Harvest: Do The Math

[unity100]

So do you think that we, now, don't have free will? It seems clear to me that we do, but it sounds like you think we don't.

i think free will is extremely reduced in this experiential nexus. to escape living in such a veil amplifying environment, one could escape to uninhabited or scarcely inhabited locations in the past and survive without being molded into a form by the society. it was possible to have social interaction while in that kind of situation too.

yet now even if it seems possible, it is much more difficult. in addition, the current established mechanics of the society, maybe intentionally, are increasingly trying to force people to oblige and comply by the society. you can see this in extreme form in the war corporations wage on self-sufficient, organic farming. no more hippie communes, if they succeed.

on the other hand, such a situation is even questionable - the aim of 3d is to interact socially - this is the purpose of 3d. in an environment in which you are obliged to withdraw from society to have free will, it means the basic premise of 3d is lost. so, your only choice becomes to engage in society by accepting its negative and veil-reinforcing state and therefore fulfill social interaction purpose of 3d, or withdraw from society, retain free will, but let go of a great deal of social interaction.

in a way, this is not so surprising since Ra says that negative environments do not allow free will. our society is currently negatively structured.

42.2 Questioner: I will attempt to make an analogy. If an animal, shall I say, a bull, in a pen attacks you because you have wandered into his pen, you get out of his way rapidly but you do not blame him. You do not have much of an emotional response other than the response that he might damage you. However, if you encounter another self in his territory and he attacks you, your response may be more of an emotional nature creating physical bodily responses. Am I correct in assuming that when your response to the animal and to the other-self is that of seeing both as Creator and loving both and understanding their action in attacking you is the action of their free will then you have balanced yourself correctly in this area? Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is basically correct. However, the balanced entity will see in the seeming attack of an other-self the causes of this action which are, in most cases, of a more complex nature than the cause of the attack of the second-density bull as was your example. Thus this balanced entity would be open to many more opportunities for service to a third-density other-self.

As stated, the balanced entity would not react in any way except to protect the free will of the other first, and their own body complex second. Let's say there is no escape, and the only options are to harm the other entity or to let it harm you (completely possible situation). Why is a choice like this necessary? The preferred choice, allowing the other-self to do as it pleases, would end in the cessation of incarnation. Can we really call it freewill when the preferred choice kills us? In my opinion, if we experienced true freewill, death would not be the only option for an entity wishing to preserve the freewill of an other-self.

enter balance ...

you, as an entity, are just an entity like the others. and therefore, as an entity, you are entitled to the same rights as others. therefore, if taken as an entity, the act of the other entity prevents your free will.

therefore, in this situation, the act of the other entity becomes infringing in the sense of balance. its freedom, cannot extend to preventing freedom of others. its freedom needs to stop there.

mystery in this equation is TIME. If all is one time - then, is not the start and the end of the experiment, and all in between, known already! Is complete ignorance and full knowledge the same?

time is not a mystery in this equation.

because all of what you speak of, ie the start and end of the experiment, and all in between, all being known already, complete ignorance and full knowledge, exist right before point infinity. these will not be valid for us, until infinity, tho we will probably approximate these in increasing speed.

.............................

the main problem on this planet, is the logos's choice of implementing weaker bodies for 3d entities to herd them towards positive polarity. even, if logos did not intend it to be for positive polarity, but instead be for pushing them towards any polarity, it is still the main problem :

survival problems are problems of early 2d existence. a breed that is afflicted with survival problems, will naturally be having problems in orange ray, and will keep exhibiting patterns of orange ray. in simple spiritual terms in grand sense, the energy gets clogged in early orange due to survival problems, and cant easily get up.

it is a foregone conclusion to say that, since the entities, or society are not able to get the upflowing energy up to higher energy centers, they also wont be in a position to make choice. for, in order to manifest in higher chajkras, you need a stable balance that allows you to get to, and go above that chakra. when your energies are clogged in early-mid orange, you cant do that.

in short, for whatever reason the logos implemented this weaker body - heavier veil system, it hampered the harvest of entities on this planet.

[βαθμιαίος]

so, your only choice becomes to engage in society by accepting its negative and veil-reinforcing state and therefore fulfill social interaction purpose of 3d, or withdraw from society, retain free will, but let go of a great deal of social interaction.

I don't think that's the only choice. Lots of people, including, I'd guess, most of us here on this forum, bumble through our lives as best we can, attempting to use the catalyst we're offered in order to choose love, light, unity, and monkey.

Edit: add monkey

[3DMonkey]

So your the one that chose unity!!

Hehehe. I couldn't resist. (delete if you must)

(my second choice was "Isnt anybody going to choose monkey? " )

[βαθμιαίος]

Fixed it.

[zenmaster]

(my second choice was "Isnt anybody going to choose monkey? " )

I see this as a rare opportunity to show my angry-monkey emoticon:

>8(|)

[Raman]

(my second choice was "Isnt anybody going to choose monkey? " )

I see this as a rare opportunity to show my angry-monkey emoticon:

>8(|)

You must have lots of free time on your hands!

[zenmaster]

(my second choice was "Isnt anybody going to choose monkey? " )

I see this as a rare opportunity to show my angry-monkey emoticon:

>8(|)

You must have lots of free time on your hands!

Thought it was that intricate?

[Raman]

(my second choice was "Isnt anybody going to choose monkey? " )

I see this as a rare opportunity to show my angry-monkey emoticon:

>8(|)

You must have lots of free time on your hands!

Thought it was that intricate?

yah you verry smart, yiur very intelligent! wow!

---

I thought you liked my jokes!

[3DMonkey]

The monkey emoticon reminds me of the iconic sock monkey

[unity100]

so, your only choice becomes to engage in society by accepting its negative and veil-reinforcing state and therefore fulfill social interaction purpose of 3d, or withdraw from society, retain free will, but let go of a great deal of social interaction.

I don't think that's the only choice. Lots of people, including, I'd guess, most of us here on this forum, bumble through our lives as best we can, attempting to use the catalyst we're offered in order to choose love, light, unity, and monkey.

Edit: add monkey

choosing to live your life to the best of you can, would not change the fact that the overall choice you make will have to stand in between the limits pictured in the above.

[βαθμιαίος]

choosing to live your life to the best of you can, would not change the fact that the overall choice you make will have to stand in between the limits pictured in the above.

Are you saying that if you live in society you won't be able to choose to polarize positively?

[unity100]

choosing to live your life to the best of you can, would not change the fact that the overall choice you make will have to stand in between the limits pictured in the above.

Are you saying that if you live in society you won't be able to choose to polarize positively?

it will be much harder. the system requires you look out for your self interest by demanding things from others in return for whatever you give out in order to stay afloat. in short, everyone have to have a measure of self-focus from the start. then there is the need to find a way to be able to give more than you take.

that is of course totally leaving out the fact that such an environment reduces vibrations, and in such an environment it would be harder to go up vibrationally, opening the energy centers going up to 6th.

[Tenet Nosce]

it will be much harder. the system requires you look out for your self interest by demanding things from others in return for whatever you give out in order to stay afloat. in short, everyone have to have a measure of self-focus from the start. then there is the need to find a way to be able to give more than you take.

I must say that I concur with this observation. Only in the last year or so have I gotten to the point where I can even start to think about how I might like to "give back" rather than simply being focused on how to not be a drain on society.

This is despite having grown up in a relatively caring environment, having my basic needs provided for, years upon years of higher education, plus countless hours spent in research and reflection upon esoteric subjects. So considering your "Average Joe on Main Street" the odds are stacked ridiculously high against making any sort of progress.

[3DMonkey]

Um. I think it only takes giving to one. Just one.

It's not difficult to find that one. He/she is right in front of you.

.... I'm not sure why unity100 commented on that. I typed out a reply but chose to delete it. I was going to say 'just because it doesn't change the 'fact' doesn't change the fact that one could choose live to 'the best' they can'. I don't get it.

[AnthroHeart]

Tenet, have you had an enlightenment experience? I hear about those that opened up to infinite bliss. But in my experience, it was all about processing my fears. I haven't had any experience where I felt that immense love they talk about. My experience a few months back was tiring, confusing, although I'd have to say it was rewarding.

Still, I have to make assumptions that the grass really is greener in 4D. I make assumption there is a harvest. I assume there is great love out there. But I guess I can't really know. I just have to trust that ascension is a good thing without really proof of it. What can I say, I'm just tired and processing some extreme frustration.

[βαθμιαίος]

it will be much harder. the system requires you look out for your self interest by demanding things from others in return for whatever you give out in order to stay afloat. in short, everyone have to have a measure of self-focus from the start. then there is the need to find a way to be able to give more than you take.

Harder doesn't mean impossible. My opinion is that the thick veil is responsible for the intensity of seeking and, hence, the brightness and vividness of our experience.

[AnthroHeart]

βαθμιαίος, do you think 4D will be more bright and vivid, even without the veil?

[unity100]

it will be much harder. the system requires you look out for your self interest by demanding things from others in return for whatever you give out in order to stay afloat. in short, everyone have to have a measure of self-focus from the start. then there is the need to find a way to be able to give more than you take.

Harder doesn't mean impossible. My opinion is that the thick veil is responsible for the intensity of seeking and, hence, the brightness and vividness of our experience.

harder doesnt mean impossible, but it also means reduction of what you can do and how high you can go. this then reflects on the number of entities which can go over a given threshold. and hence, the low numbers of the harvest. you can have a planet full of entities numbering 7 billion, and the experience may be 'vivid and bright' in 3d, and end up with 10 million harvestees from among that lot. the 'vividness and brightness' that is praised at 3d, becomes lack of variety and richness in 4d due to the low number of souls that were harvested. this doesnt change if 100 million entities arrive from other 4d harvests - the entities, souls which were not harvested at this point in time, are still richness and experience lost for entire existence.

those entities could have got harvested in a planetary experience that did not make them subservient to a choice they didnt want to make.

[βαθμιαίος]

βαθμιαίος, do you think 4D will be more bright and vivid, even without the veil?

Yes, I do. It may be a small harvest, but I think the quality of entities that make it to 4D here will be very high.

---

the entities, souls which were not harvested at this point in time, are still richness and experience lost for entire existence.

I think this may, to some extent, get back to the unity/infinity discussion we have had in other threads. However, before I respond I want to make sure I understand what you're saying. Can you explain what you mean in the excerpt I have quoted above?

[unity100]

βαθμιαίος, do you think 4D will be more bright and vivid, even without the veil?

Yes, I do. It may be a small harvest, but I think the quality of entities that make it to 4D here will be very high.

excessively imbalanced, due to the necessity for quite increased 'naivete' that is needed to polarize.

[Tenet Nosce]

Tenet, have you had an enlightenment experience?

Sure, I have had many of them. The common experience is becoming aware of a new way of processing information so as to arrive at a new understanding that was previously inaccessible. Often times, this involves having to admit to myself that I was point blank wrong in my previous understandings, and it is not always a pleasant experience.

I hear about those that opened up to infinite bliss. But in my experience, it was all about processing my fears. I haven't had any experience where I felt that immense love they talk about. My experience a few months back was tiring, confusing, although I'd have to say it was rewarding.

I really only had one experience like that. No, I take that back I can think of two. But the first was much more transient. There was a time that I was feeling extremely disenfranchised with life, full of worry and despair. One afternoon I just flopped myself down on the bed and turned inward. Every time a thought came up I looked at it and said, "That doesn't matter." After a period of time the thoughts stopped and I was filled with an incredible sense of bliss and well-bring which persisted for nearly a week.

Still, I have to make assumptions that the grass really is greener in 4D. I make assumption there is a harvest. I assume there is great love out there. But I guess I can't really know. I just have to trust that ascension is a good thing without really proof of it. What can I say, I'm just tired and processing some extreme frustration.

Based on my own personal experiences and various awakening and enlightening events, I can say that there is definitely more to life than what we are offered here in 3D earth. This place is not normal, by any stretch of the imagination. And while I understand that certain things about my individual makeup result in a natural revulsion to physicality, I am still boggled by why so many people seem to be so fond of this place.

[AnthroHeart]

Tenet, yeah I have wished many times to depart though I don't talk about it cause you know how society is. They think drugs can fix everything. I feel for many of the indigos out there. Funny thing, indigo is close to the word dingo, and I am fond of canines.

But I do see beauty here in nature. But I could much more enjoy that from 4D where one can talk with nature. Something tells me I've done it all before, but I guess there's something to learn about doing it all again.

[βαθμιαίος]

Reposting this because it may have gotten overlooked when the forum software appended it to another post of mine...

the entities, souls which were not harvested at this point in time, are still richness and experience lost for entire existence.

I think this may, to some extent, get back to the unity/infinity discussion we have had in other threads. However, before I respond I want to make sure I understand what you're saying. Can you explain what you mean in the excerpt I have quoted above?

[Tenet Nosce]

Tenet, yeah I have wished many times to depart though I don't talk about it cause you know how society is.

Oh yes, every life is precious, and wanting to leave your current incarnation is not only pathological, but abominable. This is nonsense and it is all predicated upon false identification with the physical vehicle. Nobody is aghast when somebody ditches their old beater and buys a new performance vehicle. But if a 90-year-old man says he is ready to depart, we must force him to stay here against his will, and for his own benefit.

This is not for his benefit, it is for the benefit of those who refuse to deal with their own fear of death, and typically for the benefit of family members who still have "unfinished business" with this man, despite the fact that ample opportunity has already been offered to say whatever needed to be said. It is also in complete ignorance or denial of the fact that communication with this man may fairly easily be made after he has departed the physical vehicle. Happens all the time.

Yes, life is precious. Fortunately, its preciousness has little to do with whether or not it happens to be using a physical vehicle.

But I do see beauty here in nature. But I could much more enjoy that from 4D where one can talk with nature.

Oh, yes, there is so much beauty here on 3D earth. Unfortunately, humans have projected a hideous beast into this reality which makes it highly challenging for anybody to truly appreciate it. We are forced to relish every scrap of peace that we might find in nature when we were meant to delight in it with our every breath. And yes, we were meant to communicate with nature directly- not have other beings intercede with nature on our behalf.

Something tells me I've done it all before, but I guess there's something to learn about doing it all again.

If that's the way you feel, then I see no reason to believe it isn't true. And yes, there is something to learn about doing it all again. Moreover, doing "this" might be as a vocation for some in higher densities- their chosen form of service.

Also, this isn't in direct response to you, but I feel it is appropriate to note here that I have experienced the successive quickening of chakras in my energy body to in the opposite direction as is typically depicted in the metaphysical literature. This leads me to conclude that I am either highly unusual, or that the whole "kundalini rising" bit is yet another distortion.

[AnthroHeart]

I actually don't see kundalini as anything different from Creator's light. I've read that you bring in kundalini through your root chakra from Earth, and the cosmic light in through the crown. At this point I just focus on making my field denser.

Well, I actually opened my indigo a bit before my heart chakra, then balanced both as crown opened. Throat chakra was the last to open for me. I feel very balanced, though I don't feel the sensation in my lower 2 chakras all that much. My solar plexus is pretty balanced so I don't feel much sensation from that either.

I actually keep focused on raising my density, sort of compacting the light inside myself. I find when I hold my breath for a bit and squeeze my body, the light pressure increases substantially. It's like building momentum of the light, and the inertia continues to build it after I relax.

I don't feel so comfortable in 3D at times because it's not dense enough for me. I sort of have to build up the light pressure to be comfortable. Many months ago having more light pressure made me a little scared because it felt like a big wave was building that I'd lose control of and it would wisk my mind away. Kind of scary when your body moves and your mind has to catch up to where you are. That's much better now. I'm held much more stable by the light.

I've done as much subtle balancing as I can consciously perceive at this point. I do make minor adjustments along the way. Mostly it's accepting catalyst as it comes and processing it in my field. I push up my field's density to increase the processing speed of this catalyst that comes in. Been very interesting really.

You ever get the feeling that some of us could possibly be 4D already? I mean where we are vibrating at 4D? At least when I walk around it seems like the world's a dream. At times I can't make sense of what I'm reading.

-gw

[unity100]

Reposting this because it may have gotten overlooked when the forum software appended it to another post of mine...

the entities, souls which were not harvested at this point in time, are still richness and experience lost for entire existence.

I think this may, to some extent, get back to the unity/infinity discussion we have had in other threads. However, before I respond I want to make sure I understand what you're saying. Can you explain what you mean in the excerpt I have quoted above?

souls not harvested at this point in time will be lost richness and experience for the continuum of this creation in this octave since they were not able to become actors in 4d at this point. 4d will not be richer until these entities are harvested. and moreover, even when these entities are harvested later, still there will be the loss of richness due to these entities havent been harvested before. the threads they would weave into the tapestry that this creation is, have been missing in between the period they havent been harvested now, and when they are harvested in future. it wont be recovered. tapestry is different now. and this 'now' word in the preceding sentence doesnt refer to this continuum we inhabit in earthly year of 2011. that 'now' refers to the overall tapestry that resulted at the end of 7d.

[Tenet Nosce]

I actually don't see kundalini as anything different from Creator's light.

Sorry, I didn't mean to say that it wasn't. I was referring to a distortion in the teachings such that the perception is offered that all entities awaken from the red chakra and moving upward. Also in reference to teachings which forcefully move the energy rather than allow it to develop naturally. In contrast, you can't really blow your circuits out with indigo ray energy as its very nature has a calming or settling effect.

I've read that you bring in kundalini through your root chakra from Earth, and the cosmic light in through the crown. At this point I just focus on making my field denser.

Precisely. I no longer seek to draw energy inward from the outside, through either end. Rather I draw energy forth from within, and release it to both the cosmos and the earth.

I feel very balanced, though I don't feel the sensation in my lower 2 chakras all that much. My solar plexus is pretty balanced so I don't feel much sensation from that either.

I concur. I feel very little activity going on in the lower three chakras. However, they are not blocked. I can activate them at will. However, I often forget or fail to activate them when appropriate, causing some transient disturbances in my interactions with others.

Many months ago having more light pressure made me a little scared because it felt like a big wave was building that I'd lose control of and it would wisk my mind away. Kind of scary when your body moves and your mind has to catch up to where you are. That's much better now. I'm held much more stable by the light.

I know exactly what you mean. I have had a number of such experiences, and they are getting both stronger and more frequent, like contractions during childbirth The last one was the first time I felt that level of fear during the experience. That tells me that the birthing process is about to come to a close.

I push up my field's density to increase the processing speed of this catalyst that comes in.

I hadn't really thought of it like that. Interesting.

You ever get the feeling that some of us could possibly be 4D already? I mean where we are vibrating at 4D?

That is hard to say. As for me, I don't perceive fourth density directly, though I do perceive its presence and effects. We do know that 4D catalyst is present, and that 4D lessons are being learned by entities.

At least when I walk around it seems like the world's a dream.

It can definitely seem like that at times.

[StormShadow]

I don't see how they become "lost" richness... they will simply continue exploring this density in more detail, perhaps in detail and to depths that your and my aversion prevents us from plumbing. They will then take those lessons with them into the next densities, or be blotted out. If they are blotted out, sure, I see how you could say this is a loss, but I don't think that anything short of this really qualifies as such. Even the highly negative entities, once they reach the level of unity, become - how was it put - the "most zealous converts," don't they?

Reposting this because it may have gotten overlooked when the forum software appended it to another post of mine...

the entities, souls which were not harvested at this point in time, are still richness and experience lost for entire existence.

I think this may, to some extent, get back to the unity/infinity discussion we have had in other threads. However, before I respond I want to make sure I understand what you're saying. Can you explain what you mean in the excerpt I have quoted above?

souls not harvested at this point in time will be lost richness and experience for the continuum of this creation in this octave since they were not able to become actors in 4d at this point. 4d will not be richer until these entities are harvested. and moreover, even when these entities are harvested later, still there will be the loss of richness due to these entities havent been harvested before. the threads they would weave into the tapestry that this creation is, have been missing in between the period they havent been harvested now, and when they are harvested in future. it wont be recovered. tapestry is different now. and this 'now' word in the preceding sentence doesnt refer to this continuum we inhabit in earthly year of 2011. that 'now' refers to the overall tapestry that resulted at the end of 7d.

[Tenet Nosce]

it is a foregone conclusion to say that, since the entities, or society are not able to get the upflowing energy up to higher energy centers, they also wont be in a position to make choice. for, in order to manifest in higher chajkras, you need a stable balance that allows you to get to, and go above that chakra. when your energies are clogged in early-mid orange, you cant do that.

I think I may have just spoken to this in response to Gemini Wolf, before having picked back up on this strand of the thread. I don't really buy into the notion that all entities are simultaneously meant to progress from red and up on through the chakras in a linear fashion. However, this is the case for the vast majority.

It is important to keep in mind that some are weaving oddball paths, adding a variance of color to the tapestry and a certain degree of accenting that reflects a higher order of craftsmanship.

Now what -I think- βαθμιαίος and StormShadow are alluding to is the idea that, because the veil has been so thick, and the experience so unusual, this presents an exceedingly rare opportunity for a certain kind of teach/learning. As such is highly valued, and actually sought after by many.

I concur, and would add that what is going on here has potential for effects to reach into the next octave, with possibly extremely significant positive consequences. I would speculate this type of unusual activity eventuates in the potential for a reworking of the entire 7D tapestry from outside the octave, thus bringing balance to the loss of richness and experience incurred previously.

Though I do also see your concern for the plight of the people, and as I earlier acknowledged, the cards do appear to be stacked ridiculously high against the average person to overcome the negative entropy of this nexus. If people are forced to live with turds in their midst, we can hardly expect them to attend to the more spiritual things in life.

At the same time I also observe such a lackadaisical attitude in many toward processing their own inner negativity, that it is hardly surprising that they should all be gathered here together in such a negative place. This is where all the slothful, lazy, and developmentally slow get sent to keep them from interfering with everybody else's progress.

In other words, what we have here is both a high degree of victimization and a high degree of victimhood. Neither is particularly useful for the entities displaying such characteristics. However, the situation does present an opportunity for a higher order entity to offer a very particular form of service. And so it is made useful.

[unity100]

I don't see how they become "lost" richness... they will simply continue exploring this density in more detail, perhaps in detail and to depths that your and my aversion prevents us from plumbing. They will then take those lessons with them into the next densities, or be blotted out. If they are blotted out, sure, I see how you could say this is a loss, but I don't think that anything short of this really qualifies as such. Even the highly negative entities, once they reach the level of unity, become - how was it put - the "most zealous converts," don't they?

this is not a matter of positive or negative or lessons. this is a matter of the grand play, grand act.

think what picture you see when you look back from the points nearing infinity in 7d as a tapestry. it is something that is woven with the participation of all entities.

and in that tapestry, from a certain point, there is less green color. because these entities were not harvested. and in return, because the yellow threads did not turn into green threads at this point, they dont turn to blue threads at a later point in the tapestry. since these threads remained yellow, everything has now changed to accommodate it as such. not only those threads themselves, but all the other threads in the tapestry.

and when those threads enter the green color at a later point in the tapestry, the parts they have not colored with green, will remain uncolored with green. regardless of the sharpness, strikingness of the green they bring at a later point into the tapestry.

it may be argued that, the resulting tapestry is still a unique tapestry and equal in value. in a sense, it is true. but, first imagine a piece of tapestry that is in rainbow colors uniformly in every thread. then, imagine the similar tapestry, but with a big yellow spot (or any other color) in one point, and a big blue spot in another random point and so on. imagine the number of such random spots of color increase. its not a rainbow tapestry anymore. the more imbalanced it gets, the less rainbow like it becomes.

multiplicity at any given point increases the variance of any line in the tapestry due to interaction of threads standing side by side. when you introduce a big yellow spot at a point, causing to less yellow color in the next point, you reduce the interactions at those lines in the tapestry, and therefore reduce the situations and things they would create by interacting within each other at those lines. not to mention all of these affect the lines coming later.