Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?

Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.

(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.

(05-12-2015, 10:45 AM)Matt1 Wrote: I think most of the tradition of the western mystery tradition has come down from Ancient Egypt and into Greece/Roman before making its way across Europe.
The secret chiefs are normally seen as a type of inner plane contact but some consider them to have physical counterparts on Earth, perhaps through inner Earth civilizations.  

Crowley's Aiwass could be a type of Ra contact. The problem with different societies is that if they become distorted the contact is lost and it most likely becomes a STS channeling or contact.

Many modern groups exist today, most of which claim some type of contact with the inner planes.

I have been reading a lot about Qabalah lately and i think its a great system to use with the practical application of magick. One of the most interesting things to come out of the Golden Dawn was a practice called god form assumption , although i am not sure if this was the original name. When one takes on the form of a god making use of mytho drama and correspondences in relation to the sephiroth in question. This to me sounds a lot like becoming Archetypes at will and moving towards the great work of becoming the magical personality.

Quote:75.38 Questioner: Now the invocation of the magical personality is not necessarily effective for the neophyte. Is there a point at which there is a definite quantum change and that personality does then reside, or can it be done in small degrees or percentages of magical personality as the neophyte becomes more adept?

Ra: I am Ra. The latter is correct.

75.36 Questioner: How does the use of the magical ritual of invoking the magical personality aid the mind/body/spirit complex totality? Could you expand on the answer you gave in the last session with respect to that?

Ra: I am Ra. When the magical personality is properly and efficaciously invoked the self has invoked its Higher Self. Thus a bridge betwixt space/time and time/space is made and the sixth-density magical personality experiences directly the third-density catalyst for the duration of the working. It is most central to deliberately take off the magical personality after the working in order that the Higher Self resume its appropriate configuration as analog to the space/time mind/body/spirit.

(05-12-2015, 12:06 PM)Gemini Wolf Wrote: Wow. How would a person be who was an archetype at will? If a person were all the archetypes? What type of person would they be? Enlightened?

(05-12-2015, 09:20 AM)andreazzi Wrote:

(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.

Have you ever wondered what Ra actually means with their "attempt to make reparation for distortions of this law set in motion by our naïve actions of your past"?

I actually believe Ra's teachings were part of the gist of many magical traditions, including Freemasonry, Hermetic philosophy, Rosae Crucis, Kabbalah and possibly the Golden Dawn itself.

All these magical traditions have roots in the ancient Egypt, all of them share much of the same knowledge and, unfortunately, all have gone into a path of secrecy and elitism...

(05-13-2015, 12:26 AM)Icaro Wrote: I see Ra as saying that rituals designed personally are best. This makes sense being a creator and all. The more personal the connection to the symbols, the easier it is to create a deep emotional atmospheric state I think..like a direct link. I haven't really used ritual much, but personal meaning can easily alter consciousness which is something I've experienced.

In session 74 Ra does make the distinction that known rituals are best for certain circumstances.

(05-13-2015, 01:07 AM)Tan.rar Wrote:

(05-13-2015, 12:26 AM)Icaro Wrote: I see Ra as saying that rituals designed personally are best. This makes sense being a creator and all. The more personal the connection to the symbols, the easier it is to create a deep emotional atmospheric state I think..like a direct link. I haven't really used ritual much, but personal meaning can easily alter consciousness which is something I've experienced.

In session 74 Ra does make the distinction that known rituals are best for certain circumstances.

Consider our planetary mind. A ritual that has been done hundreds, thousands of other times creates an imprint and so when you perform that same ritual you are accessing that collective of power which has been generated over many occasions.

(05-13-2015, 01:05 AM)Tan.rar Wrote:

(05-12-2015, 12:06 PM)Gemini Wolf Wrote: Wow. How would a person be who was an archetype at will? If a person were all the archetypes? What type of person would they be? Enlightened?

I am not sure you quite understand. A person who can become an archetype at will is empty. They fill themselves with the archetype. It is the skill of the adept to be able to assume a particular type of intelligent energy. We all already have all the archetypes, we are all already assuming them in lesser, mixed and distorted degrees. What magical practice helps you to do is to assume the archetypes more purely.

(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.

(05-13-2015, 05:18 AM)Indigo Light Wrote:

(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.

Dam.

That makes a profound amount of sense. This is off topic, what is your opinion on hermetics in general? In Hermes?

(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.

(05-13-2015, 06:24 AM)Matt1 Wrote:

(05-13-2015, 05:06 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: It was once said to me that the difference between magical systems is that of sophistication. Comparing a simple hermetic qabalah magic or perhaps simple witchcraft to Lurianic Qabalah or Yoga is like comparing a bicycle to a space station. Bicycles are still cool and can do things the space station can't, but the space station requires a much greater degree of sophistication of thought to accomplish what it does. So it is with the different systems of magic. I believe this is part of what draws individuals to particular systems just like there are some people who like to work with bikes and some people who like to work with space stations.

Lurianic Kabbalah is the more traditional Judaic method coming from Isaac Luria and the Hermetic tradition came through Giovanni Pico della Mirandola by fusing Christian and Hermetic elements into the Qabalah. However it was Athanasius Kircher glyph of the Qabalah that is mostly used in the western tradition.

I haven't studied the Lurianic Kabbalah in depth but i wouldn't say its better or more than the hermetic Qabalah, it simply has a different arrangement of the pathways connecting to the Sephiroths. A path connecting Geburah to Chockmah and Chesed to Binah. Rather than paths connecting Hod and Netzach to Malkuth.
The hermetic Qabalah has some advantages as they aren't limited by Mosaic law nor to traditional correspondences. For example the Tarot cards have been used as a correspondence in the Hermetic system which is highly rejected by the traditional Lurianic Kabbalah.

The higher self or the Holy Guardian Angel is almost always a correspondence of Tiphareth rather than Kether. I would say its the primordial light reflecting of Kether into the Solar Logo's of Tiphareth.
Kether and the Supernal being the Yechidah in my understanding and Tiphareth through Chesed being the Neshamah.

One of the main issues i have found while studying Qabalah is that every Occutlist has his or her own way of dividing the tree into the 4 worlds of the tetragrammaton and parts of the soul.

(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote:

Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?

Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.

It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.

Quote:6.20
We have walked among your people. We remember. We remember sorrow. We have seen much. We have searched for an instrument of the proper parameters of distortion in mind/body/spirit complex and supporting and understanding group of mind/body/spirit complexes to accept this information with minimal distortion and maximal desire to serve for some of your years. The answer, in short, is yes. However, we wished you to know that in our memory we thank you.

(05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: Fool (Matrix of the Mind)

Questioner Wrote:Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups

Ra Wrote:I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.

(05-15-2015, 01:14 PM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote:

(05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: Fool (Matrix of the Mind)

I am seriously losing my mind here or something, I thought The Fool was the Significator of the Body and the Magician the Matrix of the Mind...

(05-14-2015, 09:43 AM)Matt1 Wrote: Hermetic Qabalah is alot easier to get into i think, its difficult to find any good information in English about the Lurianic Qabalah. You do have some translations of the old texts. I think its also fair to remember that all the old texts in themselves were written by human beings who would have there own distortions. As fair as western occultism and the Ra material goes i think the Heremtic system probably works best

(05-15-2015, 11:52 AM)Bring4th_Austin Wrote:

(05-12-2015, 05:28 AM)Tan.rar Wrote:

Quote:69.22 Questioner: There are many techniques and ways of practicing so-called white magical arts. Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups such as the Order of the Golden Dawn and other magical groups?

Ra: I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.

It appears to me here that Ra is acknowledging the "formidable system of service and discipline" that is used by the Order of the Golden Dawn. The Lesser Ritual of the Pentagram which is used by the group for clearing their space is also of Golden Dawn origin. I was once informed that some of the higher adept workings in the Golden Dawn include trance channeling and keeping scribe. I have speculated that perhaps Ra, or one of the members of Ra rather, is one of the Secret Chiefs of the Golden Dawn.

I know next to nothing about the actual teaching of the Golden Dawn or the hierarchy of people and knowledge. Would you be suggesting that the Golden Dawn would be trance channeling Ra? Or perhaps Ra is interacting in a more direct sense?

I got the sense from the Ra material that Ra has decided not to interact directly and preferred the method of channeling as a teaching technique. And this particular passage seems to speak to their success in finding channels:

Quote:6.20
We have walked among your people. We remember. We remember sorrow. We have seen much. We have searched for an instrument of the proper parameters of distortion in mind/body/spirit complex and supporting and understanding group of mind/body/spirit complexes to accept this information with minimal distortion and maximal desire to serve for some of your years. The answer, in short, is yes. However, we wished you to know that in our memory we thank you.

I feel as though they are implying that their search has not been fruitful up until this certain point. Ra's particular distortions and desires may prevent them from sharing in certain ways and in certain contexts, based on their past experiences. However, that doesn't really say much about the sources the Golden Dawn may have access to through trance channeling. Ra is not the only member of the Confederation working with channels - not even the only 6th density memory complex. To a dedicated and pure group of magical workers, there is probably an abundance of potential positive sources in a similar vein as Ra.

(05-15-2015, 01:14 PM)VanAlioSaldo Wrote:

(05-13-2015, 05:01 AM)Tan.rar Wrote: Fool (Matrix of the Mind)

I am seriously losing my mind here or something, I thought The Fool was the Significator of the Body and the Magician the Matrix of the Mind...

Questioner Wrote:Are rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use just as good or possibly better than those that have been practiced by groups

Ra Wrote:I am Ra. Although we are unable to speak with precision on this query, we may note some gratification that the questioner has penetrated some of the gist of a formidable system of service and discipline.

Is how I interpreted this.  I saw it more that Ra was referring to the act of "rituals designed by a particular group for their own particular use" as that system of service and discipline which is formidable.  But they may very well have also meant it about the Golden Dawn.

Quote:42.16 Questioner: I had one experience in meditation which I spoke of before which was very profound approximately twenty years ago, a little less. What disciplines would be most applicable to re-create this situation and this type of experience?

Ra: I am Ra. Your experience would best be approached from the ceremonial magical stance. However, the Wanderer or adept shall have the far greater potential for this type of experience which, as you have undoubtedly analyzed to be the case, is one of an archetypal nature, one belonging to the roots of cosmic consciousness.

42.17 Questioner: Was that in any way related to the Golden Dawn in ceremonial magic?

Ra: I am Ra. The relationship was congruency.

42.18 Questioner: Then in attempting to reproduce this experience would I then best follow practices for the Order of the Golden Dawn in reproducing this?

Ra: I am Ra. To attempt to reproduce an initiatory experience is to move, shall we say, backwards. However, the practice of this form of service to others is appropriate in your case working with your associates. It is not well for positively polarized entities to work singly. The reasons for this are obvious.