might be triggering /harm to the body and ascencion

[Oceania]

this is about intentional harm to the body. if you have personal issues with this or think you might be triggered please do not read. i don't want to trigger anybody with this. and Gemini please don't read this, i want you to stay in a good space. i mean my post isn't that bad but you're very sensitive right now and i know when i'm sensitive reading some things upsets me a lot so i'm just saying i love you and i hope you don't read it if you're feeling sensitive or might be affected by it.
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ok so harm to the body not in the form of toxins but injuries. how does that go over with the ascencion?

because if i have to give up alcohol and valium, i might have to resort to other means of keeping calm. and i don't want talk about vitamins and yoga. i mean i'm trying to get my hands on vitamins and do qi gong but i still want to talk about this hypothetically. which worse? alcohol and pills or injuries to the body?

also, what about non additive tobacco or organic tobacco? is that as poisonous? it would be just for the occasion of need, not constant.

i want this discussion to be solely about this and nothing more. not alternative help, just this. in spiritual terms, how does it affect one's harvestability to injure the body physically on purpose, or to smoke pure tobacco. any thoughts? are these viable options? if this subject is too controversial or people just can't handle it without the whole stigma thing then maybe it was a mistake to start the thread. i dunno. people always freak out about this subject. as if it's any different to other things out there. to me at least cutting and such doesn't leave behind toxins. to me it should be the least damaging. but as i read it might leave auric holes to the body. i don't know if it's ok.

i hope if anyone responds they will stick to the topic and not start preaching. i just want to talk about the spiritual LOO related viability in a neutral hypothetical way.

[Cyan]

My experience is that harming the body does not influence your harvestability in a major way. IT does, however, influence how your guides act towadrs you. A few times after i self cut, alone, with no one seeing, 2 of my friends entirely randomly popped up with a big bag of weed and told me they dont understand why someone would want to harm themselves in this world and even though i had long pants on at one point the cuts were showing as if someone had rolled up by pants leg and i dint notice it (fat fraking chance of that).

That stopped my self mutilation cold in its track. After being told by 2 angels to stop doing it at point blank and telling me that they can see me doing it even if they are not in the same room adn they will treat me like a douche if i keep doing it because they dont understand why I do it and thus have to assume that I want an increase in painful catalyst. (pointing it out is intensly painful as you are aware)

But, the resulting experience was the closest i've been to ascending to a state with no other self. (it wasnt death as i would think of it but it was clearly indicated that if i wanted to, i could just stand up and walk out of my appartment with them and within 10-20 steps i'd be in some other planet doing some other thing, if that really hurts me so bad to stay here). But I refused, I'm near certain that after this incarnation I'll go for solitude instead of company for a very VERY long period of time, so what they offered wasnt really a... option.

Nothing like putting a person who has trouble loving and accepting themselves and some history self harm to a position where they are told they can walk into another world where they would be considered a hero (there is always a world such as that because there is always a place where what you are doing now is insanely difficult and respected).

Edit: this is what I mean by "guides paying attention" This is on the first or one of the very first pages of the site i visit, and Dr, house is kind of "me" in a way. Being a healer with a pain killer addiction and a busted knee and a superiority complex:

(the version I saw was black and white but i found this online since i dont link to sites i visit)

[Oceania]

thanks for your input Cyan.

i love House lol.

[BrownEye]

Physical injuries do not directly affect the DNA in the way that ingesting substances do.

injure the body physically on purpose

The damaging concept here is the lack of respect for your higher self. Which translates down to the self you are at the moment. What you do now is either aligned or not with your higher purpose. Self respect is important in more ways than one.

It's no coincidence that the slogan "be all that you can be" is hidden in the most violent and backpedaling form of service.

[Oceania]

what do you mean by hidden in the most violent service?

[BrownEye]

The military killing machine. The focus is not much more than being an animal.

[reeay]

injure the body physically on purpose

The damaging concept here is the lack of respect for your higher self. Which translates down to the self you are at the moment. What you do now is either aligned or not with your higher purpose.

Is this something your higher self taught you?

[Cyan]

injure the body physically on purpose

The damaging concept here is the lack of respect for your higher self. Which translates down to the self you are at the moment. What you do now is either aligned or not with your higher purpose.

Is this something your higher self taught you?

What my "higher self" taught me is that there is no way, i could ever be against its will.

[Aaron]

Harvestability is gauged by the amount of undistorted white light of the Creator that you as an entity can take into yourself and use comfortably. Ra says that harvest from third to fourth requires the kundalini reaching and penetrating the green ray, and a certain balance among the rays. (balance is more important than activation)

So if the inner locus/meeting point of intelligent energy and intelligent infinity has reached the green ray, and the entity is exploring distortions of "universal love and radiance of being", then of course they would be able to handle 4th density light. Also, if the entity is in a state of at least "51 percent dedication to the welfare of other-selves" then of course their green ray would be penetrated.

I don't think that the actions that you describe of inflicting self harm would in-and-of-themselves signal harvestability or not. Harvestability is not defined or determined by anything one does or does not do. I think that, broadly, self-harming actions are manifestations of issues and blockages within the lower rays, specifically red and orange. So it's entirely possible that they could indicate a state that is unharvestable if the struggle with these issues is continuous and woven into the life experience. But I don't think it's definitive in all circumstances. I also think these issues could be preincarnatively planned.

"because if i have to give up alcohol and valium, i might have to resort to other means of keeping calm." I laughed so hard at that by the way... Such a characteristic statement! This brings to mind the usage of substances/drugs as a crutch to gain a greater awareness or more "balanced" state of being without doing the preliminary work. However, it's important to take into consideration that many wanderers may take up substance use as a result/reaction to the disharmonious planetary vibration, and to the seeming separation from truth and love/the Creator... like a coping mechanism. A wanderer I know went through a period of life where they were using drugs in order to get to a place/state where they could easily be of service because all the stress and pain that prevented such service fell away during the usage.

Regarding self abuse with alcohol vs. a knife... I don't think one could be said to be "worse" than the other. But I do think one is more direct/physical, and the other less direct. It's true that cutting doesn't leave behind toxins, but it's more immediately damaging. And while it's possible to drink responsibly, I don't think it's possible to cut one's self responsibly.

Regarding tobacco, I feel it's along the same lines as what one chooses to consume foodwise. If it's a substance you're putting into your body, respect for the self is key. This can also be expressed as respect for the substance, like the native Americans typically held for that substance.

Can you expand upon what you meant by "are these viable options?" and "LOO related viability"?

[zenmaster]

how does it affect one's harvestability to injure the body physically on purpose, or to smoke pure tobacco. any thoughts?

Harvestability is an ability to accept a certain vibration, regardless of currently chosen catalyst. One's "violet ray" determines this ability. "violet ray" is not only not circumstantial, it's the sum-total of what you have balanced in all of your lifetimes.

If balancing opportunities are denied, that will surely affect ability to polarize in this lifetime.

[Cyan]

Your body only has a noticable lack of the vital mineral and nutrients called whiskey and valium.



No but really. If you look at it from a chemical standpoint (rememeber, all chemicals are eventually the same as the energies they correspond to).

If you really REALLy want to know whats up (I dont recommend this in general because it tends to have severly deleterious effects for months and or years.) But if you have struggled with this for a lifetime it is, perhaps, one of the least painful and bloody ways.

Read up on biochemistry and make a general chart of all the transmitters in your body that are biologically active ( Example. Both LSD and say Weed influence serotonin but their way of influencing it is different. LSD stays on the neurotransmitter and only becomes "active" once it disintegrates from the receptorsite, while weed uses the cannabinoid receptor but what you notice is an increase in serotonin + one of the usual chemical effects).

Such a indepth study of how they would, at least on paper, influence your biochemistry combined with finding legal mild potency alternatives for them. Such as ordering various foods or herbs that you know in large quantities simulate the efects desired.

Then just putting yourself on a general detox plan and using one herb at a time for several attempts and seeing if the affect is what you wanted. On and on and cataloguing your experiences in detail.

Since, there is so much more to life than just "relaxed/unrelaxed" but rather, the energies associated with relaxation on a chemical level are not understood. some people relax automatically when sober, some people sharpen up.

Once you figure out what your balance is by using the low potency legal versions. Then figure out how to boost that particular neurotransmitter group naturally and healtihy for an extended period of time.

After that is established, then you can definitevly say that, for example "my body has a definite lack of Gaba production"

After taht its just a matter of finding out why, which is usually uninteresting (a combination of past choices and reactions + environment + pre-incarnative and what not).

Most people seem to not get that you can use willpower in at least two ways.

Sit on your bum and will something to happen intentionally (meditation/magic)

Or

Figure out through the external apparatus what is bothering you by utilizing findings others have made.

Both utilize willpower just as much and develop it as well.

Willing your body to walk to the store and buy something like ginger root is not that different from willing your spirit to go around your head looking for the right switches to pull.

Except that its easier to track when you last ate ginger root than it is to "when did i last pull that imaginary switch X Y Z 4020"

[Monica]

ok so harm to the body not in the form of toxins but injuries. how does that go over with the ascencion?

I don't know the answer to your question, Oceania, but I can share my own experience with this. For about 10 years (some years back) I had a lot of stress in my life, and when I got maxed out I would start literally pulling out my hair and scratching my face, arms, legs or chest. I never did any cutting or anything like that, and I never actually pulled out any hair, but I would dig in my nails until I bled, and I still have a number of scars from it.

I too tried to breathe through it, but I wasn't successful.

There were 2 things that got me through this difficult time: Suppressing the emotions and expressing the emotions.

I would put any sort of drug (Valium, etc.), natural mood enhancer (cannabis, organic tobacco), alcohol, etc all in the category of 'suppressing the emotion.'

For me, my drug of choice was wine, whole grain bread and cheese. They didn't work alone but together they worked wonders! Within 10 minutes I'd be taken to the Land of Nod, and could fall asleep shortly thereafter. It was a great suppressor! The only problem was that I put on weight, not so much because of the fat in the cheese, but because of the emotions suppressed (in my case).

And, it only postponed the inevitable. All those suppressed emotions just kept piling up.

A few times, I chose to express the intense emotions instead of suppressing them. How to do that harmlessly? By hitting a pillow or punching bag, or, in my case, throwing dishes!

I never used glass - too much of a mess to clean up. But stoneware plates and cups worked quite nicely. Minimal mess, but oh so effective! Throwing 5 or 6 plates in succession, with all my might, just crashing them onto the patio and hearing them smash, was a great release! And infinitely preferable to scratching up my face.

So, having done both suppressing and expressing, I'd say expressing was far less harmful to me, both physically and spiritually. Provided it was done in a harmless way and the only thing I was hurting was an inanimate object, throwing dishes allowed me to get the feelings out, instead of accumulating. I felt much better afterwards, because the intensity of my emotions had been defused. When feelings are suppressed, they tend to just accumulate and must still be dealt with at some later date.

I usually had a good cry after throwing dishes. Very important to let the tears flow! An acupuncturist once told me that "a single tear is worth 1000 needles." Tears can cleanse away the pain. But, it's helpful to do a meditation or positive affirmation after the tears cease.

I'm now past that phase of my life, thankfully, but I am still discovering more layers of old emotions, accumulated in my cells, that I still have to deal with. So, in retrospect, I wish I had thrown more dishes!

Some people accomplish the same thing by hitting a punching bag or pillow. But I never liked punching much.

I don't think either approach was necessarily 'bad' for me spiritually or affected my polarity, but when I look at the scars I still carry from the times I scratched myself, I'm amazed that I did that. Those scars were much more damaging to me physically and emotionally than drinking wine or throwing dishes.

You mentioned 2 options: drugs or harming self. I don't really know which is better, between those 2. It might depend on how much the drugs cloud your mental clarity, since you might want to really stay awake right now. Based on my own personal experience, I'd suggest a 3rd alternative: physically letting out the tension in a harmless way. When you feel the urge to harm self, grab a plate and run outside and smash it on the patio, or start hitting your pillow instead.

I actually bought some cheap plates from Wal-Mart for this express purpose!

HUGS and Blessings to you Oceania! Sending lots of love your way! I've been there and I know what you're going through.

[BrownEye]

Is this something your higher self taught you?

No. Just because you are connected to your higher self does not mean you are your higher self. Distillation is described in the LOO meaning that a lot will be cleaned away from what is usable.

Your higher self is what you may evolve to, or not, depending on how much free will you utilize, and what is done with that free will.

I have only recently looked into what is involved with my higher self, after finding that my HS is in my space a lot recently. In the beginning I could not even connect to my higher self. So it is a surprise to find all of this attention going on.

---

Harvestability is an ability to accept a certain vibration,

Exactly the point.

[reeay]

You mentioned that self-harm is disrespect to higher self. That does not make sense.

Edit: You said 'lack of respect' not disrespect.

[AnthroHeart]

Thanks for the warning Oceania. I elected not to read. Hope things are looking up for you.

[zenmaster]

.....

[Tenet Nosce]

Harvestability is gauged by the amount of undistorted white light of the Creator that you as an entity can take into yourself and use comfortably. Ra says that harvest from third to fourth requires the kundalini reaching and penetrating the green ray, and a certain balance among the rays. (balance is more important than activation)

So if the inner locus/meeting point of intelligent energy and intelligent infinity has reached the green ray, and the entity is exploring distortions of "universal love and radiance of being", then of course they would be able to handle 4th density light. Also, if the entity is in a state of at least "51 percent dedication to the welfare of other-selves" then of course their green ray would be penetrated.

Well said!

I would add that polarization- and thus harvestability- occurs in response to the alignment of the mind. It doesn't have anything directly to do with actions taken by the body- towards other bodies or towards itself. However, the alignment of the mind (or lack thereof) would certainly impact an person's relationship to their body.

That being said, a very high degree of alignment - and thus polarization- much more than is needed for graduation- would likely preclude the use of self-harm as a coping mechanism.

Nevertheless, for one who wishes to use the catalyst of self-harm in order to polarize, it would be well to seek the love in the moment.

The catalytic mechanisms are dependent, not upon the chosen polarity of a mind/body/spirit complex, but upon the use or purpose to which this catalysis is put.

The only way that alcohol, valium, and tobacco could permanently hold you back from spiritual growth is if you believe that they can. They are crutches. We all have them. Therefore, if it were necessary to get rid of these in order to progress, we would all be equally screwed.

Rather, it is the other way around. Eventually we will progress to the point where we no longer use crutches. In the meantime, the question is whether you feel that you require any of these substances to authentically express yourself. My guess is no, you don't.

[zenmaster]

I would add that polarization- and thus harvestability- occurs in response to the alignment of the mind.

I believe it's actually a spiritual concept, not one of mind - hence violet ray. The mind is what provides the opportunity to polarize when using the body, however.

[Tenet Nosce]

I would add that polarization- and thus harvestability- occurs in response to the alignment of the mind.

I believe it's actually a spiritual concept, not one of mind - hence violet ray. The mind is what provides the opportunity to polarize when using the body, however.

Yes, that is more correct.

[Monica]

The only way that alcohol, valium, and tobacco could permanently hold you back from spiritual growth is if you believe that they can. They are crutches. We all have them. Therefore, if it were necessary to get rid of these in order to progress, we would all be equally screwed.

Rather, it is the other way around. Eventually we will progress to the point where we no longer use crutches. In the meantime, the question is whether you feel that you require any of these substances to authentically express yourself. My guess is no, you don't.

I think crutches do affect our spiritual growth in the sense that they can delay utilization of catalyst. But, sometimes we need to delay it! Sometimes we are in overwhelm after taking on too much, and crutches can give us a breather.

Sometimes the lesson is to know when to take a break!

I was very grateful to have crutches available when I needed them. I did need them at the time.

---

If given a choice between a pharmaceutical drug and a natural plant, I think the natural plant would be preferable (assuming it was effective in getting the desired result).

[Plenum]

I don't know the answer to your question, Oceania, but I can share my own experience with this. For about 10 years (some years back) I had a lot of stress in my life, and when I got maxed out I would start literally pulling out my hair and scratching my face, arms, legs or chest. I never did any cutting or anything like that, and I never actually pulled out any hair, but I would dig in my nails until I bled, and I still have a number of scars from it.

I too tried to breathe through it, but I wasn't successful.

There were 2 things that got me through this difficult time: Suppressing the emotions and expressing the emotions.

I would put any sort of drug (Valium, etc.), natural mood enhancer (cannabis, organic tobacco), alcohol, etc all in the category of 'suppressing the emotion.'

For me, my drug of choice was wine, whole grain bread and cheese. They didn't work alone but together they worked wonders! Within 10 minutes I'd be taken to the Land of Nod, and could fall asleep shortly thereafter. It was a great suppressor! The only problem was that I put on weight, not so much because of the fat in the cheese, but because of the emotions suppressed (in my case).

And, it only postponed the inevitable. All those suppressed emotions just kept piling up.

A few times, I chose to express the intense emotions instead of suppressing them. How to do that harmlessly? By hitting a pillow or punching bag, or, in my case, throwing dishes!

I never used glass - too much of a mess to clean up. But stoneware plates and cups worked quite nicely. Minimal mess, but oh so effective! Throwing 5 or 6 plates in succession, with all my might, just crashing them onto the patio and hearing them smash, was a great release! And infinitely preferable to scratching up my face.

So, having done both suppressing and expressing, I'd say expressing was far less harmful to me, both physically and spiritually. Provided it was done in a harmless way and the only thing I was hurting was an inanimate object, throwing dishes allowed me to get the feelings out, instead of accumulating. I felt much better afterwards, because the intensity of my emotions had been defused. When feelings are suppressed, they tend to just accumulate and must still be dealt with at some later date.

I usually had a good cry after throwing dishes. Very important to let the tears flow! An acupuncturist once told me that "a single tear is worth 1000 needles." Tears can cleanse away the pain. But, it's helpful to do a meditation or positive affirmation after the tears cease.

I'm now past that phase of my life, thankfully, but I am still discovering more layers of old emotions, accumulated in my cells, that I still have to deal with. So, in retrospect, I wish I had thrown more dishes!

Some people accomplish the same thing by hitting a punching bag or pillow. But I never liked punching much.

I don't think either approach was necessarily 'bad' for me spiritually or affected my polarity, but when I look at the scars I still carry from the times I scratched myself, I'm amazed that I did that. Those scars were much more damaging to me physically and emotionally than drinking wine or throwing dishes.

You mentioned 2 options: drugs or harming self. I don't really know which is better, between those 2. It might depend on how much the drugs cloud your mental clarity, since you might want to really stay awake right now. Based on my own personal experience, I'd suggest a 3rd alternative: physically letting out the tension in a harmless way. When you feel the urge to harm self, grab a plate and run outside and smash it on the patio, or start hitting your pillow instead.

I actually bought some cheap plates from Wal-Mart for this express purpose!

HUGS and Blessings to you Oceania! Sending lots of love your way! I've been there and I know what you're going through.

thanks for posting Monica.

Your honesty and self-expression is most refreshing to see.