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+---- Thread: Minimally Harvestable (/showthread.php?tid=10839)
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 04:27 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: Sure, I guess so.
I actually find it annoying when people try to equate the paths perfectly with eachother. Seems like a slap in the face to the uniqueness of each path.
Well they're mirroring opposites. If you follow fully one path, you deny to yourself half of your true nature and it is why at some point both paths become reconcilied as they are but two faces of the same coin.
They exist only because there is also the other path else there would be none of them.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
If you say so. I still don't agree. I agree the paths exist because of eachother, but I don't think they are just inversions of eachother. I can see how it would be easy and logical to see it that way though and indeed I used to really believe so. Something tells me it's just a little more complicated than that, though. Call it a hunch.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 05:06 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: If you say so. I still don't agree. I agree the paths exist because of eachother, but I don't think they are just inversions of eachother. I can see how it would be easy and logical to see it that way though and indeed I used to really believe so. Something tells me it's just a little more complicated than that, though. Call it a hunch.
Well the circumstances in which they emerge are different. But every positive emotion probably has a negative opposite, etc.
The positive path has it's own way of being negative and the negative path has it's own way of being positive also. The perspective of it varies depending upon the entity. What one sees as positive can be seen as negative by another.
The paths in themselves also are something that is supposed to take hundreds of billions of years to grow through, so it surely is more complicated than we make it seem. With lots of nearly-infinite gradations to it.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 05:11 PM)Minyatur Wrote:(05-11-2015, 05:06 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: If you say so. I still don't agree. I agree the paths exist because of eachother, but I don't think they are just inversions of eachother. I can see how it would be easy and logical to see it that way though and indeed I used to really believe so. Something tells me it's just a little more complicated than that, though. Call it a hunch.
Well the circumstances in which they emerge are different. But every positive emotion probably has a negative opposite, etc.
Certainly, that is the nature of the polarities of the mind, body and spirit. One of the key exercises Ra gives for balancing is through acceptance of opposites.
I don't believe the 'saga of polarity' is the same, however. Maybe similar, in that it is something occurring to balance in the Galactic Mind, but again I don't think that just means mirror of opposites. Something tells me the nature of the paths is a little more complex and that there are things which are exclusive to each path that are not necessarily mirrored in the other.
It's like being at a crossroad and saying the left and right paths are mirrors of eachother since they reach the same destination but go in opposite directions. However, once you start walking, I think you'd find unique things on each path that have no correlation on the other.
That is why I honestly believe that only an entity which has fully traversed both paths individually will actually be able to go beyond this current octave.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Also, as you say, it is likely they are more complicated than we think. This is why I avoid platitudes that attempt to place these concepts in to a neat box.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 05:17 PM)Tan.rar Wrote:(05-11-2015, 05:11 PM)Minyatur Wrote:(05-11-2015, 05:06 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: If you say so. I still don't agree. I agree the paths exist because of eachother, but I don't think they are just inversions of eachother. I can see how it would be easy and logical to see it that way though and indeed I used to really believe so. Something tells me it's just a little more complicated than that, though. Call it a hunch.
Well the circumstances in which they emerge are different. But every positive emotion probably has a negative opposite, etc.
Certainly, that is the nature of the polarities of the mind, body and spirit. One of the key exercises Ra gives for balancing is through acceptance of opposites.
I don't believe the 'saga of polarity' is the same, however. Maybe similar, in that it is something occurring to balance in the Galactic Mind, but again I don't think that just means mirror of opposites. Something tells me the nature of the paths is a little more complex and that there are things which are exclusive to each path that are not necessarily mirrored in the other.
It's like being at a crossroad and saying the left and right paths are mirrors of eachother since they reach the same destination but go in opposite directions. However, once you start walking, I think you'd find unique things on each path that have no correlation on the other.
That is why I honestly believe that only an entity which has fully traversed both paths individually will actually be able to go beyond this current octave.
I do agree whith that, surely two entities that go through the same path do not even do it in the same manner. But in higher densitites I do think both paths in their opposite efforts do mirror each other. If there is only harmony and unity then both paths are working hand in hand even when it seems to fully be the contrary.
I do also agree that to move beyond, one needs to embrace both paths equally as a needed part of existence. Nothing in any of the two paths is unlike any of us, we are each entities in existence through their circumstances.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
I think it's just that word "mirror" that bothers me. I am not exactly sure what you mean by it when you use it.
I just don't really get what it is supposed to represent. Like you say in higher densities their efforts mirror eachother, but so is that just to say that engage in activities which are the opposites? Again that doesn't make sense to me.
Maybe this will explain a little better what I am thinking. I do believe that the paths are always intertwined, for sure, that is inevitable. The paths are like a mobius strip. There is, in fact, only one path. That one path, however, takes on polarizations. I do not actually believe in 'objective paths', in that I do not believe the paths exist outside of the entities who are actually pursuing them.
Hence, polarization is entirely a matter of personal colouring. So that being said, I believe there can be just as much difference between individuals of the same polarity, as there can be between individuals of opposite polarity. So, in my mind, the paths do not mirror eachother, but rather it is identity that mirrors itself.
Thus, I believe you could have two STS entities who are totally opposite, just as you could have two STO entites which are totally opposite.
So, the only way in which I could get behind your point is if we basically view it purely in terms of light or magnetic flow. They are opposites in the sense of radiation and absorption, that I can agree with. In a metaphysically mechanical sense, that is true. However, I believe that it is a severe over simplification to apply this to the entirety of the experience of the paths.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
I like the word mirror, I think each and every single entity is a mirror for others to learn about themselves.
In this sense STO/STS are just two main mirrors to learn from in this octave but even in each path there is the same thing going on among the members of a social group where they do mirror each other until they learn what they have to learn.
The mirror notion came to me during a magic mushroom trip where I did a dual-channeling session with another wanderer friend and it seemed to us that the nature of individuality was that of a mirror for self and other-selves. Everything around you is you, what you make up of what you see not as yourself is simply a reflection of yourself.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
That's the whole problem I have with the word mirror. Put two mirrors together and there is nothing. You need something other than a mirror for the mirror to show anything.
That's why the word "mirror" doesn't make sense to me, because I think of actual mirrors and the way they work.
I do believe reality is like an empty mirror, in that it is ultimately void except what you put in front of it through focus or attention, but this whole "mirroring" thing just doesn't put together in my mind. Keep in mind, I used to very frequently use the exact same mirror analogy, so I do fully understand why you are using it and what you mean when you say it. It is just when I examined the idea more closely, I found it didn't actually match what I was perceiving.
Also, the whole "everything around you is you" is another one of those platitudes which I avoid. Sure, maybe that's true in terms of the identity of the One, but it's a severely convoluted idea.
That being said, seeing yourself reflected in everything and everything reflected in yourself doesn't immediately lead me to the thought that "I am the only thing in existence and everything is me reflecting myself". Although solipsism is very popular in new age philosophy.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
I guess it's not that I don't like the word mirror, it's more that it's just not the one I would use to describe what you are describing anymore.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 06:14 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I guess it's not that I don't like the word mirror, it's more that it's just not the one I would use to describe what you are describing anymore.
If you see someone that does something that angers you. How would you call that other than a mirror unto your anger?
I've yet to find a better word, words are a funny and limiting thing. The source of many misunderstandings when there was none.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 06:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:(05-11-2015, 06:14 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I guess it's not that I don't like the word mirror, it's more that it's just not the one I would use to describe what you are describing anymore.
If you see someone that does something that angers you. How would you call that other than a mirror unto your anger?
I've yet to find a better word, words are a funny and limiting thing. The source of many misunderstandings when there was none.
I use the word that Ra typically uses - catalyst. I don't believe that reality takes what I am feeling and thinking and feeds it back to me. I think the process is a little more articulate than that.
If I see someone do something that angers me, why would I call them a mirror for my anger? That is very self-centered, presuming that every occurrence in the outside world is specifically a reflection of a particular emotion I had. What if multiple people perceive the same thing, some get angry, others don't? Is the mirror the same?
That's why it doesn't make sense to me. If someone makes me angry it is because I have taken their catalyst and during its processing found it to have struck some emotion within me. The catalyst may not even have anything to do with the emotion, but through my processing it has become associated with it. Do I place that on the person and say they are mirroring my anger? No, I do not know what they are actually doing. I know I have perceived something and in that perception I have found a reaction within myself. My work then is to come to terms with, accept and discover the roots of that reaction.
I don't like the notion of the mirror because it seems, to me, to place unfairly upon others the responsibility of your 'reflections'. As though if you got mad over something someone did that they were in some way responsible for that. I don't believe that everything everyone does is specifically there for me to reflect on. Sure, there is always the opportunity.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 06:25 PM)Tan.rar Wrote:(05-11-2015, 06:16 PM)Minyatur Wrote:(05-11-2015, 06:14 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I guess it's not that I don't like the word mirror, it's more that it's just not the one I would use to describe what you are describing anymore.
If you see someone that does something that angers you. How would you call that other than a mirror unto your anger?
I've yet to find a better word, words are a funny and limiting thing. The source of many misunderstandings when there was none.
I use the word that Ra typically uses - catalyst. I don't believe that reality takes what I am feeling and thinking and feeds it back to me. I think the process is a little more articulate than that.
If I see someone do something that angers me, why would I call them a mirror for my anger? That is very self-centered, presuming that every occurrence in the outside world is specifically a reflection of a particular emotion I had. What if multiple people perceive the same thing, some get angry, others don't? Is the mirror the same?
That's why it doesn't make sense to me. If someone makes me angry it is because I have taken their catalyst and during its processing found it to have struck some emotion within me. The catalyst may not even have anything to do with the emotion, but through my processing it has become associated with it. Do I place that on the person and say they are mirroring my anger? No, I do not know what they are actually doing. I know I have perceived something and in that perception I have found a reaction within myself. My work then is to come to terms with, accept and discover the roots of that reaction.
I don't like the notion of the mirror because it seems, to me, to place unfairly upon others the responsibility of your 'reflections'. As though if you got mad over something someone did that they were in some way responsible for that. I don't believe that everything everyone does is specifically there for me to reflect on. Sure, there is always the opportunity.
The whole outside world exists solely for you through your senses. It's not self-centered as you are the Creator himself and the Creator is being each needed role for this giant clockwork of experiences to work. There's no random, there's no coincidences, there's just the experience of a dream.
From a quantum mechanic point of view, this is the role of the Observer. Reality is manifest only because it is observed.
I did not see the term mirror as it did put responsability on the other person, are you not what's reflected? It's like blaming a real mirror for finding yourself ugly when you look at it. The fact that there is something to reflect can attract something to reflect it though.
From my perspective, this whole universe is but a mirror unto your perspective of it just as it is a mirror of other perspectives through other-selves. That is how the Creator learn to know Itself by mirroring many-ness in infinite ways.
In the end it's just a way I found to state things based upon that you incarnate also each things you encounter.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Yeah, I don't buy it, but an interesting view.
I agree there is no random and no coincidences, but again, your wording doesn't make any sense to me. Mirrors mirroring mirrors yield nothing seen.
There must be something other than a mirror before anything can be perceived, so yeah, I still don't really follow it. I could maybe see it that there is the Creator and the Creation is the mirror and so the potential of the Creator is reflected as a kinetic occurrence in the mirror. However, your explanation necessitates viewing the Creator as a mirror, which makes no sense to me.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
I guess I could view it that the Creator is the mirror and the Creation is what is reflected in the mirror, but again, that wouldn't be mirrors reflecting mirrors...
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Also, solipsism, solipsism, solipsism. I don't buy it.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 07:08 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I guess I could view it that the Creator is the mirror and the Creation is what is reflected in the mirror, but again, that wouldn't be mirrors reflecting mirrors...
Well if each thing the Creator incarnate in Creation has the role of a mirror it can. In the end it's just a way of stating things.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Well, of course, it's a metaphor, and I do understand the concept, it's basically the Net of Indra.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
Had to google solipsism, well it's not far off if all is just a timeless/spaceless point of inner-infinity generating the illusion or perspective of all we experience.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Sure, yeah that.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Lighthead - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 04:11 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I, personally, am one who finds both the sun and the moon appealing, one who can equally walk between light and darkness and find the beauty in each. I daresay I would make a proficient 'STS' individual, just as I feel confident in my ability to be of service.
That's actually what I was going to ask you, what you identify as. It's almost like you knew someone was going to ask you. Do you feel that you have to graduate as one or the other to move on from 3rd density? And, if not, what is your goal as a spiritual entity?
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 08:25 PM)Lighthead Wrote:(05-11-2015, 04:11 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: I, personally, am one who finds both the sun and the moon appealing, one who can equally walk between light and darkness and find the beauty in each. I daresay I would make a proficient 'STS' individual, just as I feel confident in my ability to be of service.
That's actually what I was going to ask you, what you identify as. It's almost like you knew someone was going to ask you. Do you feel that you have to graduate as one or the other to move on from 3rd density? And, if not, what is your goal as a spiritual entity?
The question tends to come up when you are discussing these things. I do believe that to be harvestable and 'graduate' to the next density you do need to pick one or the other, however I believe that is more a case for those who have never made the choice than 'wanderers' or entities who have chosen or graduated before or are now returning to be of assistance. So, in a way, yes you have to make a choice to 'move on'. I still think that those individuals would need to make the choice to 'graduate' again, but I don't think they would be required to do that in order to return to their home density unless they became heavily karmically involved during the lifetime.
I believe the nature of reality and entities is not quite a well organized as Ra makes it appear and that there is more going on than just "everyone working through the densities" which is, to me, more of a mechanical explanation of what is going on.
I think that's a funny question, my goal as a spiritual entity, since I do not know any entities without spirit. I do not have any 'goals' as a spiritual entity, I have the path that I am walking. If my path is true as I see it then I am one of the "Elder Race" whom has been here for a long time, and whom has dedicated to work with the planet until all entities graduate. Thus, my goal is to embody that which I am, the One.
I admit, I prefer not to talk about my own nature very much, as most of these thoughts are relevant only to myself and my own journey. You could simply say that I am 'being groomed' for a position in the planetary hierarchy.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
It might perhaps give some explanation that I believe I have already completed the path to 6D once, on the negative path, and am now returning to re-polarize and traverse the positive path.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 08:40 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: It might perhaps give some explanation that I believe I have already completed the path to 6D once, on the negative path, and am now returning to re-polarize and traverse the positive path.
That's what I think I'm doing. After leaving the negative path where would you find a better place to be than a 3D planet with a veil that makes you forget all of that to explore a different polarity of experiences.
Surely ain't gonna go knock to a sto social memory complex to become part of them in one go. Gotta build up the guts to face their disdain of you and maybe work your own disdain of them.
I think the head elements of the Orion Group are changing because a new phase is engaged and many are leaving as their work is done.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Perhaps you have forgotten well, but I remember much. Much of my work is with remembering.
Also, I certainly am not worried about acceptance. I am here to find my own forgiveness and peace.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
(05-11-2015, 08:44 PM)Tan.rar Wrote: Perhaps you have forgotten well, but I remember much. Much of my work is with remembering.
Also, I certainly am not worried about acceptance. I am here to find my own forgiveness and peace.
I seem to avoid rememberance, I see it not as necessary at least in this incarnation.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
The reason I believe I am on this planet in particular is because it is the focal point of my karma. There are other planets involved too, quite a saga, but it all comes back here. Finish where you start.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
I try to not avoid anything, especially within myself. I do not think in terms of necessity, I think in terms of experience. If it comes, I take it. If I see it, I pursue it. This is how I explore my identity.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Minyatur - 05-11-2015
I seem to have lived off my karma in my previous incarnations here. My only karma in this incarnation seems to be related to my soul-mate, other than that my worst enemy is boredom...
She suffers from how ugly the state of this world is, if we/she too was part of creating this climate then it seems like a natural karma.
RE: Minimally Harvestable - Aion - 05-11-2015
Easy to be bored when you have no purpose for yourself.
It's a little more complicated for me, since I'm one of the reasons the world is the way it is.