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Law of One shouldn't become religion - Cainite - 05-01-2019
I've noticed some otherselves accepting their interpretation (maybe sometimes the initial one) of the Ra material without much questioning.. because Ra has to be right? u know.. other entities that seem knowledgeable or wise or whatever agree so too. so et's make it a religion!
Buddhism is very good I think.. but it became like religion.. kind of official. and that may have dumbed it down a bit.
People think dalai lama is one of the greatest adepts.. because he has authority. even people who are kinda aware of titles being empty do have such beliefs.
U know, if Buddhism hadn't become the official truth, they would eventually rethink the whole reincarnation of a human as an animal thing.. seriously.
If we accept our understandings blindly the same thing will happen to our ''Ra Material''.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Cainite - 05-01-2019
Also, Ra and other SMCs are seeing earth from outside. this we can't possibly do.. let's not pretend that we can. or is that enlightenment?
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - speedforce131 - 05-01-2019
Law of One is similar to Taoism in that it is learning about the way of life with the added component of belief in God however the description of God is not too dissimilar to Taoism. Law of One is not a religion but it can support one seamlessly whether you are a Christian, Muslim, etc. If you combine all of the religions, even including LOO, they all have a common theme anyways. Now it's just up to the rest of the world to realize that.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Cainite - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 03:52 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: Law of One is similar to Taoism in that it is learning about the way of life with the added component of belief in God however the description of God is not too dissimilar to Taoism. Law of One is not a religion but it can support one seamlessly whether you are a Christian, Muslim, etc. If you combine all of the religions, even including LOO, they all have a common theme anyways. Now it's just up to the rest of the world to realize that.
Yeah, except the god in LOO is ourselves. those religions are changed to make slave out of entities to make them unpolarized and weak they give them this weak and guilty view of self (not being the creator)
But LOO tries to give a worthy view of self to people.. because it hasn't completely become religion (being unknown and all)
Also about the guilt, another thing I've noticed is some LOO seekers telling us it's our fault if we can't accept being wronged or are at times dissatisfied with society.
Are we not allowed to desire good relations and be dissappointed by ones with less quality?
Or should we feel guilty about this natural dissapointment?
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - speedforce131 - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 04:02 AM)Cainite Wrote: Yeah, except the god in LOO is ourselves.
Not necessarily. Ra and other Confederation entities always specifically say the "One Infinite Creator". There is only one. We are co-creators.
https://www.lawofone.info/results.php?c=Cosmology
Quote:those religions are changed to make slave out of entities to make them unpolarized and weak they give them this weak and guilty view of self (not being the creator)
When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.
Quote:Also about the guilt, another thing I've noticed is some LOO seekers telling us it's our fault if we can't accept being wronged or are at times dissatisfied with society.
No it's not our fault that we feel those things but you can try to understand it looking at it from various perspectives. Sometimes you have to realize that you can't change society and that the best thing to do is focus on yourself and your own life.
Quote:Are we not allowed to desire good relations and be dissappointed by ones with less quality?
You're most certainly allowed however it shouldn't bury your own life. The negativity is the catalyst for you to learn from and grow. If you can become wiser as a result of it, you can teach others which can help carve a path to the ideal society. Microcosm of the macrocosm.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - loostudent - 05-01-2019
From my experience there would be a much greater benefit from religions if there wasn't so much monopolistic, sports team fan club and tribal attitude. I also notice how we don't know religions too well.
I am a Christian because I was born and grew up in such a family and environment. It's the closest to my understanding and thinking. In some other environment I could easily be something else. That's why appreaciate also other religions and resources and try to know them and learn from them. And I question things all the time. I don't think blind faith leads to truth. Neither scepticism.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - unity100 - 05-01-2019
You accept what you accept for yourself and follow it properly. If you trust something, you pursue it.
That's the meaning of faith, and things like 'leap of faith' and similar.
Without that, there is no progress on the spiritual path of the adept. But wandering in one direction, and the other, and waddling through mud without moving towards anything.
If you found your truth, hang on to it and follow it.
.......
Beside those, of course there are truths that are valid for everyone. Laws of the universe, physics, cause <-> effect interactions do not change depending on the biases and desires of entities.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - RitaJC - 05-01-2019
I believe becoming a religion can happen to the Ra material as it has happened to many teachings that were revealed as pointers to the TRUTH within, but got misunderstood in a way that made the doctrine more important than honest seeking of the eternal TRUTH = I AM.
But there have always been and still are honest seekers and mystics (gnostics, sufis, universalists, taoists, non-dualists, etc. etc.) that might have started out as adepts of one particular religion but never could stop there. I believe those are the agents of the Creator who have held and are holding the world together in spite of all the seeming confusion and division by their lived awareness of the TRUTH. They are the real heroes and healers quietly doing their part and serving Love = Light = Life. Most of them are never known as persons to people outside their small circle. Such people are part of this community as well. Many of them never post in the forum or do so only rarely and reluctantly.
But the ones making LOO into their religion, a doctrinal system and concerning about the details of concepts, that were important to Don Elkins and reflected in his questions, are doing so out of fear to make a mistake that could cause their condemnation and haven't still awakened to the TRUTH of who they really are and what that means for their human experience. But all of the already awakened ones went through that phase in their human experience. For many of them, it took decades or even (highly possibly) many "lifetimes". So the ones still believing in the reality of the dream are OK as well. They will get there.
Every"body" will. Or, more precisely, has never left the TRUTH
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Nau7ik - 05-01-2019
I don’t often see people treating the LOO as religion. I’ve seen people who spoke out against the LOO because they naively took it to be a religion but then attacked the material for being harmful.
So the real culprit here is immature spirituality. It is the immature minds of man who want an all knowing leader to tell them what to think and to do. They want to place their responsibility in that person.
The Law of One is quite compatible with the major world religions. I see people from all over the spectrum on this forum. I work with the Law of One and the Qabalah. Others work with Theravada Buddhism (the purest form of buddhism, From the Pali cannon; the texts are basically preserved as they were written down) and LOO. Christianity, Islam, even magick and occultism. If we can get to the heart of the religion, then the message is ever and always the same: Love!
The Law of One is not at all limiting, save in the instance of the choice of polarity. But even Ra says that’s wholly our choice, but they are biased to the positive and will only teach the positive.
I don’t see the LOO ever becoming a religion. L/L are very clear on the point that it is not a religion and to not treat it as such! Ra doesn’t speak authoritatively either. There is no dogma. You’re free to take it or leave it! Also very few people can appreciate the Ra Material. It goes over most peoples heads.
I see mainstream religion as a step on the path of spiritual development. Most of us are passed that point; religion is not helpful to me. I am a man of Will and I like to think for myself and make my own choices. I think many of you are also like this. That’s why it won’t ever become a religion: only those who are consciously aware of their spiritual path and wish to accelerate it will be able to appreciate it.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Minyatur - 05-01-2019
I think most times, it is simply that the material offers effective keys to seek yourself. It does not speak of a cosmos and sense of Creatorhood that you are apart of and instead that you contain within yourself and that you can touch. Like the veil of confusion, it is stated to be a layer that can be pierced and so a lot can be touched beyond confusion if you get to just that.
I mostly use quotes either because they word something in a nice way or because the material is the common basis of interaction on this forum. There are things I agree and disagree upon. So what I share mostly always relate to my own seekings, in which I did find my own Ceatorhood, my connection to the Logos, just as awareness of what It is, and the underlying Unity that makes this Universe without paradox and signifies all experience.
I don't see how you can make a religion out of something that tells you to find truth within yourself, or that speaks of things you can interact with or that tells you that you are Creator. It speaks little about blind faith, although to release an ego stuck in despair maybe that is what it takes, but the fool is just one of the archetypes and if you start realizing yourself you can understand the importance of it.
Little in the material is actually new knowledge that cannot be found elsewhere.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Cainite - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 05:35 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.I guess the abrahamic ones are the ones which are not helping the common man.
Buddhism and Taoism are fine. with exception of few things that I don't really like about them.
Buddhism claims to be the path to enlightenment. not recognizing that the monks and generally ppl of earth have trouble graduating to 4D. and enlightenment is beyond that.
What I'm saying is that many of the monks may not be wanderers and at the stage that's suitable for the things they do (way of life)
Some may still even lust for sex! and they suppress it.. That doesn't sound wise or healthy.
Also the uniforms (robes) and the no hair rule they have is unnecessary.
(05-01-2019, 05:35 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: You're most certainly allowed however it shouldn't bury your own life. The negativity is the catalyst for you to learn from and grow. If you can become wiser as a result of it, you can teach others which can help carve a path to the ideal society. Microcosm of the macrocosm.
Well it has. I'm in constant retreat.
I see now that it's my own anger and disappointment at myself for failing to accept things perfectly..
If I feel bad about something it's made worse by that guilt.
But I still believe the smaller half of it is related to things that can't be changed and probably should.
I get into this ''anarchist'' mode automatically at times.
(05-01-2019, 06:03 AM)loostudent Wrote: From my experience there would be a much greater benefit from religions if there wasn't so much monopolistic, sports team fan club and tribal attitude. I also notice how we don't know religions too well.
I am a Christian because I was born and grew up in such a family and environment. It's the closest to my understanding and thinking. In some other environment I could easily be something else. That's why appreaciate also other religions and resources and try to know them and learn from them. And I question things all the time. I don't think blind faith leads to truth. Neither scepticism.
I was always cast out from society so I didn't get to inherit a religion. but I generally think if the humans want to believe something, it's easy for the rulers to plant it in their holy scriptures. they've done this often it seems.
(05-01-2019, 09:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote: It does not speak of a cosmos and sense of Creatorhood that you are apart of and instead that you contain within yourself and that you can touch. Like the veil of confusion, it is stated to be a layer that can be pierced and so a lot can be touched beyond confusion if you get to just that.
That's a very cool thing!
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Minyatur - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 09:10 AM)Nau7ik Wrote: I see mainstream religion as a step on the path of spiritual development. Most of us are passed that point; religion is not helpful to me. I am a man of Will and I like to think for myself and make my own choices. I think many of you are also like this. That’s why it won’t ever become a religion: only those who are consciously aware of their spiritual path and wish to accelerate it will be able to appreciate it.
I also see religion as a gateway toward spirituality.
I always had a notion that we lived in an intelligent design and at some point it was the faith of a christian friend that inspired me to seek to connect deeper with God and this, alongside initiatory experiences, led me to a phase where I sought through Christianity for many years. At some point it was not satisfactory to my thrist of seeking the mystery of existence and I was led to other things, which ended up bringing me to the Law of One and this forum, which from day 1 I felt like would have a place in my life like anything before.
Most of my core beliefs are ones I had during my christian years and that I found echoed in the Ra material in an intelligent manner. I guess because faith is truly the enabler to touch what is. I had a good inner conception of the Octave and manyness of it, of which without the notion of a timeless Source I saw that outside the time and space of our Universe lied a singularity in which infinite big bangs existed in simultaneity. Just the idea that God was the alpha and the omega had me dive deeply into contemplation and many things simply triggered resonance and insights. My conception of the afterlife and heaven was extremely close to the notion of what time/space is. Before having the notion of wanderers I had a deep desire to be something like a prophet, not like that I wanted to work on becoming a prophet, but that I wished I had been born one, a messenger of the heavens and their truths and in some way connecting things with the concept of wanderers I saw that maybe I was and had been born a bridge between Heaven and Earth.
I think I had a lot of luck in that I never felt there was something to fix within myself or the world, my seeking was always driven by sheer curiosity in the mystery of life and existence. The only thing the material really brought me is that I had a distortion of disbelief in reincarnation because of the bible. The material and the notion of the veil allowed me then to pierce the forgetting and connect with my own spirit in a manner I had not yet before then.
I thought to add that oftentimes when sharing may seem as dogma, there is still a kind of desire to want to alleviate another's despair or helplessness regarding something. So it's rarely because it is important to convince and more about helping in the ways that are known. Like I probably focus more on Unity than most in my posts, but that is because I do believe it is the great peace bringer. If I had no faith in that All is Well, and that I have succeeded in turning to it again and again throughout the last years, I would not of share it.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - unity100 - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 11:02 AM)Cainite Wrote:(05-01-2019, 05:35 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.I guess the abrahamic ones are the ones which are not helping the common man.
That's a historically accurate statement:
Abrahamic religions come from the dominant belief systems of the Near East. Which in turn come from two major belief system branches that developed more or less simultaneously in Egypt and Mesopotamia.
In each of these regions religion developed from the root of a priest cult, turning into priest-king, and then god-king. The objective of religion was to legitimize control of the priest-king and establish him as the legitimate proxy of gods, therefore the authority over everyone in that religion.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - AnthroHeart - 05-01-2019
I think I was a monk in a past life when I realized that's not the life for me in this life. I have even studied some martial arts in this life. I used to do wrestling and football in grade school.
I never thought of LOO becoming a religion in the same way that Buddhism isn't a religion.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Billz - 05-01-2019
Everyone is right and everyone is wrong. We are all on our own journey and your perspective will change your opinion and your degree of perception. At any point in your journey, you will be both teacher or student, depending on whom you're talking with and what is needed.
Religion is a mess but is needed by those who are not yet able to see beyond the veil. Faith is part of their journey and belief systems are the foundation upon which faith is built. In most cases, you can't change the belief systems of most people. They simply aren't ready to "see." There are many prophets and sages that have attempted to expound on our reality but have been misunderstood, misquoted and misjudged, some to the extreme.
Ultimately, we must each work out our own belief system upon which we exist. Jesus said work out your faith with fear and trembling. However you say it, as wanderers, we are all searching for the truth that All are One. From the One we came and to the One we will return, some time, some place.
I wish you well in your personal journey for the truth. Afterall, as Fox Mulder said, "The Truth is out there."
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Ixchel - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 03:10 AM)Cainite Wrote: I've noticed some otherselves accepting their interpretation (maybe sometimes the initial one) of the Ra material without much questioning.. because Ra has to be right? u know.. other entities that seem knowledgeable or wise or whatever agree so too. so et's make it a religion!
Buddhism is very good I think.. but it became like religion.. kind of official. and that may have dumbed it down a bit.
People think dalai lama is one of the greatest adepts.. because he has authority. even people who are kinda aware of titles being empty do have such beliefs.
U know, if Buddhism hadn't become the official truth, they would eventually rethink the whole reincarnation of a human as an animal thing.. seriously.
If we accept our understandings blindly the same thing will happen to our ''Ra Material''.
Well, I was in the Law of One, it's made to raise you up and sacrifice your lower tendency. And become one with source of all and use the oneness to unite in the effort against evil and turning this planet into a higher. That's all. The systems outside this world that are light all adhere to the balance of the laws of the one. Because, going outside of, brings chaos and destruction and those societies have already learned that lesson. That's also why we succeed in bringing the atlantean artefacts out and keeping the Law of One. When you sacrifice the lower you truly will raise up. But at the same time you will meet resistance from evil. That's your test. Patience, endurance and discipline are very important.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Ixchel - 05-01-2019
(05-01-2019, 05:30 PM)Ixchel Wrote:(05-01-2019, 03:10 AM)Cainite Wrote: I've noticed some otherselves accepting their interpretation (maybe sometimes the initial one) of the Ra material without much questioning.. because Ra has to be right? u know.. other entities that seem knowledgeable or wise or whatever agree so too. so et's make it a religion!
Buddhism is very good I think.. but it became like religion.. kind of official. and that may have dumbed it down a bit.
People think dalai lama is one of the greatest adepts.. because he has authority. even people who are kinda aware of titles being empty do have such beliefs.
U know, if Buddhism hadn't become the official truth, they would eventually rethink the whole reincarnation of a human as an animal thing.. seriously.
If we accept our understandings blindly the same thing will happen to our ''Ra Material''.
Well, I was in the Law of One, it's made to raise you up and sacrifice your lower tendency. And become one with source of all and use the oneness to unite in the effort against evil and turning this planet into a higher. That's all. The systems outside this world that are light all adhere to the balance of the laws of the one. Because, going outside of, brings chaos and destruction and those societies have already learned that lesson. That's also why we succeed in bringing the atlantean artefacts out and keeping the Law of One. When you sacrifice the lower you truly will raise up. But at the same time you will meet resistance from evil. That's your test. Patience, endurance and discipline are very important.
I'm telling you that you can of course learn if you get through the distortion, and you can when aligned with source. But in my humble opinion you create unnecessary problems, because true learning and climbing higher with source and exstacy are only possible with source. Which is inside of balance. Balance is truly THE key.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - kristina - 05-03-2019
(05-01-2019, 11:02 AM)Cainite Wrote: [quote='speedforce131' pid='260821' dateline='1556703352']I guess the abrahamic ones are the ones which are not helping the common man.
When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.
Buddhism and Taoism are fine. with exception of few things that I don't really like about them.
How do you know that Abrahamic religions are not helping the common man? Every seeker follows his own path to enlightenment and they have as much time as they need to find their personal truths. The start of their guiding principles may begin with this type of religion. I know a lot a good hearted, helping, generous Christians and Jewish people. It's isn't fair to lump people like cattle into concepts like religions. You cannot read or know what is in another's heart. Concepts are not living breathing beings.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Cainite - 05-03-2019
(05-03-2019, 03:05 PM)kristina Wrote:(05-01-2019, 11:02 AM)Cainite Wrote:(05-01-2019, 05:35 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.I guess the abrahamic ones are the ones which are not helping the common man.
Buddhism and Taoism are fine. with exception of few things that I don't really like about them.
How do you know that Abrahamic religions are not helping the common man? Every seeker follows his own path to enlightenment and they have as much time as they need to find their personal truths. The start of their guiding principles may begin with this type of religion. I know a lot a good hearted, helping, generous Christians and Jewish people. It's isn't fair to lump people like cattle into concepts like religions. You cannot read or know what is in another's heart. Concepts are not living breathing beings.
From my vantage point it would look like what I said. because of the holy crusades/jyhads , the separation caused by thinking one's religion is better, the changed parts of the holy books by STS rulers as a means to create passive audiences out of people, etc
Perhaps you're right, I'm not aware of the heart of everyone.. and I don't know as many people as you do personally. what I see may be illusory.
Btw I remember Ra speaking of that one pharaoh who made LOO the official religion. and that didn't go well..
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - loostudent - 05-04-2019
Christianity has helped me a lot. I also know a lot of people with similar experience and even more dramatic life changes to positive ...
As Jesus noted religious ritual alone doesn't help people if it doesn't envolve your heart because this is where bad (and good) deeds actually come from.
And Ra about working with archetypes:
Quote:The intent of the practitioner in working with these powerful concepts determines the polarity of the working. The tools are the tools.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - unity100 - 05-04-2019
(05-03-2019, 03:21 PM)Cainite Wrote: Btw I remember Ra speaking of that one pharaoh who made LOO the official religion. and that didn't go well..
Well you remember wrong. For that was not what they said...
Akhenaton's one god was his and his god foremost. It was not 'we are all one'. It was 'there is one god and im its most beloved follower'.
That exact same motif was copied by abrahamic religions and it continues all the way to islam, where Mohammad is god's most beloved and the '1st' among all.
Even with that, Akhenaton's new religion was at a much higher level spiritually and philosophically than what was there before.
What 'went wrong' with the implementation of that religion has been that the priest caste and entire temple organizations which were profiting from the earlier religion did not want to let go of the profits and riches. Then again, that was one of the reasons why Akhenaton created his religion in a way - to wrest control of religion and the immense riches that flow into temples from the existing priest caste...
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - kristina - 05-04-2019
(05-03-2019, 03:21 PM)Cainite Wrote:(05-03-2019, 03:05 PM)kristina Wrote:(05-01-2019, 11:02 AM)Cainite Wrote:(05-01-2019, 05:35 AM)speedforce131 Wrote: When you say "those religions" you should clarify which one, because Buddhism and Taoism are both uplifiting and very similar to LOO.I guess the abrahamic ones are the ones which are not helping the common man.
Buddhism and Taoism are fine. with exception of few things that I don't really like about them.
How do you know that Abrahamic religions are not helping the common man? Every seeker follows his own path to enlightenment and they have as much time as they need to find their personal truths. The start of their guiding principles may begin with this type of religion. I know a lot a good hearted, helping, generous Christians and Jewish people. It's isn't fair to lump people like cattle into concepts like religions. You cannot read or know what is in another's heart. Concepts are not living breathing beings.
From my vantage point it would look like what I said. because of the holy crusades/jyhads , the separation caused by thinking one's religion is better, the changed parts of the holy books by STS rulers as a means to create passive audiences out of people, etc
Perhaps you're right, I'm not aware of the heart of everyone.. and I don't know as many people as you do personally. what I see may be illusory.
Btw I remember Ra speaking of that one pharaoh who made LOO the official religion. and that didn't go well..
Well, that's why we are here. Some will sleep and some will awaken. One person comes to mind for me. She is my sister. She goes to the inner city, delivers lunches and works for a women's center that offers showers, food and rest to the homeless. She also is 70 years old, has a shunt in her brain and can barely walk yet she loves these people dearly. She is a Christian. She has been to India and delivered young girls from brothels that had been kidnapped and taken and used as prostitutes. She does not know the Law of One and yet, she lives it and does not know it. She would love you just as she loves me. The only difference is she has a title to her system of belief. Do I think she is sleeping? Perhaps somewhat. Do I think she is a passive participant in an audience? Perhaps. Do I think she knows the Creator and loves without return. YES.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Stranger - 05-05-2019
I personally have found both Buddhism and Christianity to be immensely helpful in my journey.
When considering religion, I find it incredibly important to distinguish between the original message, vs. the excreta that remain when that message is passed through the digestive tract of ordinary humanity's biases.
There are exceptional individuals who manage to see through to the heart of things - such as Jesus, the Buddha, and many many lesser known ones. They bring their message to the masses because it's vital to do so. The masses lack the capacity to truly connect with what the great teachers have described to them. They hear the words, but don't feel the tune in their hearts - simply because they just aren't quite there yet.
Because of that, all the plagues that already bedevil mankind corrupt the original message of love and service, and the corruption goes undetected - and can even become part of the official dogma of the religion. An example of this is tribalism - us vs them thinking and intertribal conflict over the control of resources - which is profoundly embedded in the psyche of the human animal. That is the primary cause of crusades and such; religion simply serves as a readily available marker of who is "us" and who is "them."
It's as if someone who visits and spends time in Paris were to write a guidebook and give it to people who have never been there, who then begin studying the guidebook and teaching it to others. After a few generations, even if one of them were to go to Paris and attempt to say something about it from experience, that person would be told how wrong they are because that's not what the book says. It's a sad but inevitable state of affairs.
Yet, at the heart of the religion remains the pure message from someone who had been pure and whole enough to actually reach and enter the spiritual heights he/she spoke about. That's what's worth focusing on, and will never lose its value.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Patrick - 05-06-2019
Quote:Law of One shouldn't become religion
Completely agree! No dogma please. It's the destroyer of spirituality.
RE: Law of One shouldn't become religion - Glow - 05-06-2019
You may remember the story of how the devil and a friend of his were walking down the street, when they saw ahead of them a man stoop down and pick up something from the ground, look at it, and put it away in his pocket. The friend said to the devil, "What did that man pick up?" "He picked up a piece of the truth," said the devil. "That is a very bad business for you, then," said his friend. "Oh, not at all," the devil replied, "I am going to help him organize it."
Jiddu Krishnamurti