Harvest: Do The Math

[Peregrinus]

a 30 year long swedish study just concluded that there was no identifiable link in between cellphone usage and any kind of cancer. the study was very long, hence it encompassed the times when old cellular models which emitted more dangerous frequencies were in use. since the recent models are produced with more care, it is less likely that they will cause it while the bricks of old didnt. so, cellular potential is also off the table it seems. even if it wasnt, the reproduction rate in some parts of the world is so high that it would be arguable that they could offset it.

This cellular damage may not have repercussions for a generation or two. You quote one study, and yet I just read another that said that brain tumours are up by 400% in children under the age of 18. This study you speak of was "funded in part", no doubt, by Ericsson?

I can guarantee an effect... I got a new DPC-650 when they first came out. This was a 3 watt phone. After I used it for a couple weeks, I had a brutal sharp pain in my skull (headache) the opposite side of where I held the phone. I thought perhaps it was the phone and tried the other side. The brutal headache then changed sides after a week or two. I was cooking my brain literally, and I have no idea what consequences I will suffer for it, but I know the danger to be real. Though the output has been reduced, this only means it takes longer to do the damage. I bought a ear set for it and never held it to my head again after that.

That's a good list of the evils in this world. But rather than seeing it as a cohesive plan to remove the population, I see those items as just catalyst.

Agreed that they are catalyst provided for by our negatively polarized brothers (I no longer call them "ruling" or "elite", for they do not rule anything other than their own person, and they are in no way elite).

Wars are subject to group karma.

Government-run schemes are also subject to group karma. When the people wake up, the governments will reflect their new awareness. We live in a holographic UniVerse.

When the people wake up? Would not the more prudent term be "If" the people wake up. Many are, but still only a small percentage of the overall population.

The health-related items like diet can be avoided by the individual. It's true that most of the population is ignorant about the ill effects of medical procedures they take for granted (like vaccines, chemotherapy, etc.) but more and more ARE waking up! Proof of this is the booming alternative health industry. This too is catalyst.

Speaking for myself, my process thru the maze of the medical corruption and leading me to alternative health solutions has been an integral part of my spiritual process. And so it is for many.

People stampeded like pigs at the trough to get their "vaccine" against the H1N1. They are in so much fear right now they don't know what to do with it. Another thing which is causing problems is, of course, the 4D light. Because most have rejected green ray work and have fallen back into the complexities of the orange ray, the green ray light disturbs them. If you know people you can ask, but they do not know of the LOO or of what is really happening, ask them in some roundabout way if they feel like something is wrong. They will say yes, but they don't know what it is. I've asked... and always gotten the same response. You can see it in people's demeanor, their actions.

Discredited by main stream media (which is owned by the elite) as conspiracy theory perhaps, yet the truth still leaks out. Study after study prove these as fact, not fiction.

Could you please clarify: What has been discredited? Are you referring to the population growth? And what are you referring to that has been proven by multiple studies as fact?

I am speaking of researchers/ reporters that are shut down by law proceedings and/or fired/blacklisted from further work in their industry when they find results which would prove devastating to corporate interests. Two such instances I could show are research/reporting done on fluoride and on GMO crops.

The power elite use cell phones too. So do their children.

Are you sure? I have never seen a picture of a Bilderberg member holding a cell phone. Can you find one? The Queen of England? anyone extremely wealthy? or do they use their own specialized system which is on less damaging frequencies, which by the way, would reduce damage to everyone... changing the frequencies... they don't use them.

From the movie "The Queen" (2007) using a phone, exactly what she uses today. "The film, which details the death of Lady Diana Spencer and the public relations fiasco that followed, has gotten a great deal of press concerning its costumes -it's also nominated for best costumes - and set. I couldn't help but be captivated by the old fashioned phone the queen, played by Helen Mirren, uses." -The Buzz

For the most part children have been targeted when it comes to food, for removing a generation not only halts growth, but declines it

I agree that children have targeted. However, I respectfully disagree that the motive is to remove a generation. The reason is that there's a glaring flaw in the logic: The power elite are human too, and they have children too. Any project to remove children would also remove their children.

Do you honestly think the negative polarized and their family members eat GMOs, drink fluoridated water out of aluminum pots and pans, etc etc? Their children are not affected. Escape plans are not required, though of course they have vaccines against their released "outbreaks".

I complete agree that there are many destructive things in our society. I see a great deal of it in the medical industry, which I believe is largely corrupt at its root (NOT referring to individual doctors, nurses and researchers who generally do have good intentions of helping people). But the paradigm here in the US is slash and burn...when in doubt, cut it out...create new diseases with drugs so they can sell more drugs which create more new diseases which are then treated with more new drugs...ad infinitum until the population is drugged, docile, apathetic and sick.

And in this is their power, their control, their way of polarizing, work specifically in the yellow ray whereby they force their desires onto the mass population.

I also agree that, at the root, there may indeed be some in positions of power who believe they have a sinister plan...who believe they have a magic vaccine at the ready for use when the global plague hits....who believe their alien friends will rescue them at the last minute.

I don't see this as what they think at all. I think they are doing their utmost to cause as much sickness and hardship and maintain as much control as they can until the harvest. I believe they will remove themselves from the illusion at that point so they maintain as much of this negative polarization as they can in their ascension. Choosing their own time and place of death is in itself a form of control, polarization.

But they don't. They lie, cheat and deceive, even among their own ranks. They just aren't together enough to pull it off, imho.

Rather, I consider all the items on your list to be mechanisms of catalyst. For those (and this may include the majority of the population) who require a convenient exit from this planet, because they can't handle the incoming vibrations, cancer and other designer diseases are just the ticket.

If some clever STS entities designed these designer diseases with some sort of grand scheme, that may be true from their perspective, but remember, even STS serve the Creator. They have their part to play. Someone's got to do the dirty work.

Agreed

But, respectfully, these theories of annihilation on a grand scale tend to view life from only a limited 3D perspective. They don't take into account what we know about the densities, the Harvest, etc.

Eradicating a large portion of the population won't accomplish anything to STS entities. They feed off of fear, hate and violence. Remember, they want to polarize too. They have a much better chance of polarizing as long as there are still humans here to dominate and control. They have a lot more to gain by getting everyone worked up about the next plague than they do from an actual plague itself.

Their goal is not eradication, but the means of their negative polarization... which will result in such eradication.

[Monica]

Agreed that they are catalyst provided for by our negatively polarized brothers (I no longer call them "ruling" or "elite", for they do not rule anything other than their own person, and they are in no way elite).

Good point.

When the people wake up? Would not the more prudent term be "If" the people wake up. Many are, but still only a small percentage of the overall population.

Not everyone will wake up. Some will leave to another 3D planet. But many who aren't waking up consciously are still polarizing STO.

For example, I have some friends and family members who get their children vaccinated, are entrenched in religion, etc. and yet are still polarizing. I see it unfolding right before my eyes. They are waking up. Maybe not to the machinations going on behind the scenes, but they are waking up to love and compassion.

Isn't that what it's all about?

People stampeded like pigs at the trough to get their "vaccine" against the H1N1. They are in so much fear right now they don't know what to do with it.

On this planet? Hmmm....in my world, most people I know aren't afraid at all. They're just going on with their lives. Of course they are having health problems, financial difficulties, etc. but how is that any different? I remember, as a child, my parents had health problems and financial difficulties...40 years ago. It's just catalyst. That hasn't changed.

The people I know who are entrenched in fear tend to be my New Age and political friends. I could name a dozen people I know personally, locally, who follow Alex Jones, David Icke, et al and are heading for the hills, stockpiling food and weapons. Those are the people who are living in fear. Not the general population. The masses just line up to get their flu shots because they're told to do it. They aren't particularly fearful; they're just following their chosen 'authorities.' The are just doing what the doctors and preachers tell them to do, just as my parents obliged when the family doc told them to have their kids' tonsils removed. It's really no different.

Another thing which is causing problems is, of course, the 4D light. Because most have rejected green ray work and have fallen back into the complexities of the orange ray, the green ray light disturbs them.

Sure. That's where they're at. We'd be disturbed too if we were suddenly transported to the center of the Sun!

If you know people you can ask, but they do not know of the LOO or of what is really happening, ask them in some roundabout way if they feel like something is wrong. They will say yes, but they don't know what it is. I've asked... and always gotten the same response. You can see it in people's demeanor, their actions.

Back in the 1960s, my parents thought the world had become an evil place. In their minds, it was because of the 60s hippie generation! (What I consider a very positive thing.)

I know some fundamentalist Christians who think the world is messed up because of the 'secular' influence and because prayer isn't allowed in school. They think if the US became a Christian nation, we'd be 'blessed by God.'

People will interpret current events according to their paradigm. That hasn't changed.

The power elite use cell phones too. So do their children.

Are you sure? I have never seen a picture of a Bilderberg member holding a cell phone. Can you find one?

Well that must mean Obama is a good guy, because I know he uses a Blackberry.

I just did a search and couldn't find any on bush but did find a pic of former 'president' cheney holding a cell phone. (For what it's worth)

Do you honestly think the negative polarized and their family members eat GMOs, drink fluoridated water out of aluminum pots and pans, etc etc?

Yes, I do. I think they really believe the medical scam. They really believe that drugs and surgery are the answers to health.

Maybe some of them are savvy about GMOs and fluoridated water, but they certainly can't escape a plague. Viruses and bacteria aren't selective.

Also, fluoride is extremely difficult to remove from water. Fluoride filters cause other problems in the water. Bottled water puts plastic chemicals into the water. Distillers and reverse osmosis systems remove the minerals, thus causing other problems due to leaching of beneficial minerals from the body.

What about the chemicals in the environment? They still breathe the same air!

As long as they reside on planet Earth, they cannot completely escape the toxic substances they are supposedly subjecting the masses to.

Their children are not affected.

Do their children have friends? Do they have mothers? Will the mothers knowingly allow their own friends and loved ones to be affected? How far does their protective circle go?

This completely ignores human nature. Children tend to rebel. Look at how Presidents Nixon and Reagan had daughters who rebelled against the politics of their fathers. Just last week I saw something on the news about a woman who started a website entitled "dontvoteformydad" or something like that. She also ran a full-page ad in the local newspaper urging people to not vote for her father, because he was a horrible father and person in general.

Many of us incarnated into families that were entrenched in religious dogma. Some were abusive. Some were alcoholics, etc. Thus, we know that STO's can and do incarnate into messed up families, or even to STO parents.

Conversely, wouldn't it be safe to assume that STO's can and do incarnate into the families of the 'negative elite'?

I don't subscribe to the whole theory because it postulates that certain families rule the world. And I don't consider physical families to count for much in this respect, because they cannot control which souls incarnate into those families. I just don't believe that all the family members would submit to the plans of their parents. Young people just aren't like that. They rebel.

Escape plans are not required, though of course they have vaccines against their released "outbreaks".

This presupposes vaccines work. Respectfully, statements like the above indicate to me a tendency to think the very same way 'they' want us to think. They want us to think vaccines work. They want us to think drugs solve problems. They want us to think modern chemistry has the answers. They want us to think that humans can dominate the rest of the planet, that humans reign supreme, can rape the Earth and kill the animals, and then a prick of the needle will save us from the death and destruction we have subjected the rest of Nature to.

But that entire premise is inherently flawed. They have believed their own lies if they think a vaccine will save them!

There is very little evidence that vaccines work at all, and tons of evidence about the dangers of vaccines.

I don't want to sidetrack this thread, so anyone interested in exploring the vaccine issue is invited to do so here:

Life on Planet Earth > H1N1 vaccine and vaccines in general

For now, my main point is that I don't believe vaccines are reliable in the least, and any wealthy, powerful people who think they are, have fallen prey to the very same lies the rest of us have.

And in this is their power, their control, their way of polarizing, work specifically in the yellow ray whereby they force their desires onto the mass population.

True. But what you're leaving out is that they still get sick too...they still get angry...they still have inefficient utilization of catalyst, contributing (along with environmental toxins) to cancer...So what do they do when they get cancer?

They get chemo. They do the medical death thing. I doubt if very many of them drink wheatgrass juice and alkaline water and become vegetarians to treat their cancer. They use the same barbaric methods they project on the masses.

A notable exception is that the British royal family uses homeopathy. But I doubt if they avoid drugs and surgery altogether.

I could be wrong. I haven't exactly kept up with the medical treatments of the rich and famous!

I also agree that, at the root, there may indeed be some in positions of power who believe they have a sinister plan...who believe they have a magic vaccine at the ready for use when the global plague hits....who believe their alien friends will rescue them at the last minute.

I don't see this as what they think at all. I think they are doing their utmost to cause as much sickness and hardship and maintain as much control as they can until the harvest. I believe they will remove themselves from the illusion at that point so they maintain as much of this negative polarization as they can in their ascension. Choosing their own time and place of death is in itself a form of control, polarization.

Oh so you're talking about STS adepts? Masters so polarized that they can remove themselves from 3D at will? Or are you saying they will kill themselves (suicide)?

This presupposes that they are all awake enough to know exactly what they are doing.

Respectfully, dear friend, I think you're giving them too way much credit.

Most STO Wanderers can't even do that. There have been only occasional avatars who could leave their bodies at will. Most STO Wanderers are fumbling their way thru life, shining the Light, yes, but not exactly totally in control of everything that happens to them. Why would STS masters be any different? How could anyone possibly know what they've got planned? I suspect that a lot of this is pure speculation on the part of those who fear them. The rabbit hole is as deep as we dig it.

Here's an idea: What if that's exactly what they want? What if they want us to think they have it all figured out, all planned out up to their very last breath?

Their goal is not eradication, but the means of their negative polarization... which will result in such eradication.

If 3D Earth will cease being able to support humans, then there will be some natural means of humans leaving, which is the topic of this thread. I agree that the STS entities in positions of control have a hand in that. I just don't agree that it's all carefully planned and executed.

[Questioner]

Hypothesis: By the end of 2012, all people who will not graduate to 4D will no longer be on earth.

I'd like to return to the Q'uo session of Feb 13, 2010, linked in unity100's post. I interpret this as pointing to a different future timeline than the above hypothesis from Tenet.

My current understanding runs along the lines of a three-part split.

* At Harvest, 3D entities in "the sinkhole of indifference" will continue to live in 3D earth. This is simply people who were not yet ready to do a Senior Project of devoted service to either self or others. Therefore they remain in this school for another session of 75,000 years. They might some day prove themselves ready to "test out" early, an option few have ever taken.

They will be joined by entities incarnating into 3D earth with a spiritual goal of cleaning up their own karma by cleaning up the world. These incoming entities are spiritually "on hold." They wait for the dark cabal to get out of the way in the Harvest's removal of 4D-negative from earth. I hope they at least enjoy our on-hold music while there are 4 billion entities in the queue ahead of them...

I think a concept from Melanie Anne Phillips's work on storytelling applies here. She points out that in the greatest of stories, the hero's personal problem and the world's biggest issue revolve around the very same element of character and situation. When the hero Gets It Right inside his or her own heart, this also enables the world to Get It Right with the fully-functioning hero now at work.

For example, in Star Wars, Luke honored his intuitive guidance about right and wrong, rather than letting others' opinions and technologies push him around. This is the very same issue on a cosmic scale that had let the Empire get so far out of control. The winning shot, taken by faith, corrected the imbalance in Luke's personal evolution, and also by his action corrected the very same imbalance in the outer situation of the universe.

I picture the "cleanup crew" as entities whose personal issue is that they have not been holistically loving enough to the planetary sphere and consciousness that supports all life. Meanwhile, the planetary issue has been that Mother Earth's been literally walked all over, poked disrespectfully, taken advantage of and taken for granted in countless ways. As the "cleanup crew" starts their cycle of physical incarnations, they will be recognized as natural leaders by those in the "sinkhole." The cleanup crew restores this missing piece of love inside their own heart. In doing so, they also prayerfully pick up the garbage and clean up the mess. This brings healing individually, and also to a world that really needs some more TLC.

This goal of karmic healing and earth healing may or may not be actively recognized by conscious awareness in 3D lifetimes on Earth. For those who are aware of such a goal, it will be more likely to be recognized within the person, and respected by other people, than in our current situation.

It may be some time before there are any attempts from higher densities to provide hints, guidance, and help. There may also be some time of a more vigorous quarantine protecting 3D humanity against both attempts to help them and attempts to enslave them. My guess is that the higher-level attitude may be to just wait and see how 3D humanity do on their own, free at last from any type of interference, however well intentioned.

Physical artifacts of all the scary STS manipulations will still be around, such as cell towers, genetically modified seeds, viruses, polluting factories, etc.

With the evil cabals out of the picture, these will merely be leftover reminders of history to be cleaned up. In our own history, once the Berlin Wall came down, the existing stock of bombs had to be removed but nobody was putting up new bombs and barbed wire to recreate the alienation.

Without the dark forces that drive the worst of governments, mafias or gangs to manipulate followers, humanity will work together to inventory the leftover resources, create mitigation plans for pollution, turn off the flow of pollution, and salvage the useful technologies and techniques into new holistically beneficial systems.

Sadly, some people will get knocked off as "collateral damage" just like those who stepped onto mines planted by soldiers of long-forgotten wars.

Over time some people will naturally increase their polarity to 4D positive, others will naturally increase their polarity to 4D negative. When there is enough of a call from 4D-compatible natives on the 3D earth, the quarantine will be lifted, or at least a few holes poked in the firewall.

Some entities may be so eager to get the healing work started - for them and the planet - that they jumped in a bit before Harvest. If this line of speculation lines up with the truth, then I wonder if our new member @ndy may be an example:

A friend asked me last night what I felt I should be doing - and my instant answer was to say 'healing the earth' ...I guess I also feel I have her a debt to pay too.

If Disclosure occurs before Harvest, I suspect the 3D neutral majority of population, plus the incoming 3D "cleanup crew," may have a message like this for forces outside the Earth: "Please drop off some really good mops we can use around here, and then leave us alone for a while!"

* At Harvest, 3D entities that have highly polarized to selfishness will be relocated to a 4D-negative STS planet, not necessarily Earth. In their new home, they will continue their own self-chosen explorations in the nature of enslavement, coercion, and manipulation without love.

Whatever they might remember of humanistic values, the scientific method, the U.S. Constitution, etc., will be used as raw materials for new purposes. The purposes will be justification or technical infrastructure for further consolidation of power without compassion.

Since the evil cabal members will wind up in a world without the 90% that they so despise, they'll likely lose interest in all their mechanisms that they've used to try to turn this world into their own 4D-negative area. To the extent that anything from this Earth gets carried into their new world or recreated there, they'll probably do some cleanup on where they personally live. They'll let the areas between revert to barren wasteland, Mordoor between the castles.

For at least a while, nobody will be oppose their destructiveness against each other. Also for at least a while, they'll be kept from interfering with anyone outside the Empire.

* At Harvest, 3D entities that have adequately polarized to STO will be relocated to the 4D-positive Earth. As I hope to be in this group, I'll hopefully say that in our new home we will have a much easier time working together because the "evil cabal," "dark Ones," etc. will be somewhere else rather than meddling here as their top priority.

There may be leftover junk from this existence that gets moved or recreated in 4D-positive. Between 4D+ humanity's innate abilities, and the likely ability of higher densities to openly help as much as we are ready to receive, this cleanup should be fairly straightforward.

I'm still not clear on whether Harvest is a single event, a transition period spanning centuries, or maybe, like a flourish on the drum kit, a big bang and crash followed by rattles that continue sizzling a while.

If this model is close enough to accurate, then our current task is clear: be as loving and kind as we can to ourselves and to all others who are open to receiving our love. This might include blessing our own bodies by reducing the use of radio frequency transceivers handheld right up against our skulls. It might include our blessing other people by pointing out that their chemistry-lab physical bodies may be happier if they don't use gadgets to cook themselves. As frustrating as it can be, it has to include our recognition that some people would rather follow a trend or fad, or do things their own way, or just be stubborn, rather than heed any evidence about the dangers of cell phones.

The same would apply to all of the dangers on P's list of manipulative pollutions dumped by the current "powers that be" into our current world reality.

[unity100]

a 30 year long swedish study just concluded that there was no identifiable link in between cellphone usage and any kind of cancer. the study was very long, hence it encompassed the times when old cellular models which emitted more dangerous frequencies were in use. since the recent models are produced with more care, it is less likely that they will cause it while the bricks of old didnt. so, cellular potential is also off the table it seems. even if it wasnt, the reproduction rate in some parts of the world is so high that it would be arguable that they could offset it.

This cellular damage may not have repercussions for a generation or two. You quote one study, and yet I just read another that said that brain tumours are up by 400% in children under the age of 18. This study you speak of was "funded in part", no doubt, by Ericsson?

I can guarantee an effect... I got a new DPC-650 when they first came out. This was a 3 watt phone. After I used it for a couple weeks, I had a brutal sharp pain in my skull (headache) the opposite side of where I held the phone. I thought perhaps it was the phone and tried the other side. The brutal headache then changed sides after a week or two. I was cooking my brain literally, and I have no idea what consequences I will suffer for it, but I know the danger to be real. Though the output has been reduced, this only means it takes longer to do the damage. I bought a ear set for it and never held it to my head again after that.

its not related to ericsson.

and as of now sweden is the most trustworthy country in regard to anything. similar to its immediate neighbors. lobbying and its evils are a fact of everyday life in united states, uk and to a lesser extent some other countries. however up till this date, scandinavian countries has been free of such evil. maybe its because of their socialist culture.

in any case, no company would fund a 30 year study. for starters, a study that will not finalize in 30 years would practically have no positive effect for the market share or aims of the company.

Since the evil cabal members will wind up in a world without the 90% that they so despise, they'll likely lose interest in all their mechanisms that they've used to try to turn this world into their own 4D-negative area.

oh boy. that goes totally against the whole basis of negative polarity. they will 'just lose interest' and do cleanup and so on. negative polarity is one of fixation and stubbornness. 'losing interest' is not a feature in that road. you can expect them to try to dominate until they are totally removed from this planetary influence sphere, not just their incarnation.

[Peregrinus]

First off, I must make it clear that to be a member of the people I speak of, one must have, not a petty small time billion or less, but minimally several billion dollars.

Not everyone will wake up. Some will leave to another 3D planet.

In order to leave for another 3D planet they must be free of the physical vehicle they currently inhabit. "You can't take it with you" is indeed fitting in this case.

But many who aren't waking up consciously are still polarizing STO. For example, I have some friends and family members who get their children vaccinated, are entrenched in religion, etc. and yet are still polarizing. I see it unfolding right before my eyes. They are waking up. Maybe not to the machinations going on behind the scenes, but they are waking up to love and compassion.

Isn't that what it's all about?

Agreed this is what it is all about, but the number is, in ratio to the population, still relatively small. Orange ray work is complex... as I have personally found. One must clear the blockage or partial blockage in the orange ray to fully work in the green ray, and this takes a great deal of effort and focus. With all the distractions presented in this current world, that is a task the many fail to ever do.

People stampeded like pigs at the trough to get their "vaccine" against the H1N1. They are in so much fear right now they don't know what to do with it.

The masses just line up to get their flu shots because they're told to do it. They aren't particularly fearful; they're just following their chosen 'authorities.' The are just doing what the doctors and preachers tell them to do, just as my parents obliged when the family doc told them to have their kids' tonsils removed. It's really no different.

You don't remember the "Pandemic"? There were vax shortages. Health care professionals were charged with stealing it to vaccinate their families. There was security personnel at the clinics, lineups out the doors... The clinics ended up prioritizing women and children first because they couldn't make it fast enough... how convenient. I think if you don't see the fear in people, you aren't looking. Walk down the street. Look into peoples eyes. Wait.. you can't because they won't look at you. People hide inside their heads or their cell phones or in their iPods or their homes. Granted there are those that don't; again, this number is small. I personally smile at almost everyone I meet going down the street, and occasionally one smiles back. It isn't many. I have found the homeless actually smile back a good deal.

Another thing which is causing problems is, of course, the 4D light. Because most have rejected green ray work and have fallen back into the complexities of the orange ray, the green ray light disturbs them.

Sure. That's where they're at. We'd be disturbed too if we were suddenly transported to the center of the Sun!

If you know people you can ask, but they do not know of the LOO or of what is really happening, ask them in some roundabout way if they feel like something is wrong. They will say yes, but they don't know what it is. I've asked... and always gotten the same response. You can see it in people's demeanor, their actions.

Back in the 1960s, my parents thought the world had become an evil place. In their minds, it was because of the 60s hippie generation! (What I consider a very positive thing.)

I was speaking of the "something wrong" feeling in regards to 4D light, not in any other sense such as saying "there is something wrong with this generation". That has been said for thousands of years My apologies for the misunderstanding.

The power elite use cell phones too. So do their children.

Are you sure? I have never seen a picture of a Bilderberg member holding a cell phone. Can you find one?

Well that must mean Obama is a good guy, because I know he uses a Blackberry.

I just did a search and couldn't find any on bush but did find a pic of former 'president' cheney holding a cell phone. (For what it's worth)

Search away. When it comes to hand held, you won't find any. They don't use them. If vehicle mounted, the antenna is on the roof and the roof is EMF shielded. No precaution is spared.

Do you honestly think the negative polarized and their family members eat GMOs, drink fluoridated water out of aluminum pots and pans, etc etc?

Yes, I do. I think they really believe the medical scam. They really believe that drugs and surgery are the answers to health.

Who do you think owns pharma? Just as the Queen uses homoeopathic/holistic medicine, I would bet dollars to donuts the rest do too.

Maybe some of them are savvy about GMOs and fluoridated water, but they certainly can't escape a plague. Viruses and bacteria aren't selective.

What about the chemicals in the environment? They still breathe the same air!

Virus', bacteria, pollution, deathly gases, pollution etc etc certainly are easy to remove in a filtered environment such as a multi-million dollar home. Howard Hughes had one in the 1930's. I'm sure they have become far more advanced since then, and if it can be done in a "Boy in the bubble" scenario, it can be easily done in a home/car/business. Do a search for home air purification or home air filtration systems.

Also, fluoride is extremely difficult to remove from water. Fluoride filters cause other problems in the water. Bottled water puts plastic chemicals into the water. Distillers and reverse osmosis systems remove the minerals, thus causing other problems due to leaching of beneficial minerals from the body.

Do you seriously think the monitory rich drink tap water? Really? I'm not rich and I don't drink it. You aren't rich and you don't drink it. If anyone here had the money to drink better than fluoridated tap water, would they choose it?

As long as they reside on planet Earth, they cannot completely escape the toxic substances they are supposedly subjecting the masses to.

I agree they cannot completely avoid life... They have to walk from the car to the hotel and back to the car at times. Sure they can't avoid everything at all times, but they can most of the time.

Do their children have friends? Do they have mothers? Will the mothers knowingly allow their own friends and loved ones to be affected? How far does their protective circle go?

The children's friends are other members or families within the circle. More on this below.

This completely ignores human nature. Children tend to rebel. Look at how Presidents Nixon and Reagan had daughters who rebelled against the politics of their fathers. Just last week I saw something on the news about a woman who started a website entitled "dontvoteformydad" or something like that. She also ran a full-page ad in the local newspaper urging people to not vote for her father, because he was a horrible father and person in general.

Politicians are low level "front men". It is required for the spotlight to be on these puppets so that the real players are not noticed. Having foolish children/ family members is fine, for these simply continue to distract the masses. All of this distraction is so beautifully orchestrated by the main stream media. (Perhaps a whole other thread, though I tire of speaking of all this).

An STS entity is selfish from the beginning of life, and this is encouraged and rewarded from an early age. The schools even are designed so that they are taught they are smarter and superior in every way, and that the rest of the people in the world are weak stupid animals. They not only dislike people, but feel no remorse or compassion for them because they believe what they have been told. It pays to believe (for them).

Many of us incarnated into families that were entrenched in religious dogma. Some were abusive. Some were alcoholics, etc. Thus, we know that STO's can and do incarnate into messed up families, or even to STO parents.

Conversely, wouldn't it be safe to assume that STO's can and do incarnate into the families of the 'negative elite'?

I assume in the last sentence you meant to say STS... All spirits incarnate into lives which will best provide the catalyst which will advance their individual spiritual evolution. If one is STS, then the life of an ultra rich self indulgent family that caters to the self is the perfect place to continue to gain polarization... it only makes sense.

I don't subscribe to the whole theory because it postulates that certain families rule the world. And I don't consider physical families to count for much in this respect, because they cannot control which souls incarnate into those families. I just don't believe that all the family members would submit to the plans of their parents. Young people just aren't like that. They rebel.

Brain washing combined with STS traits (of a psychopath) cemented with threats of loss of power, security, and monitory income can do wonders. Doubt nothing is possible, sister, if the desire is great enough. When one speaks of moving mountains, it can be done.

There are several ruling powers in the world, but one has held the balance of power and still do. As to ruling the world... no they don't, but they have had considerable power for the last couple hundred years. They have been working towards their final push to polarize as strongly as possible, for they know just as we know, that where they ascend to is hostile.

Escape plans are not required, though of course they have vaccines against their released "outbreaks".

This presupposes vaccines work. Respectfully, statements like the above indicate to me a tendency to think the very same way 'they' want us to think. They want us to think vaccines work. They want us to think drugs solve problems. They want us to think modern chemistry has the answers. They want us to think that humans can dominate the rest of the planet, that humans reign supreme, can rape the Earth and kill the animals, and then a prick of the needle will save us from the death and destruction we have subjected the rest of Nature to.

But that entire premise is inherently flawed. They have believed their own lies if they think a vaccine will save them!

There is very little evidence that vaccines work at all, and tons of evidence about the dangers of vaccines.

Correct; the vaccines given to the masses are designed to do damage.

I don't want to sidetrack this thread, so anyone interested in exploring the vaccine issue is invited to do so here:

Life on Planet Earth > H1N1 vaccine and vaccines in general

Also to not sidetrack, I only wish to emphasize that the vaccines given to the masses are not the vaccines which the manufacturers of the disease(s) have.

I don't see this as what they think at all. I think they are doing their utmost to cause as much sickness and hardship and maintain as much control as they can until the harvest. I believe they will remove themselves from the illusion at that point so they maintain as much of this negative polarization as they can in their ascension. Choosing their own time and place of death is in itself a form of control, polarization.

Oh so you're talking about STS adepts? Masters so polarized that they can remove themselves from 3D at will? Or are you saying they will kill themselves (suicide)?

This presupposes that they are all awake enough to know exactly what they are doing.

Respectfully, dear friend, I think you're giving them too way much credit.

Respectfully sister, I think you underestimate them. They have been working on the plan on getting the world to being the way it is for hundreds of years, if not thousands. Because history was not recorded I cannot show points going back that far, but I will tell you one significant date... 5 October 1582. As for STS adepts, there are many, far more than STO adepts. This is why there are so many lightworkers here; to create balance.

Most STO Wanderers can't even do that. There have been only occasional avatars who could leave their bodies at will. Most STO Wanderers are fumbling their way thru life, shining the Light, yes, but not exactly totally in control of everything that happens to them. Why would STS masters be any different? How could anyone possibly know what they've got planned? I suspect that a lot of this is pure speculation on the part of those who fear them. The rabbit hole is as deep as we dig it.

Here's an idea: What if that's exactly what they want? What if they want us to think they have it all figured out, all planned out up to their very last breath?

This is not my desire and I hope to manifest a different reality, one in which this catalyst spurs mankind to awaken and move into the green ray, but as I understand it, and as we have spoken about, this is a blend of manifestation of the many, not of the one. Ever possible, but improbable, no?

For example, in Star Wars, Luke honored his intuitive guidance about right and wrong, rather than letting others' opinions and technologies push him around. This is the very same issue on a cosmic scale that had let the Empire get so far out of control. The winning shot, taken by faith, corrected the imbalance in Luke's personal evolution, and also by his action corrected the very same imbalance in the outer situation of the universe.

I like this analogy brother

* At Harvest, 3D entities that have highly polarized to selfishness will be relocated to a 4D-negative STS planet, not necessarily Earth. In their new home, they will continue their own self-chosen explorations in the nature of enslavement, coercion, and manipulation without love.

Not necessarily earth? This is incorrect. Most definitely not earth. Without love? Again incorrect. In the case of STS, they love the self.

Whatever they might remember...

Once free of the veil one remembers all of their past lives. Nothing is forgotten.

My apologies if I missed response to any points you deem important. It is late and I am tired and it took some time to reply to our dear sister

[Questioner]

Since the evil cabal members will wind up in a world without the 90% that they so despise, they'll likely lose interest in all their mechanisms that they've used to try to turn this world into their own 4D-negative area.

oh boy. that goes totally against the whole basis of negative polarity. they will 'just lose interest' and do cleanup and so on. negative polarity is one of fixation and stubbornness. 'losing interest' is not a feature in that road. you can expect them to try to dominate until they are totally removed from this planetary influence sphere, not just their incarnation.

I meant to refer to the time after Harvest, when the 4d-negative types will have been removed to their own environment - totally removed from this planetary influence sphere, as you well put it.

On our current planet today, the grim core of the 4d-negative dark cabal (the psychopathic bloodlines, Machiavellian manipulators and so on) is likely under 10% of the total population. When that minority gets their own planet, the schemes they currently use to oppress or kill off the other 90% of the people here won't be relevant any more. The 90% will be in other worlds, unavailable to be oppressed or killed off any more.

When the die-hard STS'ers are on their own planet, separate from both 4d-positive and 3d-undecided, they will no longer be able to have an influence on those they currently consider the non-elite. They'll no doubt make their new elite planet an imperial prison planet. But to continue their polarizing experiments, they will have to work on enslaving each other rather than the rest of us.

On the 4d-negative planet, of course it's to be expected that the 4d-neg types may further work hard on oppressing each other.

Think of it this way. Suppose that everyone but the most vicious, ruthless power-grabbing types disappeared from New York City, leaving behind only a few thousand people of the most negative, hostile, madly authoritarian mindsets. Some would be Wall Street or political types, already ensconced in the fanciest of penthouses. Some would be gang leaders, drug dealers, mobsters, or petty thieves, each one the king of the trashiest hill in their neighborhood.
With the rest of the population gone, people who live by preying on the unsuspecting masses would have to switch to preying on each other. The low-lifes would likely seize some kind of properties they could make into their own fortresses, while the upper-class manipulators would have a bunker mentality behind wrought-iron gates.
Within a few years, there would likely be some patches of beauty and elegance inside the virtual castles, with decay taking over the rest of the city. Eventually a new slavery system will guarantee that someone will take out the trash and trim the trees inside the walled estates, because they're forced to do this as a form of humiliating exploitation. Since blessings for the public good would not be of any interest to the 4d-negative types, Central Park would pretty quickly go to hell in the 4d-neg planet starts off like Earth at the time of Harvest.

This is a world away, literally, from the beauty that I think both 3D-undecided and 4D-positive worlds will have. Once the cabal's interference is removed, the normal human capacity for responsible maintenance will get expressed without perverse redirection to private aggrandizement.

I agree that we can expect 4D-neg to be pretty much relentless up to their last minute here. I've seen some channeled sources indicate that they're working on some kind of a checkmate/blackmail scenario to force the hidden-agenda creators to abdicate. While I'd love to see that turn out well, it seems like an uphill and unlikely battle from my current view.

[3D Sunset]

Ultimately, all this discussion seems like wasted energy to me. I am reminded of the following quote. I think that it was no coincidence that this statement was made in the inaugural session of the Ra contact.

Ra: I am Ra... We do not concern ourselves with the conditions which bring about harvest.

Love and Light,

3D Sunset

[Questioner]

My apologies if I missed response to any points you deem important. It is late and I am tired and it took some time to reply to our dear sister

Ultimately, all this discussion seems like wasted energy to me.

I think what is most important is what we already agree on here. Otherwise this forum would hold no sustained interest for any of us. They key point is this: our opportunity for spiritual growth is in discovering the love available in each moment, as we appreciate and participate in ever more of the one creator's diversity of expressions.

With that foundation, there is plenty of time to discuss what might happen; or, without expectation, to simply wait and see while going about our everyday, every moment mission of bringing light and love to that moment. There is always enough time to greet the future with love in our hearts. If that's what we do, then it really doesn't matter much whether or not our minds turn over various speculations. Compared to driving, the heart is the engine, the mind is the radio. As long as we don't get too distracted to pay attention to the road, a talk show is fine as long as we don't substitute chatter for genuine traffic reports.

If P's interpretation is right, Harvest will be a transition process spanning centuries. Therefore there is no need to rush to figure it out now. If David Wilcock's interpretation is right, Harvest will come about from forces of nature and forces of "spiritual Management." These forces, he says, will do their work with or without our understanding of the process. If those who expect "change in the twinkling of an eye" are correct, the earliest we can expect that change is a year and half from now assuming Q'uo's Solstice 2011 remark wasn't a communication error. Therefore, if our discussions occur today or next week, that doesn't really matter much, does it?

Ra specifically said that our current density of consciousness does not support truly understanding these matters. Despite that limitation, Ra and Q'uo have seen benefit in providing what information they can to those who seek what understanding we can have inside these limits. I've been outspoken, perhaps most so in a thread that since got deleted, against any premise of "salvation through cleverness." I see that as a manipulation used by negative forces to spread fear, despair, anxiety, worry, and dependency on particular groups. Whether or not we figure out what might happen and how it might happen, cleverness and comprehension will not save us if we don't first have compassion, wisdom, and balance. If we do have those positive qualities, the clever understanding is still optional.

This context still gives opportunity to explore some topics that seem to be to be worth discussing, for those interested. One very serious concern brought up by P: since we apparently haven't yet experienced Harvest, what if anything can we do about the evil manipulations being done by the STS ne'er-do-wells in our current world? And other question is, given what information we have so far, how might life be like after Harvest? While realizing that insights and conversations can't save us, it still can be useful to compare what we've learned so that each of our minds can be, if possible, a bit more accurate in their model of how the future might yet unfold.

[unity100]

....................

i think you are mixing two concepts together. and a few missed points.

first of all, the percentage of sts harvests are always low. 10% would be a MEGA overestimation in regard to their number. and when they get harvested, they wont get their own planet, they wont be in numbers to necessitate a planet. they will just incarnate in wherever they are sent to.

secondly, this is totally irrelevant to us. doesnt concern us. its their situation. moreover, the sts entities need not be in positions of power. there are a few probably still alive now, from nazi episode. yet, you dont see any of them in positions of power. so, the sts harvest is not directly related to political power usage. 'power over others' can be manifested in many different ways.

the negatively inclined entities, probably are who you are speaking of. the ones who are leaning towards political power, of course. even if they are not harvestable yet, these entities are still negatively inclined, and at the point of negativity towards harvest as much as they were able to go forward. so, they will be exhibiting the characteristics as much as their polarization.

even if sts entities live and die out their lives naturally and get harvested, there wont be any relation in between the 3d negatively inclined entities and these sts harvestable ones throughout their lives. therefore, when any kind of harvest happens, there is no necessary correlation in between sts harvested entities and the situation and desires of negatively inclined 3d entities in power. these remaining 3d negative inclined entities will still be behaving as they behaved before. ie, now.

---

Ultimately, all this discussion seems like wasted energy to me. I am reminded of the following quote. I think that it was no coincidence that this statement was made in the inaugural session of the Ra contact.

Ra: I am Ra... We do not concern ourselves with the conditions which bring about harvest.

Love and Light,

3D Sunset

i disagree with Ra, and you. on grounds of wisdom.

conditions which bring the harvest, will affect the harvest. conditions which bring the harvest, are what we are living in. conditions which bring the harvest IS the dance that is happening on this planet here and now.

with the other kind of logic, one could as well say 'we do not concern ourselves with the conditions which bring the end of octave' and ignore this entire octave and all that is in it ...

[Monica]

In order to leave for another 3D planet they must be free of the physical vehicle they currently inhabit. "You can't take it with you" is indeed fitting in this case.

My point is that, rather than seeing the masses as helpless victims of the STS ptb, why not consider that they are working within their own karmas? Many won't wake up, and a designer disease is just the ticket to where they will be more comfortable. These souls, who are choosing to move to a 3D planet, aren't food for the elite because they're failing to polarize. So the bulk of the population, who won't be polarizing, are the ones being supposedly controlled? What's the point of controlling them if they aren't polarizing STS anyway? Other than to provide a bit of sustenance from their fear.

Agreed this is what it is all about, but the number is, in ratio to the population, still relatively small. Orange ray work is complex... as I have personally found. One must clear the blockage or partial blockage in the orange ray to fully work in the green ray, and this takes a great deal of effort and focus. With all the distractions presented in this current world, that is a task the many fail to ever do.

That's presupposing that there are blockages in the orange ray. Perhaps to someone who is awake, orange ray work is more significant. But I know plenty of people who are just average, mainstream people, who don't seem to have orange ray issues, who aren't into power at all, and who have a sweetness about them, a passion for helping others...I consider these people harvestable to STO. Their numbers are far greater than you might think! Q'uo has stated that, if a straw poll were done today, the majority of the population would choose to no longer live with violence. For a straw poll to show a majority, that means 51% or more of the population. Does this mean 51% is harvestable? I don't know. Maybe not necessarily. But we do know, from Q'uo, that at least 51% has chosen to move away from violence. That's encouraging!

Sessions in Focus > 2007.02.11 World Events, Failed STS Coup, Rejoining Time-Lateral

You don't remember the "Pandemic"? There were vax shortages. Health care professionals were charged with stealing it to vaccinate their families. There was security personnel at the clinics, lineups out the doors... The clinics ended up prioritizing women and children first because they couldn't make it fast enough... how convenient.

I think alot of that was inflated by the media, to get people to get their flu shots. I know lots of people who didn't get it at all. Sure there were some who were desperate, but that's always true.

I think if you don't see the fear in people, you aren't looking.

You're right I'm not looking....for fear. We see what we look for.

Walk down the street. Look into peoples eyes. Wait.. you can't because they won't look at you. People hide inside their heads or their cell phones or in their iPods or their homes. Granted there are those that don't; again, this number is small.

Wow, are we living on the same planet?? That is nothing like my world. I find people friendly, with very little effort.

It might be partially geographic. When I was in New Jersey a few months ago, I noticed the black people up there were less friendly, like they weren't used to be greeted by a white person. I found this sad. But that was surely due to them being used to experiencing prejudice. I don't see that as supporting the idea that people are fearful as a whole.

What you describe is not true at all where I live. Maybe you get different responses because you're male, maybe? I'm a short woman so not very intimidating, haha.

I personally smile at almost everyone I meet going down the street, and occasionally one smiles back. It isn't many.

Well, smiles are easy to avoid. Try adding some audio! I don't just smile, I give them a great BIG smile and I say, "Hi, how are you doing today?" with a lot of feeling and it never fails to get a response. People might act surprised but they always, always respond! with a smile too.

I have found the homeless actually smile back a good deal.

Maybe because they aren't preoccupied with their cell phones or whatever and just more alert to what's around them. Try adding the audio and I'm sure you will find that people are pretty much the same everywhere! Even in NJ, when I just smiled at the black people, they averted their eyes and ignored me. But when I TALKED to them, they responded!

I was speaking of the "something wrong" feeling in regards to 4D light, not in any other sense such as saying "there is something wrong with this generation". That has been said for thousands of years My apologies for the misunderstanding.

OK, thanks for the clarification! Undoubtedly all souls presently incarnated know something is afoot, subconsciously.

Search away. When it comes to hand held, you won't find any. They don't use them. If vehicle mounted, the antenna is on the roof and the roof is EMF shielded. No precaution is spared.

OK. Maybe cheney isn't the dark lord I thought he was, then. Maybe he's just a flunkie.

Who do you think owns pharma? Just as the Queen uses homoeopathic/holistic medicine, I would bet dollars to donuts the rest do too.

Does the queen use homeopathy exclusively? Or do they sometimes go to the hospital?

You may be right about this. I agree that Big Pharma is owned by evil entities, at its core.

Maybe some of them are savvy about GMOs and fluoridated water, but they certainly can't escape a plague. Viruses and bacteria aren't selective.

What about the chemicals in the environment? They still breathe the same air!

Virus', bacteria, pollution, deathly gases, pollution etc etc certainly are easy to remove in a filtered environment such as a multi-million dollar home. Howard Hughes had one in the 1930's. I'm sure they have become far more advanced since then, and if it can be done in a "Boy in the bubble" scenario, it can be easily done in a home/car/business. Do a search for home air purification or home air filtration systems.

My opinion is based on the 30 years of research I have done personally, on the issue of health, environmental poisons, wholistic health, etc. Yes, a lot can be filtered out. But not completely. It doesn't take much exposure. A walk to the car can expose a person to a deadly virus. Food must still be brought in.

I agree they probably avoid the fluoride, but I doubt that all of them live in bubbles. And even if they do, they cannot avoid plagues. Remember, these people are still human. Do you really think their youth would be content to live their lives in bubbles?

I agree they cannot completely avoid life... They have to walk from the car to the hotel and back to the car at times. Sure they can't avoid everything at all times, but they can most of the time.

"most of the time" isn't good enough to avoid plagues. And they still have anger, contributing to cancer. I doubt if they drink wheatgrass juice and go raw foods vegan when they get cancer. So how do they treat their cancer?

The children's friends are other members or families within the circle. More on this below.

Circles widen over time and generations.

An STS entity is selfish from the beginning of life, and this is encouraged and rewarded from an early age. The schools even are designed so that they are taught they are smarter and superior in every way, and that the rest of the people in the world are weak stupid animals. They not only dislike people, but feel no remorse or compassion for them because they believe what they have been told. It pays to believe (for them).

This presupposes all souls born into these families are STS. How do you know that to be true?

Many of us incarnated into families that were entrenched in religious dogma. Some were abusive. Some were alcoholics, etc. Thus, we know that STO's can and do incarnate into messed up families, or even to STO parents.

Conversely, wouldn't it be safe to assume that STO's can and do incarnate into the families of the 'negative elite'?

I assume in the last sentence you meant to say STS... All spirits incarnate into lives which will best provide the catalyst which will advance their individual spiritual evolution. If one is STS, then the life of an ultra rich self indulgent family that caters to the self is the perfect place to continue to gain polarization... it only makes sense.

No, I definitely meant STO. It's not such a neat package, so easy to figure out who's STO and who's STS. Some STO advanced souls have incarnated into religious dogmatic families, to learn discipline (not sure which Ra session I read that in). An STO might incarnate into a predominately STS family in order to strengthen certain aspects of his being, or to try to work from within. Who knows? But we certainly cannot assume that such hard and fast rules about incarnation exist. The STS entities have their catalyst too! Just as we have to deal with them, so too do they have to deal with us. An STO in their midst might give them a challenge. It works both ways!

Respectfully, I just don't accept the idea that certain families are all completely STS.

Brain washing combined with STS traits (of a psychopath) cemented with threats of loss of power, security, and monitory income can do wonders. Doubt nothing is possible, sister, if the desire is great enough. When one speaks of moving mountains, it can be done.

I acknowledge that anything is possible. But I am choosing to expand my open-mindedness in the direction of awe and wonder at how good might prevail, rather than being in awe of how powerful STS entities are.

Correct; the vaccines given to the masses are designed to do damage.

Are you implying that the STS ptb have their own, better vaccines that they trust are foolproof? I respectfully disagree. I don't believe in the entire premise of vaccines at all. There are way too many factors involved in health.

Respectfully sister, I think you underestimate them. They have been working on the plan on getting the world to being the way it is for hundreds of years, if not thousands.

Yup. I do underestimate them. But I am in good company. Our own dear Q'uo advises us to not be overly concerned with those who build empires. See the session I posted above.

A pastor once said, "The devil is no bigger than a flea on a gnat's behind, to those who love the Lord." I think that's a useful philosophy. Why should we be fearful of STS machinations? We have the power to rise above that and create our own realities. They can't touch us unless we let them.

[Questioner]

secondly, this is totally irrelevant to us. doesnt concern us. its their situation.

If my curiosity about the post-Harvest experiences of the die-hard STS'ers is just a dead end, I'm willing to entirely drop the subject. Perhaps exploring these speculations is a distraction from good that can be done here and now, preparing for a future in which the manipulators will be pretty much irrelevant.

---

Why should we be fearful of STS machinations? We have the power to rise above that and create our own realities. They can't touch us unless we let them.

I guess I can finally summarize my concern. It's necessary to learn enough about the forces of evil so that one doesn't get sucked in by their schemes. At the same time, spending too much time on that would suck away one's opportunities to do good. How to find a healthy balance?

[3D Sunset]

i disagree with Ra, and you. on grounds of wisdom.

conditions which bring the harvest, will affect the harvest. conditions which bring the harvest, are what we are living in. conditions which bring the harvest IS the dance that is happening on this planet here and now.

with the other kind of logic, one could as well say 'we do not concern ourselves with the conditions which bring the end of octave' and ignore this entire octave and all that is in it ...

And I too, respectfully disagree with you, my friend, on the ground of foolishness. For fool I am, and the Fool's Archetype seems most appropriate when discussing topics of such mystery as the Harvest.

I propose that the conditions we are living in, are not those that will bring about the harvest. Rather, they are simply the manifestation of forces that are being brought to bear to maximize the bounty of the harvest. In much the same way as rain and sun can maximize the harvest of wheat, so too, catalysts help maximize the bounty of our Harvest.

As such, rather than concerning myself with the amount of sun and rain that is provided across my field (and which I have no real control over... for does not the rain fall on the unjust as well?), I prefer to concern myself with the efficient processing of that which I receive, in order to maximize the resulting yield that I may humbly deliver to the One Creator.

I would suggest that this may prove to be a more productive, but perhaps not wiser action to take.

I would further propose that the actual conditions that will bring about the harvest are both unknown and unknowable, until viewed with the benefit of hindsight.

Just remember, ultimately, it is the Fool's Choice that we are here to make!

Love and Light,

3D Sunset

[unity100]

secondly, this is totally irrelevant to us. doesnt concern us. its their situation.

If my curiosity about the post-Harvest experiences of the die-hard STS'ers is just a dead end, I'm willing to entirely drop the subject. Perhaps exploring these speculations is a distraction from good that can be done here and now, preparing for a future in which the manipulators will be pretty much irrelevant.

---

i didnt say as such. i think it is a subject that needs to be known for wisdom.

however, post harvest experiences of die hard stsers is irrelevant to the question at hand -> what happens to this planet now, immediately, and after harvest.

---

..................

because this will probably be a detailed topic in itself, i will just reply in short ; the study and understanding of the dance during this harvest, has the possibility of offering biggest lessons to the sharp mind and sensitive soul. of course, that would be a concern of blue ray and above work.

[lvxseeker]

Respectfully sister, I think you underestimate them. They have been working on the plan on getting the world to being the way it is for hundreds of years, if not thousands. Because history was not recorded I cannot show points going back that far, but I will tell you one significant date... 5 October 1582.

I had to investigate that date - it was the day there was a switch from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar. Ten days were eliminated from October that year. I never knew that, so thank you Peregrinus for educating me! The Gregorian calendar wasn't implemented globally, which explains why there can be discrepancies in historical dates. Russia didn't adopt the Gregorian calendar until 1919, and the Eastern Orthodox Churches still use the Julian calendar which explains why their Easter falls at a different date.

I can not understand how this falls into the STS agenda. Could you explain or provide a link. Many thanks

[Peregrinus]

Respectfully sister, I think you underestimate them. They have been working on the plan on getting the world to being the way it is for hundreds of years, if not thousands. Because history was not recorded I cannot show points going back that far, but I will tell you one significant date... 5 October 1582.

I had to investigate that date - it was the day there was a switch from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar. Ten days were eliminated from October that year. I never knew that, so thank you Peregrinus for educating me! The Gregorian calendar wasn't implemented globally, which explains why there can be discrepancies in historical dates. Russia didn't adopt the Gregorian calendar until 1919, and the Eastern Orthodox Churches still use the Julian calendar which explains why their Easter falls at a different date.

I can not understand how this falls into the STS agenda. Could you explain or provide a link. Many thanks

Separation of self from harmony with nature.

When people used the moon as their monthly 28 day cycle (which is the same length as the female menstrual cycle), this was separating the self from the cycles of the moon.

Today, when people are not in touch with these cycles, they are not in touch with the self, for the moon is part of the self, and holds great sway over us, as it does with the Mother. Ask almost anyone when the next full moon is. 500 years ago they would have been able to tell you, but now, the moon is just another part of the separated cosmos.

Note how aggressively the natives of North America have been exterminated. More than 150 million have been aggressively terminated, while today sterilization programs, under the guise of birth control, are still used on them. The reason was/is that the natives were/are in touch with nature, and this is something which removed power from the lie of separation.

[Peregrinus]

My point is that, rather than seeing the masses as helpless victims of the STS ptb, why not consider that they are working within their own karmas? Many won't wake up, and a designer disease is just the ticket to where they will be more comfortable. These souls, who are choosing to move to a 3D planet, aren't food for the elite because they're failing to polarize. So the bulk of the population, who won't be polarizing, are the ones being supposedly controlled? What's the point of controlling them if they aren't polarizing STS anyway? Other than to provide a bit of sustenance from their fear.

I believe this was the point I had previously made, to which I would say we are in agreement.

But we do know, from Q'uo, that at least 51% has chosen to move away from violence. That's encouraging!

Indeed

I think alot of that was inflated by the media, to get people to get their flu shots. I know lots of people who didn't get it at all. Sure there were some who were desperate, but that's always true.

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/6396102/
http://www.8newsnow.com/global/story.asp?s=11341517

There are thousands of stories like that, of thousands of people lined up. It's a good thing there was a shortage...

You're right I'm not looking....for fear. We see what we look for.

it is not what I look for, but what I see. It breaks my heart, for I have a great compassion for people. I have to be careful about paying too much attention to this, for it can have a demoralizing effect on me. Agreed geographic location is important, for it is not like that everywhere.

OK. Maybe cheney isn't the dark lord I thought he was, then. Maybe he's just a flunkie.

As I believe I previously mentioned, the puppets that appear in the news are not the real powers... not even close.

Circles widen over time and generations.

You appear to forget the key to sts polarization. Control control control. For those with billions of dollars, this is made easier.

This presupposes all souls born into these families are STS. How do you know that to be true?

I am not saying every single person born into these families is sts, but the sts entity will find these offer the best choices for spiritual advancement.

Conversely, wouldn't it be safe to assume that STO's can and do incarnate into the families of the 'negative elite'?

Agreed. Princess Diana had Rothschild bloodlines, and she was very sto.

I acknowledge that anything is possible. But I am choosing to expand my open-mindedness in the direction of awe and wonder at how good might prevail, rather than being in awe of how powerful STS entities are.

Good (positive polarity ascension) will prevail dear sister; just not in the numbers we had hoped for in this time lateral.

Yup. I do underestimate them. But I am in good company. Our own dear Q'uo advises us to not be overly concerned with those who build empires. See the session I posted above.

Although you might see me as being overly concerned, I really am not.

Years ago before I had ever read the LOO, I spoke and thought as though I had read it. I offered thanks to the Creator each morning when I woke, talked to my higher self often, and knew this plane was an illusion. I was not and am not fearful of anything, especially death, for I learned many years ago that I was not in control of how/when I die. I found I couldn't die or be seriously hurt no matter how hard I tried, and Oh I did try, and came to think I was invincible. Bullets always went by me; bombs never touched me; knives always missed me; tanks never once rolled over me even when I standing within feet of where they travelled; car and motorcycle accidents I walked away from, even several where the vehicles were written off; the list goes on and on... I was, of course, then given a lesson (crushed a verebrae and had to learn to walk/breath upright again) to show me that that was not the case. It was in this lesson that I truly understood the value of the physical vehicle in continuing the experience. I recovered 100% from this and took up skateboarding and snowboarding 5 years later, two things which I still enjoy.

Just as we teach a child to look both ways before he/she crosses the street, I found it important to understand the playing field, the "street" we play on, as it were. Only in this understanding can one avoid the "traffic" and keep the physical vehicle in good condition. When I speak of these things to people, they often say "Well, what can one do with all these dangers". It is easy; learn what/where the dangers are and minimize/remove your exposure to them. Just as crossing the street takes a little care, so can one take care with their life. One may see all these things I pointed out as doom and gloom; I simply see them as traffic on the street; not good, not evil, just harmful if ignored.

A pastor once said, "The devil is no bigger than a flea on a gnat's behind, to those who love the Lord." I think that's a useful philosophy. Why should we be fearful of STS machinations? We have the power to rise above that and create our own realities. They can't touch us unless we let them.

Being the devil is a thought form, it can be as big, or as small, as we desire it. I'm surprised... you using a quote from a religious man :p

You are indeed correct though, and I do agree. Power must be given, and I do not give it by stepping into our negative brother's traffic or in living by their rules. They may lock me in chains, or make unviable this physical vehicle if they desire, but they will never control me.

[Monica]

I believe this was the point I had previously made, to which I would say we are in agreement.

But we do know, from Q'uo, that at least 51% has chosen to move away from violence. That's encouraging!

Indeed

To clarify: Q'uo didn't use any numbers, did not actually say 51%, but did say that if a straw poll were taken today, more people would choose peace over violence, than would choose to be controlled by the STS empire. So I interpret that as 'more than half.'

There are thousands of stories like that, of thousands of people lined up.

That just means they did it. It doesn't necessarily mean they have any more fear about this virus than our grandparents had about polio. It's natural for people to fear plagues and be willing to line up like sheep when the 'authorities' tell them to do so.

Sure, the drug companies took advantage of that.

it is not what I look for, but what I see.

Why are you seeing the fear instead of the hope? Both are there if you look.

Agreed geographic location is important, for it is not like that everywhere.

I think that might be part of it, but hope is still there, in your part of the world, if you look for it. Suggestion: Try talking to people with a big smile and see what happens! Just a simple "Hi! How's your day going?" when you pass them on the street or when you hand the cashier your $$, or when the UPS guys delivers your package or whatever.

Agreed. Princess Diana had Rothschild bloodlines, and she was very sto.

OK, excellent example! I'm sure there are more. We just know about Diana because she was in the spotlight.

It is easy; learn what/where the dangers are and minimize/remove your exposure to them. Just as crossing the street takes a little care, so can one take care with their life. One may see all these things I pointed out as doom and gloom; I simply see them as traffic on the street; not good, not evil, just harmful if ignored.

Thanks for sharing!

As was said in this thread, the task is to find the balance between knowing dangers but keeping them in perspective; ie. knowing the terrain and creating a new terrain. That's where you and I might have a difference idea of what that balance is. I actually agree with you on a lot. The difference is that I don't think the STS entities have nearly as much control and I also think that the deeper you dig, the deeper the rabbit hole gets, not necessarily because it really was deep, but because the person digging is also creating it as he goes, just by the act of digging. We are all contributing to the holographic reality we live in. For example, if a person has his mind made up that Obama is the anti-Christ, he will find evidence to support that belief. We can find evidence to the degree that it might seem we aren't living on the same planet. Such is the nature of our holographic UniVerse. Just look at the huge discrepancy between the perspectives of our 2 political parties right now. People view the same people and events as though on different planets!

[quote='Bring4th_Monica' pid='17616' dateline='1280766061']
Being the devil is a thought form, it can be as big, or as small, as we desire it.

Exactly! The 'devil' is the evil STS ptb, in this case.

I'm surprised... you using a quote from a religious man :p

Sure, why not? It does happen occasionally!

[lvxseeker]

Separation of self from harmony with nature.

When people used the moon as their monthly 28 day cycle (which is the same length as the female menstrual cycle), this was separating the self from the cycles of the moon.

Today, when people are not in touch with these cycles, they are not in touch with the self, for the moon is part of the self, and holds great sway over us, as it does with the Mother. Ask almost anyone when the next full moon is. 500 years ago they would have been able to tell you, but now, the moon is just another part of the separated cosmos.

Note how aggressively the natives of North America have been exterminated. More than 150 million have been aggressively terminated, while today sterilization programs, under the guise of birth control, are still used on them. The reason was/is that the natives were/are in touch with nature, and this is something which removed power from the lie of separation.

This happened not only in North America, but in many countries where the invading power crushed the indigenous cultures.

I really think the rot started to set in when humans moved from hunter gatherers to farmers. The development of agriculture and becoming fixed in the one place began the notion of property and acquisition, and a loss in the knowledge of how to find the food that Nature provides.

I wonder how this harmony can be returned to the peoples of Earth. I can't see 6 billion people returning to a hunter gatherer lifestyle

[Peregrinus]

Not in the way you think of it, I suspect that will be happening sooner than later.

[Xplosiw]

I would love it to happen, really

[Monica]

Apparently, a lot of people are exiting via cancer:

cancer rates are on the rise and the disease is expected to kill more than 13 million people a year by 2030, almost double the number who died from the disease in 2008.

from mercola.com

[ricdaw]

After the harvest date, anyone who dies will walk the steps of light. No more incarnating here with a 3D body. Only dual wired people will be born after that date.

It does not mean that we will all die right after the harvest date.

I think history suggests that harvest is not a sudden extinction event. We've had two 3D harvests already (25k and 50k years ago). There was no Ra textual suggestion that everyone died the last two times. (And if they did, how exactly did the birth cycle start up again?) This suggests that harvest is a new and temporary post-death process: when the individual dies they to walk the "stairs of light." Which makes sense. When you arrive in the time/space areas of a planet, that mandates you will/must reincarnate there. (Remember the warning to the group that if the 5th density "friend" was successful in grabbing Carla while in trance, and putting her in a negative time/space environment, she would HAVE TO incarnate in the paired negative space/time physical environment.)

The "steps of light" intervene in the natural order of post-death processes. Instead of going directly to the Earth inner planes at death (for life-review, healing, planning the next incarnation, etc.) , the recently departed is intercepted (harvested) and either: (1) diverted to a new 3d place (not havestable), (2) diverted to a 4d world (negative harvested) or (3) allowed access back to Earth's inner planes (positive harvestable) as the "stairs of light" walk determine.

If there is any suddenness to harvest, it will occur for all the billions currently residing in the inner Earth planes. (Ra said they participate in harvest too.) The non-harvestable disincarnate must be relocated to a different world to incarnate. And since they are already "dead" there's no reason to do that part slowly.

What we may see "down here" after 2012 is a radical drop in fertility? No more 3d yellow-body births. Those rare Indigo kids will be EVERY birth.. (Will probably scare the pants off many as it will look like the children have evolved suddenly into a new species of human.) But we remaining 3d yellow bodies will live out our lives to natural 3d deaths, and be harvested in the post-death process.

For what it's worth . . . .

[CircleofOne]

The other harvests were at the end of minor cycles though, this is the end of a Great cycle, and thus a Great Harvest is in store. Ra, and I think Q'uo as well, speak about the Earth needing to recover from the intense strain that mankind has put on her. I'm speaking only from memory here, perhaps someone knows what sessions it's covered in, but the gist seemed to be that Earth will temporarily be "shut down" for 3D incarnations while she recovers with her natural processes (plate movements, new continents and oceans, etc).

I know for myself I simply want there to be a sudden shift because I'm honestly tired of living with the daily grind and general chaos of negativity, and maybe that's why others support the idea. And I'm sure that I'm not alone in noticing that more and more people are choosing their polarity and "showing their colors" with every choice. It's no longer an abstract feeling, it's visible in every day life! To me it feels like a ramping up in intensity that will reach a natural boiling point, hopefully the Harvest in 2012.

But hey, if not, does it really matter? We, the Wanderers, are still here to do our tour of duty until we get called home!

[AnthroHeart]

I've heard it said that one thing that remote viewers agree on is that none of them can see beyond 2012. It's been mentioned that time is spiraling toward singularity, and Gregg Braden tells how after 2012 time just won't make sense.

I too believe that it will be rather quick. I actually feel energies increasing each day, and I get a strong sense of time speeding up.

[CircleofOne]

I recall reading that before too, only it was in context of government time machines hitting a wall at 2012 that they were unable to move beyond.

I know what you mean about feeling the energies! I get a feeling so often, I want to compare it to Deja Vu, only it seems like a much deeper kind. I notice too that natural light is looking different. Sunsets seem to be much more grand, and they stir what I can only describe as veiled memories of sunsets on other worlds.

[AnthroHeart]

Yeah, that was project Looking Glass, from what I had learned in the Project Camelot videos.

Anyway, I used to be annoyed when the sun would shine through the window at work and be too bright that I'd close the shades. Now, I let it comfortably hit me.

Sunsets on other worlds sounds fascinating. I can just imagine what perhaps a blue or violet star sunset would look like, esp. if your visual acuity went beyond the visual spectrum. When I do my energy meditations, I sometimes visualize myself in the core of the sun, to really intensify them.

My take is, sooner or later, everyone will be forced to deal with energy blockages, as the ascension energies continue to increase. I'd rather deal with the releasing now, then closer to 2012 when it will be painfully accelerated for those who had not been releasing. I can't imagine all my emotional and physical detox symptomos happening rapidly, rather than over the last 8 months that I've been working on them.

I hadn't gotten the sense of Deja Vu really. I don't actually ever get that sensation. I typically feel physical, electrical sensations, pressure, heat, light-headedness. Though no longer the nausea that I had before.

[Tenet Nosce]

I've heard it said that one thing that remote viewers agree on is that none of them can see beyond 2012. It's been mentioned that time is spiraling toward singularity, and Gregg Braden tells how after 2012 time just won't make sense.

Yes! I recently discussed this in More Positive but Less Harvestable.

I too believe that it will be rather quick. I actually feel energies increasing each day, and I get a strong sense of time speeding up.

What say you now, nearly a year later from this original post?

[AnthroHeart]

Well, it seems like days still go by fast. I can't say that it's been a linear or an exponential speedup of time, but I just notice that days go fast. I don't seem to have as much a perception of time as before. Meaning a few hours can go by without me realizing it.

[Oceania]

project looking glass and i think the montauk project or was it the philly experiment were said to have hit a wall in 2012.

[Tenet Nosce]

Well, it seems like days still go by fast. I can't say that it's been a linear or an exponential speedup of time, but I just notice that days go fast. I don't seem to have as much a perception of time as before. Meaning a few hours can go by without me realizing it.

Yeah I know what you mean. There seems to be some kind of ebb and flow to it to me though. Things still get faster, but the pace of the acceleration appears to change. Have you noticed anything like that?