The Great Emptiness (or), the "Nothingness"

[Sacred Fool]

AS IT IS.

 
Yes, and a person's ability to perceive consciousness as it is is a function of their ability to encompass their own capacity for consciousness, which is what the quotations above discuss.  Emptiness, great or small, is not a real thing in itself, rather, it reflects back to the perceiver some aspects of self, of its own capacity for consciousness.
 

[Ming the Merciful]

Spirituality is illogical. At least in 3d. It requires blind faith to have any value to the entity it seems.

Yes Patrick, Spirituality is illogical. Although I would use Faith wisely too. Observation of the "Great Nothingness" is even beyond Faith. Acceptance is the word I would use. Almost to the point of accepting your Fate. Cycles within cycles, for an infinity of infinities. Timeless time and a multitude of Dimensions, and verging, (once again), on the incomprehensible. We are sitting on a knife-edge between three worlds. Logical, illogical and transcendental.

[Ming the Merciful]

AS IT IS.

 
Yes, and a person's ability to perceive consciousness as it is is a function of their ability to encompass their own capacity for consciousness, which is what the quotations above discuss.  Emptiness, great or small, is not a real thing in itself, rather, it reflects back to the perceiver some aspects of self, of its own capacity for consciousness.
 

Then the question arises, do we create our own Universe and the illusion of existence? Everything is perceived in Mind and the Mind is capable of encompassing the seen, (and the unseen). I exist, (therefore I exist). Everything outside of my "Self" is the "Emptiness". Sacred Fool, I cannot perceive your Emptiness because I have not created it, and it is of your own creation within your Mind. Therefore, from my existence, you then become part of the illusion, and that follows for everything else, (created and the uncreated). This is when it must become Transcendental and we are meeting on a Common Ground. Spirituality is somewhere within that place of Transcendentalism. The "Great Mystery", and the Great Mystery continues.

[Sacred Fool]

I exist, (therefore I exist).

That's an assumption, not a proof.

Everything outside of my "Self" is the "Emptiness".

Part of that which is outside yourself is that which your consciousness is not prepared to perceive.  Just because you are not perceiving something does not mean that it is empty.

Sacred Fool, I cannot perceive your Emptiness because I have not created it, and it is of your own creation within your Mind. Therefore, from my existence, you then become part of the illusion, and that follows for everything else, (created and the uncreated). This is when it must become Transcendental and we are meeting on a Common Ground. Spirituality is somewhere within that place of Transcendentalism. The "Great Mystery", and the Great Mystery continues.

I'll re-post this quote because it gives a more explicit explanation of what "becoming Transcendental
and meeting on Common Ground" means.  It discusses a progression of exploration in consciousness where enlightenment & emptiness are not the goals.

The mind is a complex which reflects the inpourings of the spirit and the up-pourings of the body complex. It contains what you know as feelings, emotions, and intellectual thoughts in its more conscious complexities. Moving further down the tree of mind we see the intuition which is of the nature of the mind more in contact or in tune with the total beingness complex. Moving down to the roots of mind we find the progression of consciousness which gradually turns from the personal to the racial memory, to the cosmic influxes, and thus becomes a direct contactor of that shuttle which we call the spirit complex.

 

[Ming the Merciful]

I exist, (therefore I exist).

That's an assumption, not a proof.

Everything outside of my "Self" is the "Emptiness".

Part of that which is outside yourself is that which your consciousness is not prepared to perceive.  Just because you are not perceiving something does not mean that it is empty.

Sacred Fool, I cannot perceive your Emptiness because I have not created it, and it is of your own creation within your Mind. Therefore, from my existence, you then become part of the illusion, and that follows for everything else, (created and the uncreated). This is when it must become Transcendental and we are meeting on a Common Ground. Spirituality is somewhere within that place of Transcendentalism. The "Great Mystery", and the Great Mystery continues.

I'll re-post this quote because it gives a more explicit explanation of what "becoming Transcendental
and meeting on Common Ground" means.  It discusses a progression of exploration in consciousness where enlightenment & emptiness are not the goals.

The mind is a complex which reflects the inpourings of the spirit and the up-pourings of the body complex. It contains what you know as feelings, emotions, and intellectual thoughts in its more conscious complexities. Moving further down the tree of mind we see the intuition which is of the nature of the mind more in contact or in tune with the total beingness complex. Moving down to the roots of mind we find the progression of consciousness which gradually turns from the personal to the racial memory, to the cosmic influxes, and thus becomes a direct contactor of that shuttle which we call the spirit complex.

 

We are complex creatures and the Mind even more complicated. The biggest problem is, the Mind cannot analyze the Mind. Everything is only assumption and speculation. Although I agree with the quote. I am, (therefore I am), I am also Universal Mind, and it is rarely considered on the Gross Intellectual Level. Even Intuitive Mind is limited because it still remains in Self-Consciousness and the "I-ness". We must learn to expand our Consciousness on the "Grand Universal Scale", and not remain trapped in our feeble and limited worldview, (our created worlds).

[Sacred Fool]

Ra 30.2The mind is a complex which reflects the inpourings of the spirit and the up-pourings of the body complex. It contains what you know as feelings, emotions, and intellectual thoughts in its more conscious complexities. Moving further down the tree of mind we see the intuition which is of the nature of the mind more in contact or in tune with the total beingness complex. Moving down to the roots of mind we find the progression of consciousness which gradually turns from the personal to the racial memory, to the cosmic influxes, and thus becomes a direct contactor of that shuttle which we call the spirit complex.

 

We are complex creatures and the Mind even more complicated. The biggest problem is, the Mind cannot analyze the Mind. Everything is only assumption and speculation. Although I agree with the quote. I am, (therefore I am), I am also Universal Mind, and it is rarely considered on the Gross Intellectual Level. Even Intuitive Mind is limited because it still remains in Self-Consciousness and the "I-ness". We must learn to expand our Consciousness on the "Grand Universal Scale", and not remain trapped in our feeble and limited worldview, (our created worlds).

 

• If you were one with the Universal Mind, I doubt you'd be spending your time posting here.
  
• The Ra quote above indicates that the intuitive mind (accessed through the heart) is the means for reaching a state where self-consciousness includes all planetary and cosmic consciousness.  This approach offers a path of expanding self-awareness, not neutering it. 
  
• Ra, 5.2. "The mind must be opened like a door. The key is silence."  Silence or emptiness within is necessary to discipline the mind in order to begin the journey just described.  It is the first step towards expanding the awareness of being to include the levels listed above.
  

Naturally, I'm not advising that you believe one thing or another, I'm just trying to be scrupulous about pointing out the Confederation viewpoint on this because I feel it is quite informative for any seeker.

   

[Ohr Ein Sof]

Ra 30.2The mind is a complex which reflects the inpourings of the spirit and the up-pourings of the body complex. It contains what you know as feelings, emotions, and intellectual thoughts in its more conscious complexities. Moving further down the tree of mind we see the intuition which is of the nature of the mind more in contact or in tune with the total beingness complex. Moving down to the roots of mind we find the progression of consciousness which gradually turns from the personal to the racial memory, to the cosmic influxes, and thus becomes a direct contactor of that shuttle which we call the spirit complex.

 

We are complex creatures and the Mind even more complicated. The biggest problem is, the Mind cannot analyze the Mind. Everything is only assumption and speculation. Although I agree with the quote. I am, (therefore I am), I am also Universal Mind, and it is rarely considered on the Gross Intellectual Level. Even Intuitive Mind is limited because it still remains in Self-Consciousness and the "I-ness". We must learn to expand our Consciousness on the "Grand Universal Scale", and not remain trapped in our feeble and limited worldview, (our created worlds).

 

• If you were one with the Universal Mind, I doubt you'd be spending your time posting here.
  
• The Ra quote above indicates that the intuitive mind (accessed through the heart) is the means for reaching a state where self-consciousness includes all planetary and cosmic consciousness.  This approach offers a path of expanding self-awareness, not neutering it. 
  
• Ra, 5.2. "The mind must be opened like a door. The key is silence."  Silence or emptiness within is necessary to discipline the mind in order to begin the journey just described.  It is the first step towards expanding the awareness of being to include the levels listed above.
  

Naturally, I'm not advising that you believe one thing or another, I'm just trying to be scrupulous about pointing out the Confederation viewpoint on this because I feel it is quite informative for any seeker.

   

When you say that intuition is accessed through the heart are you meaning all entities access this through the heart? Intuition is available to all entities including the negative polarity. If you are including the negative polarity can you explain how this would be done? Or rather tell more details and we can draw conclusions upon that I guess.

[Sacred Fool]

When you say that intuition is accessed through the heart are you meaning all entities access this through the heart? Intuition is available to all entities including the negative polarity. If you are including the negative polarity can you explain how this would be done? Or rather tell more details and we can draw conclusions upon that I guess.

What I was referring to is the Confederation perspective, which of course has an STO framework and bias. 
 
Intuition is certainly available on a variety of levels, one form being on a basic 2nd chakra/animal instinct level.  The general format suggested by Q'uo and others is that the first three chakras, which are oriented towrads helping us navigate the illusion, must be cleared, cleaned, relaxed and allowed to flow to allow the bulk of one's energies to move into the heart area, the heart being oriented both towards the illusion and towards the Divine.  It is in the heart center that the deeper intuitive apparatus becomes available to be employed, as expressed in the passage I quoted above...and so below.  

https://llresearch.org/transcripts/issue..._0816.aspx

 

The workings of the heart are not seen. The self-acceptance or lack of it is not seen. The love or hunger for love in relationships is not seen. Circumstances only are seen. There is, my friends, a reason for this. The design is to so baffle, frustrate and confuse the intellect with all the data of the senses that the student will be forced to move the center of investigatory energy from the intellectual mind, which is a creature of this illusion only, to the wisdom of the deep mind, which is vastly more informed and which resides in what you would call the heart energy center. This center is the gateway center wherein, when the lower energies have been cleared, the gate becomes opened so that you can effectively focus the heart’s wisdom upon the situation you wish balanced within you.

 
 

[Ming the Merciful]

When you say that intuition is accessed through the heart are you meaning all entities access this through the heart? Intuition is available to all entities including the negative polarity. If you are including the negative polarity can you explain how this would be done? Or rather tell more details and we can draw conclusions upon that I guess.

What I was referring to is the Confederation perspective, which of course has an STO framework and bias. 
 
Intuition is certainly available on a variety of levels, one form being on a basic 2nd chakra/animal instinct level.  The general format suggested by Q'uo and others is that the first three chakras, which are oriented towrads helping us navigate the illusion, must be cleared, cleaned, relaxed and allowed to flow to allow the bulk of one's energies to move into the heart area, the heart being oriented both towards the illusion and towards the Divine.  It is in the heart center that the deeper intuitive apparatus becomes available to be employed, as expressed in the passage I quoted above...and so below.  

https://llresearch.org/transcripts/issue..._0816.aspx

 

The workings of the heart are not seen. The self-acceptance or lack of it is not seen. The love or hunger for love in relationships is not seen. Circumstances only are seen. There is, my friends, a reason for this. The design is to so baffle, frustrate and confuse the intellect with all the data of the senses that the student will be forced to move the center of investigatory energy from the intellectual mind, which is a creature of this illusion only, to the wisdom of the deep mind, which is vastly more informed and which resides in what you would call the heart energy center. This center is the gateway center wherein, when the lower energies have been cleared, the gate becomes opened so that you can effectively focus the heart’s wisdom upon the situation you wish balanced within you.

 
 

Unfortunately, Man is living too close to the Apes to commune with the God(s). We, (Humanity), still has to go through a lot more Evolution before we evolve enough to commune with the God(s), and there are many people who still remain closer to the Apes, than even to Man. The other problem we face, is that there is nothing on the Universal Scale where we can focus. All our Evolution is from exploration and learning new values. Guidelines such as the "Law of One" remain only guidelines and pointers to the Higher Dimensions. I have studied Zen for forty years, and I am still learning. Learning is unending and occasionally there is a "Spark" and a Realization. I agree about the Chakras and that too is a part of the Realization and Self-Development. Although I am discovering that rejection of Philosophical Values removes a lot of garbage because the Point of Focus has moved to something higher. Or, that is to say, once we remove Philosophical connotations, and there is nothing left except the Emptiness, then the Emptiness has value. The Emptiness and cultivating Self-Realization through Chakra Work? The Great Mystery continues?

[Patrick]

If I remember correctly, Ra did mention that STS refuses help even from their higher-self. That is a big part of intuition that is rejected.

[Ming the Merciful]

If I remember correctly, Ra did mention that STS refuses help even from their higher-self. That is a big part of intuition that is rejected.

Without learning and achieving Intuitive Mind, an individual will never gain Enlightenment. That cannot be gained Intellectually. Through Meditation and Chakra work we access our Higher-Self. A Gross Human will never cross the divide. The basic Transmutation.

[Ohr Ein Sof]

When you say that intuition is accessed through the heart are you meaning all entities access this through the heart? Intuition is available to all entities including the negative polarity. If you are including the negative polarity can you explain how this would be done? Or rather tell more details and we can draw conclusions upon that I guess.

What I was referring to is the Confederation perspective, which of course has an STO framework and bias. 
 
Intuition is certainly available on a variety of levels, one form being on a basic 2nd chakra/animal instinct level.  The general format suggested by Q'uo and others is that the first three chakras, which are oriented towrads helping us navigate the illusion, must be cleared, cleaned, relaxed and allowed to flow to allow the bulk of one's energies to move into the heart area, the heart being oriented both towards the illusion and towards the Divine.  It is in the heart center that the deeper intuitive apparatus becomes available to be employed, as expressed in the passage I quoted above...and so below.  

https://llresearch.org/transcripts/issue..._0816.aspx

 

The workings of the heart are not seen. The self-acceptance or lack of it is not seen. The love or hunger for love in relationships is not seen. Circumstances only are seen. There is, my friends, a reason for this. The design is to so baffle, frustrate and confuse the intellect with all the data of the senses that the student will be forced to move the center of investigatory energy from the intellectual mind, which is a creature of this illusion only, to the wisdom of the deep mind, which is vastly more informed and which resides in what you would call the heart energy center. This center is the gateway center wherein, when the lower energies have been cleared, the gate becomes opened so that you can effectively focus the heart’s wisdom upon the situation you wish balanced within you.

 
 

Ok I was not sure how the negative polarity was to access the heart in order to allow the inflow of intuition. I was hoping you could make it clear that they do not use this energy center like we do to experience the higher expressions of Life. Thanks for clearing that up or rather, going into further detail.

[Ohr Ein Sof]

If I remember correctly, Ra did mention that STS refuses help even from their higher-self. That is a big part of intuition that is rejected.

Yeah I was more concerned with the energy centers and the flow of life force through them and how we access them in order to experience intuition but SF explained it wonderfully. I was seeking the more in depth explanation from the standpoint of someone wondering how this works that has read the Material (or not) and now they would assume that both polarities use the heart center as a way of experiencing intuition. I am not well versed on all of the confederation's teachings, however, this is my view as well (the lower 3 rays for the neg polarity). I thought it would be nice to go into further detail regarding his own comment. Which was nicely put together.

[Ohr Ein Sof]

If I remember correctly, Ra did mention that STS refuses help even from their higher-self. That is a big part of intuition that is rejected.

Without learning and achieving Intuitive Mind, an individual will never gain Enlightenment. That cannot be gained Intellectually. Through Meditation and Chakra work we access our Higher-Self. A Gross Human will never cross the divide. The basic Transmutation.

In my glossary of terms and definitions, I could never say that we "learn" the intuitive mind but rather we discover it through our desire to align ourselves with higher faculties and forces that are available to each. We do this through various workings including the study of the archetypes which brings the intuition into greater and greater manifestation. Two courses of study that I find invaluable are Tarot and Qabalah.

[jafar]

If I remember correctly, Ra did mention that STS refuses help even from their higher-self. That is a big part of intuition that is rejected.

STS personalities are exploring the option of 'separation', in contrast to 'unity' / 'unification'.
If it 'accept' or 'ask' the help of 'higher self' it will be gravitating (back) towards 'unity'.
As 'higher self' by itself is a union of millions (if not billions) of personalities.

Separation option offers experiences not available in unity.
How can one 'win' when there's no other to lose?
How can one be 'above' when there's no other being 'below'?
How can one be a 'master' when there's no other being 'slaves'?
etc..

Yet STS personalities are still part of it's higher self nonetheless, thus it can also be said that each STS personalities is the personality used by 'higher self' to explore / experience the option of 'separation'.
After the exploration has been satisfied (and all excesses being resolved) it will eventually merged back with it's higher self.
And higher self will eventually merged back with the ultimate self, the infinite creator.

The destination of any path is the same, what varies are the experiences being experienced.
STSes or STOs all are serving the infinite creator.

[Sacred Fool]

Unfortunately, Man is living too close to the Apes to commune with the God(s). We, (Humanity), still has to go through a lot more Evolution before we evolve enough to commune with the God(s), and there are many people who still remain closer to the Apes, than even to Man. The other problem we face, is that there is nothing on the Universal Scale where we can focus. All our Evolution is from exploration and learning new values. Guidelines such as the "Law of One" remain only guidelines and pointers to the Higher Dimensions

Confederation sources describe it a little differently.  They say there that within 3D there are seven sub-densities, the first just a step beyond our ape relations, as you say, and the last just a step below 4D.  Where we vibrate on this scale, on the one hand, is our choice, and on the other hand beyond our direct choosing.

We can look back over our day, our week or month and see how much of our time was spent just getting along in the illusion, surviving, chatting with friends, meeting social obligations, etc.  We can also see how much of our time was spent in prayer, contemplation, meditation or posting on this website.  (ha ha)  If we wish, we can try to adjust our schedule so that more time can be spent leaning closer to the gods, if you like.  In this sense we have a choice about where on the scale we are vibrating.

And yet, they say that our actual spiritual vibration (that which also determines our harvestability) is not a function of our good intentions, beliefs and so on, but is measured by how we react without thinking about the reaction.  That is, it's revealed in our spontaneous responses.  In that sense, we can't control it and have no direct choice about it.

There are things on a universal scale we can focus upon, but again, these are not apparent to the outer senses, nor to the intellect.  These things are known in one's deep heart.  Ironically, it is a lonely path to find one's way into this place where one communes with one's soul stream and other spiritual companions.  But in that space of one's deep heart, where the sense of self expands out from that of an individual to that of a crowd, the rules change and the ape-derived inclinations warm and then melt into more god-like inclinations and biases.  The feeling of offering self to this process is as reflexive as breathing in after you breathe out.
  

[Ming the Merciful]

Unfortunately, Man is living too close to the Apes to commune with the God(s). We, (Humanity), still has to go through a lot more Evolution before we evolve enough to commune with the God(s), and there are many people who still remain closer to the Apes, than even to Man. The other problem we face, is that there is nothing on the Universal Scale where we can focus. All our Evolution is from exploration and learning new values. Guidelines such as the "Law of One" remain only guidelines and pointers to the Higher Dimensions

Confederation sources describe it a little differently.  They say there that within 3D there are seven sub-densities, the first just a step beyond our ape relations, as you say, and the last just a step below 4D.  Where we vibrate on this scale, on the one hand, is our choice, and on the other hand beyond our direct choosing.

We can look back over our day, our week or month and see how much of our time was spent just getting along in the illusion, surviving, chatting with friends, meeting social obligations, etc.  We can also see how much of our time was spent in prayer, contemplation, meditation or posting on this website.  (ha ha)  If we wish, we can try to adjust our schedule so that more time can be spent leaning closer to the gods, if you like.  In this sense we have a choice about where on the scale we are vibrating.

And yet, they say that our actual spiritual vibration (that which also determines our harvestability) is not a function of our good intentions, beliefs and so on, but is measured by how we react without thinking about the reaction.  That is, it's revealed in our spontaneous responses.  In that sense, we can't control it and have no direct choice about it.

There are things on a universal scale we can focus upon, but again, these are not apparent to the outer senses, nor to the intellect.  These things are known in one's deep heart.  Ironically, it is a lonely path to find one's way into this place where one communes with one's soul stream and other spiritual companions.  But in that space of one's deep heart, where the sense of self expands out from that of an individual to that of a crowd, the rules change and the ape-derived inclinations warm and then melt into more god-like inclinations and biases.  The feeling of offering self to this process is as reflexive as breathing in after you breathe out.
  

I like where you are coming from Sacred Fool. I believe that realistically, we must find a balance in everything in life. Or, in Buddhism, the "Middle Path". Spirituality is like standing on the edge of the Abyss, and one wrong move and we fall. As for the Ape and Man, indirectly I was paraphrasing Nietzsche, (my favourite author of Philosophy), and "Thus Spoke Zarathrustra". Although I can see parallels between ourselves and the, (humble), Ape. How many people have actually considered, and thinking retrospectively, just how far we have come, (as Humans)? For the last few days my apartment has been plagued with flies. To the, (humble), fly, are we not already "God(s)"? I am being realistic? We have come along way in our evolution, and did we once give birth to maggots on rotting flesh? So grotesque?

Although I am now even questioning concepts. Everything that we believe, (or not believe), is a concept generated by the Mind. Is that another barrier that must be crossed? If the "Absolute Spiritual State" is neutral, it only naturally follows that it is without concept? Non-conceptual and without form? The formless manifestation of the Absolute, (within everything). Once again, the Zen of No Zen. Or, Zen destroying itself and recreating itself in the next moment. There are too many mysteries and not enough answers?

[unity100]

Spirituality is not experienced on the Intellectual level.

That's not correct. Every entity exists by having mind, body and spirit components. Not having any of them makes it impossible for one to exist, leave aside experience anything. The very 'experience' that you are having is what your mind complex perceives and conveys to your own consciousness. This includes non-physical experiences.

...

But, say, i have been wondering one thing - if not doing something and instead meditating and being one with it is 'the' way, why are you talking about that in this forum instead of logging off, meditating and being one with the forum instead?

[Ming the Merciful]

Spirituality is not experienced on the Intellectual level.

That's not correct. Every entity exists by having mind, body and spirit components. Not having any of them makes it impossible for one to exist, leave aside experience anything. The very 'experience' that you are having is what your mind complex perceives and conveys to your own consciousness. This includes non-physical experiences.

...

But, say, i have been wondering one thing - if not doing something and instead meditating and being one with it is 'the' way, why are you talking about that in this forum instead of logging off, meditating and being one with the forum instead?

Any action can be performed in a meditative state. It is when we allow the Mind to become still within the action. When we are in trance, we are transcending between Intellectual and Intuitive Mind. Even when we have a Spiritual Experience, it is not perceived on the Intellectual level. We have allowed ourselves to transcend from one State to the other. During the "Spark" of Realization it can be interpreted by Intellectual Mind, although the process did not happen there. If we are constantly in Still Mind, it is already in a State of Meditation because the Mind is not thinking. This technique I use frequently because it is the most efficient, (without the need for Mantras). Plus, the advantage, the "I-ness", "Self", or "Ego", (or whatever you want to call it), is controlling the Mind, and not the reverse. Simply in the State of "Being". The more I have used this as an example, I am beginning to believe that in the "State of the Now", (and in the moment), that is it leading to something even deeper. Living in the "Moment" or the "Now" is not the end result, but only the beginning of something more profound. That I have not discovered yet.

[unity100]

Any action can be performed in a meditative state

Then people can also discuss existence intellectually in a meditative state. Which invalidates your original proposition in your first post in the thread.

[Ming the Merciful]

Any action can be performed in a meditative state

Then people can also discuss existence intellectually in a meditative state. Which invalidates your original proposition in your first post in the thread.

What I am saying is, in the State of No Mind, we are touching the Consciousness, (outside ourselves). Intuitive Mind connects with the Higher Consciousness. When we are in Trance, it is a State beyond normal Intellectual thinking. How is that a contradiction to the first post of this Thread? All the time that we are in gross Intellectual Mind, our Consciousness is observation from a lower level of thinking. In Still Mind, there is no thinking. Any action in Still Mind, is still, Still Mind. Although depending on the action, we can reach different levels of Consciousness. It is learning the art of just "Being".

[unity100]

How is that a contradiction to the first post of this Thread?

How that is a contradiction is that, you proposed people to not discuss anything intellectually and empty their minds and meditate to be one with things instead, however you yourself are doing the exact opposite of that by telling us that in this forum and not logging off to meditate to be one with the forum.

When we are in Trance, it is a State beyond normal Intellectual thinking

Are you in trance now then as you read these lines.

[Ming the Merciful]

How is that a contradiction to the first post of this Thread?

How that is a contradiction is that, you proposed people to not discuss anything intellectually and empty their minds and meditate to be one with things instead, however you yourself are doing the exact opposite of that by telling us that in this forum and not logging off to meditate to be one with the forum.

When we are in Trance, it is a State beyond normal Intellectual thinking

Are you in trance now then as you read these lines.

Life is a contradiction my friend. If you can explain to me how I can discuss anything without using Intellectual Mind, I would be pleased know? When we discuss, think, imagine, talk, and think, we are using Intellectual Mind. Unless you can explain to me how to think in a state beyond Intuitive Mind. Intuitive Mind is a non-thinking State, so that obviously does not work. A contradiction my friend.

[Ohr Ein Sof]

Ming. I understand what you are saying. Some humans will acheive this while most of us will alternate between states of being. I feel this is a fair statement.
We access the intuitive state through medation and then it would be fair to say that we would then go into the world to test what we have learned and this requires the conscious mind, the objective mind. I feel the most important accomplishment is that we see our reality with as little distortion as possible in order to give our subconscious mind healthy, reality based feedback.

[Ming the Merciful]

Ming. I understand what you are saying. Some humans will acheive this while most of us will alternate between states of being. I feel this is a fair statement.
We access the intuitive state through medation and then it would be fair to say that we would then go into the world to test what we have learned and this requires the conscious mind, the objective mind. I feel the most important accomplishment is that we see our reality with as little distortion as possible in order to give our subconscious mind healthy, reality based feedback.

Thank you Ohr Ein Sof. I appreciate your thoughts. Without sounding egotistical, (which I am not). I find the transition between Intellectual to Intuitive Mind easy, simply because I was trained by a Spiritual Teacher. Perhaps the majority of people can only achieve this in a Meditative State, (which I sometimes forget). Again, (without ego), Spirituality comes easy, because that has always been my Path. When we can live a life in Stillness, and without Mind Clutter it creates a different scenario which the average person is unaware. Although I think that once we can gain an insight into the "Great Emptiness", (for what it is), through Meditation, our Realities change. As I mentioned in another Thread, the more I understand Reality, the less I know. Or, the greater the Knowledge, it feels incomplete. There is no end in Spiritual Knowledge, and even I have only just started to learn. A novice.

[Aion]

Fruits are born only with effort, and they consumed as part of their life cycle to be reborn again. The effort, the work, is itself the Path, yet there is still no path to be followed. Only to be chosen.

Avalokiteshvara
while practicing deeply with
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore,
suddenly discovered that
all of the five Skandhas are equally empty,
and with this realisation
he overcame all Ill-being.

“Listen Sariputra,
this Body itself is Emptiness
and Emptiness itself is this Body.
This Body is not other than Emptiness
and Emptiness is not other than this Body.
The same is true of Feelings,
Perceptions, Mental Formations,
and Consciousness.

“Listen Sariputra,
all phenomena bear the mark of Emptiness;
their true nature is the nature of
no Birth no Death,
no Being no Non-being,
no Defilement no Purity,
no Increasing no Decreasing.

“That is why in Emptiness,
Body, Feelings, Perceptions,
Mental Formations and Consciousness
are not separate self entities.

The Eighteen Realms of Phenomena
which are the six Sense Organs,
the six Sense Objects,
and the six Consciousnesses
are also not separate self entities.

The Twelve Links of Interdependent Arising
and their Extinction
are also not separate self entities.
Ill-being, the Causes of Ill-being,
the End of Ill-being, the Path,
insight and attainment,
are also not separate self entities.

Whoever can see this
no longer needs anything to attain.

Bodhisattvas who practice
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
see no more obstacles in their mind,
and because there
are no more obstacles in their mind,
they can overcome all fear,
destroy all wrong perceptions
and realize Perfect Nirvana.

“All Buddhas in the past, present and future
by practicing
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
are all capable of attaining
Authentic and Perfect Enlightenment.

“Therefore Sariputra,
it should be known that
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
is a Great Mantra,
the most illuminating mantra,
the highest mantra,
a mantra beyond compare,
the True Wisdom that has the power
to put an end to all kinds of suffering.
Therefore let us proclaim
a mantra to praise
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore.

Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!
Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!
Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!”

https://plumvillage.org/about/thich-nhat...anslation/

Though None the One may be, it is not without its Great Perfection. I have been fond of the Dzogchen philosophy for some time which is how this general concept of Emptiness appears to me.

https://dzogchen.org/

[Ming the Merciful]

Fruits are born only with effort, and they consumed as part of their life cycle to be reborn again. The effort, the work, is itself the Path, yet there is still no path to be followed. Only to be chosen.

Avalokiteshvara
while practicing deeply with
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore,
suddenly discovered that
all of the five Skandhas are equally empty,
and with this realisation
he overcame all Ill-being.

“Listen Sariputra,
this Body itself is Emptiness
and Emptiness itself is this Body.
This Body is not other than Emptiness
and Emptiness is not other than this Body.
The same is true of Feelings,
Perceptions, Mental Formations,
and Consciousness.

“Listen Sariputra,
all phenomena bear the mark of Emptiness;
their true nature is the nature of
no Birth no Death,
no Being no Non-being,
no Defilement no Purity,
no Increasing no Decreasing.

“That is why in Emptiness,
Body, Feelings, Perceptions,
Mental Formations and Consciousness
are not separate self entities.

The Eighteen Realms of Phenomena
which are the six Sense Organs,
the six Sense Objects,
and the six Consciousnesses
are also not separate self entities.

The Twelve Links of Interdependent Arising
and their Extinction
are also not separate self entities.
Ill-being, the Causes of Ill-being,
the End of Ill-being, the Path,
insight and attainment,
are also not separate self entities.

Whoever can see this
no longer needs anything to attain.

Bodhisattvas who practice
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
see no more obstacles in their mind,
and because there
are no more obstacles in their mind,
they can overcome all fear,
destroy all wrong perceptions
and realize Perfect Nirvana.

“All Buddhas in the past, present and future
by practicing
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
are all capable of attaining
Authentic and Perfect Enlightenment.

“Therefore Sariputra,
it should be known that
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore
is a Great Mantra,
the most illuminating mantra,
the highest mantra,
a mantra beyond compare,
the True Wisdom that has the power
to put an end to all kinds of suffering.
Therefore let us proclaim
a mantra to praise
the Insight that Brings Us to the Other Shore.

Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!
Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!
Gate, Gate, Paragate, Parasamgate, Bodhi Svaha!”

https://plumvillage.org/about/thich-nhat...anslation/

Though None the One may be, it is not without its Great Perfection. I have been fond of the Dzogchen philosophy for some time which is how this general concept of Emptiness appears to me.

https://dzogchen.org/

That is an amazing writing and I feel honoured reading it. I have heard of Plum Village, although not the other retreat. Too many answers and not enough questions. That was meant to be a Koan. Perhaps at the moment when we acknowledge the fact that we know nothing, then maybe we will begin to understand. Everybody seems to approach Spirituality from the same direction, (Intellectual Mind). We need to change course and approach from a different direction and admit our ignorance. The more we understand, the less we know. We pass through different stages of Self-Realization, only to discover it only lasted a moment. Then once again, our ignorance revealed itself. Realistically, we occupy more space than matter and when observing it from that viewpoint, we are already the "Great Emptiness".

[Patrick]

If you knew how often I cried within my mind saying that I just don't know. Don't know anything. I don't get it. It does not compute. And then I relax because it's ok. It's perfectly normal not to get it. I'm just supposed to throw all the concepts away and simply focus on what is, that being the love in the moment without sense, without understanding. Smiling at the world that seems crazy because it is made to not make sense on purpose. Just so we have opportunities to decide that none of it matters, only love matters.

[Ming the Merciful]

If you knew how often I cried within my mind saying that I just don't know. Don't know anything. I don't get it. It does not compute. And then I relax because it's ok. It's perfectly normal not to get it. I'm just supposed to throw all the concepts away and simply focus on what is, that being the love in the moment without sense, without understanding. Smiling at the world that seems crazy because it is made to not make sense on purpose. Just so we have opportunities to decide that none of it matters, only love matters.

Nice one Patrick. Once we admit the fact that we simply do not know, then that changes everything. And, everything continues with, (or without), us. Realistically, have you ever considered that we control nothing? We are born, grow through childhood into adulthood. Do we have any control how we develop physically? Supposedly, the hormones in our body drives growth. Has it been proven or is it still scientific speculation? With, (or without us), the world continues, wars, famine, floods, weather, volcanoes, tornadoes, earthquakes, the list goes on and on. Is there anything we control. We cannot even control ourselves. Once we accept, we have no control, then it is a Realization that there is a Greater Power than us. Conscious, or unconscious, it really doesn't matter. It is still more powerful than us. Everything continues with, (or without us).

[Patrick]

...Everything continues with, (or without us).

...yes, there is every reason to feel more tired than usual, to be weary with the world’s heavy energies. And yet you came here to serve. This is the moment for which you sacrificed so much. Now you are here. Now you are on the ground. Now you are in the midst of the fire, and it certainly is wearying. Yet comfort yourself with the knowledge that you did not come here to fix things. You came here to love things—to love yourself and to love those around you, to love all of the tribe of humankind and, above all, to love the Creator.

Therefore, it’s all right to feel weary. One feels weary at sundown. And it is truly sundown for your planet and your people. At the end of this incarnation, each of you shall walk the steps of light. This is your last incarnation upon this particular planet in this particular environment. Consequently, rejoice in your time, however wearying it may seem. You are in the place you sacrificed comfort and family and the remembrance of how things truly are, [so that you could] serve and to learn. And you are serving, my sister and you are learning. And so are all of those who seek at this time...

...When this entity began working to forgive itself, it ran into a brick wall and we feel that this is true of most people who begin to attempt to create a spiritual practice of speaking to the self in a loving way. The problem is that part of being a human being on planet Earth is being imperfect, and not just slightly imperfect, but continuingly and maddeningly imperfect. It is, in fact, your responsibility to be imperfect on planet Earth, to be confused, to be foolish, to miss signs and signals and to remain somewhat confused at all times. This is the most beneficial atmosphere for growth and this is the atmosphere which each of you enjoys. How can one forgive oneself when one is constantly discovering that one has once again been mistaken? Been a bozo? Been a fool? But here is the key: it is when you see the imperfection of the self that you may realize that you are here, not to be perfect, but to love. You are not here to love perfection, but to love. You are not here to love this and not that, but to love. And the first object of your love needs to be yourself. There is a process of falling in love with yourself which is most salubrious and helpful, and we recommend it to each of you...

...That which you know of the higher planes, that which you remember in a dim or not so dim way, bring into your heart and let it bless the environment that you see before you, just as it is. You are not here to clean it up. You are not here to make it right. You are not here to fix it. For all of the outer world is an illusion. You are here to love it. Take the world in your arms and embrace it. This is how you came to serve. This is your glory and your crown. Wear it well and rejoice in being here...