Deleted

[Adonai One]

Deleted

[Karl]

The negative time/space concept confuses me to no end.

[Ashim]

Hate and love both create gravity.
Understand what gravity really is and more to the point, why you are still here reincarnating on this planet.

[Bring4th_Austin]

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?s=68#6

Carla apparently almost got sucked into negative time/space by an Orion entity when she tried to contact Ra outside the circle. Why is this possible? What is negative time/space exactly besides "darkness" and death? Why is it possible for entities to kill us in this way?

Equating death with negative time/space wouldn't be very accurate, death (as I understand it) would be a transition from space/time to time/space, and there's plenty of that going on in both positive and negative space/time.

You might find more answers to the questions you're asking in the next session. Ra describes that this sort of trick would only happen in unique trance situations such as how Carla channeled Ra, and that it is a function of free will of both the Orion entity and the displaced entity (the Orion "tricks" the entity into negative time/space).

As for what is negative time/space, I can give my own simple and fallible understanding. Every space/time environment has a time/space environment, with a particular "vibration" or "attraction." If you were to peak into time/space from your current environment in space/time, it would probably be full of guides, entities, artifacts, and thoughtforms attracted to you (to each other) by similar "vibration," as well as the vibration from your current life circumstances. These would, in some sense, be an equivalent to what you currently experience in space/time. As far as I understand, your time/space environment is sort of a natural thing, simply where you end up in the midst of your biases, balances, and progression through the universe. Were you somehow taken out of this place you ended up naturally, surrounded by things you have attracted, and placed in an environment where there is literally nothing "like" to attract, there would be darkness. From what I understand, this time/space environment would have an equivalent space/time environment, what we would see as a negatively polarized planet or social memory complex.

What I think goes unanswered in the material, though I think Don was trying to ask but couldn't quite frame the question right, is if this wise negative entity could pluck someone from their current time/space and put them in a negative time/space, why couldn't a wise positive entity pluck someone from negative time/space and put them in positive time/space?

[Spaced]

So are there two time/spaces, one positive one negative? Or is 'positive' movement in one direction through time/space while 'negative' is movement in the opposite direction? Are they different halves of the same continuum?

[zenmaster]

So are there two time/spaces, one positive one negative? Or is 'positive' movement in one direction through time/space while 'negative' is movement in the opposite direction? Are they different halves of the same continuum?

Ultimately, there's one time/space. Until one is sufficiently balanced, there are two possible seeking orientations which define the patterns of mind available in time/space. Apparently, it is possible to assign a compatible experiential nexus to another entity (i.e. a logos), at some level, which is of the opposite polarity to the one intended.

[anagogy]

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?s=68#6

Carla apparently almost got sucked into negative time/space by an Orion entity when she tried to contact Ra outside the circle. Why is this possible? What is negative time/space exactly besides "darkness" and death? Why is it possible for entities to kill us in this way?

Negative time/space is simply a realm of non-physical consciousness that is of a certain vibrational quality. That vibrational quality is negatively polarized. An analogous example would be like a prison in our physical world. So you can think of "negative time/space" as a "prison-esque" astral environment inhabited by entities and thoughtforms of similar vibrational quality. That is to say, inhabited by beings who serve self at the expense of others. That is its "vibrational signature" just as helping others is the vibrational signature or resonance to positive time/space.

And you cannot be forcibly abducted and thrown into negative time/space. You have to choose it. The force of free will is paramount here. The circumstance where this occurs is when you are convinced by some smooth talking astral being into taking a walk down the darker side of "astral-who-ville" so to speak. And some curious entities decide they like what they see and abandon positive polarization altogether.

However, this sort of circumstance is extremely rare. In fact, it is so rare that when asked Ra said that in the last 75,000 years of this master cycle, only one wanderer has been successfully infringed upon in this fashion.

69.12 Questioner: Is it possible to tell me roughly how many Wanderers who have come to this planet during this master cycle have experienced this displacement into a negative time/space?

Ra: I am Ra. We can note the number of such occurrences. There has been only one. We cannot, due to the Law of Confusion, discuss the entity.

69.17 Questioner: This is a point that I find quite confusing to me.

It is the function of the free will of the positively oriented entity to move into the negatively polarized time/space. However, it is also a function of his lack of understanding of what he is doing. I am sure that if the entity had full understanding of what he was doing he would not do it. It is a function of his negatively polarized other-self creating a situation where he is lured to that configuration. What is the principle with respect to the first distortion that allows this to occur since we have two portions of the Creator, each of equal value or of equal potential, but oppositely polarized and we have this situation resulting. Could you tell me the philosophical principle behind this particular act?

Ra: I am Ra. There are two important points in this regard. Firstly, we may note the situation wherein an entity gets a road-map which is poorly marked and in fact is quite incorrect. The entity sets out to its destination. It wishes only to reach the point of destination but, becoming confused by the faulty authority and not knowing the territory through which it drives, it becomes hopelessly lost.

Free will does not mean that there will be no circumstances when calculations will be awry. This is so in all aspects of the life experience. Although there are no mistakes, there are surprises.

Secondly, that which we and you do in workings such as this carries a magical charge, if you would use this much misunderstood term, perhaps we may say a metaphysical power. Those who do work of power are available for communication to and from entities of roughly similar power. It is fortunate that the Orion entity does not have the native power of this group. However, it is quite disciplined whereas this group lacks the finesse equivalent to its power. Each is working in consciousness but the group has not begun a work as a group. The individual work is helpful for the group is mutually an aid, one to another.

So are there two time/spaces, one positive one negative? Or is 'positive' movement in one direction through time/space while 'negative' is movement in the opposite direction? Are they different halves of the same continuum?

Time/space is basically just the inverse of space/time. space/time is a reflection of time/space if you will, in opposites. Every time/space is an analog of a particular sort of space/time and vice versa. One is physical, one is metaphysical. One is tangible, the other is intangible. One is finite, the other is infinite. Time/space doesn't possess the properties of dynamic motion.

You could think of them as movement in different directions of time/space. However, don't confuse these spatial directions with physical spatial directions that are extended. These are inner dimensions. The directions of spatial movement are intangible and vibrational. So moving from negative to positive time/space is not up or down or left or right or anything like that. It's its own unique direction in consciousness -- its own kind of "space". I would agree that they are different halves of the same continuum.

Time/space is like "mental space" and space/time is physical space. You could also think of "space/time" as a frozen or crystallized cross-section of "time/space". Time/space is like fluid water, and space/time is like frozen water with ice crystals and what not.

[spero]

70.17....
time/space is no more homogenous than space/time. It is as complex and complete a system of illusions, dances, and pattern as is space/time and has as structured a system of what you may call natural laws.

I'm gonna guess its just one of the natural laws (analogous to gravity) of that particular time/space that negative entities use to their advantage.

And you cannot be forcibly abducted and thrown into negative time/space. You have to choose it. The force of free will is paramount here. The circumstance where this occurs is when you are convinced by some smooth talking astral being into taking a walk down the darker side of "astral-who-ville" so to speak. And some curious entities decide they like what they see and abandon positive polarization altogether.

Anagogy i agree you have to choose to follow the negative entity, but it doesn't mean you choose to become STS because you like what you see. That decision is forced on you by the STS entity putting you in negative time/space.

70.14 ...
Each time/space is an analog of a particular sort or vibration of space/time. When a negative time/space is entered by an entity the next experience will be that of the appropriate space/time....

70.23 ....
The entity which incarnates into negative space/time will not find it possible to maintain any significant positive polarity as negativity, when pure, is a type of gravity well, shall we say, pulling all into it. Thus the entity, while remembering its learned and preferred polarity, must needs make use of the catalyst given and recapitulate the lessons of service to self in order to build up enough polarity in order to cause the potential to occur for reversal.....

It a dirty trick, not a seduction to the dark side.

[zenmaster]

It a dirty trick, not a seduction to the dark side.

Maybe a dirty trick, but they are still able to balance their imbalances and learn what they've so far ignored.

[anagogy]

Anagogy i agree you have to choose to follow the negative entity, but it doesn't mean you choose to become STS because you like what you see. That decision is forced on you by the STS entity putting you in negative time/space.

You can't simultaneously choose to follow a negative entity into time/space and be "placed" there. It is either chosen, or it is not. I don't believe you can be placed there, against your will. Thus, it is choice. Certainly, there are many reasons for that choice, but it is choice nonetheless.

No one forces a soul to stay in negative time/space. They willfully do so, for a multitude of different reasons. Possibly shame, possibly hate, possibly greed. But always, it is a choice. They could, at any time, move to a different portion of time/space. Movement on the astral planes is accomplished by thought, it only takes a moment.

And lets also keep in mind this has only worked on one wanderer in the last 75,000 years according to Ra. It is a very rare occurrence, relatively speaking.

70.17 Questioner: Now here is the point of my confusion. If, after physical death, a Wanderer would return to his home planet why cannot the same entity be extracted from negative time/space to the home planet rather than incarnating in negative space/time?

Ra: I am Ra. As we stated, the position in negative time/space, of which we previously were speaking, is that position which is pre-incarnative. After the death of the physical complex in yellow-ray activation the mind/body/spirit complex moves to a far different portion of time/space in which the indigo body will allow much healing and review to take place before any movement is made towards another incarnative experience.

I perceive a basic miscalculation upon your part in that time/space is no more homogenous than space/time. It is as complex and complete a system of illusions, dances, and pattern as is space/time and has as structured a system of what you may call natural laws.

That pre-incarnative position is a willfully chosen platform for entrance into space/time incarnation.

The dirty trick does not take away free will, it just convinces you to choose negatively. Much like the salesman who convinces you of a need you didn't know you had (and probably didn't have).

[spero]

You can't simultaneously choose to follow a negative entity into time/space and be "placed" there. It is either chosen, or it is not. I don't believe you can be placed there, against your will. Thus, it is choice. Certainly, there are many reasons for that choice, but it is choice nonetheless.

No one forces a soul to stay in negative time/space. They willfully do so, for a multitude of different reasons. Possibly shame, possibly hate, possibly greed. But always, it is a choice. They could, at any time, move to a different portion of time/space. Movement on the astral planes is accomplished by thought, it only takes a moment.

Anagogy, it's my understanding the STS entity uses deception ( e.g. impersonating Ra) to convince the entity to follow them and then places their m/b/s complex in negative time/space at a pre-incarnative position. Regardless of the desire of the entity so deceived or even its higher self, the next incarnation in space/time must be in a negative space/time environment. This isn't something they can alter. They can delay the choice to incarnate for a while and the higher self is often reluctant to let it happen but it's not something that can be altered. It was the entities free will and choice to naively trust and follow the STS entity but once placed in that time/space environment there is no choice but incarnation in the corresponding space/time. This is why I refer to it as a dirty trick, not a choice made in free and full awareness of the consequences.

Its not as straightforward as simply moving back to positive time/space

68.6 Questioner: Could you tell me what the plan of the fifth-density negatively oriented entity was and how it would have accomplished it and what the results would have been if it had worked?

Ra: I am Ra. The plan, which is on-going, was to take the mind/body/spirit complex while it was separated from its yellow body physical complex shell, to then place this mind/body/spirit complex within the negative portions of your time/space. The shell would then become that of the unknowing, unconscious entity and could be, shall we say, worked upon to cause malfunction which would end in coma and then in what you call the death of the body. At this point the higher self of the instrument would have the choice of leaving the mind/body/spirit complex in negative sp— we correct— time/space or of allowing incarnation in space/time of equivalent vibration and polarity distortions. Thus this entity would become a negatively polarized entity without the advantage of native negative polarization. It would find a long path to the Creator under these circumstances although the path would inevitably end well.

69.11 Questioner: Can you tell me the situation that the Wanderer finds himself in and the path back, why that path could not be the simple moving back into positive time/space?

Ra: I am Ra. The path back revolves, firstly, about the higher self’s reluctance to enter negative space/time. This may be a significant part of the length of that path. Secondly, when a positively oriented entity incarnates in a thoroughly negative environment it must needs learn/teach the lessons of the love of self thus becoming one with its other-selves.

When this has been accomplished the entity may then choose to release the potential difference and change polarities.

However, the process of learning the accumulated lessons of love of self may be quite lengthy. Also the entity, in learning these lessons, may lose much positive orientation during the process and the choice of reversing polarities may be delayed until the mid-sixth density. All of this is, in your way of measurement, time-consuming although the end result is well.

[Ankh]

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?s=68#6

Carla apparently almost got sucked into negative time/space by an Orion entity when she tried to contact Ra outside the circle. Why is this possible?

My understanding is that it was possible because Carla, unconsciously, was preparing to leave her body when channeling Q'uo instead of Ra (which as the working was protected).

What is negative time/space exactly besides "darkness" and death? Why is it possible for entities to kill us in this way?

Guys in this thread are now discussing what the negative time/space is, but in regards to your questions about the death; in my understanding, death occurs only to the physical, yellow ray body complex, because of the displacement of the mind/body/spirit complex into the negative time/space:

The plan, which is on-going, was to take the mind/body/spirit complex while it was separated from its yellow body physical complex shell, to then place this mind/body/spirit complex within the negative portions of your time/space. The shell would then become that of the unknowing, unconscious entity and could be, shall we say, worked upon to cause malfunction which would end in coma and then in what you call the death of the body.

Then you asked Carla some questions, which might be the heart of your concern? I found these questions interesting, and if you don't mind, I would like to mention them here?

If this question could be transferred to Carla, I would be very grateful:

After reading through the Ra material, I found myself frightened by the passages describing an Orion entity attempting to put part of Carla's energy into "negative time/space" after attempting to contact Ra in trance without being in the group setting.

What is "negative time/space" and what would the effects be of being put into it? How does one protect themselves from such a threat? Why does this threat exist? Are all channelers in danger of this?

Ra recomended to hold Carla's hand during conscious channelings or similar workings (when not working with Ra), so that she would not leave her physical body, which Jim has been faithfully doing ever since, until this day.

I don't think that all channelers are in danger of this, but only those working by consciously willing out of their body:

Given that the entity is not attempting to be of service in this particular way which is proceeding now, the entities of negative orientation would not find it possible to remove the mind/body/spirit. The unique characteristic, as we have said, which is, shall we say, dangerous is the willing of the mind/body/spirit complex outward from the physical complex of third density for the purpose of service to others. In any other situation this circumstance would not be in effect.

Consider also these quotes:

The uniqueness of this situation is not the lack of friends, for this, as all entities, has its guides or angelic presences and, due to polarization, teachers and friends also. The unique characteristic of the workings which the social memory complex Ra and your group have begun is the intent to serve others with the highest attempt at near purity which we as comrades may achieve.

This has alerted a much more determined friend of negative polarity which is interested in removing this particular opportunity.

...that which we and you do in workings such as this carries a magical charge...

My understanding of the above is that workings with Ra carried a magical charge. The dedication of the group and those of Ra towards service to others was approaching purity. This attracted a very determined fifth density entity, after the attempts of fourth density were failed. The fifth density entity's desire was to remove this opportunity by whatever means possible.

[ChenHsi]

Hello.

This might detract from the original topic but...so the net gain from this opportunity, and all the various other attacks/greetings offered by this negative fifth-density brother and the initial temptations of his lesser brothers, is that the heart of Carla and the group becomes more and more dedicated towards the service-to-others polarity?

Even if within illusions on the physical plane, this benefit does plays out as hardships, sufferings and apparent "lose of spirituality" at times?

After reading the Law of One, the impression I have is that even though the 4th-density goodies and baddies are against each other with their intergalactic wars and stuff(Star Wars heh heh..), they are actually helping each other out, and serving the same purpose of the Creator regardless of whether or not they have the wisdom to realize this? And that their ignorance of having to battle is what makes them more useful in the 4th density than those of 5th density and higher? I mean, the very existence of the higher self within each and everyone of them, regardless of the service to self or others polarity...is already an indication of their eventual reconciliation at the 6th density of Unity? Or rather, when you take away the illusionary time concept, they are already reconciled and One, and that all is well, with this Unity expressed as an apparent duality within time/space and space/time?

Hell, I am also right now getting the feeling that the entire 1st density to the 7th density, is nothing but an immensely small step within an infinity that has no end to its bliss?!?

Geez the Creator is forcing me to praise him again...haha.

[βαθμιαίος]

Anagogy, it's my understanding the STS entity uses deception ( e.g. impersonating Ra) to convince the entity to follow them and then places their m/b/s complex in negative time/space at a pre-incarnative position. Regardless of the desire of the entity so deceived or even its higher self, the next incarnation in space/time must be in a negative space/time environment. This isn't something they can alter. They can delay the choice to incarnate for a while and the higher self is often reluctant to let it happen but it's not something that can be altered. It was the entities free will and choice to naively trust and follow the STS entity but once placed in that time/space environment there is no choice but incarnation in the corresponding space/time. This is why I refer to it as a dirty trick, not a choice made in free and full awareness of the consequences.

Its not as straightforward as simply moving back to positive time/space

This is my understanding, too. I suppose they can delay the choice to incarnate forever (until the creation re-coalesces, I guess), but Ra says the higher self is unlikely to do that "due to its distortion towards the belief that the function of the mind/body/spirit complex is to experience and learn from other-selves thus experiencing the Creator."

[anagogy]

Anagogy, it's my understanding the STS entity uses deception ( e.g. impersonating Ra) to convince the entity to follow them and then places their m/b/s complex in negative time/space at a pre-incarnative position. Regardless of the desire of the entity so deceived or even its higher self, the next incarnation in space/time must be in a negative space/time environment. This isn't something they can alter. They can delay the choice to incarnate for a while and the higher self is often reluctant to let it happen but it's not something that can be altered. It was the entities free will and choice to naively trust and follow the STS entity but once placed in that time/space environment there is no choice but incarnation in the corresponding space/time. This is why I refer to it as a dirty trick, not a choice made in free and full awareness of the consequences.

Its not as straightforward as simply moving back to positive time/space

I suppose it is just at odds with my personal understanding of the astral planes.

From my perspective, and understanding of the incarnation process, it just doesn't work that way, so I interpret these Ra quotes in a wholly different light, but I respect your opinion and difference in interpretation nonetheless.

From my point of view, the reason it is not as straightforward as moving into positive time/space is simply because "time/space" is a mental space, and the being that has moved into negative time/space has already begun switching polarities. You could even think of it as a form of "brain-washing" so to speak. They are thinking differently now, and their next choice of incarnation is from that, now, newly negatively polarized standpoint or platform. Then, once incarnate in space/time the gravity well affect of being surrounded by other negative beings naturally begins polarizing that being even more negatively.

This is why they find a long path back to the creator. They engage in a spiral of choice which results in the complete switch over of polarity.

I still stand by my position that they could literally switch over at any time were the requisite effort exercised. They simply do not want to anymore, at that point in the game. That reluctance to switch over is the newly acquired momentum of thought they developed which is negatively polarized, and which keeps them in negative time/space. It's just a vibration of thought/consciousness, and since thought creates reality, their next incarnate experience will naturally be a manifestation of that framework of thought. Vibrationally, it would be a negative space/time environment which reflects as closely as possible, the vibrations of the time/space analog environment which they are resonating with.

The whole reason the Higher Self is "reluctant" to enter negative time/space is because it simply will never join in negative thought, which is what negative time/space is. It doesn't abandon us, rather, it would be more accurate to say it is we who abandon it, in that circumstance.

Ra: I am Ra. We remind you that the negative path is one of separation. What is the first separation: the self from the self. [...]

The higher self has to "allow" incarnation into negative space/time because it is the free will choice of that soul now.

70.7 Questioner: Why is the Higher Self reluctant to enter negative time/space?

Ra: I am Ra. The Higher Self is reluctant to allow its mind/body/spirit complex to enter negative time/space for the same basic reason an entity of your societal complex would be reluctant to enter a prison.

That sort of negative environment changes those who, through choice of negative thought, reside there. And that is what keeps them there.

I'm not claiming there is no trickery. Clearly if they had a broader view of what they were doing they would not follow negative entities into negative time/space, but it is the trickery of the mind, rather than a soul being forcibly thrown into an environment not of its choosing. The whole negative service to self path is about harnessing the wills of others to do their bidding. This is just another example of that.

[Spaced]

Apparently, it is possible to assign a compatible experiential nexus to another entity (i.e. a logos), at some level, which is of the opposite polarity to the one intended.

Would this be similar to a geomagnetic pole reversal in a way?

[Siren]

What is negative time/space exactly besides "darkness" and death?

First of all, let us dis-associate death with negative time/space. Death = birth and birth = death. These two concepts are reciprocal to each other just as space/time is analog to time/space. LIFE is all there is, whether one is born/incarnated in space/time or dead/discarnate in time/space. All there is LIFE. Being "dead" is as much being alive (if not more) as being born/incarnated.

Negative time/space, much like negative space/time, may be seen by those of a service-to-others positive orientation as a self-imposed darkness. To the negative self-serving entity this environment is home.

Why is it possible for entities to kill us in this way?

For the very same reason that if I offered you a poisoned apple and you ate it, you'd probably die. I am not killing you any more than you are allowing yourself to be killed. Did I trick you? Maybe so. Will you blame me? Maybe so. But are you not responsible for your own choices? There may be a lesson to be learned here, O student! =O

I am very much restating what Anagogy said here. To the best of my knowledge (which is not infallible) and using the example of the one known as Carla—being a positively-oriented entity—, if one was "lured" into a time/space environment of sufficient negative intensity, this would cause a "vibratory mismatch," so to speak, between the entity's physical space/time and the negative time/space it has just entered; which would in turn necessitate, by simple law of resonance, the "readjustment" of the mind/body/spirit complex into a more appropriate space/time locus (in this case, negative space/time). This is the reason why the space/time physical vehicle would need to die, in order to for the entity to be born in a more appropriate negative space/time environment.

Simply put: a positively-polarized entity cannot dwell within negative time/space while remaining in a positive space/time (same applies inversely for negatively-polarized entities). If the "vibratory mismatch" between space/time and time/space is drastically dissimilar, then the entity's current space/time may need be "readjusted" by the process of death/rebirth to conform to its new time/space configurations. We should note, however, that this is extremely rare.

---

In essence, the space/time experiential nexus is always determined by time/space. You dwell primarily in time/space. Space/time is simply the cause of the effect that is time/space, if you will use this analogy. This is also why "magical work" has its operations in time/space. If you want to affect space/time reality, all you need do is reconfigure time/space alignments and space/time replicates.

[Vasistha]

Why is it possible for entities to kill us in this way?

Because positive polarized entity are usually naive and gullible, whereas negative polarized entity are very clever.

What is negative time/space exactly besides "darkness" and death?

(About time/space) These entities are divided in what you may call an artificial dream within a dream into various levels."

Time/space being shaped by your personal thoughts or by collective thoughts, it is exactly anything that you could imagine to be.

There is no such things as death.

Why then be concerned with the grass that blooms, withers and dies in its season only to grow once again due to the infinite love and light of the One Creator? This is the message we bring. Each entity is only superficially that which blooms and dies. In the deeper sense there is no end to beingness.

It is to be kept in the forefront of the faculties of intelligence that there is one creation in which there is no loss.

[blargg]

Because positive polarized entity are usually naive and gullible, whereas negative polarized entity are very clever.

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ra_mat...arot09.gif

Seems like Service to Others aren't afraid to march right into any experience that comes their way, even if it means getting a bit filthy. STS use their fear of such speed bumps in their growth to observe and learn from the STO. They enjoy keeping themselves as pristine, or separated, as possible and the local big guy allows and facilitates this.

[zenmaster]

Apparently, it is possible to assign a compatible experiential nexus to another entity (i.e. a logos), at some level, which is of the opposite polarity to the one intended.

Would this be similar to a geomagnetic pole reversal in a way?

I imagine it to be like snapping to another origin or base of experience. So maybe like a "magnetic pole reversal" of the spirit complex.