Infinite number of octaves

[Sabou]

Questioner: Does Ra have any knowledge of the number of previous octaves; and if so, how many?

Ra: I am Ra. As far as we are aware we are in an infinite creation. There is no counting.

I wonder if our learning and progression ever stops, I think it is safe to assume that it never does. I use to think that once we eventually went through enough densities in enough octaves that eventually there would be literally nothing else we could experience and then we would join back with Source. I thought this was the 7th density of the octave we are in, but with infinite octaves, then - if we do join back with Source, it must not be permanent, as we will fragment from source again into the next octave, over and over again infinitely refining? I just assume that if we live in an infinite creation then there is infinite growth.

Though there is no way of knowing what the other octaves are like and what form we will be in etc... Maybe.

Infinity is fun

[Stranger]

As I understand it, we dissolve the personality shell and merge with the Source at the end of the octave. The Higher Self is an interactive record of all we have experienced - very similar conceptually to a Star Trek holodeck recreation of historical personages. You can interact with it, but it can no longer co-create. Another analogy would be reaching the end of an RPG game with a character, and stepping away from the computer, having integrated the character's experiences and memories into your actual identity.

The next octave is then analogous to sitting down again at the computer to play a different game with a different character, but it's still you who is playing (remembering that the real you is the Logos).

I am not personally crazy about this notion, but higher density beings have described it to me as "a perfect part of a perfect plan" so I choose to trust that any discomfort I have about it is due to the limitation of my vision in 3D, and that it all makes perfect sense from a less limited perspective. Perhaps by 6th density we become very acutely aware of how artificial and limiting a construct a personality or "individual identity" is, and want to shed it to regain that wholeness and oneness and perfect integration into the ocean of being which we all have once known.

[isis]

i don't think we infinitely grow & learn but i think there's a good chance we may seemingly infinitely grow & learn - or evolve

i think the reality is that we never grow/learn/evolve at all - never have & never will. i define the OIC, what we are, as something that's omniscient/omnipotent/changeless/whole/complete/perfect & ultimately unfathomable

[Stranger]

Right, isis, we continuously work upon the personality shell, much like an RPG player can work to continuously improve his/her character in the game -- while at the same time retaining the actual identity, which is far beyond anything one could have in any game.

[sunnysideup]

Pretty amazing huh. Though I honestly still can't get my head around the concept of infinity, but it does seem logical to me that it takes eternity for infinity to experience itself.

16.51 ↥ Questioner: Could you define the word density as we have been using it to give us a little greater idea of the concept of this term when used by you?
Ra: I am Ra. The term density is a, what you would call, mathematical one. The closest analogy is that of music, whereby after seven notes on your western type of scale, if you will, the eighth note begins a new octave. Within your great octave of existence which we share with you, there are seven octaves or densities. Within each density there are seven sub-densities. Within each sub-density, seven sub-sub-densities, and so on infinitely.

You see even a density is infinite, but I think only in potential. We all go about in a different cyclical schedule as Ra says.

27.6...Ra: I am Ra. As we use this term it is universal in application. Intelligent infinity has a rhythm or flow as of a giant heart beginning with the central sun as you would think or conceive of this, the presence of the flow inevitable as a tide of beingness without polarity, without finity; the vast and silent all beating outward, outward, focusing outward and inward until the focuses are complete. The intelligence or consciousness of foci have reached a state where their, shall we say, spiritual nature or mass calls them inward, inward, inward until all is coalesced. This is the rhythm of reality as you spoke.

9.4 ↥ Questioner: The way I understand the process of evolution [of a] planetary population is that [a] population has a certain amount of time to progress. This is generally divided into three 25,000-year cycles. At the end of 75,000 years the planet progresses itself. What caused this situation to come about… preciseness of the years, 25,000 years, etc.? What set this up to begin with?
Ra: I am Ra. Visualize, if you will, the particular energy which, outward flowing and inward coagulating, formed the tiny realm of the creation governed by your Council of Saturn. Continue seeing the rhythm of this process. The living flow creates a rhythm which is as inevitable as one of your timepieces. Each of your planetary entities began the first cycle when the energy nexus was able in that environment to support such mind/body experiences. Thus, each of your planetary entities is on a different cyclical schedule as you might call it. The timing of these cycles is a measurement equal to a portion of intelligent energy. This intelligent energy offers a type of clock. The cycles move as precisely as a clock strikes your hour. Thus, the gateway from intelligent energy to intelligent infinity opens regardless of circumstance on the striking of the hour.

Also I guess the Guardians would have knowledge of the next octave.

51.1...The third group watching over this process is that group you call the Guardians. This group is from the octave above our own and serves in this manner as light-bringers...

[Matt1]

I am glad that we have infinity. If you think about it logically if the universe was finite we would reach a point of self mastery at one point in the future when all things are understood and known there is nothing left to do. Infinity gives rise to mystery and lasting fulfillment.

[Stranger]

The Universe is still in the process of being created.

[Unbound]

I think it makes the most sense of they are seen to be one inside the other, rather than a linear progression of "one after the other". I believe that this entire octave is the first density of the next octave, so the whole thing is scalar rather than a vector, like the layers of an onion. A good analogy of this is the transformation of the cube in to the tesseract. I believe the octaves encapsulate one another like dimensions. Thus, the next octave starts with the seed of this octave nestled within it, just as this one began with the foundation of the previous.

---

Of course, I say "beginning" but I actually believe all octaves are infinite, eternal, and are not separated by time, but by degree. An understanding in music would be that as you go up in frequency you reach new tones and the previous tones "go silent", not that they no longer exist, but they are not the ones being sounded. I believe consciousness "sounds the frequencies" of whatever state or level it is at. Thus, the "next octave" already exists and is already happening, it just occurs on the next level of scalar awareness.

[anagogy]

What we have, in my opinion, is a series of reflections, within reflections, within reflections, within reflections. That is infinity. Every focusing of this infinite power results in distortion, which reflexively creates a whole plethora of other distortions to support the first distortion. Everything affects everything, because oneness cannot become other than oneness except in illusory perception. It's holographic. Every seeming "piece" contains the Whole within it.

All potential experiences are enfolded in the octave density, which is pure spirit, or intelligent infinity. Beingness.

Densities represent different "types" of experiences within that infinity. The structure of 7 being repeated from the macrocosm to microcosm in structure and experience. So in the next octave, the densities will have a similar structure. There will be a red ray involving survival/physical experiences, there will be an orange ray involving personal/growth experiences, and so on up the rays.

So I agree with Unbound, that the densities are "within" each other. The formless and intangible and infinitely unquantifiable is the container for the progressively more defined and tangible manifestations as the energy gradually steps down to more and more quantifiable discrete manifestations of energy (i.e. physical matter).

The densities are not created to get anywhere, in my opinion. We are already all things, infinite power, infinite perfection. The densities occur because we are, as infinite intelligence, *creative energy incarnate* so to speak. The nature of Beingness, as creator, is to *create*.

Another way of saying this is: white light is beautiful, but that same white light passed through a prism which creates the 7 colors is also beautiful. It is beautiful to appreciate colors in their separation. Colors contrasted with other colors maintain and enrich the infinite diversity and perfection of the creator. That is, after all, the great hallmark of an infinite creator: variety.

And we couldn't enjoy the sublime ecstasy of remembering, or reunifying, with our own essential nature if we didn't focus on the illusion of something different than that. So the densities provide an experience of growth, not for what the growth will net us, for the experience of growth itself.

Ignorance gives enlightenment a contrasting backdrop. Gives it meaning.

It is a one of a kind soul journey. Everything is a story in the universal consciousness. A neverending story.

[AnthroHeart]

We already exist simultaneously in all octaves.
I hope in "future" octaves there isn't a defiant density where we have to be defiant. I had a bad psychedelic experience about a defiant octave being the next one.

[dreamliner]

Considering that even Ra entities (that is, a group whose minds are basically 2.5 billion years ahead of human mind) do not know even 7th density fully, I guess one can not penetrate/grasp such concepts with chemical human brain.

[Fastidious Emanations]

39.9 Questioner: I see. “The Nine” describe themselves as the “nine principals of God.”* Can you tell me what they mean by that?

Ra: I am Ra. This is also a veiled statement. The attempt is made to indicate that the nine who sit upon the Council are those representing the Creator, the One Creator, just as there may be nine witnesses in a courtroom testifying for one defendant. The term principal has this meaning also.

The desire of the scribe may be seen in much of this material to have affected the manner of its presentation just as the abilities and preferences of this group determine the nature of this contact. The difference lies in the fact that we are as we are. Thus we may either speak as we will or not speak at all. This demands a very tuned, shall we say, group.

 

7.9 Questioner: I have a question here, I believe, about that Council from Jim. Who are the members, and how does the Council function?
Ra: I am Ra. The members of the Council are representatives from the Confederation and from those vibratory levels of your inner planes bearing responsibility for your third density. The names are not important because there are no names. Your mind/body/spirit complexes request names and so, in many cases, the vibratory sound complexes which are consonant with the vibratory distortions of each entity are used. However, the name concept is not part of the Council. If names are requested, we will attempt them. However, not all have chosen names.

In number, the Council that sits in constant session, though varying in its members by means of balancing, which takes place, what you would call irregularly, is nine. That is the Session Council. To back up this Council, there are twenty-four entities which offer their services as requested. These entities faithfully watch and have been called the Guardians.

The Council operates by means of, what you would call, telepathic contact with the oneness or unity of the nine, the distortions blending harmoniously so that the Law of One prevails with ease. When a need for thought is present, the Council retains the distortion-complex of this need, balancing it as described, and then recommends what it considers as appropriate action. This includes: One, the duty of admitting social memory complexes to the Confederation; Two, offering aid to those who are unsure how to aid the social memory complex requesting aid in a way consonant with both the call, the Law, and the number of those calling (that is to say, sometimes the resistance of the call); Three, internal questions in the Council are determined.

These are the prominent duties of the Council. They are, if in any doubt, able to contact the twenty-four who then offer consensus/judgment/thinking to the Council. The Council then may reconsider any question.

9.4 Questioner: The way I understand the process of evolution [of a] planetary population is that [a] population has a certain amount of time to progress. This is generally divided into three 25,000-year cycles. At the end of 75,000 years the planet progresses itself. What caused this situation to come about… preciseness of the years, 25,000 years, etc.? What set this up to begin with?
Ra: I am Ra. Visualize, if you will, the particular energy which, outward flowing and inward coagulating, formed the tiny realm of the creation governed by your Council of Saturn. Continue seeing the rhythm of this process. The living flow creates a rhythm which is as inevitable as one of your timepieces. Each of your planetary entities began the first cycle when the energy nexus was able in that environment to support such mind/body experiences. Thus, each of your planetary entities is on a different cyclical schedule as you might call it. The timing of these cycles is a measurement equal to a portion of intelligent energy.

This intelligent energy offers a type of clock. The cycles move as precisely as a clock strikes your hour. Thus, the gateway from intelligent energy to intelligent infinity opens regardless of circumstance on the striking of the hour.

6.8 Questioner: Where is this Council located?
Ra: This Council is located in the octave, or eight[h] dimension, of the planet Saturn, taking its place in an area which you understand in third-dimensional terms as the rings.

This Math May be Useful for Understanding the Relations

8.1 Questioner: I have a question about [what] I call the advertising of the Confederation. It has to do with free will. There have been certain contacts allowed, as I understand, by the Council, but this is limited because of free will of those who are not oriented in such a way that they could maybe want contact. This material that we are doing now will be disseminated. Dissemination of this material will be dependent upon the wants of [a] relatively small number of people on the planet. Many people on the planet now want this material, but even though we disseminate it they will not be aware it is available. Is there any possibility of creating some effect which I would call advertising, or is this against the principle of free will?
Ra: I am Ra. Consider, if you will, the path your life-experience complex has taken. Consider the coincidences and odd circumstances by which one thing flowed to the next. Consider this well.

Each entity will receive the opportunity that each needs. This information source-beingness does not have uses in the life-experience complex of each of those among your peoples who seek. Thus the advertisement is general and not designed to indicate the searching out of any particular material, but only to suggest the noumenal aspect of the illusion.

 

[Unbound]

I have found it helpful to simplify the whole thing and suggest that there is actually only one, unified octave that contains all possible octaves. When you go to the "next" octave, you're not leaving anything behind or going somewhere that is elsewhere, you're just tapping in to the next degree of freedom of possibilities. There only needs to be one actual octave structure to accommodate all octaves.

[Unbound]

As Ra says, infinity can only be defined or referenced by unity, and so anything otherwise is manyness, and not infinite.

[Fastidious Emanations]

"In a boundary is the possibility of infinite division. And thus infinities and finite structures are complementary." -Nasseim in that video clip.
This to me is a wonderful description of 1st/ 8th density.
Remember that Ra is a late sixth density complex if I assume correctly they are actually viewing creation from that perspective.
They are seeking still, remember.

I don't think that these ideas imply many-ness I think that they Basically aim to photograph that which is the underlying living energy system that 'creates' octaves.
I say a snapshot because it is also entirely perspective based.
I honestly think that the catalyst of 3D is actually necessary to find these results mathematically.
Read on and you may find that these mathematical systems (Ra's system of octaves and this vortex based math system of 9) are complementary.

Again though my signature stands and I am open to the ebb and flow.
all is well

[Plenum]

Considering that even Ra entities (that is, a group whose minds are basically 2.5 billion years ahead of human mind) do not know even 7th density fully, I guess one can not penetrate/grasp such concepts with chemical human brain.

yes, I think it's the case that we get the physical vehicle that is perfectly suited to comprehend the density in which it finds itself.

So the vast majority of humans have a 3d physical vehicle to enjoy the fruits of the experience here; with the exception of dual activated individuals who also have a 4d body active because they have arrived early, and can make use of the present 4d vibrations, which is their native home.

but how does a dual activated individual experience their reality quite exactly?  a firmer sense of knowing?  never ever feeling disconnected from a source of connective 4d love?  They can definitely draw upon innate memory.

[Diana]

It must be considered that Source is evolving, too. It follows that as we evolve and add to the all, Source—the all—evolves.

So if Source is evolving, there would be no end point.

[Minyatur]

It must be considered that Source is evolving, too. It follows that as we evolve and add to the all, Source—the all—evolves.

So if Source is evolving, there would be no end point.

I don't think the Source evolves, the Source is infinite. Evolution seems more like a process of finite things reaching infinity by living close to infinity. I view the source as a comon higher self to all our higher selves.

[anagogy]

It must be considered that Source is evolving, too. It follows that as we evolve and add to the all, Source—the all—evolves.

So if Source is evolving, there would be no end point.

I don't think the Source evolves, the Source is infinite. Evolution seems more like a process of finite things reaching infinity by living close to infinity. I view the source as a comon higher self to all our higher selves.

I agree with you, Minyatur.  The ultimate source, as infinity, does not evolve.  It knows all, is all, and has all power.  It knows all probable paths of evolution, and this perfectly accurate knowing, which redounds to the very minutest depths of conceptualization, we confuse as our experience of reality.  All experiences are enfolded in the One.

Evolution is a valuable experience, not for what it will net us, but simply for the experience of evolution itself.  Growth is a very satisfying experience.

Source is like the mouth of the river of consciousness that has view of the whole system from the source to the river, and eventual return point.  Because of our identification with a specific place along the stream of consciousness, our perspective is limited to a certain specific place in the stream.  The perspective is much different from the source, which contains the perspective of the interrelated whole flow of consciousness.