality".
By their fruits you will know them and not by the tree.

[zedro]

I think the point I am making is flying past you.

...

I have a question do you think the world needs more and more spirituality to solve all of the problems people have? I do not think it is working or has worked. 

I am not missing your point, I'm claiming you don't understand what spirituality is and how it is the ultimate solution to all things, like a master key.

More spirituality?  Or better spirituality? These adjectives are not suitable with the concept.

Again, I think you need to explore what spirituality actually means, what it's purpose ultimately is. Peace could be achieved with simple authoritarian control reinforcing manners (tolerance)...is this a better outcome? Is that the point of living, does it serve spiritual evolution to the next density and the Logos? Where does true sincere tolerance really come from? And do you understand how karma, polarity and catalyst create and maintain these environments? 

If the goal is merely to just get along, could we medicate people into a stupor and tie them into self serving materialism and identity instead? Would that shortcut be adequate despite the spiritual dead-end, to repeat that pattern lifetime after lifetime with no evolution, because it makes for a more pleasant incarnation? Or will it be ultimately doomed to degenerate because the true reasons behind tolerance have never been galvanized at a deeper level, which is the spiritual/ultimate understanding? 

I'll leave this here, as the discussion does not seem to be evolving past the constructs set in your question, I feel you should explore the LOO material more deeply to gain context on what is missing from your inquiry.

[Diana]

To me, the whole point of conscious evolution is thinking for one's self, not following an external source. When I say "thinking" I mean all that involves with the mind and deep mind. Obviously religion is dogma, and following any religion is not accessing an inner, self-instigated path but an outer, dogmatic path. As for spirituality, I agree we have entered the realm of semantics, because the word may mean anything at all to any individual. "Spirituality" it seems to me just acknowledges that there is a spirit which includes a larger understanding of existence than just the body and conscious mind and this one life we are consciously aware of.

In thinking for myself, I personally don't have any attachment to what anyone or thing says about my path. I resonate with some material such as Ra's, and I can get value or insights from anything at all, but I do not follow it as a result or "believe" it. I like to stay open to the flow of information and catalyst without rigidity.

That said, everyone's life and path are unique and "right" for them. If it takes following a very dogmatic religion for a person to recognize control and the idea of self-responsibility and accountability through that catalyst, and open up to a bigger picture, then that is good for them.

[MrWho]

Talking about tolerance with the Law of One in mind.

We have one particular quote that stands out.

Questioner: Thank you. Can you give me examples of catalytic action to produce learning under each of the following headings from the last session we had… Can you give me an example of the self unmanifested producing learning catalyst?

Ra: I am Ra. We observed your interest in the catalyst of pain. This experience is most common among your entities. The pain may be of the physical complex. More often it is of the mental and emotional complex. In some few cases the pain is spiritual in complex-nature. This creates a potential for learning. The lessons to be learned vary. Almost always these lessons include patience, tolerance, and the ability for the light touch.

Very often the catalyst for emotional pain, whether it be the death of the physical complex of one other-self which is loved or some other seeming loss, will simply result in the opposite, in a bitterness, an impatience, a souring. This is catalyst which has gone awry. In these cases, then, there will be additional catalyst provided to offer the unmanifested self further opportunities for discovering the self as all-sufficient Creator containing all that there is and full of joy.

https://www.lawofone.info/s/34#6

[Ming the Merciful]

Tolerance without love is not Spirituality. When we gain tolerance, it should be given equally to everybody we meet daily in our lives. Without question or prerequisites. No preconceptions of how we observe one person from another. Did not Jesus say, love your enemies? If a person lives a tolerant life, he has no enemies, only friends. Every person is a friend. Somebody maybe only an acquaintance, yet, he must also be respected. Without respect, there is no tolerance. Respect comes before tolerance. Love comes before respect. Even if somebody has an opposite and opposing view to you, you must first show love for that person, then respect and tolerance follows.

[LeiwoUnion]

Thank you for your post Ming the Merciful. It gave me a powerful realization and understanding regarding love, respect and tolerance. I contemplated and tried to drill into this but just could not see/feel the difference between these concepts, just couldn't. Very profound. Perhaps this is of interest to others as well.

[flofrog]

Thank you LeiwoUnion , for the initial question... . and Ming !!

There is an extraordinary peace when you come to this state and realize.... one should have reached that way earlier... lol.

it is indeed pretty blissful to live this way and the real way to suddenly realize, yes, everyone is myself indeed.

[3-24-2022]

Thank you all for engaging in thus discussion.

Jafar, I think it is very interesting how this "social memory complex" idea was developed before the Internet was available to everyday people and yet here we are discussing it 40 years later.

[jafar]

All conflict in the world are caused by "Limited / Small Scoped Identity".
Whether the "Identity" is formed by nationality, religion, race, ethnicity, political party, ideology or even as menial as favorite football club or neighborhood.

From made up "Aryan identity" by the Nazis, "Chosen People" as defined by Judaism to "Believer/Devotee" as defined by other religion.

Through identity the self recognize "others" and label it as "THEM", and through shared identity the self label it as "US".
Separation is then being created, between US vs THEM.

What the world need to be peaceful and harmonious is to break those barrier of small scoped identity, or at least expand it to include as many as possible.

As addition, I just found a wonderfully correlated answer from Quo on this "Limited Identification" thus "Uber Alles" attitude.
And how it relate to Middle East population and 3 of it's major (surviving) religion (Judaism, Christianity, Islam)

From: https://www.llresearch.org/channeling/2006/0321


The Guardians’ mistake was in creating better physical vehicle with the attitude that these physical vehicles were better and that the people that inhabited those physical vehicles were special. Naturally, the Guardians were very fond of the incoming population and felt great love for them, as they were placing them carefully and gently upon planet Earth to take up again their search for love.

What they did not anticipate was that the people themselves would feel that they were special. They were aware that their intellect [was more powerful] than other great-ape species that inhabited the Earth at that time. They felt privileged and special. And they created within themselves an attitude of “better than.”

The energy of the beings from the Red Planet was naturally somewhat progressive and fiery. They had demonstrated this aggression, this ability to wage war on their home planet and had succeeded in destroying the surface of it as an acceptable environment for third-density life. They carried these biases with them into third density upon this planet.

The very beginning of your cycle of third density upon planet Earth was nearly 76,000 of your years ago, by your counting. The [Martian population] incarnated in what you would call the Middle East and parts of Africa first, their thickest area of population in that area of the planet. Gradually they become the populations that you now know of as the Moslems, the Jewish people, the Palestinians, and others of Middle Eastern heritage.

As the population settled in and began their cycles of reincarnation to gain experience and learn the lessons of love, they spread out, becoming the populations that you now know as the Russian and Eastern Orthodox churches, the Christian church, and the Christian Protestant church as opposed to the Christian Roman Catholic church. All of these populations are heavily “larded” with those originally from planet Mars.

You will note that these entities comprise the bulk of those who believe in one God. The up-side in the belief in one Creator is that it is closer to that mystery of the Creator than the solution which posits many gods. It is our understanding that all things are one, and the infinite Creator is as single as Its universe and creation.

The down-side in believing in one God is that belief that only if you believe in that one God —and believe in a certain way— shall your soul reach heaven. This creates a bias within the religious, and oftentimes the political mind of those [who so believe] that there is their way or the highway, as this instrument would put it.

You will note that in the Moslem church, the Christian church, and in the church of the Jews that there is a strong tendency to exclude certain of their members who do not believe specifically in the points of dogma in which they hold to be true. The tendency of this energy of belief in one God, then, has its challenging aspects when it comes to using that religion as a springboard for the lessons of love.

If you will examine the writings that are at the heart of any of those three religions, you will find a mystical understanding of unity that is very similar between those three churches. However, for the entity that is living an everyday life, the tendency with dogmatic churches is to be very exclusionary and judgmental, so that an entity is told basically, “Either you believe the way we believe or you are consigned to one of the circles of Hell after you are dead.” They then feel that it is permissible and even desirable to proselytize and attempt to create that bias within those whom they meet.

This nest or web of actions is basically the end result of the Guardians, 75,000 years ago, making too many improvements on physical vehicles and creating pride and arrogance as a birthright of the new and improved human species. You may still see those energies playing themselves out in your Earth world at this time.

Many of those who come from the Red Planet have earned the right to graduate into fourth density. They have achieved that shift in consciousness from fear to love, from war to peace, from doubt to faith, and from despair to hope. There is no stigma in being from Mars, anymore than there is a stigma to anyone for being born of a certain genetic heritage.

[meadow-foreigner]

Mind is not Spirit.

[unity100]

Spirituality in the majority of organized religions is lacking. People are expected to obey rigid orders and commandments.

[Dtris]

Gonna stir the pot. Tolerance is bullshit. At it's core what does the word tolerate mean? It means you are condemning an action as wrong, or unacceptable, yet putting up with it anyways.

Acceptance is much better. I don't need to agree with someone to accept them. I don't need to believe what someone else believes to accept the person. But if someone shows up at my house and believes dogs should be eaten for dinner, I will accept them and their belief, but if they touch my dog they are outta here.

The middle east, just like other parts of the world, doesn't need to tolerate people they believe are wrong or evil. They need to accept them with a loving heart. They need to forgive each other and accept their differences, and figure out a way to live together.

Maybe I am jaded, but tolerance just breeds resentment IMO.

[LeiwoUnion]

I think this issue is subtle and nuanced.

Dtris, do you tolerate or accept taxes, or both? About the dog eating cultural concept; it seems to me that you tolerate the idea that people do it in their own countries, even if you'd visit them. Does tolerance engender acceptance or vice versa?

In my view tolerance is a wisdom based issue in a confused society when the others just aren't capable of matching your acceptance or direction of seeking. Within an SMC tolerance would be obsolete but again an issue of when dealing with other SMC's/beings with opposite polarity. I would assume that in 5th density this concept would be dropped completely. This is my understanding.

[3-24-2022]

All conflict in the world are caused by "Limited / Small Scoped Identity".
Whether the "Identity" is formed by nationality, religion, race, ethnicity, political party, ideology or even as menial as favorite football club or neighborhood.

From made up "Aryan identity" by the Nazis, "Chosen People" as defined by Judaism to "Believer/Devotee" as defined by other religion.

Through identity the self recognize "others" and label it as "THEM", and through shared identity the self label it as "US".
Separation is then being created, between US vs THEM.

What the world need to be peaceful and harmonious is to break those barrier of small scoped identity, or at least expand it to include as many as possible.

As addition, I just found a wonderfully correlated answer from Quo on this "Limited Identification" thus "Uber Alles" attitude.
And how it relate to Middle East population and 3 of it's major (surviving) religion (Judaism, Christianity, Islam)

From: https://www.llresearch.org/channeling/2006/0321


The Guardians’ mistake was in creating better physical vehicle with the attitude that these physical vehicles were better and that the people that inhabited those physical vehicles were special. Naturally, the Guardians were very fond of the incoming population and felt great love for them, as they were placing them carefully and gently upon planet Earth to take up again their search for love.

What they did not anticipate was that the people themselves would feel that they were special. They were aware that their intellect [was more powerful] than other great-ape species that inhabited the Earth at that time. They felt privileged and special. And they created within themselves an attitude of “better than.”

The energy of the beings from the Red Planet was naturally somewhat progressive and fiery. They had demonstrated this aggression, this ability to wage war on their home planet and had succeeded in destroying the surface of it as an acceptable environment for third-density life. They carried these biases with them into third density upon this planet.

The very beginning of your cycle of third density upon planet Earth was nearly 76,000 of your years ago, by your counting. The [Martian population] incarnated in what you would call the Middle East and parts of Africa first, their thickest area of population in that area of the planet. Gradually they become the populations that you now know of as the Moslems, the Jewish people, the Palestinians, and others of Middle Eastern heritage.

As the population settled in and began their cycles of reincarnation to gain experience and learn the lessons of love, they spread out, becoming the populations that you now know as the Russian and Eastern Orthodox churches, the Christian church, and the Christian Protestant church as opposed to the Christian Roman Catholic church. All of these populations are heavily “larded” with those originally from planet Mars.

You will note that these entities comprise the bulk of those who believe in one God. The up-side in the belief in one Creator is that it is closer to that mystery of the Creator than the solution which posits many gods. It is our understanding that all things are one, and the infinite Creator is as single as Its universe and creation.

The down-side in believing in one God is that belief that only if you believe in that one God —and believe in a certain way— shall your soul reach heaven. This creates a bias within the religious, and oftentimes the political mind of those [who so believe] that there is their way or the highway, as this instrument would put it.

You will note that in the Moslem church, the Christian church, and in the church of the Jews that there is a strong tendency to exclude certain of their members who do not believe specifically in the points of dogma in which they hold to be true. The tendency of this energy of belief in one God, then, has its challenging aspects when it comes to using that religion as a springboard for the lessons of love.

If you will examine the writings that are at the heart of any of those three religions, you will find a mystical understanding of unity that is very similar between those three churches. However, for the entity that is living an everyday life, the tendency with dogmatic churches is to be very exclusionary and judgmental, so that an entity is told basically, “Either you believe the way we believe or you are consigned to one of the circles of Hell after you are dead.” They then feel that it is permissible and even desirable to proselytize and attempt to create that bias within those whom they meet.

This nest or web of actions is basically the end result of the Guardians, 75,000 years ago, making too many improvements on physical vehicles and creating pride and arrogance as a birthright of the new and improved human species. You may still see those energies playing themselves out in your Earth world at this time.

Many of those who come from the Red Planet have earned the right to graduate into fourth density. They have achieved that shift in consciousness from fear to love, from war to peace, from doubt to faith, and from despair to hope. There is no stigma in being from Mars, anymore than there is a stigma to anyone for being born of a certain genetic heritage.

As I've pointed out before, I think it is very intriguing that Judaism originated in Egypt with Moses, and the Persian religion before Islam came about was Zoroastrianism. Both are thought to have been the first forms of monotheism or monolatry

Every day theres news of a rivalry between Iran/Afghanistan and Israel/Europe. Egypt is stuck somewhere in neutral territory.

[jafar]

Every day theres news of a rivalry between Iran/Afghanistan and Israel/Europe. Egypt is stuck somewhere in neutral territory.

Ra gave quite a description about 'who actually appeared and delivered messages to Moses'.
http://www.lawofonesociety.com/index.php...s%20Yahweh

Quo and Ra on Yahweh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bu1Nv68vPX0


Iran vs Israel conflict is a 'very recent development', started in 1979.
And it's more related to "middle east power grab" and not philosophical nor religious nor racial conflict.
As we speak there are Jewish representative in Iranian parliament. 
And today's Iran government has clearly stated that they're fighting Zionism (Nationalist Movement) and not Judaism (Religion) or Jewish people (Racial).
Yet as mentioned above such policy was implemented only in 1979.

The 'more traditional rival' of Iran, which was shiite majority country was actually the sunnis, started in 7th century.
The middle east history is full of 'holy war' between shiite vs sunnis which has happened for many centuries.
The conflict is very similar to Catholics vs Orthodox church.

A good documentary about how people living just few meters from each other, hate each others and literally shooting each others with automatic rifles.
North Lebanon: My Neighbour My Enemy,  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gdd-TfCMLYI

Whichever the conflicts there is a pattern.
Observe the pattern; it always started with "We are superior than them" attitude, (a.k.a 'the chosen people' vs 'the unchosen people', 'the believer' vs 'the unbeliever')

"It was a great temptation to consider the so-called social complex or sub-complex elite or different and better than other-selves, this is one of the techniques of service to self"
-- Ra, Session 18

[3-24-2022]

I left out the historic conflict between the Romans and Persians because I did not want to broaden the topic too widely, but if one considers this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman%E2%8...rsian_Wars

and the fact that Roman Catholicism emerged from Judaism, hence the term Judeo-Christian, it appears the conflict is older than 1979

[jafar]

What happened in 1979 is this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution

From there, it marked the end of "Imperial State of Iran/Pahlevi's Iran" and marked the beginning of "Islamic Republic of Iran".
The new leader then adopted an f-you stance against western powers and western 'agents' in Middle East.
Particularly; State of Israel, Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and (back then) Republic of Iraq (Saddam Hussein).
Yes Saddam Hussein were once loyal puppet of Washington.

It then marked the beginning of Iran receiving it's first 'punishment' (among many), invasion from Iraq.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War

As for the 'why' the new leader adopted f-you stance, this video might explain the origin.
CIA Oil Coup in Iran
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbEKMMtfujc

Thus it's too far and actually irrelevant to tie up today's Iran vs Israel conflict with ancient Roman vs Persian conflict.

For many centuries, the relationship between Jewish and Persian people are warm.
The only people explicitly mentioned with the title of "Yahweh's Mossiach", which then become "Kristos" in greek and become "Christ" in english, inside the Tanakh, is actually a Persian king named Cyrus. (Isaiah 45)
Isaiah 45 also explained why.

Cyrus is actually worth to be discussed here, since he's among the very rare of ancient king who adopted the stance of 'tolerance'.

Yet through many events happened throughout ages, there's always similar pattern that came up.
It always started with "We are superior than them" attitude and as Ra mentioned it's among the 'signature mark' of Service to Self.
The "We are superior than them" then drive the act of intolerance as part of conquering and putting 'others' beneath 'us'.

[3-24-2022]

I think you're ignoring the period when Spain was under control of the mideastern/african umayyads, the British-Afghan wars of the 1800s, the tale of Esther & Mordecai, and of course the crusades.

It's not true at all to say 1979 was the start of the historic conflict of Europe and the mideast/persia

Maybe between Jews, but even that is disputable.

I'm not saying this to sow division but just looking on a map and the language families

Judeo-Christian origins are the countries around the East mediterranean, Egypt, Israel, Greece, Rome.
The languages, the ideas of democracy, the tales of Moses & Christ.

To the East looking at a map you will see Saudi Arabia/Iran/Afghans while they have their conflicts, the east zone of that area is historically where Persia was.

[jafar]

Since 4th density is the density of love / understanding.
And we're on the topic of certain distortion relating to social complex of Iran as shown today, then one need to understand the sequence of events that lead to such as it happened sequentially. As every action has it's own sequential reaction/aftermath.

Today's Iran's distortion can be traced back to 1979 events which then traced back to CIA/British coup + assasination with objective to gain total control of oil in Iran.
Thus one can understand why one of their leader famously declared that "America is the great Satan, the wounded snake".
And why they have certain view that Israel, Saudi Arabia are among "The Great Satan's agents".