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RE: US is set to censor internet - Monica - 11-28-2010
(11-28-2010, 02:25 AM)Lavazza Wrote: I have to say I'm enjoying the resurrection of this topic here, as it was about a year ago in my 'Argh!' thead.
I resurrected that thread, since it so closely overlaps this one.
(11-28-2010, 02:25 AM)Lavazza Wrote: Enjoying because I am learning quite a bit, but I would please, please ask that before anyone posts again he or she take a deep breath and remember that we are One in the same, and what that One is is Love itself made manifest. Topics like these can lead to anger in a hurry and raise our gentle mind/body/spirit complexes' blood pressure. Just saying... Lets feel some love for each other first and foremost.
Great suggestion! As with other volatile topics that tend to push people's buttons because they do or do not engage in said behavior, please let's all remember to discuss ideas and concepts, rather than judge individuals.
(11-28-2010, 02:25 AM)Lavazza Wrote: And what of the average Joe seeking to increase his salary from $40k/year to $45k/year? Both sums are viewed as weath beyond imagining to some of the poorest people in the world- the same as how you are viewing the millionaire. With your reasoning Joe would be on the sts path as well as just about everyone. I think that's unsound logic.
I once got into a heated discussion with a co-worker about this very comparison. She was raised in a very affluent family, and she and her husband both had parents whom they could call upon if they ever needed financial assistance. In contrast, my husband and I were both raised poor, and had no one to turn to for financial assistance.
My co-worker insisted that wealthy people struggled financially just as much as poor people, because they had higher expenses. I asserted that they had more options, because they could always opt for a smaller house, less expensive car, forgo the big screen tv and European vacations, etc., whereas a family struggling to make ends meet can only cut so many corners. In an already lean budget, there just aren't many luxuries to eliminate, so then it becomes a question of "Pay the mortgage or buy groceries?" as opposed to the wealthy person having to choose between the new car or the European vacation. To compare their financial challenges would be like comparing survival vs mere inconvenience.
My co-worker disagreed, and then took the discussion to a new level: She insisted that a multi-millionaire suffers just as much, even financially, as a person living in poverty!!
I was incredulous!
This discussion reminded me of that long-age exchange, in which my co-worker and I never did reconcile our differences. I feel that a middle-class worker seeking to raise his standard of living just a bit, maybe plan for his children's college education, have a bit of a safety net in case of an unexpected big expense, etc. cannot even remotely be compared to someone who has extreme excess and seeks more and more excess, out of greed rather than need.
(Not saying you were doing that, Lavazza! I realize you were just asking the question.)
RE: US is set to censor internet - Ali Quadir - 11-28-2010
Unity, I'm getting a lot of signals about those blocked websites. So my initial stance to wait and see seems unwarranted. you were right the US government has apparently decided to censor without legal reasons a lot of international web sites.
This block works across the world, in my opinion this would be like the dutch demanding a texas based gun seller to report at a prison near here for breaking dutch laws. it's outrageous.
RE: US is set to censor internet - unity100 - 11-28-2010
(11-28-2010, 02:25 AM)Lavazza Wrote: Unity, I'm really enjoying your points, but I have to agree with Seejay that this is a pretty bad analogy. Downloading copyrighted material is just too far off from stealing potatoes to feed a starving family for me to make sense of. If you could make another analogy that is closer in comparison I could follow you more closely. But as it is now it doesn't work.
is it ?
what difference do they have. is it because potato is needed for continuance of physical body complex ? and instead, music, visual arts, drama are related to the needs of the mind and spirit complexes, so they are less important ?
with density, both activities and the needs of the sentient increases. a 3d entity cannot do without laughing, entertainment, leisure, various types of enjoyment. specifically, most of these are related to easing of mind complex.
there is a phenomenon called 'death from overwork' in japan. it is an important part of workforce statistics.
what happens is, people just drop dead. healthy people. reason is, overworking non stop, with only sleeping and eating in between. japanese governments pursue this matter and try to reduce that phenomenon.
it is so that a person can even drop dead out of nowhere, with no health problems. leave aside the fact that they can go unstable, mad, or dysfunctional through a lot of other ways. this example should establish the importance of relaxation of the mind complex.
one could say at this point that, there are a multitude of other means of entertainment available than pirating. at first sight that seems indeed to be true. after all, you can go to a local bar in your area, listen to some indie bands that you can find, or, watch a local tv station, or something like that.
now, if you boil it down to that, the french people could also go out to the wilds, and eat berries they could find, tap the wild bee hives, or eat various plant roots too. after all they are food too. but, for some reason, they insisted on luxury things like bread, potato etc ...
the reason is, the effort one spends and the satisfaction/replenishment one gets from potato and raspberries are not the same. in the latter case, one may even spend more energy to take less nutrition.
same goes with entertainment :
if, an indie band in your area had been THAT good, they would have already been tapped by the industry labels already. those that come up good, are tapped anyway. you can say 'but there are real good indie bands out there'. yeah. and they are as rare as the wild potato in wilderness. it takes effort to find them. it takes more effort to find one of those groups, who would be very good, refusing to sign with big corporations AND sell their music from logical rates, rather than aligning their prices with the 'industry standard'.
had your local tv station been shooting good series and movies, they wouldnt still be a local tv station in the first place.
so, in this situation, you end up having to get your entertainment from among what the cartel provides to you. and the cartel enforces not only its prices but also its methods over to you too. you cant copy music in between your devices. you cant do this, you cant do that. you cant go without wearing panties on a thursday night if its after 18.00 and so on.
so, people pirate.
Quote:And what of the average Joe seeking to increase his salary from $40k/year to $45k/year? Both sums are viewed as weath beyond imagining to some of the poorest people in the world- the same as how you are viewing the millionaire. With your reasoning Joe would be on the sts path as well as just about everyone. I think that's unsound logic.
average joe seeking to increase his salary from 40 to 45 k a year would be manifesting sts thoughts, if his salary increase desire is not out of procuring more security for his family, or others. or, another comparable aim.
doesnt change with the income level. wanting more for yourself than you need, will remain negative.
Quote:Anyways, I don't see resolve to the debate here as I eventually realized it wouldn't happen in my old thread. The best course of action I feel is to follow what you believe is the right thing to do in your heart while at least attempting understanding if not achieving it for those around you who disagree. Much LOVE,
~Lavazza
that is because a lot of people need to break out of societal biases that are present today, and see everything from outside.
RE: US is set to censor internet - Lavazza - 11-28-2010
Monica, yes. I agree with your train of thought overall, I'm simply trying to give some illumination to a concept that I disagree with in premise... That is that seeking to better ones' monetary income would indicate that one is participating in an STS act, or is on the STS path or worse, as I gather some here feel is true. All is well.
Unity, I am afraid we disagree completely on both counts. I am content to leave the debate aside however, and not because of disrespect. Thank you for taking the time to more fully explain your viewpoints.
Love and light,
~L
RE: US is set to censor internet - unity100 - 11-28-2010
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=10/11/28/1317223
Quote:"The US Copyright Group has sued Graham Syfert, an attorney that created a packet of self-representation paperwork for individuals sued for P2P sharing of certain movies and moved to have sanctions placed against the defense attorney. Syfert sells these packets for $20, and the USCG claims the 19 individuals that have used it have cost them over $5000.
See the rock bottom this whole charade has hit.
RE: US is set to censor internet - Monica - 11-28-2010
(11-16-2010, 07:02 PM)Ali Quadir Wrote: There's one tiny problem for them though.. No one has been able to police the web so far.
I wasn't following the beginning of this thread, so I'm not sure if these have already been posted, but China has indeed managed to police the internet:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/science/july-dec10/chinainternet_11-26.html
And now the US:
http://www.naturalnews.com/030542_censorship_internet.html
http://torrent-finder.com/
RE: US is set to censor internet - seejay21 - 11-28-2010
(11-28-2010, 01:16 PM)Bring4th_Monica Wrote:(11-16-2010, 07:02 PM)Ali Quadir Wrote: There's one tiny problem for them though.. No one has been able to police the web so far.
I wasn't following the beginning of this thread, so I'm not sure if these have already been posted, but China has indeed managed to police the internet:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/science/july-dec10/chinainternet_11-26.html
And now the US:
http://www.naturalnews.com/030542_censorship_internet.html
http://torrent-finder.com/
I think you are right on the mark putting these two things together. Most of the seized websites were selling counterfeit merchandise from China.
Looks like tit for tat.
http://www.dotweekly.com/list-of-government-ice-seized-domain-names
RE: US is set to censor internet - Richard - 11-29-2010
There is always one or more logic paths to justify ones actions or beliefs, but is the outcome positive or negative? Only you can judge that.... if you're brutally honest with yourself.
Richard