The Metaphysical Matter of Bring4th Itself

[LeafieGreens]

I am feeling that full super-moon energy today and my Piscean energy is percolating and has me pondering about this very community and its implications. Do not forget that the channeled words of Ra and the Law of One were what lead me to bring4th. The discussions in these forums are often very advanced both metaphysically and philosophically.

And in that sense, we are all prophets and priests of this reality and the advancement of humankind through all the discussions.

So that lead me think about all the different people out there who are waking up right now and poking around youtube like I did -- searching for terms like 'awakening' and then finding Aaron Abke videos, then learning about the LOO and resonating with it like I did. Then they go to google and find L/L Research and the next thing you know they are registering to be a member on bring4th to talk about their journey and reality.

I keep having the thought (or download?) that the discussions and forums here are far more important than we realize and if we are the Master Creators, then we are perhaps molding this reality as we iron out our interpretations of the ever-present question of WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON? As we all come to conclusions and agreement about things, then a little bit more Unity consciousness is created, perhaps.

I am now getting a bit esoteric, but I wanted to post this in gratitude to everyone here. Because this website and community itself is blessed by the light and thus all those who post here are subsequently blessed. And that's pretty kick-ass.

What do you think?

[Ymarsakar]

I think social media is going bye bye, so people will need private forums like this. People thought it was obsolete, but au contraire. Divinity has plans for this

https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthre...?tid=18544

This is what it was like last year and before

[Patrick]

What do you think?

I think you rock dude !

[Diana]

I am feeling that full super-moon energy today and my Piscean energy is percolating and has me pondering about this very community and its implications. 

He-he...water signs would definitely "percolate" with the energy of the moon which moves the tides.

I keep having the thought (or download?) that the discussions and forums here are far more important than we realize and if we are the Master Creators, then we are perhaps molding this reality as we iron out our interpretations of the ever-present question of WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON? As we all come to conclusions and agreement about things, then a little bit more Unity consciousness is created, perhaps.

I am now getting a bit esoteric, but I wanted to post this in gratitude to everyone here. Because this website and community itself is blessed by the light and thus all those who post here are subsequently blessed. And that's pretty kick-ass.

What do you think?

Totally agree.

[LeafieGreens]

What I was getting at is there is and will be a natural flow of seekers who will find themselves here perusing these forums. So in that sense those who contribute here are contributing toward the overall awakening of humanity.

I also like to imagine that there are other beings out there who have easy access to earth's internet and are closely watching these forums as well (besides Ymarsakar).

The other concept I like to playfully bounce around is that --

There is no time. We already are fully Awakened and United. Everything is now. Expand awareness to the Infinite.

[Ohr Ein Sof]

This forum is a nice place to land once the search has been made through the conspiracy theories. At this point I would like to guess that the one who has learned of such things begins to question reality or the reality one finds itself within. Suddenly, we are here on B4. Perhaps we are ready to question the consensus reality? In order to do this comfortably (enough) and being supported thus not scoffed at.... is landing here IMO. We are ready for more.

[Spaced]

This forum is a nice place to land once the search has been made through the conspiracy theories. At this point I would like to guess that the one who has learned of such things begins to question reality or the reality one finds itself within. Suddenly, we are here on B4. Perhaps we are ready to question the consensus reality? In order to do this comfortably (enough) and being supported thus not scoffed at.... is landing here IMO. We are ready for more.

I think conspiracy theories are one path that can lead people to this kind of information, but I think at some point there comes a realization that there is more to it than that. 

As Q'uo says:

Q’uo: I am Q’uo, and am aware of your query, my brother. The so-called conspiracy theories are, for many entities, as you have mentioned: a beginning movement away from the generally accepted explanation of the nature of reality, for that which is hidden is known within the inner being to be of a spiritual nature ultimately for each individual. Thus, this subconscious knowing of the need to seek that which is hidden within the self oftentimes begins with seeking that which is hidden in the outer reality, there being an inner sense that the hidden quality is of importance to the individual mind/body/spirit complex.

However, when this path of seeking to know more about the hidden qualities of the so-called planetary game, or conspiracy theories, as to how this game is played, is pursued long enough by an entity which is enough interested in riddles and puzzles to move beyond that which is of the conspiracy nature, eventually such an entity discovers that it does not feel fulfilled in that inner sense of craving fulfillment by knowing more and more of the conspiracy scenario—who did what to whom, and why.

When this sense of lack of fulfillment becomes strong enough, such an entity becomes more aware that there is something lacking within this hidden story—there is something there that might point the attention and the consciousness, and the expenditures of energy inward to this conspiracy buff, shall we say, for it is discovered that this sense of craving is stronger than the desire to know something that was hidden, and therefore, feel more informed than the average consumer of information within your culture.

The desire to move beyond being controlled by forces that are unseen and who have supposedly contact with entities of an extraterrestrial nature, perhaps, who are behind their machinations, causes the seeker of truth to be born in a fashion within the conscious mind and the sensitive heart of the entity who has heretofore decided that there was something more to the illusion than normally experienced, and now has decided that there is more to the illusion than conspiracies, and illuminati, and Malta, and so forth. Thus the seeker may be born as a portion of the path of seeking begins within that investigation into the planetary game.

I personally hope we can begin to focus less on that sort of information as there are plenty of venues for discussions in that vein, but not so many places to discuss the finer points of the Law of One philosophy. And if we are indeed co-creating this reality through our conscious attention, why focus on things that may be disempowering or indeed transient in the overall spiritual journey? 

[Ymarsakar]

The Law of One channeled info is full of conspiracy info even more than the conspiracy theories online.

Orion. Negative greetings. Not even conspiracy land thinks there are magical powers watching them and messing with their lives, they just think it is all spy stuff.

A channel will ask the instruments not to focus on this because it invites depolarization, confusion, interference, and it wastes time.

Few however are fully able to accomplish the length of the quo answer. Instead they bypass the difficulty by finding something easier, like spiritual new age ego, to replace the conspiracy ego. Same ego different ice cream flavor.

The weakness of humanity is the inability to face your pain and mistakes. You want to focus on things that benefit you im the concrete. It bypasdes true awareness because if your arm is cut off, teying not to focus on it and ignorijg it by talking up the principles of spiritual evolution, is not the test for your current grade. You are not allowed tonskip ahead. First fix your arm that is bleeding out. Focus and be aware of pain cause it is a msg

[Spaced]

Or one may have already faced all that stuff and found it wanting and unfulfilling in the spiritual sense.

I understand that some people are strongly attached to "the desire to know something that was hidden, and therefore, feel more informed than the average consumer of information within your culture" as Q'uo puts it. That simply is of no interest to me, I have no desire to engage in that sort of shadowplay.

[Ymarsakar]

Or one may have already faced all that stuff and found it wanting and unfulfilling in the spiritual sense.

I understand that some people are strongly attached to "the desire to know something that was hidden, and therefore, feel more informed than the average consumer of information within your culture" as Q'uo puts it. That simply is of no interest to me, I have no desire to engage in that sort of shadowplay.

Or the human ego thinks it faced all that stuff and has progressed.

What exact evidence do you have that you have passed the tests?

[Spaced]

Or one may have already faced all that stuff and found it wanting and unfulfilling in the spiritual sense.

I understand that some people are strongly attached to "the desire to know something that was hidden, and therefore, feel more informed than the average consumer of information within your culture" as Q'uo puts it. That simply is of no interest to me, I have no desire to engage in that sort of shadowplay.

Or the human ego thinks it faced all that stuff and has progressed.

What exact evidence do you have that you have passed the tests?

For one thing, knowledge of self which comes with a complete lack of need to prove myself to others. Love you buddy, but your judgement means very little to me 

[Diana]

The Law of One channeled info is full of conspiracy info...
A channel will ask the instruments not to focus on this because it invites depolarization, confusion, interference, and it wastes time.

True. Though it is sometimes challenging to draw the line between that which is relevant and that which is not, and beyond that assigning importance to it or letting it go.

I see conspiracies as a fact of human society. That does not point out what is true or not, just that conspiracies exist. I see no efficacy in denying their existence, but neither do I see efficacy in focusing on them. I have posted this quote ad nauseum, but I like it and think it applies:

12.28 ▶ Questioner: Are most of these from the fourth density? What density do they come from?

Ra: I am Ra. Few there are of fourth density. The largest number of Wanderers, as you call them, are of the sixth density. The desire to serve must be distorted towards a great deal of purity of mind and what you may call foolhardiness or bravery, depending upon your distortion complex judgment. The challenge/danger of the Wanderer is that it will forget its mission, become karmically involved, and thus be swept into the maelstrom from which it had incarnated to aid the destruction.

The weakness of humanity is the inability to face your pain and mistakes. You want to focus on things that benefit you im the concrete. It bypasdes true awareness because if your arm is cut off, teying not to focus on it and ignorijg it by talking up the principles of spiritual evolution, is not the test for your current grade. You are not allowed tonskip ahead. First fix your arm that is bleeding out. Focus and be aware of pain cause it is a msg

To cut the average person some slack, this is a difficult existence. Denial and avoidance are survival skills that can work for a person (say, as a child) but eventually work against evolution of consciousness. Then there are layers: one's own pain and mistakes; then the pain and mistakes of others; then expanding that empathy to other life forms, and so on—along the path to unity.

It takes courage and determination to look into the abyss of self. Some just aren't ready for it. And in today's world the amount of distraction available to avoid it is endless. 

Acceptance is a complex concept, as far as I have experienced. Another favorite quote of mine, regarding other-selves (in this case, people):

Ra: I am Ra. ...The apparent happening is disassociation whether the truth is service to self and thus true disassociation from other-selves or service to others and thus true association with the heart of all other-selves and disassociation only from the illusory husks which prevent the adept from correctly perceiving the self and other-self as one.

[Ymarsakar]

Or one may have already faced all that stuff and found it wanting and unfulfilling in the spiritual sense.

I understand that some people are strongly attached to "the desire to know something that was hidden, and therefore, feel more informed than the average consumer of information within your culture" as Q'uo puts it. That simply is of no interest to me, I have no desire to engage in that sort of shadowplay.

Or the human ego thinks it faced all that stuff and has progressed.

What exact evidence do you have that you have passed the tests?

For one thing, knowledge of self which comes with a complete lack of need to prove myself to others. Love you buddy, but your judgement means very little to me 

It is a question, not a judgment. It is your choice to judge the trigger response to catalyst.

I would point out that your previous posts and choices have been mixed. You state you are not interested, but post certain pro conspiracy statements which i can find later for reference. If you want to choose not to know, that is your choice to make.

But on the threads where people have requested knowledge, why are you choosing to read it, participate in it, share your previous conspiracy minded views, as well as keep repeating that you choose not to know?

Your choice does not affect their choice. And attempting to over rule the free will of others here on topica they specifically want to know, by declaring your position here every once in awhile, can lead to free will infringement.

As for judgment, i will be very clear once i make a judgments. I wipl not be asking questions then i assure you.

[Ymarsakar]

There is also a logic paradox. For quo to give that answer, someone has to have asked a question that was about conspiracies. Thus that question was either specifically focused on conspiracies or attempting to reconcile the dark with light aspecta of consciousness.

This is a kind of shadow work.

Bypassing would be to ignore these topics, never ask about them, and replace this desire for info with another topic that is equally transient.

2 basic questions erupt.

1. Why would spaced cut out the question but use the answer as part of a post where he says he would rather not focus on this topic.

2. This is not the first time q uo has been asked aboit conspiracies. Thus should l l research stopasking questiojs about this research topic because it would be seen as a focus?

[Black Dragon]

Well, conspiracies and bad intentions are part of physical and metaphysical reality. They are as valid a topic for understanding the creation and oneself as any. It is a problem when a focus on conspiracism becomes negative and demoralizing, victimhood porn that people keep using to reinforce their victimhood and distract their attention from doing real spiritual work. It is unhealthy when conspiracism is focused on at the exclusion or of greater importance than actual practical metaphysical knowledge about working on the self. I actually don't really see that in any of the recent discussions here.

There are many discussions here where knowing the strategies and tactics of the dark is a perfectly legitimate topic. It comes down to context. It's not really much of a mark of enlightenment to sit there and poo-poo those discussions as "just another conspiracy theory". If I have something to add about the subject I do. If I think its disinfo or inaccurate, I'll share my opinion. If there's nothing to say I move on. What I personally don't do, is go "why are you focused on this" or "that's just a conspiracy theory". I may be critical of links or sources that seem off to me, but I don't feel I should be critical of another person's line of seeking and questioning.

[Sacred Fool]

There are many discussions here where knowing the strategies and tactics of the dark is a perfectly legitimate topic. It comes down to context.

I take your point, BD.  And there's a further dimension to this matter in the following sense.  LLR runs this website, and it is an organization which is deliberately and exclusively polarized STO.  So, a question arises when conversations, or the tenor of some portion of the website, dwell on messages of gloom & doom, to what extent might that have subtle ripple effects which begin to detune the host organization.    I can't give a quantified estimation of this, but it seems reasonable to me that this state of affairs could be reached, ergo, a discussion of this seems like not such a bad thing, especially considering the title of this thread.

12.15 Questioner: Is it possible for an entity here on Earth to be so confused as to call both the Confederation and the Orion group in [an] alternating way, one, then the other, [inaudible] back to [inaudible]?

Ra: I am Ra. It is entirely possible for the untuned channel, as you call that service, to receive both positive and negative communications. If the entity at the base of its confusion is oriented towards service to others, the entity will begin to receive messages of doom. If the entity at the base of the complex of beingness is oriented towards service to self, the crusaders, who in this case, do not find it necessary to lie, will simply begin to give the philosophy they are here to give. Many of your so-called contacts among your people have been confused and self-destructive because the channels were oriented towards service to others but, in the desire for proof, were open to the lying information of the crusaders who then were able to neutralize the effectiveness of the channel.

I'm not necessarily saying that LLR's channeling sessions would become corrupted.  I don't know that.  But some degree of metaphysical negative pressure must be already there and all around, seeking inroads or fissures to exploit, don't you think?

Do you think we have any duty/responsibility to keep this place clean, so to speak, while we're using it?  I think that's reasonable, but naturally, defining "clean" will require much discussion.

   

[Ymarsakar]

"and it is an organization which is deliberately and exclusively polarized STO"

As others have noted, the org is very 3d. So it is not harvestable or even close.

Certain individuals are on the spiritual path such as old timer Jim.

Percentage wise, they might be positive a third of the time. Or even less. Humans have good days and bad days yes.

"begin to detune the host organization. "

The last time the counsel of 7 tried to retune things it ended up the counsel of 6 and the mistakes were rectified. The mistake was attempting to fix something that was unasked for.

While this thread is not specifically about dark subjects, leafie is active enough in other threads for people to get that he is not asking to know what is going on but go away with the dark stuff. So when somebody said conspiracies helped raise consciousness, this was counter challenged by spaced. Using a quo quote answering a question about conspiracies.

I pointed out the contradictions already.

"Do you think we have any duty/responsibility to keep this place clean, so to speak, while we're using it? I think that's reasonable, but naturally, defining "clean" will require much discussion."

Yes but it would help not to make a mess of things while trying.

Until the counsel decides on a new revised or better explained forum rule guideline, it would help to read the current pages. And if you think there is a mess, just post the link or relevant portions.

What i see happen is that in trying to fix issues, people have personal biases. Posting the forum rule removes much of that. And it will help prevent people from violating more rules fixing other rules. Potentially infringing on people s right to know by declaring your right not to know. Creating separation by justifying it as fixing detunement. This is not complicated stuff.

If you had a job, you had work place rules to follow.

[Spaced]

While this thread is not specifically about dark subjects, leafie is active enough in other threads for people to get that he is not asking to know what is going on but go away with the dark stuff. So when somebody said conspiracies helped raise consciousness, this was counter challenged by spaced. Using a quo quote answering a question about conspiracies.

I pointed out the contradictions already.

I fail to see any contradiction. I shared my personal opinion that while conspiracy theories can lead people to question the nature of their reality there comes a point where that sort of external seeking turns inward and one begins to focus more on their own spiritual journey rather than getting caught up in the planetary game. I used a the Q'uo quote to support that argument.

The question Q'uo was responding to was:

Austin: Yeah, on a different topic. I would like to ask about the idea that the information that you share, and that we provide on the internet, generally falls within the realm of—let me reword that.

People typically find it through a means of researching conspiracy theories, and there’s a path to finding the Law of One and the other channeled material by first discovering conspiracy and then finding the channeled material. And sometimes people sort of fall away from the conspiracy aspect, but I wanted to ask what the role of conspiracy theories, and that path of first finding conspiracy, and then finding the spiritual information, what the dynamic is there, and what the proper role of the conspiracy theories are in the heart of spiritual evolution.

The response to a question about the role of conspiracy theories in the context of spiritual evolution being used to support a comment about the role of conspiracy theories in the context of spiritual evolution. I find the correlation quite clear.

[Ymarsakar]

I am absolutely sure you fail to see the contradiction. As there is also no evidence you read or responded to the post.

[Spaced]

I am absolutely sure you fail to see the contradiction. As there is also no evidence you read or responded to the post.

I didn't respond to your other posts because I felt the strawman you constructed to attack the Spaced that lives in your head to not be representative of the one that lives in mine and as such felt no need to comment. I also felt that you failed to comment on the content of my post. I did not in fact refute the idea that conspiracy theories are a path to raising ones consciousness, I merely pointed out that the path goes on.

You are, however, free to believe whatever you wish about me, oh great magus.

[Black Dragon]

I don't see why this discussion has to have anything to do with personal attacks. I don't really agree with the notion that "people who research these topics are trying to feel more informed than the average sinkholer" thing. Like it's some ego-based thing to laugh at people and call them "sheeple". Maybe some people see it this way, and really do think reading conspiracy theories makes them smarter than everyone else. Those people would still be operating at a very 3d level. Seekers in communities like b4 are not often like that.

We can discuss these topics in their context. Is it transient to want to understand the world around, what makes humans tick, and what the societal dysfunctions are? It does not mean you are expected to physically go and fix them. It just means being aware. Understanding. If people want to discuss conspiracies in the actual greater context of the LOO and Earth 4d ascension, than I see it as a legitimate topic. If one wants to discuss other things, there is nothing stopping them from discussing higher spiritual principles removed from the framework of any Earth agendas. Nobody's discouraging that type of discussion and those avenues of seeking. Why discourage another's?

I don't think there's any judgments going on here. It's the tower of babel effect casting shadows again. I'd rather build bridges.

I see the issues with an over-focus on such topics at the detriment of purer spiritual pursuits. The tendency to use it as victimhood fuel. I don't really see that happening with any of the discussions on b4 lately. People can have a unified theory, integrated world view and bounce back and forth between conspiracy topics, Earth historical and cultural topics, and pure metaphysical and occult topics. They can discuss these in their own contexts and how they intermingle as a unified theory, just like the questions asked of the confederation addressed all these topics as a unified theory. This doesn't have to be a conflict. Everything doesn't have to be a fucking dichotomy.

[Aion]

I don't see why this discussion has to have anything to do with personal attacks. I don't really agree with the notion that "people who research these topics are trying to feel more informed than the average sinkholer" thing. Like it's some ego-based thing to laugh at people and call them "sheeple". Maybe some people see it this way, and really do think reading conspiracy theories makes them smarter than everyone else. Those people would still be operating at a very 3d level. Seekers in communities like b4 are not often like that.

We can discuss these topics in their context. Is it transient to want to understand the world around, what makes humans tick, and what the societal dysfunctions are? It does not mean you are expected to physically go and fix them. It just means being aware. Understanding. If people want to discuss conspiracies in the actual greater context of the LOO and Earth 4d ascension, than I see it as a legitimate topic. If one wants to discuss other things, there is nothing stopping them from discussing higher spiritual principles removed from the framework of any Earth agendas. Nobody's discouraging that type of discussion and those avenues of seeking. Why discourage another's?

I don't think there's any judgments going on here. It's the tower of babel effect casting shadows again. I'd rather build bridges.

I see the issues with an over-focus on such topics at the detriment of purer spiritual pursuits. The tendency to use it as victimhood fuel. I don't really see that happening with any of the discussions on b4 lately. People can have a unified theory, integrated world view and bounce back and forth between conspiracy topics, Earth historical and cultural topics, and pure metaphysical and occult topics. They can discuss these in their own contexts and how they intermingle as a unified theory, just like the questions asked of the confederation addressed all these topics as a unified theory. This doesn't have to be a conflict. Everything doesn't have to be a fucking dichotomy.

I agree with your sentiment and approach here, but I would offer one bit of food for thought. People have different ways of measuring truth for themselves, and everyone develops very different convictions as to what 'the truth' is. The basis for this is rooted in each individual's experience and whatever method they have gone about attaining knowledge in their lifetime.

If, after all of this, individuals encounter each other with wildly opposite senses of truth, with each certain of their own truth, how does a bridge get built? This is a pragmatic question, one which I am frequently concerned with since the bridging of opposites is something I think is a very crux of unification.

Do you see it that others here (using this forum as example because it's the immediate environment, but I am leaning to a more general idea) simply let others have their beliefs, or does it seem like people make efforts to make their truth dominant? In my mind, it is possible to both be convicted to one's own truth as well as being humble enough to not preach it, but others see truth and deceit as a matter of warfare, and to some extent even contextualized as some battle for the human spirit and mind. Some will claim they hold more than a personal truth, and have universal truth. If someone feels this way, how could that ever allow the room for other viewpoints?

Personally, I am a little avoidant of hierarchical thinking I admit. I prefer to think in circles and with conviction only towards the seeking, less the grasping.

[LeafieGreens]

I quickly learned to let go of that which does not resonate with me here and elsewhere.

I also realize that there is a very specific reason why legitimate channels often start with by telling those who would take in the information to only take in that which resonates with you and disregard the rest. In a way, Ra is protecting themselves in case the channel did become corrupted by STS entities.

I find that whole side of L/L Research really intriguing too. Because of the law of duality, of course forces of darkness would become aware of this new Light of the Law of One entering the conscious realm of earth (again). And of course they would want to stop that flow of information about the LOO. And these STS entities had just as much of a "right of access" to the channel that those of Ra did.

It's pretty impressive that L/L Research forged ahead anyway, even after knowing the risk.

So, it is sort of the same with ideas and interpretations presented here in these forms. If someone's words don't feel right and do not resonate I will just let it go. Conversely, I also try not to get too attached to my ideas about WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON because that seems to be changing constantly too. It's a Piscean thing too, to just go with the flow as new information presents itself to my awareness.

[jafar]

I quickly learned to let go of that which does not resonate with me here and elsewhere.

I also realize that there is a very specific reason why legitimate channels often start with by telling those who would take in the information to only take in that which resonates with you and disregard the rest. In a way, Ra is protecting themselves in case the channel did become corrupted by STS entities.

So, it is sort of the same with ideas and interpretations presented here in these forms. If someone's words don't feel right and do not resonate I will just let it go. Conversely, I also try not to get too attached to my ideas about WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON because that seems to be changing constantly too. It's a Piscean thing too, to just go with the flow as new information presents itself to my awareness.

Mr Ra and friends are well aware that the message will not be completed without 'enhancement' from the 'loyal opposition'. That was Quo's lingo anyway, "Loyal Opposition". The contrast will exist and it actually act as a guidance too, as without contrast or contradiction one will not seek and merely obey blindly. When one obey blindly then no understanding and knowing will actually be gained.

Many ascended teachers knew that the objective is actually to merely triggering the 'wishes to know'.
To make the student 'ponder' and 'seek'.
As those who seek shall definitely find.
And those who merely believe and obey, will never find, they're stuck in their comfort of un-knowing-ness.

Once the seeking has started.
The student will definitely make many wrong turns on the crossroad.
Yet the wrong turn itself is part of the seeking process.
Through walking the wrong path he gained understanding, why it leads to dead-end.
And by walking the trail back to the crossroad, the student will now be more equipped to know better on which path that most probably will not lead to dead-end.

There is a story of Siddhartha when asked on the issue of God existence, he answered "God do not exist" to the Theist and give the answer of "God exist" to the Atheist. Because both are actually on the same boat, they believe in something that they don't know. The answer was given to make them start the 'seeking' themselves. If they admit that 'they don't know' and start the seeking, rather than merely believing, then the chance of knowing will become a possibility.

[LeafieGreens]

Many ascended teachers knew that the objective is actually to merely triggering the 'wishes to know'.
To make the student 'ponder' and 'seek'.
As those who seek shall definitely find.
And those who merely believe and obey, will never find, they're stuck in their comfort of un-knowing-ness.

Once the seeking has started.
The student will definitely make many wrong turns on the crossroad.
Yet the wrong turn itself is part of the seeking process.
Through walking the wrong path he gained understanding, why it leads to dead-end.
And by walking the trail back to the crossroad, the student will now be more equipped to know better on which path that most probably will not lead to dead-end.

There is a story of Siddhartha when asked on the issue of God existence, he answered "God do not exist" to the Theist and give the answer of "God exist" to the Atheist.  Because both are actually on the same boat, they believe in something that they don't know. The answer was given to make them start the 'seeking' themselves. If they admit that 'they don't know' and start the seeking, rather than merely believing, then the chance of knowing will become a possibility.

I love this!

Parables and stories always make these tricky topics much more relatable -- that's why JC had so much success (ya know, besides the whole constant miracle thing)... Very cool post, jafar. Much gratitude.

[Dtris]

I don't see why this discussion has to have anything to do with personal attacks. I don't really agree with the notion that "people who research these topics are trying to feel more informed than the average sinkholer" thing. Like it's some ego-based thing to laugh at people and call them "sheeple". Maybe some people see it this way, and really do think reading conspiracy theories makes them smarter than everyone else. Those people would still be operating at a very 3d level. Seekers in communities like b4 are not often like that.

We can discuss these topics in their context. Is it transient to want to understand the world around, what makes humans tick, and what the societal dysfunctions are? It does not mean you are expected to physically go and fix them. It just means being aware. Understanding. If people want to discuss conspiracies in the actual greater context of the LOO and Earth 4d ascension, than I see it as a legitimate topic. If one wants to discuss other things, there is nothing stopping them from discussing higher spiritual principles removed from the framework of any Earth agendas. Nobody's discouraging that type of discussion and those avenues of seeking. Why discourage another's?

I don't think there's any judgments going on here. It's the tower of babel effect casting shadows again. I'd rather build bridges.

I see the issues with an over-focus on such topics at the detriment of purer spiritual pursuits. The tendency to use it as victimhood fuel. I don't really see that happening with any of the discussions on b4 lately. People can have a unified theory, integrated world view and bounce back and forth between conspiracy topics, Earth historical and cultural topics, and pure metaphysical and occult topics. They can discuss these in their own contexts and how they intermingle as a unified theory, just like the questions asked of the confederation addressed all these topics as a unified theory. This doesn't have to be a conflict. Everything doesn't have to be a fucking dichotomy.

I agree with your sentiment and approach here, but I would offer one bit of food for thought. People have different ways of measuring truth for themselves, and everyone develops very different convictions as to what 'the truth' is. The basis for this is rooted in each individual's experience and whatever method they have gone about attaining knowledge in their lifetime.

If, after all of this, individuals encounter each other with wildly opposite senses of truth, with each certain of their own truth, how does a bridge get built? This is a pragmatic question, one which I am frequently concerned with since the bridging of opposites is something I think is a very crux of unification.

Do you see it that others here (using this forum as example because it's the immediate environment, but I am leaning to a more general idea) simply let others have their beliefs, or does it seem like people make efforts to make their truth dominant? In my mind, it is possible to both be convicted to one's own truth as well as being humble enough to not preach it, but others see truth and deceit as a matter of warfare, and to some extent even contextualized as some battle for the human spirit and mind. Some will claim they hold more than a personal truth, and have universal truth. If someone feels this way, how could that ever allow the room for other viewpoints?

Personally, I am a little avoidant of hierarchical thinking I admit. I prefer to think in circles and with conviction only towards the seeking, less the grasping.

Thankfully, this discussion board is full of mature individuals who are here to genuinely seek knowledge. In the more mainstream conspiracy sites, there are plenty of people who feel superior due to knowing more theories or some particular theory.

I actually found that attitude the most prevalent among philosophy majors in college. I doubt much has changed but smug arrogance was their modus operandi, and I greatly enjoyed messing with them. The same attitude can even be found in video games and books. Some people think there is a "right" way to do everything.

This type of individual is similar to the one who preaches THE TRUTH™ and feels compelled to convert as many as possible to it. Both types of individuals take it as a personal affront that someone can do something they disagree with. Especially if after explaining why they are obviously correct, and anyone who does or believes differently is incorrect, then the person still refuses to capitulate their beliefs or actions, they lose their minds.

These type of people have cropped up here occasionally as well. The message here is not compatible with blind devotion, preaching, or overly judgemental discussion methods. As most everyone who participates here makes a conscious and sustained effort to accept other selves and love other selves as self, those types of interactions are not fruitful for the ego gratification of those who would engage in that method.

While there is only one truth, there is an infinite depth and breadth to the truth as well. We are not here to reconcile the polarities, or make sense of the world. Once you accept that it becomes easy to accept others and what they believe. The challenge is when what someone believes or someones actions are an infringement on yourself or others. Then you must decide what is the appropriate response.

I think this forum will continue to be an example of how STO seekers can and should interact. Hopefully more are drawn in as time moves forward and the inquisitive harmony will help many seekers.

[Ymarsakar]

If people are triggered by me bringing up mensa and the prometheus society.... i dont see them as better tha average humans.

Most people are bothered by another thing, the fact that i accurately describe whom i am talking to or about. They have a problem with being labeled as human.

Sorry if i mislabeled any agarthan super humans or lizards or insects as human. I do not want to offend the ai s either.

Spaced is wasting my time. So i am no longer interested. The magic words to get rid of me is simple. Simply write, your service is unwanted and unrequested.

Otherwise, fighting me is not recommended. What you resist, persists.

https://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthre...#pid294536

This is the pro conspiracy post spaced made. There are a lot easier short cuts to this than fighting. Either choose you want to know or if you do not want to know, erase those kind of posts.

Choose.

[Aion]

I don't see why this discussion has to have anything to do with personal attacks. I don't really agree with the notion that "people who research these topics are trying to feel more informed than the average sinkholer" thing. Like it's some ego-based thing to laugh at people and call them "sheeple". Maybe some people see it this way, and really do think reading conspiracy theories makes them smarter than everyone else. Those people would still be operating at a very 3d level. Seekers in communities like b4 are not often like that.

We can discuss these topics in their context. Is it transient to want to understand the world around, what makes humans tick, and what the societal dysfunctions are? It does not mean you are expected to physically go and fix them. It just means being aware. Understanding. If people want to discuss conspiracies in the actual greater context of the LOO and Earth 4d ascension, than I see it as a legitimate topic. If one wants to discuss other things, there is nothing stopping them from discussing higher spiritual principles removed from the framework of any Earth agendas. Nobody's discouraging that type of discussion and those avenues of seeking. Why discourage another's?

I don't think there's any judgments going on here. It's the tower of babel effect casting shadows again. I'd rather build bridges.

I see the issues with an over-focus on such topics at the detriment of purer spiritual pursuits. The tendency to use it as victimhood fuel. I don't really see that happening with any of the discussions on b4 lately. People can have a unified theory, integrated world view and bounce back and forth between conspiracy topics, Earth historical and cultural topics, and pure metaphysical and occult topics. They can discuss these in their own contexts and how they intermingle as a unified theory, just like the questions asked of the confederation addressed all these topics as a unified theory. This doesn't have to be a conflict. Everything doesn't have to be a fucking dichotomy.

I agree with your sentiment and approach here, but I would offer one bit of food for thought. People have different ways of measuring truth for themselves, and everyone develops very different convictions as to what 'the truth' is. The basis for this is rooted in each individual's experience and whatever method they have gone about attaining knowledge in their lifetime.

If, after all of this, individuals encounter each other with wildly opposite senses of truth, with each certain of their own truth, how does a bridge get built? This is a pragmatic question, one which I am frequently concerned with since the bridging of opposites is something I think is a very crux of unification.

Do you see it that others here (using this forum as example because it's the immediate environment, but I am leaning to a more general idea) simply let others have their beliefs, or does it seem like people make efforts to make their truth dominant? In my mind, it is possible to both be convicted to one's own truth as well as being humble enough to not preach it, but others see truth and deceit as a matter of warfare, and to some extent even contextualized as some battle for the human spirit and mind. Some will claim they hold more than a personal truth, and have universal truth. If someone feels this way, how could that ever allow the room for other viewpoints?

Personally, I am a little avoidant of hierarchical thinking I admit. I prefer to think in circles and with conviction only towards the seeking, less the grasping.

Thankfully, this discussion board is full of mature individuals who are here to genuinely seek knowledge. In the more mainstream conspiracy sites, there are plenty of people who feel superior due to knowing more theories or some particular theory.

I actually found that attitude the most prevalent among philosophy majors in college. I doubt much has changed but smug arrogance was their modus operandi, and I greatly enjoyed messing with them. The same attitude can even be found in video games and books. Some people think there is a "right" way to do everything.

This type of individual is similar to the one who preaches THE TRUTH™ and feels compelled to convert as many as possible to it. Both types of individuals take it as a personal affront that someone can do something they disagree with. Especially if after explaining why they are obviously correct, and anyone who does or believes differently is incorrect, then the person still refuses to capitulate their beliefs or actions, they lose their minds.

These type of people have cropped up here occasionally as well. The message here is not compatible with blind devotion, preaching, or overly judgemental discussion methods. As most everyone who participates here makes a conscious and sustained effort to accept other selves and love other selves as self, those types of interactions are not fruitful for the ego gratification of those who would engage in that method.

While there is only one truth, there is an infinite depth and breadth to the truth as well. We are not here to reconcile the polarities, or make sense of the world. Once you accept that it becomes easy to accept others and what they believe. The challenge is when what someone believes or someones actions are an infringement on yourself or others. Then you must decide what is the appropriate response.

I think this forum will continue to be an example of how STO seekers can and should interact. Hopefully more are drawn in as time moves forward and the inquisitive harmony will help many seekers.

There is a Youtube series that parodies the "Freshman Philosopher" in this way, you might get a kick out of it. It's obviously tongue in cheek but worth a chuckle.
I get what you mean though and in general I agree. In a lot of cases I think the allowances of differences is the closest to 'reconciliation' that can happen.

It's true that by and far this is quite a civil forum, although it certainly isn't without its shadows, but that's life. In actuality, the words of wisdom "let it be" might really be the key.

[Patrick]

https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/i..._0305.aspx

...When there is a storm at sea a lighthouse is needed, for one cannot see in the storm the rocks that are hidden beneath the waters. Each of you is as the lamp on the hill. You may feel that you have very little candle power yet light is penetrating. You can even see a candle a half mile away and you, my friends, are far more than a candle. The infinite love and the light of the one Creator flows through your body and as you bless its infinite energy you send it out into the world, and that light says to those about you, “There is love, there is safety, there is intimacy, there is that peace that passeth understanding.”

A world hungering sees light such as yours and they are fed, for that which is coming through you is infinite, it cannot be exhausted. You have the responsibility of being a human being at this time of shift. You carry infinity within you. Each time that you pray you move into infinite light. Each time that you meditate you rest in unconditional love, tabernacling with the infinite One. It is not human strength that lights the flame that you offer the world but the Creator Itself. You are simply a channel through which that light may flow. And when your energy body is open and your heart is open, that light bursts upon the world in great beauty...

https://www.llresearch.org/transcripts/i..._0812.aspx

...Allow yourself to radiate like a beacon, a lighthouse and know that you are one of millions who attempt at this time to cause this planet to lighten this consciousness to feel it quite crystallized, now fuller and fuller of love. Many entities ask what is my service, what is my path, what must I do, what did I come here for? And we say to any and all the first and foremost thing of which you came here [to do] was to be loving in the face of a cold and unloving environment...

Who am I ? Remember, each seekers are seeking to know the self. At the root of the tree of mind, the self is simply Love.