Traps of Enlightenment - A Good Zen-Themed Lecture

[native]

http://youtu.be/oJixbi1QrKo

I recently came across Adyashanti, and he's pretty good at explaining concepts. The video starts off quite separative, but he makes some great points throughout the video.

A conclusion I came to myself and one of the things he discusses, is the trap of belief and the need to seek comfort and agreement in spiritual groups. There is of course nothing wrong with belief, otherwise there would be no progression in consciousness, but the idea is that our beliefs can create perceptual boundaries between ourselves and others during interaction. We can be so firmly rooted in our opinions, general or spiritual, that during interaction or when looking outward at the world, we are only focused on how the other is supposedly wrong or doesn't get it, when in reality we are all born into darkness. Afterall, one of the main things that is always being discussed in any spiritual gathering is how others are asleep. And so, the consciousness of most spiritual people is actually focused on separation rather than unity. 94.12 "..negative interpretations of catalyst."

So the purpose of enlightenment (polarization), is to bring you to a place where in all interaction you experience yourself in the other. We all know this but I don't think it's said enough. He discusses this in various forms in the video. When you can get to a place where you regularly see yourself, you are becoming radiant. Rather than reacting to and attempting to conform catalyst in your own image, you begin to enter that humble state where you're able to help in a manner more appropriate to the other's needs and state of consciousness..which often means little to no advice at all.

[Plenum]

So the purpose of enlightenment (polarization), is to bring you to a place where in all interaction you experience yourself in the other.

... you begin to enter that humble state where you're able to help in a manner more appropriate to the other's needs and state of consciousness..which often means little to no advice at all.

yes Icaro, a good point.

let me try to explain how I experience this particular phenomena from my perspective.

as one progresses, one becomes more explicitly cognisant of certain understandings. These understandings (I believe) are universally applicable, or at least very generally applicable to those undergoing a similiar level experience (humans incarnate in a 3d body on planet earth for eg).

these 'generalised understandings' have to do with the mind and the mind's interaction with the chakra system. As these understandings grow, and one clears more of one's own blockages (blockages which are quite often very common, or due to societal forces), one then becomes very able to recognise when those blockages are present in others.

this 'knowledge' of having cleared one's own blockages then provides esquisite context in understanding the state of mind of the other and what they are experiencing in dealing with their own blockage. It is not necessarily a one-to-one correspondance, but there are enough giveaways in their behaviours and the words they use to describe what they are experiencing for you to make a very good estimate of where they are at.

and with experience, one becomes very aware of when they are ready to hear a story of your own experience, or there is a potential window for offering 'advice' (I hesitate to even use that word; the more appropriate term would be more along the lines of empathetic understanding or communion with the others' condition).

and as you say, sometimes the most appropriate response is to say nothing at all; even if there is an explicit request for information or guidance (ie the conscious calling is not actually sincere or coming from a deep place in which a response from you would actually be of aid or lasting benefit).

of course, all these are moment by moment assessments, and deeply informed by a sensitive intuition.

I know the topic of appropriate and non-infringing service is of some interest to you Icaro (its been raised a few times in the past) and I've found this particular quote to be of some succor when navigating this area:

18.6 T
Thus, what would be an improper distortion with one entity is proper with another.

We can suggest an attempt to become aware of the other-self as self and thus do that action which is needed by other-self, understanding from the other-self’s intelligence and awareness.

In many cases this does not involve the breaking of the distortion of free will into a distortion or fragmentation called infringement.

However, it is a delicate matter to be of service, and compassion, sensitivity, and an ability to empathize are helpful in avoiding the distortions of man-made intelligence and awareness.

...

and you have one infinitely subtle and various set of distortions of which you may be aware; that is, distortions with respect to self and other-selves not concerning free will but concerning harmonious relationships and service to others as other-selves would most benefit.

I can only say that this 'sensitivity' increases over time as one removes and addresses one's own blockages in a heartfelt way.

one can then empathise in the most direct way.

[zenmaster]

So the purpose of enlightenment (polarization), is to bring you to a place where in all interaction you experience yourself in the other. We all know this but I don't think it's said enough. He discusses this in various forms in the video. When you can get to a place where you regularly see yourself, you are becoming radiant. Rather than reacting to and attempting to conform catalyst in your own image, you begin to enter that humble state where you're able to help in a manner more appropriate to the other's needs and state of consciousness..which often means little to no advice at all.

That's after a certain degree of polarization, but I wouldn't say it's the purpose. (see what I did there)

[native]

plenum - All good points. I had that quote in mind when writing this thread, and my thoughts are also based on experience. Ra's comments on natural and man-made intelligence have always interested me. From my own experience, what I see around me, and also in spiritual groups, when people begin waking up there is the urge to bring others up to your understanding, rather than empathizing as you say. Knowledge can be tricky because the more of it you gain, the more so-called fallacy you're able to see around you, which can support feelings of separation in the sense that others aren't where you are in terms of understanding. But those are absurd thoughts, because we aren't born awake. So when we encounter someone who is so-called uninformed, rather than realizing we're encountering what we could call a past aspect of self, seeing the unity, we only see separation and attempt to guide others too much, without keeping in mind that much of our own learning was sought out by ourselves rather than having guiding figures pointing out our mistakes (excluding parents ).

So man-made intelligence seems to be a reference to this quickness of mind and the intellect attempting to rationalize situations, rather than thinking with the heart so to speak. You made similar points, but I wanted to make the point about how the mind creates separation. I've also theorized that when Ra mentions learning about natural laws, that they're simply referring to learning about the patterns of mind, body, and spirit in terms of our interactions with each other.

"The gate to intelligent infinity can only be opened when an understanding of the in-streamings of intelligent energy are opened unto the healer. These are the so-called Natural Laws of your local space/time continuum and its web of electromagnetic sources or nexi of in-streaming energy."

So you could view each person as a source of energy, and we collectively make up a web on its surface which has a natural rhythm (Love/Light). In our spiritual infancy, everything is rather chaotic and doesn't make much sense. As one develops compassion and understanding, while also seeking out spiritual understandings, we're tuning into that natural rhythm, the expression of this Logos. I like to think of it as a web of energy around Earth that has a certain pattern which moves and flows. Initially our perceptions embody a pattern that doesn't match up with the natural pattern. As we progress, the two begin to align, able to channel intelligent energy with little distortion. So this requires getting yourself out of the way, allowing the other to express themselves, to feel and think what they like, rather than attempting to control experience too much.

"The precision with which each energy center matches the Original Thought lies not in the systematic placement of each energy nexus but rather in the fluid and plastic placement of the balanced blending of these energy centers in such a way that intelligent energy is able to channel itself with minimal distortion."

zenmaster - Yes I see that. Enlightenment doesn't necessarily have a purpose beyond freeing your own self, or in the sense that it has no function other than paving the way for direct experience, but that state of consciousness is apparently a service which serves a purpose metaphysically. "..thus making contact with intelligent infinity and dissolving all illusions. Service-to-others is automatic at the released energy generated by this state of consciousness." I know what you're trying to say though.