12/21/2012: David Wilcock, Harvest, Ra, New Age Gurus. What does it all mean?

[BrownEye]

Can you guess how 4D earth is being populated right now? You don't just pop up in some light body LoL! You don't start up a population with babies either.

[Ashim]

Sure. We can all be buddhists or hindus or whatever and find joy in the moment.

But what does that have to do with 2012?

How many people on this forum thought that there would be some kind of ascension event today?

How many thousands of people have been following the new age community for 20 years expecting this 2012 major event?

Let's draw some definitive conclusions.

David Wilcock: FRAUD. This is the guy who supposedly slept in Don Elkins' bed. He lived with Carla and Jim but it seems he was kicked out for some reason (not doing the work he agreed to do? smoking too much weed?)

He then went and started a website where he channelled Ra and started telling people that something big involving UFO landings and ascension events would happen in 2000. When it didn't pan out he changed it to 2012.

Now he's on TV and has a book and supposedly a movie. What now? When all your claims are proven false, one after another after another, what then? There were no mass arrests. There were no destroyed underground bases. There was no alien disclosure in 2009. Obama did not defeat the Illuminati. And most of all: NOTHING HAPPENED ON TODAY Dec 21st, 2012.

As someone who basically wasted six years of my life on New Age stuff, what do I have to show for it? Some old Buddhist stuff about Joy in the moment? What the f*** is the point of channelled material if all it does is reproduce Zen and Buddhist material from forever ago?

Of course, I didn't expect anything to happen today. But now that today has finally come I guess I'm looking for final closure on this delusional part of my life. What does the New Age community have to offer?

The entire New Age community has been obsessed with THE NEW AGE. Ra said 2011. Mayans said 2012. Everyone said 2012. So much channelled material said so.

So where does the New Age community go from here? Are people just going to keep on like the entire community wasn't caught up in a mass delusion about a huge event happening today? Are people just going to pretend this never happened and keep harping on about love and light and ascension and the age of Aquarius and mayan prophecies and star children?

Here is a quote from your favourite book:

"A darkness lies behind us; and we have turned our backs on it, and we do not desire to return thither even in thought. Westwards our hearts have been turned, and we believe that there we shall find Light."

[BrownEye]

I wouldn't be surprised is today marked the shift of humanity into total and utter darkness.

Quite the ray of sunshine you are!

Where did this special date come from? I thought it came from Terrence Mckenna, after he adjusted his timeline to make way for convenience. As far as I knew, the Mayan calendar ended on October 28th 2011.

On top of that we are basing all of this on Gregorian numbers. How can that even work?

On the other hand, you all chose the same timeline I did, for better or for worst LMAO!

[Lycen]

It was as I expected, though secretly hoped for more. But it was an awesome day, as I made it such. Thanks to the use of a certain plant, the day was mighty special. Even though for the date alone I already considered it so .D

Now what?

Keep on truckin ,)

[Goldenratio]

Now were on the next Piktun

[irpsit]

Now what?

This was not a problem for me. I never expected anything to happen to me or anyone else.

I think the real problems are on our Earth, not in the hopes of finding another fantasy escapist 4th density world.

Do I think 4th density exists? Yes. But we are in another density (3d). And it's on this density that we should stop to focus on escapisms and focus and start working really in our Earthly problems. When we die, we will go where we are tuned to. Why I say escapisms? Because light and love we ought to be in on daily moments interacting with others, not in our selfish dreams of ascending. Just my opinnion! Peace for all,

[Shin'Ar]

http://www.sinfest.net/comikaze/comics/2012-12-06.gif


Was it as good for you as it was for me?(lays back and puffs on cigarette)

Okay, now what do we do next?

I know, I know, let's start a new religion and see how many followers we can get.

We can call it Bring4thianity.


So now that I got the sarcasm out of my system, ( thanks Cyan, for the comic strip by the way),

What are your thoughts on the harvest and has anyone realized any specific results from its occurrence?

I eagerly keep my ear to the ground for signs of any change in Her breathing, and my awareness keen for meeting with any new opportunities which may have arisen from any possible cosmic realigning.

One question I do have, (and I have not yet found time to listen to Monica's show to see if this has been discussed, as I am sure it will be), is 'what exactly are the Ra quotes referring to this event?'

And has the fact that nothing dramatic,(wrong word as some may not know whether or not any thing dramatic has occurred or not), has occurred, contradict anything which Ra may have stated, and how has it affected your thinking around the whole harvest matter?

[GentleReckoning]

Um, I just haven't been sleeping well for the past week or so.

Hopefully I can start getting sleep again soon. On the other hand I seem to require much less sleep than I did before.

[yshurik]

Well, I remembered that someone mentioned on this forum before that after 21 psychiatrists will make fortune on lightworkers

[Spaced]

I was expecting to make some spiritual progress in the period leading up to the 21st and those expectations were met as far as I am concerned.

I don't think that nothing physical happening on that date detracts from the message of the Law of One whatsoever, which was never about seeking salvation from the outside. The harvest is a deeply personal thing, a re-connection to your higher ways of being. The idea is that you have to be the one to rise up and grasp it for yourself.

Those are my thoughts at least. How are you doing Shin'Ar? I'm feeling pretty great

[Brittany]

I felt sick all day. Aside from that it was business as usual.

I'm actually sort of glad the "sudden deliverance" meme has passed. Time to stop waiting for the magical aliens to save us and realize it's up to US to change this world and transform ourselves.

[Horuseus]

Infringement upon Free Will is the main reason why some 'miraculous' ascension did not occur.

Ascension occurs within. Do not look outside for the outer is only a reflection/mirror of the inner.

[zenmaster]

Infringement upon Free Will is the main reason why some 'miraculous' ascension did not occur.

that's exactly like saying infringement upon free will is the main reason that pigs do not suddenly fly. Or you could just as well say that the main reason each and every one of anyone's fantasies are not brought to life according to mere whimsical and superficial desire is due to infringement. Either the way the more primary condition is what always was regardless of invention, hopes, or fears.

[reeay]

Well, I remembered that someone mentioned on this forum before that after 21 psychiatrists will make fortune on lightworkers

The comment was therapists and lightworkers will make more money.

[Horuseus]

that's exactly like saying infringement upon free will is the main reason that pigs do not suddenly fly. Or you could just as well say that the main reason each and every one of anyone's fantasies are not brought to life according to mere whimsical and superficial desire is due to infringement. Either the way the more primary condition is what always was regardless of invention, hopes, or fears.

How do you make such a parallel? This 'gradual' ascension was decided ultimately by the Free Will of those players on this stage (we). The 3D mindset is one subjugated to linear time; a sequential cause and effect in achieving results with a perceived time interval between one event and the next. We have planned this gradual ascension to 'wean' ourselves out of such a mindset. This indicates that we as a collective are not ready for a sudden ascension. The notion of a sudden ascension is also not a 'whimsical and superficial' desire for is not all ascension sudden taking into account the illusionary aspect of time. That being said, let's not confuse semantics, I don't doubt many saw the notion of a sudden ascension externally as some sort of Get out of Jail free card or a validation of sorts. I don't doubt in all likelihood given the circumstances a gradual harvest on the outside was always a given, but the actual ascension itself 'was' sudden, whether we realize it on a conscious level or not.

I suppose one can make a parallel to why E.T.s have not suddenly landed on our doorsteps. Those who are ready for such contact have already had such, on various levels. Those who are not will not, It's quite simple. It all begins inside however.

[litllady]

What do I think it was about?

Something that would make more humans then ever...look at the stars and more humans then ever, actually considered, is there something special about us, our sun, and the center of the galaxy?

It gave many a moment of thought, a moment of choice, a moment of reflection. The outer and the inner. We all share this solar system, we all share this galaxy. We all share a inner spirit and just like the galactic center...we might not know its there till we take a look for it.

Im a firm believer that in this matrix we call life, every so often, something will occur that may force us to look within us to find out what is really there...what really makes 'us' and what is that 'something' that connects us.

I bet more people then ever before on this earth...looked within them this year. I bet some became more spiritual. I bet some became more empathetic after breaking down their own walls that they built about fear, doubt, envy, material importance's ect. I bet more people on earth then ever before....took a step on their OWN path rather then finding someones elses path to walk along. This...is a HUGE thing...for our people, for our planet. There will be repercussions of this on down the line..it may be years and years till it all comes together but I guarantee you that there is a strong group of people on this earth now that will hold a vibration of love like never before, that will stand sure footed in believing in life, the rights of life, and the rights of everyone finding their path in life instead of being told by another person what their path should be.

This was not about 1 year or 1 day. Its about the hub of a time where peoples minds started to open to new thoughts, new possibilities, new ways to discover and align, to the spirit that fills our being. I think this
time was about discovering the spirit within us and then also seeing it within everything that surrounds us.

Awakening to what we are can happen at anytime. Awakening to living more for others then our own self and understanding that no one is above or below another. Something like 'moving on' will only happen through death.

So what all the stuff that was hoped for did not happen. I too thought at times that many people were going to be really really disappointed when all of that stuff does not happen. But what was supposed to happen, did, and that is what matters.

We are now in a time and age where there is no 'one' right way...and as people discover walking a path of their own and seeking 'god' not in books but in life itself, in nature, in cycles, in the very design of our experiences, they discover very similar things, even though no path this way is the same, the discoveries are the same. To me, this shows us, the word of god is in life, I think this moment in time is a stepping stone...to move away from the ideas that god is in books, that god is something not outside of us, that god is something that can always be found as long as the person looks with that one eye of light. Anywhere, anytime...without books??? That is pretty amazing to me.

Bring on 2013!

[almostdone]

Not sure where to post exactly since there has been dissatisfaction here and there in several posts regarding 12/21/12 and the feeling/emotions "nothing has happened" that conveys a negative turn in the way we experience this density and the hope for changes or at least a clear beginning of changes. So I suppose is OK to post here. Even if the Mayans of today (I'm thinking about "Ac Tah", his group and its "teachings" leading to this particular date for example, but to others including some like "Cosmic Awareness" and in this forum, Godwide _Void). Even if the Mayan Ac Tah is related to the 150 that were harvestable at the end of the second cycle, Ra only gives an "approximate" time frame when "this" is supposed to occur-- also mixed with other Q/A subject to endless interpretations and arguments. The main point is that no specific date was given.

Now I ask: What is approximate for you? Is it 5%? 10%.... understanding now that it has to be most probably after 2012.

If specific dates are of negative origin (most probably) now you know why. It has disheartened many.

Even if some say this new cycle might have been started and we just did not notice, I would say that an opening of the gateway to Intelligent Infinity would be very obvious.

We can also take this as a lesson and go from here...

[BrownEye]

Even if some say this new cycle might have been started and we just did not notice, I would say that an opening of the gateway to Intelligent Infinity would be very obvious

The gateway is your crown. Your "guardian angel". Maybe it is guarded well?

[reeay]

How did DW become such an authority?

[almostdone]

If you were harvested good for you. I can still see you're here though.

[yossarian]

Sure. We can all be buddhists or hindus or whatever and find joy in the moment.

But what does that have to do with 2012?

How many people on this forum thought that there would be some kind of ascension event today?

How many thousands of people have been following the new age community for 20 years expecting this 2012 major event?

Let's draw some definitive conclusions.

David Wilcock: FRAUD. This is the guy who supposedly slept in Don Elkins' bed. He lived with Carla and Jim but it seems he was kicked out for some reason (not doing the work he agreed to do? smoking too much weed?)

He then went and started a website where he channelled Ra and started telling people that something big involving UFO landings and ascension events would happen in 2000. When it didn't pan out he changed it to 2012.

Now he's on TV and has a book and supposedly a movie. What now? When all your claims are proven false, one after another after another, what then? There were no mass arrests. There were no destroyed underground bases. There was no alien disclosure in 2009. Obama did not defeat the Illuminati. And most of all: NOTHING HAPPENED ON TODAY Dec 21st, 2012.

As someone who basically wasted six years of my life on New Age stuff, what do I have to show for it? Some old Buddhist stuff about Joy in the moment? What the f*** is the point of channelled material if all it does is reproduce Zen and Buddhist material from forever ago?

Of course, I didn't expect anything to happen today. But now that today has finally come I guess I'm looking for final closure on this delusional part of my life. What does the New Age community have to offer?

The entire New Age community has been obsessed with THE NEW AGE. Ra said 2011. Mayans said 2012. Everyone said 2012. So much channelled material said so.

So where does the New Age community go from here? Are people just going to keep on like the entire community wasn't caught up in a mass delusion about a huge event happening today? Are people just going to pretend this never happened and keep harping on about love and light and ascension and the age of Aquarius and mayan prophecies and star children?

Here is a quote from your favourite book:

"A darkness lies behind us; and we have turned our backs on it, and we do not desire to return thither even in thought. Westwards our hearts have been turned, and we believe that there we shall find Light."

Except the Children of Hurin and other men came to tragedy, for they refused to look back at that darkness.

They were ashamed of the darkness in the East from which they came. They were too ashamed to consider it, especially when the light of the Eldar could be seen in Middle Earth.

Their shame led them to tragedy.

I won't let the same happen. I look back into the darkness, I look back into the vanished shames of every man.

What I see in this thread is a lot of people dodging the point. I've seen so much passive aggressive, downright emotionally abusive answers.

People think saying, "Sorry! The rest of us ascended but you just weren't good enough!" is a loving thing to say? That is extremely hurtful.

People think mocking me or others for 2012 beliefs is loving? "HAHA, what did you expect, you idiot? You really thought a bunch of aliens would come down and pick you up and usher you into 4th D? What a MORON! All the smart people have always known it would be gradual."

The people who say this are just cutting the world into us vs. them. They don't want to be part of the "them" for whom 2012 was supposed to be a Big Deal. A Big Shift.

Others say, "The shift is that you were disappointed with New Age material. That ITSELF is the shift."

Fine. If that is the shift, then the lesson is to STOP with the New Age material. Others, who instantly marked New Age stuff as bullshit, did not have to experience this disappointment because they never believed in it.

Someone defended David Wilcock as sharing "only his truth." But this isn't true. David Wilcock shared the INSIDER TESTIMONY from the ILLUMINATI that said they had SCIENTIFIC PROOF of a shift. David constantly claimed to have objective scientific proof. He claimed that he had spoken to astral entities who revealed this to him--like a revealed religion. He claimed that higher beings had revealed this to him--also like a revealed religion. Like when Constantine had a dream of Christ and changed the fate of the Roman Empire.

David claimed that we should trust his insider sources. He told us, "I'm not telling you everything because that would be too dangerous, but just trust me, you can trust me, can't you? I wouldn't lie about something this big, would I? I'm STO! All I ever do is try to love you guys and service you guys."

And now he's on TV. Now he has a movie deal and a New York Times Bestseller. He got his book into the Bestseller list before it was released by asking his followers to pre-order it so that this info about 2012 could get into the mainstream BEFORE the 2012 shift. WHAT 2012 shift?

David just exploited thousands of people to make himself into a bestseller. It was all based on lies. Who are his insiders? What about the SCIENTIFIC proof using the LOOKING GLASS MACHINE that PROVED that yesterday was a momentous occasion?

What about his detailed dreams explaining precisely what would happen on yesterday, what would happen in terms of people would wake up. Some would be visited by aliens. Some would experience telekineses, etc.

What about Hidden Hand who claimed that today some would be harvested into 4D while others had the most spiritual experience of their lives?

Are you gonna tell me that I just missed the shift when all the gurus have been telling me that I probably made it, since I try so hard to be STO?

LOO people have constantly said stuff like, "Well, you're here. So you're probably STO. So you'll probably make the shift."

I tried really really hard to be STO.

Did a single person ascend? Is there a single person on this forum who made it, for all the bullshit that has been thrown around, all the speculation?

Don't dodge the issue and say "The truth is all about what you make of it." That's a dodge. Ra didn't say the Harvest was what you make of it, they said it's a thing "like the clock striking on the hour" and that when that clock strikes it strikes for ALL of humanity.

What do those of us who have spent years in mass delusion about 2012 do with ourselves? Should we be ashamed for believing in the abrupt shift? Should we be ashamed for failing to "make the grade" or failing to "have a spiritual experience" or whatever? Should we be ashamed for lacking the necessary spirituality to see the lesson here, as so many of you are implying?

I don't consider the response from the majority of New Age apologists here to be loving. Most of you are responding to say, "Well it worked out for me! If you expected something else, that's YOUR fault!"

You sound like right wingers blaming the victim, not loving spiritual people. Maybe that's why YOU didn't ascend--you're so holier-than-thou.

[Dinko]

Sure. We can all be buddhists or hindus or whatever and find joy in the moment.

But what does that have to do with 2012?

How many people on this forum thought that there would be some kind of ascension event today?

How many thousands of people have been following the new age community for 20 years expecting this 2012 major event?

Let's draw some definitive conclusions.

David Wilcock: FRAUD. This is the guy who supposedly slept in Don Elkins' bed. He lived with Carla and Jim but it seems he was kicked out for some reason (not doing the work he agreed to do? smoking too much weed?)

He then went and started a website where he channelled Ra and started telling people that something big involving UFO landings and ascension events would happen in 2000. When it didn't pan out he changed it to 2012.

Now he's on TV and has a book and supposedly a movie. What now? When all your claims are proven false, one after another after another, what then? There were no mass arrests. There were no destroyed underground bases. There was no alien disclosure in 2009. Obama did not defeat the Illuminati. And most of all: NOTHING HAPPENED ON TODAY Dec 21st, 2012.

As someone who basically wasted six years of my life on New Age stuff, what do I have to show for it? Some old Buddhist stuff about Joy in the moment? What the f*** is the point of channelled material if all it does is reproduce Zen and Buddhist material from forever ago?

Of course, I didn't expect anything to happen today. But now that today has finally come I guess I'm looking for final closure on this delusional part of my life. What does the New Age community have to offer?

The entire New Age community has been obsessed with THE NEW AGE. Ra said 2011. Mayans said 2012. Everyone said 2012. So much channelled material said so.

So where does the New Age community go from here? Are people just going to keep on like the entire community wasn't caught up in a mass delusion about a huge event happening today? Are people just going to pretend this never happened and keep harping on about love and light and ascension and the age of Aquarius and mayan prophecies and star children?

Here is a quote from your favourite book:

"A darkness lies behind us; and we have turned our backs on it, and we do not desire to return thither even in thought. Westwards our hearts have been turned, and we believe that there we shall find Light."

Except the Children of Hurin and other men came to tragedy, for they refused to look back at that darkness.

They were ashamed of the darkness in the East from which they came. They were too ashamed to consider it, especially when the light of the Eldar could be seen in Middle Earth.

Their shame led them to tragedy.

I won't let the same happen. I look back into the darkness, I look back into the vanished shames of every man.

What I see in this thread is a lot of people dodging the point. I've seen so much passive aggressive, downright emotionally abusive answers.

People think saying, "Sorry! The rest of us ascended but you just weren't good enough!" is a loving thing to say? That is extremely hurtful.

People think mocking me or others for 2012 beliefs is loving? "HAHA, what did you expect, you idiot? You really thought a bunch of aliens would come down and pick you up and usher you into 4th D? What a MORON! All the smart people have always known it would be gradual."

The people who say this are just cutting the world into us vs. them. They don't want to be part of the "them" for whom 2012 was supposed to be a Big Deal. A Big Shift.

Others say, "The shift is that you were disappointed with New Age material. That ITSELF is the shift."

Fine. If that is the shift, then the lesson is to STOP with the New Age material. Others, who instantly marked New Age stuff as bullshit, did not have to experience this disappointment because they never believed in it.

Someone defended David Wilcock as sharing "only his truth." But this isn't true. David Wilcock shared the INSIDER TESTIMONY from the ILLUMINATI that said they had SCIENTIFIC PROOF of a shift. David constantly claimed to have objective scientific proof. He claimed that he had spoken to astral entities who revealed this to him--like a revealed religion. He claimed that higher beings had revealed this to him--also like a revealed religion. Like when Constantine had a dream of Christ and changed the fate of the Roman Empire.

David claimed that we should trust his insider sources. He told us, "I'm not telling you everything because that would be too dangerous, but just trust me, you can trust me, can't you? I wouldn't lie about something this big, would I? I'm STO! All I ever do is try to love you guys and service you guys."

And now he's on TV. Now he has a movie deal and a New York Times Bestseller. He got his book into the Bestseller list before it was released by asking his followers to pre-order it so that this info about 2012 could get into the mainstream BEFORE the 2012 shift. WHAT 2012 shift?

David just exploited thousands of people to make himself into a bestseller. It was all based on lies. Who are his insiders? What about the SCIENTIFIC proof using the LOOKING GLASS MACHINE that PROVED that yesterday was a momentous occasion?

What about his detailed dreams explaining precisely what would happen on yesterday, what would happen in terms of people would wake up. Some would be visited by aliens. Some would experience telekineses, etc.

What about Hidden Hand who claimed that today some would be harvested into 4D while others had the most spiritual experience of their lives?

Are you gonna tell me that I just missed the shift when all the gurus have been telling me that I probably made it, since I try so hard to be STO?

LOO people have constantly said stuff like, "Well, you're here. So you're probably STO. So you'll probably make the shift."

I tried really really hard to be STO.

Did a single person ascend? Is there a single person on this forum who made it, for all the bullshit that has been thrown around, all the speculation?

Don't dodge the issue and say "The truth is all about what you make of it." That's a dodge. Ra didn't say the Harvest was what you make of it, they said it's a thing "like the clock striking on the hour" and that when that clock strikes it strikes for ALL of humanity.

What do those of us who have spent years in mass delusion about 2012 do with ourselves? Should we be ashamed for believing in the abrupt shift? Should we be ashamed for failing to "make the grade" or failing to "have a spiritual experience" or whatever? Should we be ashamed for lacking the necessary spirituality to see the lesson here, as so many of you are implying?

I don't consider the response from the majority of New Age apologists here to be loving. Most of you are responding to say, "Well it worked out for me! If you expected something else, that's YOUR fault!"

You sound like right wingers blaming the victim, not loving spiritual people. Maybe that's why YOU didn't ascend you holier-than-thou people.

maybe someone ascended in their paralel reality from their perspective that we cant see...

[yossarian]

maybe someone ascended in their paralel reality from their perspective that we cant see...

And how is this in line with the Ra Material or with what any other new age guru said?

If people ascended in their parallel reality, how is 2012 momentous for humanity? Why is it a big deal if all that happens is a bunch of people imperceptibly ascend but they still leave behind their lower selves to suffer on the 3D plane?

You can say anything when it comes to that. Maybe invisible unicorns exist. Claiming that invisible unicorns are coming on 2012 would not make you famous, would not make your Ra Material famous, would not make David Wilcock or New Age material famous.

The reason these things are famous is because they DID NOT predict INVISIBLE unicorns. It's because they DID predict VISIBLE unicorns.

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

[Dinko]

maybe someone ascended in their paralel reality from their perspective that we cant see...

And how is this in line with the Ra Material or with what any other new age guru said?

If people ascended in their parallel reality, how is 2012 momentous for humanity? Why is it a big deal if all that happens is a bunch of people imperceptibly ascend but they still leave behind their lower selves to suffer on the 3D plane?

You can say anything when it comes to that. Maybe invisible unicorns exist. Claiming that invisible unicorns are coming on 2012 would not make you famous, would not make your Ra Material famous, would not make David Wilcock or New Age material famous.

The reason these things are famous is because they DID NOT predict INVISIBLE unicorns. It's because they DID predict VISIBLE unicorns.

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

its ok bro... u will ascend sometime

[Shin'Ar]

The change in vibration of Gaia related to the great anticipation of this date was in itself a great shift.

Does anyone consider the possibility that such a prophecy could be a deliberate attempt to test the responses of those in the aftermath, and judge them by their reactions, or even create a particular vibration to meet a cosmic changing with a very specific frequency?

What should be seen in our reactions, more than anything else, is this great thinking we have that we are somehow a more important focus than any other aspect of creation.

The human tendency is to elevate their identity into a grand central axis of the universe.

Do you really suppose that this form in which you now reside is somehow so important that any cosmic shift or transformation must be reported to you in such a way that you are made fully aware of it?

If so, then the very fact that you have not received that report, should reveal to you your actual importance in the grand scheme.

Many are crying 'I' and 'me', and attaching that identity to some cosmic priority as though unique or different than any other event.

This 'you' which awaited an obvious transformation, IS NOW the transformed awareness of now knowing that 'you' is not the priority of some cosmic obligation to this delusional identity 'you' adopt as 'you'.

Process of Being.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

It will be interesting indeed to see the backpedaling and spinning which will now take place, as well as how the change in vibration related to the disappointment will manifest.

'We' ascend each and every second of existence at varying rates. This is natural evolution and Divine Design.

What we ascend into is not as important a question as , 'do you want to leave 'you' behind in order to ascend higher'.

Each circle, each flower of the Grand Design, is connected by the Design and Process of Being in such a way that each is always 'the other' in various stages of awareness and states of being.

As above, So below.

The Ancients, from whom most religious persuasion descended, have always spoken of ascension as the awakening of the 'self', through the realization that one is NOT this 'self' that we adopt as our identity, but rather that we are a fire within, a Sacred Fire connecting us to The One Source. It is the freeing and awakening of THAT flame within that activates true ascension, which is simply natural evolution of consciousness.

And there are many connections that play a part in this process, and among them there will be shifts from one state of being into a higher state of being which will be accompanied by a transformation of form and process. at some point of this process reincarnation will no longer be a necessary aspect of this process for that particular field or fragment.

But the one thing that the Ancients pressed more than any other was this notion of identity, and its entrapping consequence of continuing a cycle of repetition unnecessarily.

If 'you' place such priority on 'you' that it supersedes 'us', this 'you' becomes the teeth of the trap which ensnares 'you'. And the trap which has now caused the real you to be held firmly to this delusional world of mistaken identity.

This is the STS to which Ra so often refers. But those who think as 'Is' cannot understand this.

Being trapped in this delusion of 'you' is what the Ancient Ones called the 'cycle of darkness'. 'YOU' shall not ascend from it, because 'you' do not want to.

[zenmaster]

I suppose one can make a parallel to why E.T.s have not suddenly landed on our doorsteps.

That'd be conflation. Very simply, there is a natural progression of evolution which has nothing to do with ascension ideas. When a pattern of mind which corresponds to a certain vibration is transcended, the corresponding body is activated and available for potential use - just like the chakras are activated. Preparation was involved. The corresponding bodily evolution, which naturally takes place over time, is due to conscious use of that new vibration (yes, the mind is that influential). In other words, as learning takes place, more and more is allowed. Transcendence is an ongoing process and always has been. It is not suddenly provided whole cloth as a physical transfiguration. Because someone may manufacture an idea of ascension and that desired, distorted reality was not forthcoming, does not mean the law of free will was involved whatsoever.

Thus I can say "pigs will fly" and when they don't, it's not because there would have been infringement with that new condition. It's simply because of an incompatible notion of reality. Sometimes things are rather simple.

[Plenum]

maybe someone ascended in their paralel reality from their perspective that we cant see...

And how is this in line with the Ra Material or with what any other new age guru said?

If people ascended in their parallel reality, how is 2012 momentous for humanity? Why is it a big deal if all that happens is a bunch of people imperceptibly ascend but they still leave behind their lower selves to suffer on the 3D plane?

You can say anything when it comes to that. Maybe invisible unicorns exist. Claiming that invisible unicorns are coming on 2012 would not make you famous, would not make your Ra Material famous, would not make David Wilcock or New Age material famous.

The reason these things are famous is because they DID NOT predict INVISIBLE unicorns. It's because they DID predict VISIBLE unicorns.

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

its ok bro... u will ascend sometime

that is Dinko wisdom, right there!

this man, simple and unassuming, perceives much.

[zenmaster]

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

yoss, you and I both know you are correct in general. Remember that many of these ideas were generated for the purpose of entertainment and escapism. You will recall all of the sci-fi references and other popular fantasy motifs blended in for appeal. If evolution was that simple, there would be no actual value provided - no learning about what really matters. "There is no experience which is not purchased by effort of some kind, no act of service to self or others which does not bear a price, to the entity manifesting, commensurate with its purity. All things in manifestation may be seen in one way or another to be offering themselves in order that transformations may take place upon the level appropriate to the action."

Actual, rather than imaginary, transformations take place from real work and responsibility. Not from jumping on someone's fantasy bandwagon which may 'resonate' with vague and overly confused notions of what it could mean to be suddenly exalted.

[Horuseus]

I suppose one can make a parallel to why E.T.s have not suddenly landed on our doorsteps.

That'd be conflation. Very simply, there is a natural progression of evolution which has nothing to do with ascension ideas. When a pattern of mind which corresponds to a certain vibration is transcended, the corresponding body is activated and available for potential use - just like the chakras are activated. Preparation was involved. The corresponding bodily evolution, which naturally takes place over time, is due to conscious use of that new vibration (yes, the mind is that influential). In other words, as learning takes place, more and more is allowed. Transcendence is an ongoing process and always has been. It is not suddenly provided whole cloth as a physical transfiguration. Because someone may manufacture an idea of ascension and that desired, distorted reality was not forthcoming, does not mean the law of free will was involved whatsoever.

Thus I can say "pigs will fly" and when they don't, it's not because there would have been infringement with that new condition. It's simply because of an incompatible notion of reality. Sometimes things are rather simple.

I see where you're coming from. That's quite a logical stance and one I hadn't really pondered on. Thanks. Will assimilate as appropriate.

[yossarian]

maybe someone ascended in their paralel reality from their perspective that we cant see...

And how is this in line with the Ra Material or with what any other new age guru said?

If people ascended in their parallel reality, how is 2012 momentous for humanity? Why is it a big deal if all that happens is a bunch of people imperceptibly ascend but they still leave behind their lower selves to suffer on the 3D plane?

You can say anything when it comes to that. Maybe invisible unicorns exist. Claiming that invisible unicorns are coming on 2012 would not make you famous, would not make your Ra Material famous, would not make David Wilcock or New Age material famous.

The reason these things are famous is because they DID NOT predict INVISIBLE unicorns. It's because they DID predict VISIBLE unicorns.

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

its ok bro... u will ascend sometime

Is this what passes for compassion around here?

---

Now that visible unicorns aren't here, are we just going to say, "Well they meant INvisible and they simply misspoke" ? Are we THAT much of a sucker?

yoss, you and I both know you are correct in general. Remember that many of these ideas were generated for the purpose of entertainment and escapism. You will recall all of the sci-fi references and other popular fantasy motifs blended in for appeal. If evolution was that simple, there would be no actual value provided - no learning about what really matters. "There is no experience which is not purchased by effort of some kind, no act of service to self or others which does not bear a price, to the entity manifesting, commensurate with its purity. All things in manifestation may be seen in one way or another to be offering themselves in order that transformations may take place upon the level appropriate to the action."

Actual, rather than imaginary, transformations take place from real work and responsibility. Not from jumping on someone's fantasy bandwagon which may 'resonate' with vague and overly confused notions of what it could mean to be suddenly exalted.

Sure. You've been preaching this for years, so you actually have credibility. You never believed in 2012.

Others did and it is those others I am trying to address.

Your notion of evolution of consciousness, which aligns with Shin'Ar, is not the notion that has yesterday been debunked.

Many people don't see David Wilcock as fantasy or entertainment. Many people took Ra seriously when Ra said, "The moment of ascension is like a clock striking on the hour. No one is excluded from this process." and many people took the 2011 prediction of Ra seriously.

So far in this thread we have people who never believed it just saying, "Same as usual."

I want to talk to the people who did believe it. What now? I believed it for many years. When I first read about "the striking clock" style harvest in the Ra Material I believed that it was coming in 2011 and I said to myself, "Wow, that isn't far off!"

Some parts of Ra said it would take many years, but this was NOT clear at all.

I then found all kinds of New Agers channelling giving supposedly factual messages about 2012.

You have always been convinced that most of this is just fantasy and entertainment. But I really believed it for quite a few years.

People can mock me and say, "I told you so" but you sound like unloving hypocrites who are not striving for Unity but rather for Separation when you do that.

It's like, "Ok, 2012 hit, now it's time to throw everyone who believed in it under the bus. All that love and unity and compassion stuff? That was just bullshit. The real separation is between us and you. We who weren't dumb enough to fall for it, and those of you who took The Harvest to mean the one described by Ra as 2011 ascension involving massive amounts of telekinesis and so on."