(02-14-2021, 04:57 PM)Diana Wrote: I don't take either side. I can see the points made on either view. It's all hearsay to me, and my view has more to do with the way I live my life. But I respect the time people have put into the research—whether that research derives from alternative sources or official ones, because no matter what anyone says, official sources aren't all honest and alternative sources aren't all looney-bin.

(02-09-2021, 09:49 PM)Minyatur Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 08:22 PM)Louisabell Wrote: I do believe that getting the COVID vaccine in order to reduce potentially spreading the disease to more vulnerable people is a STO act. Choosing not to take the vaccine doesn't mean you're not a STO person in general, but in that specific choice, I don't see how it's STO.

I don't really think it is that simple. How the material seems to define the key toward negative polarization is control of catalyst, while the key toward positive polarization is acceptance of catalyst.

Where I stand in my beliefs, to not take the vaccine is a way to empower faith and personal growth in both myself and others.

(02-09-2021, 11:36 PM)Spaced Wrote: Is getting vaccinated a case of acting without any self-interest though? You'd be getting the vaccine so you yourself would not get sick (or at least would not suffer the worst of the effects). It's not like taking a bullet for someone

(02-10-2021, 11:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote: Feeding the mind/body/spirit complex when it starves is acceptance of the catalyst of hunger.

(02-11-2021, 01:22 AM)zedro Wrote:

(02-11-2021, 01:09 AM)Spaced Wrote: On a metaphysical level see this as a global catalyst that is testing to see if we can work together on a global level to overcome an obstacle rather than retreating into self-centered concerns about individual rights.

That is a narrative framing device that is not necessarily true, but rather a projection of a belief on what you perceive to be reality. In fact that type of narrative ironically is what causes separation. Namely, that either those who don't follow your beliefs are either selfish or delusional, or both.

Quote:The 4th density isn't about unity, it's about harmony.

(02-14-2021, 12:14 PM)Glow Wrote: David you do know globally there are lots of different countries making their own vaccines right?

Your theories make no sense outside the USA. Just like the Covid political hoax stuff made no sense because again it’s global so not about the US political system.

The weirdest part of these theories is they always lead back to anti-semitism and blaming them as the elite, yet Israel is doing the most thorough vaccination program.

(02-14-2021, 02:25 PM)ScottK Wrote: America has led the world since WW2 because it has historically been the most righteous country in the world (along with having the best lawform) - not perfect, but most righteous.

(02-14-2021, 04:57 PM)Diana Wrote: It might be good to remember that no one is in possession of all the facts, information, or truth

It just seems to me that there are two sides.

(02-14-2021, 07:30 PM)Glow Wrote: Law of confusion.

(02-14-2021, 04:38 PM)confusedseeker Wrote: I don't agree with everything you've said but I definitely agree that weakening the West and the US is a top priority. All you have to do is look at the illogical inconsistencies enacted by our politicians to see what's going on. This is definitely an economic and political attack. Then you look at how our political system was manipulated, it's very dark.  For me, it become utterly clear during the BLM riots. I applaud Florida and hope to move there soon, great leadership.

(02-14-2021, 10:34 PM)ScottK Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 04:38 PM)confusedseeker Wrote: I don't agree with everything you've said but I definitely agree that weakening the West and the US is a top priority. All you have to do is look at the illogical inconsistencies enacted by our politicians to see what's going on. This is definitely an economic and political attack. Then you look at how our political system was manipulated, it's very dark.  For me, it become utterly clear during the BLM riots. I applaud Florida and hope to move there soon, great leadership.

I wouldn't think of the current situation continuing in a straight line for much longer.  For myself, I just wouldn't want to live in a city, and if I was moving, I would probably want to avoid being close to a nuclear plant and find a place with some nice virgin land.

But the game has been playing for a while, at least 10 years:

Darkside trying to destroy the United States, the dollar, and the Constitution,

and the Lightside trying Restore the original republic and the constitutional lawform, and strengthen the dollar as the world's reserve currency.

Checkmate approaches, but not without struggle.  If there's one thing this period of time has shown is just how corrupt the entire system is across the board, which I think you would agree with.  It'll be a great project rebuilding the whole thing, as the corrupt mess of a corporate system falls apart.

(02-14-2021, 09:09 PM)unity100 Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 09:49 PM)Minyatur Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 08:22 PM)Louisabell Wrote: I do believe that getting the COVID vaccine in order to reduce potentially spreading the disease to more vulnerable people is a STO act. Choosing not to take the vaccine doesn't mean you're not a STO person in general, but in that specific choice, I don't see how it's STO.

I don't really think it is that simple. How the material seems to define the key toward negative polarization is control of catalyst, while the key toward positive polarization is acceptance of catalyst.

Where I stand in my beliefs, to not take the vaccine is a way to empower faith and personal growth in both myself and others.

It doesnt work like that. You cant just keep bashing your head into something that you or your society have already gone through and learned. Foolishly risking one's life is not catalyst. Its just being foolish. And what ends up with doing that end getting a 'suboptimal' result would be learning of not doing that.

Similar with what Ra says about what to do with a person who is starving:

The correct course of action in the face of a starving person is to feed them.

Not to 'have faith', 'accept catalyst', and the other person also 'accepting catalyst', not even 'being wise' and expecting the person 'help himself/herself'.

There are already a bazillion catalyst which need to be processed in this situation. Those themselves should present a gigantic load of work which would last for years. No need to add to that.

You are not leaving your door open by having faith in whatever happens, you are not going home without buying groceries by trusting and having faith, you are not driving without heeding road signs by choosing to have faith.

Absolutely the same situation.

(02-09-2021, 11:36 PM)Spaced Wrote: Is getting vaccinated a case of acting without any self-interest though? You'd be getting the vaccine so you yourself would not get sick (or at least would not suffer the worst of the effects). It's not like taking a bullet for someone

If the person is predominantly thinking of others while taking the vaccine, that's positive polarization. If s/he is thinking only about himself or herself, that's just being cautious. No particular polarization could be examined. If the person is thinking of both himself/herself and everyone else, that's wisdom.

(02-10-2021, 11:10 AM)Minyatur Wrote: Feeding the mind/body/spirit complex when it starves is acceptance of the catalyst of hunger.

But getting vaccinated when facing an illness is rejection of the catalyst of illness.

(02-11-2021, 01:22 AM)zedro Wrote:

(02-11-2021, 01:09 AM)Spaced Wrote: On a metaphysical level see this as a global catalyst that is testing to see if we can work together on a global level to overcome an obstacle rather than retreating into self-centered concerns about individual rights.

That is a narrative framing device that is not necessarily true, but rather a projection of a belief on what you perceive to be reality. In fact that type of narrative ironically is what causes separation. Namely, that either those who don't follow your beliefs are either selfish or delusional, or both.

Risking other people's lives for one's own desires is selfishness. There are no two ways about that, and there is no 'framing' it. You are the one who is doing the framing, in this particular case, and thats literal projection.

Quote:The 4th density isn't about unity, it's about harmony.

4d harmony is not something in which entire society accommodates the selfish notions of a group of individuals and collectively chooses to have millions die among them.

No entity who would consciously risk killing other people would get harvested to positive 4.

Positive path is about others. Not about 'belief' leave aside self.

(02-14-2021, 12:14 PM)Glow Wrote: David you do know globally there are lots of different countries making their own vaccines right?

Your theories make no sense outside the USA. Just like the Covid political hoax stuff made no sense because again it’s global so not about the US political system.

The weirdest part of these theories is they always lead back to anti-semitism and blaming them as the elite, yet Israel is doing the most thorough vaccination program.

Indeed - in such conspiracy theories, certain countries like Russia are described to be 'fighting the globalist plan' and are celebrated loudly for 'standing up to them', including the 'population reduction' conspiracy.

However when Russia creates vaccines along with entire rest of the world, that constitutes no contradiction with the 'vaccines are made for population reduction' conspiracy. Russia is both fighting the 'globalists who want to reduce world population through vaccines' while producing their own vaccine at the same time.

Same with China. China is both evil, guilty of all kinds of things, but also part of the 'globalist elite' at the same time even as the very purported 'globalist elites' are openly hostile to China and are its enemies. Two contradictory opinions presented at the same time.

(02-14-2021, 02:25 PM)ScottK Wrote: America has led the world since WW2 because it has historically been the most righteous country in the world (along with having the best lawform) - not perfect, but most righteous.

I normally skip by Scott's posts because they are way too 'far out' for me, but man, this needs quoting as an example.

That's above is literal crusader language.

Literal example of how negative philosophy infects minds and polarizes people to negative.

So, US had a 'right' to 'lead the world' since Ww2 because it is 'righteous'. And that's why 1 million Iraqis died, apparently. And US ended up with their oil and natural resources. Without even coming around to the kids who were bombed with napalm in Vietnam, South American dictators educated in School of Americas who then massacred hundreds of thousands and all that assorted stuff.

That was 'US leading the world'.

There is even 'god' in the mix.

(02-14-2021, 04:57 PM)Diana Wrote: It might be good to remember that no one is in possession of all the facts, information, or truth

It just seems to me that there are two sides.

Only in US, where people need to diffuse conflict and tension by 'finding a middle road' in between people who adhere to actual science which entire rest of the world adheres to, and religious extremists who just deny reality and make up their own.

And some literal far right extremists around the world who repeat that latter group.

(02-14-2021, 07:30 PM)Glow Wrote: Law of confusion.

You people are stretching some concepts in Ra material and spirituality waaaaaay more than their actual meanings.

Law of confusion does not mean a state of muddy delirium in which the entities are allowed or made to deny reality and act irrationally.

Law of confusion merely refers to veil making polarity choices unclear by obscuring subconscious so the entity cannot automatically know which choice it wants to make deep down, and by obscuring the fact that everything is one and connected.

That's what allows polarity choice.

And in another tangent, free will is not "i can do whatever i want and everything is just going to be 'okay' without any consequences because god/higher self/universe will make it so for me'.

Its just being allowed to choose a polarity by obscuring the fact that everything is one, so the entity can have the free will to polarize negatively. Before veil, law of confusion etc, that wasnt possible.

Otherwise nothing protects any entity from the consequences of its actions. What's done is done, and even if the entity forgives itself and everyone else, the polarity results of the act are there to stay.

.....

I want to distill down all the above into two basic spiritual concepts:

First, for those who can, liberating one's consciousness from societal/cultural window of wherever the person grew up or what s/he got accustomed to and then viewing the perspectives in this thread and the actual topic from an objective angle would help a lot in understanding not only the actual topic here (vaccines) but also help understand how social and cultural conditioning cloud people's perceptions to whatever format that culture has.

To start with, Anti-vaccination is an American thing. Majority of developed world has mandatory vaccination for children for schooling, which basically makes it mandatory, and some even for adults. There arent people who are discussing vaccines, leave aside being 'anti' them in these countries. Leave aside a sizable, mainstream movement. Its literally unimaginable.

Now - and this is very interesting - there are those in such countries who are niche groups, very tiny amount of people, who copy the same narrative that exists in American alt-right sphere and talk against the vaccines. The very interesting part comes from these people tending to be English-speaking foreigners who got into conspiracy theorism through their interest or connections to mainly Angloamerican cultures. Or, through those who copied those narratives and spread them in their own language. People who are Anglophiles, or people who have lived/worked in Anglosphere. The same people also tend to copy other narratives from the same culture - ie, right wing economic policies of 'free market', 'deregulation', 'liberty' and so on.

This tells us that not only the culture which one has been born and raised in would shape one's perception and thinking, but also even any kind of additional influence accepted by the person can do that to great extent as well.

That is a very important lesson for the adept, in not only understanding itself, but also understanding the reality it is living in.

A mind confined by its local, national culture will see existence through that window. A mind that is not confined by even its own planetary culture, will see existence from an infinite window.

Second, a lot of people seem to complicate, stretch and 'obscurantize' spiritual concepts.

There are beliefs, there are interpretations of spiritual concepts to extremes, there are groupings of semi-relevant things into other concepts, there are many complex thoughts, emotions and feelings going on about a bazillion things, all of which are again justified through the same complex web by concluding everything to be par course in an obscurantist manner.

Just like what Ra said about 'your peoples manifesting a complex system of distortions' when it comes to orange ray. That considerably affects yellow ray, ie, societal things and relations.

Spirituality is not that complicated. Leave aside existence.

Have you thought about other people when taking an action, and have you benefited/helped/protected/bettered other people to any degree while taking that action?

Thats positive polarization.

Have you acted selfishly while taking an action, in the end harming or exploiting others for your own sake?

That's negative polarization.

Beliefs, interpretations, rationalizations, justifications, explanations, feelings, appeals to authority, religion, 'god', spirituality, this or that - nothing changes that basic mechanic.

When you approach the harvester, there is no tally of your thoughts/feelings/justifications/rationalizations in your current life or your past lives, there are no questions posed to you, there are no explanations from your side, there is no accounting/calculation of all those complexities which you use to complicate things in your life, to have them have any effect on anything during that process.

You approach the light, and stop where you can go no further.

And that is determined by the distilled polarization that has become ingrained in your spirit as a result of all the actions in your past existence.

The more you thought about other people and the more selfless acts you did to help/serve other people, the more positively polarized is your soul.

The more you thought about yourself and the more you hurt/exploited other people with selfish acts, the more negatively polarized is your soul.

Its that simple.

Quote:Questioner: What could one of these entities do to become karmically involved? Could you give us an example?

Ra: I am Ra. An entity which acts in a consciously unloving manner in action with other beings can become karmically involved.

Quote:However, in this instance the steroids or, alternately, the antibiotic family might be useful in the complete removal of the difficulty within which the working is still able to thrive.

(02-16-2021, 10:02 AM)MrWho Wrote: Very few people realize how spiritual evolution and disease interact.

Quote:34.7 ▶ Questioner: Do what we call contagious diseases play any part in this process with respect to the unmanifested self?


Ra: I am Ra. These so-called contagious diseases are those entities of second density which offer an opportunity for this type of catalyst. If this catalyst is unneeded, then these second-density creatures, as you would call them, do not have an effect. In each of these generalizations you may please note that there are anomalies so that we cannot speak to every circumstance but only to the general run or way of things as you experience them.

Quote:Questioner: Could you expand a little bit on how that aids in the teach/learning of patience?

Ra: I am Ra. To stop the functioning of service to others long enough to ingest foodstuffs is to invoke patience.

(02-17-2021, 05:21 AM)Margan Wrote: Mme Flofrog, how is it going? did you already recieve the second shot and how was it?

I liked Miniyatur 's approach about to decide when the decision is imminent whether to take the vaccine or not. That is exactly what I was intending myself.
For me it is about what my intuition tells me to do and then going with that. I have no way to prove either side right or wrong. I am not a scientist.
Of course my conspiracy part says "vaccine bad". On the other hand so many scientists have worked on this and my friend who is a doctor got the shots and all his colleagues too and they still alive and went right back to work lol.
Also I was thinking about what Jesus said when someone complained about taxation by the Romans back in the day. He said "Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's."
One could transfer that to the vaccine issue. Give them what they want. The politicians and pharma lobbyists (our modern day Caesars) want it so give it to them and don't worry about the rest.

(02-17-2021, 12:34 PM)Margan Wrote: Mr Who, since you are here let me tell you that I liked your expression "negative delight". However I am not sure you meant it the way I understood it lol.
When I read it I was reminded of the term "fear porn", bc that also can generate some kind of delight. You know, like on the subject of conspiracy theories that are fear-based it can cause one to find some kind of perverted pleasure indulging in them and all the evils of the world.
There is fear on both sides of the subject though - the fear of covid in the people who regularly watch Tv and all the "special editions" where they talk about latest mutations, horror stories of people who had really bad covid, death tolls etc.
The conspiracy fears center more about fear of the vaccine and what it can do, fear of state restrictions and countries descending into some kind of health fascism etc.
We should never forget that all this is part of the illusion and provides excellent catalyst. As can be amply demonstrated by the discussions on the subject

(02-17-2021, 08:19 PM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote: So what approach will you be using? The "its my responsibility to not make others sick" approach or the fear approach which both come from the same side. "fear".

Quote:Questioner: That’s OK. I don’t think that was that good a question anyway.

Now, when Ra initially planned for helping the Egyptians with their evolution, what was the most, or the primary concept, and also secondary and tertiary if you can name those, that Ra wished to impart to the Egyptians? In other words, what was Ra’s training plan or schedule for making the Egyptians aware of what was necessary for their evolution?

Ra: I am Ra. We came to your peoples to enunciate the Law of One. We wished to impress upon those who wished to learn of unity that in unity all paradoxes are resolved; all that is broken is healed; all that is forgotten is brought to light. We had no teaching plan, as you have called it, in that our intention when we walked among your peoples was to manifest that which was requested by those learn/teachers to which we had come.

We are aware that this particular line of querying; that is, the nature and architecture of the archetypical mind, has caused the questioner to attempt, to its own mind unsuccessfully, to determine the relative importance of these concepts. We cannot learn/teach for any, nor would we take this opportunity from the questioner. However, we shall comment.

The adept has already worked much, not only within the red, orange, yellow, and green energy centers, but already in the opening of blue and indigo. Up through this point the archetypes function as the great base or plinth of a builded structure or statue keeping the mind complex viable, level, and available as a resource whenever it may be evoked. There is a point at which the adept takes up its work. This is the point at which a clear and conscious consideration of the archetypical mind is useful.

(02-17-2021, 12:56 PM)Agua Wrote: [quote='MrWho' pid='289385' dateline='1613574154']
I very much like how much strength Jesus was able to demonstrate.

He was never afraid.

It says a lot when one makes decisions on fear. And not strength.

Quote:When you just deny it, you cannot even evolve anymore.


I love and agree with much you have written here with one small exception.
[quote]When you just deny it, you cannot even evolve anymore.

(02-18-2021, 08:02 AM)Agua Wrote: When I wrote that I have been shown some importamt things about the vaccine, however, it has instantly been dismissed as bullshit.
No one was interested in what the source is or what exactly the source showed me.

Quote:Questioner: Wouldn’t this type of craft totally solve, or come close to solving, a lot of the energy problems as far as transport goes? That we’re used to transporting [inaudible]… transporting [inaudible].

Ra: I am Ra. The technology your peoples possess at this time is capable of resolving each and every limitation which plagues your social memory complex at this present nexus of experience. However, the concerns of some of your beings with distortions towards what you would call powerful energy cause these solutions to be withheld until the solutions are so needed that those with the distortion can then become further distorted in the direction of power.

(02-18-2021, 11:25 AM)MrWho Wrote: "Thoughts become things"

"The body is a creature of the minds creation"

So anything one truely believes will be true. If one thinks they will suffer irreparable damage from a vaccine. Then they may. The opposite is also true.