The elephant in the room.

[Unbound]

I don't see anything striving for balance. I don't see anything balancing. I don't see a "highest good" or even a seperate Creator. I see everything as the Creator. I see everything as already balanced and infinitely perfect.

So, what are you going to do with your infinite time?

[Adonai One]

Also, I will say that in no way do I enjoy the raw concept of murder and killing, it is not pleasant and, in my opinion, is not meant to be. That is the point of killing someone or something, to exert your absolute power upon its existence, to take life and death in to your hands and make you feel powerful. No matter how seemingly big or small the life is, it makes one feel powerful, and therefore safe and secure.

However, what I do understand is the thrill, the adrenaline, like a drug, and the vampiric absorption of another's life force. Truly killing a being is an act of great significance, as there is a lot of energy in a life, but to murder is to forfeit one's own life. When you kill another you kill part of yourself until all you are is the desire for death, for power.

We have to kill to survive, to eat, although that is also disputed, but murder is killing which is done for anything other than survival.

Can I ask you, Adonai One, have you ever killed anyone/anything or been to war?

No but I feel compelled to love all things, ALL things as the creator does. I believe every thought deserves love. I believe all things are life and are currently unified.

No, I have not in this life. I am getting pretty confident that I have been in war in many other lives.

[Unbound]

Also, you are using the word illusion a lot. What does that word mean to you?

[Adonai One]

I don't see anything striving for balance. I don't see anything balancing. I don't see a "highest good" or even a seperate Creator. I see everything as the Creator. I see everything as already balanced and infinitely perfect.

So, what are you going to do with your infinite time?

Create within the percieved illusions as we all do. I just choose a minimalist philosophy. It's hard to get rid of my nihilism, Eternal.

I don't like non-sense. I like truth: It's all an illusion and I love it. It's all a beautiful creation and I choose to embrace every bit of it.

---

Also, you are using the word illusion a lot. What does that word mean to you?

I associate it with "creation", a construct, a manifestation of thought.

[xise]

Adonai One, if you, hypothetically speaking, loved both:
(1) all consciousness/entities (which I agree with) as well as
(2) all actions (which I disagree with loving all actions in their entirety),

What would you do when if another self encouraged and wanted you to do the action of murder?

Would you do so? Why or why not?

[Unbound]

Doesn't the truth of infinity include non-sense? I am confused, you say you strive to love all things, but don't love non-sense? Aha

[Adonai One]

Doesn't the truth of infinity include non-sense? I am confused, you say you strive to love all things, but don't love non-sense? Aha

I love that I love that I don't love non-sense.

[xise]

Doesn't the truth of infinity include non-sense? I am confused, you say you strive to love all things, but don't love non-sense? Aha

I love that I love that I don't love non-sense.

That's still not loving non-sense itself though.

[Hototo]

I don't see anything striving for balance. I don't see anything balancing. I don't see a "highest good" or even a seperate Creator. I see everything as the Creator. I see everything as already balanced and infinitely perfect.

So, what are you going to do with your infinite time?

Right now. Play this RPG called human experience. Once its done I'll let you know what I'll do next. I have some ideas.

[Unbound]

Life is the best video game!

[Adonai One]

Adonai One, if you, hypothetically speaking, loved both:
(1) all consciousness/entities (which I agree with) as well as
(2) all actions (which I disagree with loving all actions in their entirety),

What would you do when if another self encouraged and wanted you to do the action of murder?

Would you do so? Why or why not?

I look at my life as a painting. Right now my plans for this painting do not include me murdering people.

Why don't I murder? Because I would probably not sleep at night and go insane. However, I choose to love murder because it is a creation I have made. It is a creation we have all made. Just as I love murder, I love my personal choice not to do it.

---

Doesn't the truth of infinity include non-sense? I am confused, you say you strive to love all things, but don't love non-sense? Aha

I love that I love that I don't love non-sense.

That's still not loving non-sense itself though.

There's a quantum state here. I do love non-sense because we/I have created it. However, it's not included in this life right now.

We can accept something and reject it at the same time which I believe the creator does.

---

The Creator is also The Destroyer.

The Destroyer is also The Creator.

[Unbound]

You are making amusing loopholes for yourself.

[xise]

Why don't I murder? Because I would probably not sleep at night and go insane.

Love is a vibration my friend. True understanding of love is not of the mind, it is of the heart. If you truly loved murder, you would have no problems sleeping and not going insane.

Perhaps you are exploring this topic as you are trying to decide, at the level of the mind, what the unity of love encompasses. But clearly, if you have trouble sleeping over an action, you cannot be anywhere close to loving it, because obviously your heart disagrees.

My advice if you are indeed exploring the unity of love, is move from your mind, to your heart. It speaks much more coherently on this subject than the mind ever can.

[Adonai One]

You are making amusing loopholes for yourself.

You call them loopholes. I call them the inherent paradoxes of this illusion.

[Unbound]

The Destroyer ends, that is its nature, as the Creator is eternal. The Destroyer exists as only the most fleeting of instances, while the Creation dances on.

Everything must be reconciled in to one, but each is still in its own nature.

[anagogy]

All that I argue is that if all things are in unity inherently and that even seperation itself as a concept is within this unity, the duality doesn't truly exist. I argue that duality is an illusion. The concept of distortion is just as illusive as the concept of illusion itself.

I don't see anything striving for balance. I don't see anything balancing. I don't see a "highest good" or even a seperate Creator. I see everything as the Creator. I see everything as already balanced and infinitely perfect.

My point was that there is the intellectual understanding of "illusion", and there is the visceral understanding of illusion.

Many, especially those on this forum, have that intellectual understanding, but if they had the visceral understanding, they would not even be incarnate on this density, myself included.

Everything is an illusion, sure, but I still have to deal with action and reaction (i.e. balance).

I just stubbed my toe. It hurt. Everything's perfect, sure, but I've still got to deal with this world. See my point?

[Unbound]

You are making amusing loopholes for yourself.

You call them loopholes. I call them the inherent paradoxes of this illusion.

And still the labyrinth we walk.

[Adonai One]

All that I argue is that if all things are in unity inherently and that even seperation itself as a concept is within this unity, the duality doesn't truly exist. I argue that duality is an illusion. The concept of distortion is just as illusive as the concept of illusion itself.

I don't see anything striving for balance. I don't see anything balancing. I don't see a "highest good" or even a seperate Creator. I see everything as the Creator. I see everything as already balanced and infinitely perfect.

My point was that there is the intellectual understanding of "illusion", and there is the visceral understanding of illusion.

Many, especially those on this forum, have that intellectual understanding, but if they had the visceral understanding, they would not even be incarnate on this density, myself included.

Everything is an illusion, sure, but I still have to deal with action and reaction (i.e. balance).

I just stubbed my toe. It hurt. Everything's perfect, sure, but I've still got to deal with this world. See my point?

I see your point and I agree except for your point on incarnation: Some wander. Many here have migrated from the unity of 6th density to here. Densities aren't grade levels. They are creations open for whatever use and whatever purpose.

---

Why don't I murder? Because I would probably not sleep at night and go insane.

Love is a vibration my friend. True understanding of love is not of the mind, it is of the heart. If you truly loved murder, you would have no problems sleeping and not going insane.

Perhaps you are exploring this topic as you are trying to decide, at the level of the mind, what the unity of love encompasses. But clearly, if you have trouble sleeping over an action, you cannot be anywhere close to loving it, because obviously your heart disagrees.

My advice if you are indeed exploring the unity of love, is move from your mind, to your heart. It speaks much more coherently on this subject than the mind ever can.

The heart alone acts without wisdom and it will try to love in such a discriminate direction it begins to reject a lot and even one's true intentions.

[Unbound]

Then what's all that stuff Ra says about graduation and needing to be able to hold certain degrees of light to function in each density?

[anagogy]

I see your point and I agree except for your point on incarnation: Some wander. Many here have migrated from the unity of 6th density to here. Densities aren't grade levels. They are creations open for whatever use and whatever purpose.

I never said they were grade levels. But even a wanderer takes upon themselves distortion in order to operate in this reality. A 3rd density activated wanderer is no different from a native 3rd density as far as distortion is concerned. That is, until after the agreed amount of time of "wandering", at which point, they are allowed to "remember" what they've learned or transcended.

[Adonai One]

Then what's all that stuff Ra says about graduation and needing to be able to hold certain degrees of light to function in each density?

That's just a prerequisite. It isn't the exclusive purpose. An entity can bring themselves to highest amount of light in one third-density incarnation with enough determination. How these densities are used, traveled is up to the individual entity. The levels of light are just there to signify what experiences can be experienced practically, like levels in a video game. At the end of some games, you can skip around the levels as you choose.

[Unbound]

So as long as you've done it once, you never have to again? Doesn't every part of the oversoul have to make the journey?

[Hototo]

This is a game that ends at the end of the first day when you fall asleep.

After that its all about travelling where you like.

---

So as long as you've done it once, you never have to again? Doesn't every part of the oversoul have to make the journey?

True simultaneity or some such.

[xise]

The heart alone acts without wisdom and it will try to love in such a discriminate direction it begins to reject a lot and even one's true intentions.

I disagree with you mate. I've never heard of this. I've never heard of the folly of a bright green ray without blue/indigo resulting in conditional love. I've only ever heard of the folly of the bright green without blue/indigo resulting in martyrdom.

By definition a bright green ray seems, in my experience, result in an universality of unconditional love, to the expense of the survival (red), self-acceptance/self-love (orange), power (yellow), honesty (blue), wisdom (indigo). It seems an impossibility to say a big heart, or a bright green results in conditional love. Conditional love results from an imbalance in a number of energy centers, but I believe that conditional love, necessarily entails a weak green ray.

That being said, I agree that exploring love begins with the green, and continues with blue/indigo, for it must be balanced by wisdom. But green, or the heart is the key. You can't begin to truly explore the unity of love without a strong green ray. Once you are there, it is helpful to have blue/indigo, but I don't think a lack in that area manifests as conditional love, because green itself is pure universal love.

[Adonai One]

I see your point and I agree except for your point on incarnation: Some wander. Many here have migrated from the unity of 6th density to here. Densities aren't grade levels. They are creations open for whatever use and whatever purpose.

I never said they were grade levels. But even a wanderer takes upon themselves distortion in order to operate in this reality. A 3rd density activated wanderer is no different from a native 3rd density as far as distortion is concerned. That is, until after the agreed amount of time of "wandering", at which point, they are allowed to "remember" what they've learned or transcended.

The experience isn't consistent among all wanderers. Another point I wish to make: There is no rulebook for these things. There are natural laws and limitations but there are no strict social customs except on a locale basis.

---

So as long as you've done it once, you never have to again? Doesn't every part of the oversoul have to make the journey?

I don't understand your last question. The fact is we are the Creator, we don't have to do anything that we don't want to.

---

The heart alone acts without wisdom and it will try to love in such a discriminate direction it begins to reject a lot and even one's true intentions.

I've only ever heard of the folly of the bright green without blue/indigo resulting in martyrdom.

Exactly and even martyrdom isn't an act of true universal love.

[xise]

Exactly and even martyrdom isn't an act of true universal love.

I disagree.

Obviously, it depends on the example of martrydom. But let's take Jesus - his was an act of universal love, it just lacks wisdom for there are other paths that could also express universal love while maintaining the life of the martyr. I don't think his martyrdom stemmed from a weak red or orange or yellow in his case, I think it's from a lack of blue/indigo, which was also implied from Ra.

[Hototo]

The true problem with this universe is that you are already free to do anything since it is infinite.

Infinite being said, let me crunch up some numbers for you.

93 billion light-years side to side

14 billion years old.

Low estimate is around 500 billion galaxies.

Lets say 100 billion stars per galaxy.

Lets say that each star system has say, only 100 sentient individuated experiential nexi within it.

100.000.000.000 x 500.000.000.000 x 100

We get to around 5,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 individuated souls that we can calculate that must exist.

It might take you a while to go and say Hi to all of those. That might be a good goal, introduce yourself to "the neighborhood"

[Adonai One]

Exactly and even martyrdom isn't an act of true universal love.

I disagree.

Obviously, it depends on the example of martrydom. But let's take Jesus - his was an act of universal love, it just lacks wisdom for there are other paths that could also increase universal love while maintaining the life of the martyr. I don't think his martyrdom stemmed from a weak red or orange or yellow in his case, I think it's from a lack of blue/indigo, which was also implied from Ra.

It seems we are arguing semantics. I agree with what you are saying here except the blue isn't just honesty nor is Indigo wisdom but that's not another discussion.

The real question is can an entity discover the love that exists in all things without wisdom?

---

I apologize for any disrespect. Thank you all for discussing this with me.

[xise]

The real question is can an entity discover the love that exists in all things without wisdom?

Probably not. Intellectually, I might be able to acknowledge that a ruthless child rapist is an entity capable of love, but my heart doesn't yet beat for them I think. I probably need a brighter green, as well as a brighter blue/indigo and be more balanced overall.

However, getting back to the original discussion of whether loving the unity involves loving all the actions of co-Creators:

I agree that love exists in all things, even if actions are things. There is some part of every action that contains love.

I do not think that all things, if we say actions are things, are in their entirety, comprised of love.

10.14 Questioner: For general development [of the] reader of this book, could you state some of the practices or exercises to perform to produce an acceleration toward the Law of One?
Ra: I am Ra.

Exercise One. This is the most nearly centered and usable within your illusion complex. The moment contains love. That is the lesson/goal of this illusion or density. The exercise is to consciously seek that love in awareness and understanding distortions. The first attempt is the cornerstone. Upon this choosing rests the remainder of the life-experience of an entity. The second seeking of love within the moment begins the addition. The third seeking powers the second, the fourth powering or doubling the third. As with the previous type of empowerment, there will be some loss of power due to flaws within the seeking in the distortion of insincerity. However, the conscious statement of self to self of the desire to seek love is so central an act of will that, as before, the loss of power due to this friction is inconsequential.

Exercise Two. The universe is one being. When a mind/body/spirit complex views another mind/body/spirit complex, see the Creator. This is an helpful exercise.

Exercise Three. Gaze within a mirror. See the Creator.

Exercise Four. Gaze at the creation which lies about the mind/body/spirit complex of each entity. See the Creator.

The foundation or prerequisite of these exercises is a predilection towards what may be called meditation, contemplation, or prayer. With this attitude, these exercises can be processed. Without it, the data will not sink down into the roots of the tree of mind, thus enabling and ennobling the body and touching the spirit.

My understanding of this quotation my not be complete, but the way I see, is that the moment contains love, not that the moment is entirely comprised of love.

Every action contains love. But every action is not comprised of 100% of love. It is possible Ra did not mean that to make that distinction. But between this quotation, and the other quotation earlier about rejecting (rejecting - the opposite of love) actions of offering one's life to an sts entity, I think it's the distinction is an important one. Also note how much emphasis is placed on see co-Creators as self - the emphasis is on the conciousnesses, not on the illusory actions.

Now, I'm not going to say that I know the idea that loving the unity of Creation involves loving all the actions of the Co-Creators is wrong. But based on my personal spiritual journey, as well as these Ra quotations, I think you can be a perfectly realized, energetically balanced, evolved consciousness, once you learn to find love in the moment, and once you learn to love all selves. You don't have to love each and every action of every co-Creator in their entirety.

If that is your path, there is nothing wrong with it! There's space for an infinite amount of paths. Who knows, perhaps if you manage to love very single action in their entirety you could be finding a way to increase the infinite capacity of love. But it does seem beyond the scope of even the Ra material (which of course is limited). In my opinion, of course!

EDIT: See one of my posts on page 4. I now believe this position is wrong! "You are every thing, every being, every emotion, every event, every situation."

[Adonai One]

If the Creator is love and everything is made of the Creator, are not all things love?

---

Again, I want to express how grateful I am for this humbling experience. Thank you all for making me think and question myself.