(12-20-2020, 03:29 AM)Louisabell Wrote:(12-20-2020, 12:20 AM)jafar Wrote: [quote='Sacred Fool' pid='286103' dateline='1608312653']
What is actually won by the winners? What are we fighting for, exactly? Please remind me.
The 'winning' (thus it's opposite implication 'losing') is an STS thought framework.
Winning = gaining superiority, gaining dominance over the losers, enslaving the losers.
Quote:Below is one view of this. If you make it to the end of the excerpt, you'll see that the path forward for some is the way of the heart. Why would that be, I wonder?
Thank you for pointing the citation from Hatton, it correlate well and very similar with the Zen story..
Let me repeat the zen story:
Quote:There's a Zen story about a warlord who attack and raid a village, once he and his band arrived at the village he found that the village is already empty, all the populace has run away for safety. He and his band can then easily loot anything that they wishes from the village.
Until one of his man report back about a presence of a monk within the temple, who did not run away and sit still in meditation posture.
Enraged, the warlord come to the temple and approached the monk, draw his sword pointing it at the monk's head and said:
Warlord: You stupid monk! Why you don't run away like everybody else, don't you know who I am??? I can easily split you in half!
Monk: And don't you know who I am?? I can easily split MYSELF in half.
The probable result are the following:
1. The monk decided to fight the warlord, the monk won the battle gaining dominance over the warlord.
The monk has polarized himself one notch closer to STS path, the warlord failed to polarize further on STS path as he failed to gain dominance.
If the monk continue this pattern, continue seeking and fighting another warlords, he will be on his 'highway to STS' and potentially polarizing much further than the warlord himself on STS path, becoming more war mongering than the warlord, although he dressed like a monk.
2. The monk decided to fight the warlord, the warlord won the battle gaining dominance over the monk. (the 'loser' scenario)
The warlord has polarized further on STS path, the monk has polarized himself one notch closer to STS path. If the monk did not accept the 'losing' event and vow for revenge, the monk will grow further in his bitterness and anger, the monk will polarize further and further to STS.
3. The monk decided to fight the warlord, but the battle ends in a draw, none of them could dominate over the other.
The warlord fail to polarize further on STS path, the monk has polarized himself one notch closer to STS path and failed to polarize further on STO path.
4. The monk decided to let the warlord split him in half without resistance and the warlord split him in half. (the 'loser' scenario)
The warlord has polarized further on STS path, the monk has polarized himself further on STO path.
So both are polarizing further on their respective path.
5. The monk decided to let the warlord split him in half without resistance, but the warlord amazed by the courage of the monk, as 'splitting myself in half' is something that the warlord is not able to do, he then decided to learn more on how the monk is able to do that.
The warlord has starting to polarize himself towards STO path.
Quote:Interesting. I interpreted that Zen story to be one centered on unity consciousness. i.e. the warlord splitting the monk in half IS the monk splitting himself in half, because we are all One. All actions are performed by and on the One. The monk (assuming he has unity consciousness) can see and understand how no external action on him is performed by anyone other than himSelf. So, for the warlord, it kind of takes away the satisfaction of there being a "battle" of "adversaries" in the first place. There is no separateness, there are no enemies, there is no ego to war against, just movements of different arms from the same One Infinite Creator. The warlord then is faced with whether he wishes to perform such violence on one of his own limbs... bah! realisation ... very zen
Exactly...
But the 'illusion of separation' hindrance the 'other self' for such realization.
The monk realize that even when the warlord strike him, both of his 'self' are polarizing towards the same destination. Just through different path...
Quote:Quite relevant to the thread topic. How can there be winners, when there are no separate players? And what about the game ... which (or whose) game are you trying to play?
There is no winner when there is no loser.
Winning or losing is merely an illusion, if we took the 'zoomed out' perspective.
It's similar to playing video games in a living room, whomever win or lose inside the game doesn't really matter.
All of you is having fun playing video games in a living room.
Some player might become too 'attached' or 'immersed' to the game and cannot accept 'losing', we call this 'gamer rage'.
Some can, and he / she is laughing even when he / she is losing inside the game.
As for 'what game', then it left entirely to you, every individualization or identification of the self will have each their own unique and distinct experience.
And after some time one might get tired, wary and bored with the game, and decided not to play any more or play a totally new different game.