(09-09-2011, 04:46 PM)Oceania Wrote: i think we should start a thread on this. i tried meds and then woke up. gave up meds, sort of. most pharms are there to dumb us down and make us sick so we buy meds. imo. but everyone does what they feel is best at the time. i don't regret using medication when i felt it was right. it helped when it worked.

---

i take supplements now too. what do you take Ky?

• Flaxseed oil (veg for fish oil, Omega 3)
  
• DLPA D-L Phenylalanine
  
• DMAE dimethylaminoethyline
  

(09-10-2011, 05:14 PM)GreatSpirit Wrote: After I went into the hospital in 2008, they prescribed me some of that Abilify. Big mistake. It made me totally restless and they had to give me a medication to counter the effects of the Abilify. A med for a med??? I don't think so. I felt a little bit better, but I feel meds prescribed by a doctor in league with the pharmaceutical companies is not the way for me.

I can deal with being alone and anti-social and depressed. I've had years of practice but I can do it. I guess my real problem is that I don't have a job now and I'm financially strapped. I hate doing meaningless work and I despise the 9-5 rat race routine, but I have altogether $15. Ironic I can deal with all that, but I can't deal with finances. Unfortunately, the world is run on money and its very sad.

I'm honestly terrified to go back to work because people terrify me, especially the public. It's like I already paid my dues dealing with snotty and ignorant people when I worked at Wal-Mart and the call center. It's not that I am that lazy. I just hate dealing with crappy miserable people who have nothing better to do than b!tch at a complete stranger over something that is usually so minute and trivial.

I just feel that if I have to slave away being yelled and cursed in front of the public just to make 8-9 dollars an hour to eek my way through life, then thats a life not worth living at all, especially for one who worked their a$$ off in college to get a degree writing meaningless papers that never got me anywhere in the long run. But lock me in a room by myself, put me on auto-pilot doing the same easy random work and pay me 10-11 dollars an hour and I'll be fine as long as I don't have to deal with people or BS. Many of you would say that thats insane, but I don't do well with stress at work. My life is already crappy, so why should work make it even more crappier? It's like the Universe saying, "ok, we'll give you a job. But we're going to still make you broke and on top of that, we're going to have you deal with the meanest people around!! ahaha!!!"

All I ask from God right now is just to approve my unemployment (which I believe I deserve anyway!) so I can have some peace of mind. At this point, there really isn't anything anyone can do for me.

(09-09-2011, 07:50 PM)Namaste Wrote:

(09-09-2011, 03:44 AM)yossarian Wrote: Is this a joke?

Not at all, I think that most 'standard' therapists use out-dated paradigms regarding consciousness and the mind, and have no idea, at all, about the spiritual nature of catalyst and the nature of time.

Quote:There are many cases in which subjects have been with the same therapist for years, with little improvement. Some have even caused further damage by perpetually referencing the (painful) past before the subject is mentally/emotionally ready to do so. There are also cases in which the subject becomes addicted/dependant upon therapy.

Quote:In my personal opinion, there are better options. Hypnotherapy, for example, along with guidance from a person who has a balanced understanding of both scientific and spiritual aspects of consciousness/mind. Treatment can be holistic. Those that practice just one side of the coin, as such, are oblivious to much wisdom.

Quote:Bashar and Abraham also state that learning to accept that the past and future do no exist, and do not define you, is a means to springboard to the place of mental stability that would then entail the reviewing of said memories, but from a more empowered position. I personally find this an invaluable stage in the process, one which is not part of the 'standard' curriculum. They have even said that revisiting the past continually can be of no value whatsoever. I trust those sources. Whether you do or not, is up to you.

(09-09-2011, 10:13 PM)3DMonkey Wrote: I have always wondered why therapy education doesn't take into account the very psychological relationship between therapist and patient.

(09-10-2011, 09:18 PM)yossarian Wrote: Most modern psychologists take a holistic point of view and address both the person as a whole as well as each aspect of the person: meaning physical, mental, spiritual, emotional, social. Psychologists are keenly aware that health in one aspect can help or hurt the other aspects.

(09-10-2011, 07:21 PM)unity100 Wrote: have you checked the links i have given ?

(09-10-2011, 10:02 PM)3DMonkey Wrote: It is the idea that the therapist is not experiencing these very same things themselves whilst applying their profession for the others' benefit. 'Round and round we go, where it stops no one knows.'

Quote:I'm basically saying that any therapist would absolutely have their hands full with me.... (light bulb) Anyone interesting in making a documentary to see how many therapists I could get to recommend me to someone else? 'How many therapists does it take to get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop?

(09-10-2011, 10:39 PM)GreatSpirit Wrote: I have, but in all honesty, I don't have any ambition to find a job right now. I feel like such a fool listening to my parents telling me to take that job that I got transferred to after I got laid off. My own supervisor told me to just take unemployment!

I don't know whats going to happen to me, but I'm not begging for handouts and I am not degrading myself to a service job where I'll get bitched at and made fun of, just like Wal-Mart. I'll have to give my cat to my parents because I can't feed him and my parents are remodeling their house so there is no room for me and my belongings there, and they are the last ones who want me back there. I really don't get along with my step-father so I can't go back.

The rent isn't getting paid for October so I'll get a nice eviction notice in a few weeks as well.

I don't even care anymore. I just want my cat to have a good home. He's the only thing that brought me real joy. I just don't care.....f*ck-it all.

(09-10-2011, 07:21 PM)unity100 Wrote: have you checked the links i have given ?

(09-10-2011, 10:41 PM)yossarian Wrote:

(09-10-2011, 10:02 PM)3DMonkey Wrote: It is the idea that the therapist is not experiencing these very same things themselves whilst applying their profession for the others' benefit. 'Round and round we go, where it stops no one knows.'

Most therapists agree with you though. Most therapists do recognize that they are constantly and inescapably affected by the therapy process and by their patients. It's like the #1 challenge of the therapist to creatively manage this situation to be the best therapist they can be.

The therapist is using their own beingness as a tool to try and help others. Good therapists are keenly aware of this and their entire focus is on using their tool properly.

Quote:I'm basically saying that any therapist would absolutely have their hands full with me.... (light bulb) Anyone interesting in making a documentary to see how many therapists I could get to recommend me to someone else? 'How many therapists does it take to get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop?

The job of giving therapy is to offer yourself as a tool that others can use to help themselves. The therapist is only as useful to you as you make him or her. Like any tool.

I'm sure you would be a challenging patient with challenging issues, but there are plenty of psychologists willing to hang in there with you regardless of how uncomfortable it might be for them. There is nothing wrong with a referral as long as you eventually meet up with someone who is confident and enlightened enough to understand.

(09-10-2011, 10:41 PM)yossarian Wrote: Honestly, it sounds like your issues with your mom are being projected on the entire field. So you think all therapists are going to act to like your mom, or that all therapists see you in the way you believe you mom sees you.

(09-10-2011, 10:41 PM)yossarian Wrote: The therapy process, if both parties are being sincere, can be extremely uncomfortable and challenging for both people, but that is part of the process. At the very least it is making some good catalyst available.

(09-10-2011, 10:41 PM)yossarian Wrote: How many people in the world will talk to you seriously about the Law of One, and are educated and open-minded enough to have meaningful things to say, regardless of whether they believe in it or not? Psychologists are one of the few actual professions where people spend their lives talking about stuff like this. Their entire job is to be able to help you clarify your beliefs including spiritual beliefs, while respecting your free will.

Anyway it's a shame that it has such a bad image because there are few things that are more enlightening in this world than having deep conversations about beliefs, feelings, and patterns of behaviour.

(09-10-2011, 10:39 PM)GreatSpirit Wrote: I don't know whats going to happen to me, but I'm not begging for handouts and I am not degrading myself to a service job where I'll get bitched at and made fun of, just like Wal-Mart.

I'll have to give my cat to my parents because I can't feed him and my parents are remodeling their house so there is no room for me and my belongings there, and they are the last ones who want me back there. I really don't get along with my step-father so I can't go back.

Quote:I don't even care anymore. I just want my cat to have a good home. He's the only thing that brought me real joy. I just don't care.....f*ck-it all.

(09-10-2011, 07:21 PM)unity100 Wrote: have you checked the links i have given ?

(09-10-2011, 11:07 PM)yossarian Wrote: P.S. Movies do not give good depictions of the therapeutic process. Even the most accurate movies typically have major distortions for the sake of entertainment, e.g. In Treatment which is probably the most accurate show about therapy but has to do big embellishments for the sake of TV.

(09-10-2011, 05:37 AM)Ankh Wrote: What I wanted to say is that by saying that a person, who is in service to the mankind in the way s/he believes is right, doing it wrong, would be doing a disservice to those who seek that kind of vibration and do get help; and to that being.

(09-10-2011, 11:31 PM)3DMonkey Wrote:

(09-10-2011, 11:07 PM)yossarian Wrote: P.S. Movies do not give good depictions of the therapeutic process. Even the most accurate movies typically have major distortions for the sake of entertainment, e.g. In Treatment which is probably the most accurate show about therapy but has to do big embellishments for the sake of TV.

The therapy profession does not take into account IQ.

Quote:... This is disheartening to me. In all, pure, honesty, therapists, for what their purpose is, can be found in the darnedest places. ... A newborn child (apologies for redundancy here, but I am thinking of hogey11, quite frankly) can sometimes offer more than a textbook educated somebody can. And this is the point that has been brought to attention about the neglected spiritual aspects of the degree-ridden.

(09-10-2011, 05:14 PM)GreatSpirit Wrote: After I went into the hospital in 2008, they prescribed me some of that Abilify. Big mistake. It made me totally restless and they had to give me a medication to counter the effects of the Abilify. A med for a med??? I don't think so. I felt a little bit better, but I feel meds prescribed by a doctor in league with the pharmaceutical companies is not the way for me.

I can deal with being alone and anti-social and depressed. I've had years of practice but I can do it. I guess my real problem is that I don't have a job now and I'm financially strapped. I hate doing meaningless work and I despise the 9-5 rat race routine, but I have altogether $15. Ironic I can deal with all that, but I can't deal with finances. Unfortunately, the world is run on money and its very sad.

I'm honestly terrified to go back to work because people terrify me, especially the public. It's like I already paid my dues dealing with snotty and ignorant people when I worked at Wal-Mart and the call center. It's not that I am that lazy. I just hate dealing with crappy miserable people who have nothing better to do than b!tch at a complete stranger over something that is usually so minute and trivial.

I just feel that if I have to slave away being yelled and cursed in front of the public just to make 8-9 dollars an hour to eek my way through life, then thats a life not worth living at all, especially for one who worked their a$$ off in college to get a degree writing meaningless papers that never got me anywhere in the long run. But lock me in a room by myself, put me on auto-pilot doing the same easy random work and pay me 10-11 dollars an hour and I'll be fine as long as I don't have to deal with people or BS. Many of you would say that thats insane, but I don't do well with stress at work. My life is already crappy, so why should work make it even more crappier? It's like the Universe saying, "ok, we'll give you a job. But we're going to still make you broke and on top of that, we're going to have you deal with the meanest people around!! ahaha!!!"

All I ask from God right now is just to approve my unemployment (which I believe I deserve anyway!) so I can have some peace of mind. At this point, there really isn't anything anyone can do for me.

(09-11-2011, 01:26 AM)Meerie Wrote: Ah but I don't think anyone said the shrinks were doing it all wrong!

Quote:To the one seeking advice on how to further proceed it may be useful to hear about both sides, that is all.

(09-11-2011, 02:01 AM)yossarian Wrote:

(09-10-2011, 11:31 PM)3DMonkey Wrote:

(09-10-2011, 11:07 PM)yossarian Wrote: P.S. Movies do not give good depictions of the therapeutic process. Even the most accurate movies typically have major distortions for the sake of entertainment, e.g. In Treatment which is probably the most accurate show about therapy but has to do big embellishments for the sake of TV.

The therapy profession does not take into account IQ.

1. This isn't true. IQ and academic performance are strongly correlated and you need high academic performance to become a therapist. The competition is tremendous, straight As are not enough. (The actual IQ metric was originally created specifically to measure academic performance in children in a standardized school setting. Only later on did pop culture turn it into this big number that defines your worth as a human being.)

Quote:... This is disheartening to me. In all, pure, honesty, therapists, for what their purpose is, can be found in the darnedest places. ... A newborn child (apologies for redundancy here, but I am thinking of hogey11, quite frankly) can sometimes offer more than a textbook educated somebody can. And this is the point that has been brought to attention about the neglected spiritual aspects of the degree-ridden.

... but newborn babies have low IQs. So which is it? Do therapists need high IQs or don't they?

IQ was invented by psychologists who believed in eugenics and it's a lot of bullshit anyway. Society latched onto the concept and governments promoted it because it's a great way to divide people into elites and non-elites. One of the things my "evil" psych textbooks taught me is that society's obsession with IQ has a lot to do with society wanting to divide people using simple tests and very little to do with anything meaningful or scientific.

Your talk of IQ sounds incredibly elitist. Low IQ people are perfectly capable of having therapeutic personalities.

Quote:Depression is potentially inevitable. It’s so much a part of our potential that whole types of music and art are defined by it. Whenever you struggle to the point your strength fails you, you will go into at least a temporary depression.Mostly, we get in trouble with depression, because of our beliefs surrounding the state of being. Our value judgements, or the idea we have or were taught regarding how to deal with depression. Like the idea that trying to forget it will make it get better. Forgetting that our body has needs can wind up making you very dead. Well, your mind has needs also.
One of the needs of the mind is managing your mental and emotional strength. When we strain our muscles so much that they scream in pain, most of us know to stop. We rest a bit and either try the same task again, let our bodies get over the pain, or while we are resting we think of another way to perform that task that doesn’t involve so much strain. This is very natural. But when it comes to the mind, we seem to believe that it should be able to do anything, all of the time, constantly. When the mind begins to hurt what do we do? The mind can indeed hurt. It doesn’t have pain sensors. Mental pain results in the same thing as physical pain does, stiffness.
Most people just push on, in my experience.
Judge it as bad.

Medicate. That seems to be the answer for a lot of things. Medication is very often self sabotage, and institutions only care if society approves of how they handle things.
Rest, meditate, put mind to other parts of your reality to remind you you are not trapped by this depression. This is a good strategy.
Everything on this planet survives and thrives by adapting. What happens if you drive a nail deeply into a tree? It grows around it. Yes. It doesn’t fix it. It doesn’t destroy it. It doesn’t obsess on why a nail was driven into its body.
You put a bucket on it, catch the sap, make maple syrup. Yes. Sometimes you just bleed. It bleeds sap, and our mind bleeds also. It’s called sorrow. We weep.
The tree that doesn’t bend in the storm breaks. You have to be strong enough to be weak. You cannot avoid points of depression in your life, everyone will have them, but with understanding they will be a strength and not a threatening disease.
Your thoughts are welcome. Be well friends.
Travis Saunders
Dragon Intuitive
~science,mysticism,spirituality~
http://dragonintuitive.com/needs-of-the-mind/

Quote: To take depression somewhere useful… A plant grows from its roots. We grow from that lowest of our emotional points, but we can grow. If the forces we choose for ourselves are too harsh, we grow twisted, like a blighted tree. But if we grow from our inner game, we will grow in the true way that is meant for us.Ever notice that children will just sing or drum or play pretend without really intending anything by it? They don’t even have to be taught. Left to their own devices they just find something to do, and the defining factor is joy. It is fun and happiness at being themselves. We all do still have that. We have just ignored it.
Growth isn’t playing simple games your whole life. Growth would have been continuing to play and letting that grow in depth and range with our experience. We don’t as adults have to all go play hide and seek to be wise, but we do need to understand that we can choose that if we want, and realize that we have countless options and even ways of elaborating on that.
We can choose based on what comes naturally to us. Some children don’t play chase games, but sing all day long. Some children build things from sticks and mud. Others don’t try to build anything, but instead draw lines in the dirt. They are all just playing. No game better than any other, but some games are better for them personally. When they share their games with their friends, then everyone’s play is enriched. They can grow from that. What would this be if our adult world didn’t cut itself off from these roots?
A lot more fun. Peaceful. Perhaps more sane as well. Enlightened.
So about depression in summary. You don’t have to go backward, but do it if you really want to in time or space. Likewise, you don’t have to go forward, but do it if you feel drawn forward. If the way forward feels healthy and whole and holy.
You can even go sideways. I like going sideways myself. I do it when, though I know a thing, I ask someone else anyway just to see what they will say about it. This makes for a fuller moment. I like my moments that way. It isn’t just about me in the sideways moment. It’s about me and you also, and on any given day, you can play Ring Around The Rosie. Go all the directions, and fall down at the end of the day when it’s time for bed. Would that be so bad, really?
When you don’t know about a choice, play the Hokie Pokie. Put your right foot in, then take it back out again. That is ok to do. This is why laughter is healing, but laughter is not an idea. It’s not a sound you make with your voice, though it can include that.
Thoughts about depression? Feet! It is indeed all about feet. [Contemplates the holy holey socks.]
I am going to go play a different game now. Enjoy your play my friends. Take care, take fair, and carnival too.
Your thoughts are welcome. Be well friends.
Travis Saunders
Dragon Intuitive
~science,mysticism,spirituality~
http://dragonintuitive.com/we-can-grow/

(09-11-2011, 02:01 AM)yossarian Wrote: IQ and academic performance are strongly correlated

(09-11-2011, 06:47 PM)Pickle Wrote:

(09-11-2011, 02:01 AM)yossarian Wrote: IQ and academic performance are strongly correlated

Huh? Academic performance to me is how perfectly you do what you are told. I have a supposed high IQ and a decent paying job without even gaining a 9th grade degree.

I am definitely not good at doing what I am told. I got expelled second day of my freshman year. Boy did I know how to party.

(09-11-2011, 02:23 AM)kycahi Wrote: I asked about approving the unemployment, and God said, "I'm still thinking about it. We'll see." I take that to mean that if you don't get the unemployment, something else good will happen for you. That's kind of what I think'll happen, anyway. This thread has lots of good advice. Follow some of it and let us know. WE ALL CARE, REALLY.

(09-12-2011, 03:06 AM)GreatSpirit Wrote: a comet would not have the gravitational effect to disturb our planet, unless it was some kind of star type object.

(09-12-2011, 05:20 AM)Namaste Wrote: Fantastic! Well manifested ;¬)

That gratefulness will draw more of the same to you - stay in that vibration and you'll continue to see how supported you are :¬)

(09-07-2011, 10:02 PM)GreatSpirit Wrote: As for being homeless, I honestly don't want to be because the winter is coming up, but I KNOW my mom will try to commit me to the mental hospital. I was there in 2008 because I dealt with my first break up and it wasn't really a fun experience, but my mom will ask me, "are you suicidal" and if I say yes, my a$$ will be in the hospital very quickly. She would do that. Ironic, she is a nurse in a state mental hospital. If I say no, then I'll get a huge a$$ lecture on how I have to work to survive and live comfortably. They are very money oriented people.

(09-08-2011, 06:30 PM)yossarian Wrote: Do yourself a favor. Get a job at McDonald's and spend your last pennies on a shrink. Ask the therapist for a discount since you're poor, they will oblige you.

(09-07-2011, 09:28 PM)ahktu Wrote: I've been in these types of situations, and the basic truth I've found is that if you continuously focus on the negative, thinking of everything that can go wrong, you will continuously find yourself in a negative situation where everything goes wrong. You are creating that reality for yourself.

Quote:G: Q’uo, M writes: “Can personal events be metaphysically manipulated by negatively-oriented entities in order to give the outer appearance of synchronicity? If so, how does this demonstrate the Law of One and how can one best discern between true and false synchronicity?

We are those of Q’uo, and are aware of your query, my brother. My brother, we would say that it is entirely possible that negative entities might be interested in a certain entity and might find it useful to manipulate events so as to create synchronicity that would help to persuade a person to feel that certain thoughts were helpful. As always, those behind the veil, unable to see the true vibrations of unseen friends, must depend upon their powers of observation and discernment.

If an unseen friend of the negative orientation were attempting to persuade you, for instance, that it was a good idea to break free of a relationship or otherwise destabilize your life, it would work only if the person being persuaded wanted that persuasion. Consequently, we would encourage each seeker to look at synchronicities and rather than scooping them up wholesale without thought, look at and ponder the pattern being made by synchronicity. If the pattern is one which does not sit well with you for some reason, we would encourage you to trust that and to lift away from finding importance in such synchronicity.

The principle of the Law of One which bears upon this question is the principle of free will. This instrument, for instance, was once given the negative impression that she could not breathe. Try as she might she could not bring air into her lungs. However, this psychic greeting was unable to be effective because its effect depended upon the instrument panicking and losing faith that all was well.

As it happened, this instrument was well aware of the greeting, as it had been ongoing for some time, and simply walked on, thinking that, probably, eventually she would fall to the ground because there was no more air and that when unconscious the psychic greeting would no longer have an effect and she would regain her ability to breathe. Consequently, there was no fear. And after perhaps a minute of this situation being ongoing it lifted away and was gone.

There is a tremendous amount of play that you have with the steering of your mind. There is a great deal to learn about the discipline that you can exercise over your thoughts. And it is the work of an incarnation to become an artist with perception working with thought in a creative way but not fooling the self; being insightful but not being clever; moving into the verticality of a moment so that it opens up like a flower rather than moving horizontally past the moment in search of a distant goal.

The web of synchronicity is valid and it indeed is offered from all sides that are attracted to you and your situation. It takes discernment to sort out the tremendous richness of information that is coming into you at all times. It is not the work of a moment. It is not the work of a year. It is the work of a lifetime. And we hope that each of you enjoys this carnival ride. Remember, dear ones, that what you see often depends upon how you choose to perceive.

The one known as L spoke recently in a circle like this one of experiencing a concert, first as full of negativity where the words to the songs seemed to be violent and hurtful and the energy of those in the audience seemed to be shallow and driven by substance abuse. Yet she persisted and moved to a level where she was able to see the love pouring out of every heart, every instrument, every note. And her environment changed from an environment of hell to one of heaven.

You have this capacity within you to make heaven of hell or hell of heaven. We encourage you to believe in the truth, which is that heaven lies within you. It is accessible. It is as if you were looking at a closed door. The key to that door is silence. Open it. Walk into your own heart and fly away. There you are safe. There you are loved. There you shall become capable of loving. We are with you; the angels are with you.

(09-09-2011, 02:35 AM)Meerie Wrote: The problem with shrinks is that most are trained only to make you "function" in society again, and that will often include giving you prescription meds, that have lots of harmful side effects.

I had what could be termed a "mental breakdown" at the age of 28 / 29 and going to the shrink only aggravated the problems I had, by their method of focusing on the negative only. Besides no one of them could relate to the metaphysical aspects and my paranormal experiences.

(09-09-2011, 05:37 AM)Oceania Wrote: i haven't even got a job, i'm 28 and have never had a real job because of my self esteem and developmental and mental issues. if you're able to work that's already a step up, i think you're doing great. you have your own place. stoves are a luxury not everyone has. independence is a luxury too. i need to work on my own issues somehow, from where i'm looking you seem to be doing great. not that going homeless is great but so far you have at least kept your head above the water, i wish you luck in figuring it out. i believe in you. try to be creative in what brings you joy, try to get out of survival and into doing what you want. is there anything you could have fun doing? are you artistic? or interested in engineering? or what? what is it you wanted to do before you got sidetracked? maybe you could do it now, this could be that opening. maybe you have to work a menial job for a while but at the same time somehow figure out how to get a nice job, and find your joy.

(09-09-2011, 08:13 AM)3DMonkey Wrote: Going homeless should be a freeing experience, not a depressing one. Family is important, even if they are all b******. You have the freedom to let go and roll with the punches. Accept the punches that are coming. Honestly, it sounds very liberating and not enslaving. Humility is better than pride. For instance, show up in court just for the sake of showing up. Walk in and take your punches. You must at least be here. If it all doesn't matter, then show up anyone. Show up at court. Show up at your mom's doorstep. Show up at the soup line. Go sleep at the homeless shelter tonight. Experience that stuff.

3DMonkey Wrote:But whatever you do. Whatever you do!!!! Do not turn to drugs or alcohol or you will be in pain you can't imagine. Don't turn to drugs or alcohol!!!!

Quote:Questioner: I have a question, Q’uo, but I would first like to thank you for sharing that and sharing your love with us. My question is about the substance of marijuana, the chemical THC, and what effect it has on seeking of any given seeker. My question comes from my experience, which is that it has an impact that seems to be negative on my seeking. It lowers my energy in days following exposure to it. But at the time of using the substance I do feel a certain inspiration and a sort of freedom, so that’s my question. What is the nature of this substance and its effect on seeking?

We are those of Q’uo, and are aware of your query, my brother. Each substance has complex characteristics. Each food that you eat, each liquid that you drink, has those characteristics which are generally considered positive and those characteristics which are considered undesirable and therefore called something like “side effects.” The substance, marijuana, is no exception.

In general, my brother, if you want to obtain maximally useful results from your observations and your witness during incarnation, you are best served by a completely pure and this instrument would say “sober,” base. Every substance you ingest, every substance you drink, creates not just one, but several different effects within the body, and, as the one known as S has said, it is quite so that every seeker will have a different experience of apples or asparagus or marijuana. However, none of asparagus’s side effects impact the spiritual life whereas in the case of marijuana, its effect on the spiritual life is inconstant and untrustable.

The basic principle involved in this opinion is that principle which suggests that you will be able to open your mind, your body, and your spirit more and more as you become lit from within, as you become kindled by that spirit that yearns for the perfect devotion, the truly whole giving of the self to service. As you persist along this line of seeking the veil thins for you, little by little, in a way which is safe for you.

The difficulty that we see with the use of marijuana in the spiritual seeking is that it enables you to experience an environment for which you are not naturally prepared. Thusly, while the experience is a good one, perhaps, at the time, the side effects that come with the use of marijuana, mainly the damping of the energies that you would normally have in more abundance, create the sum total experience of a positive time that you could not fully use because it was artificially created, and the cumulative effects of the use of marijuana, which involve weariness and a lack of motivation.

It is to be noted that all of these effects, both positive and seemingly negative, are temporary. The [chemicals in marijuana] are chemicals which have an effect, here and there and here and there, and then within a month’s time they are gone. Consequently, it is a relatively transparent, recreational mood changer. And as this instrument can attest, that particular substance has medicinal qualities that are very appreciated by those who have chronic pain and chronic nausea. There would be no reason for us to encourage people to think of marijuana as evil or as an agent that will lead people astray. However, in terms of improving the spiritual life, its uses are very limited.

When you wish to improve your spiritual life, turn within. There is no substance, there is no answer, there is no shortcut outside of the vast reaches of your heart. When we suggest that you go within, we truly mean to go within, to cross the boundary between the ordinary reality of everyday life and the reality that is the environment of your open heart.

Dear ones, your people have ingested and drunk and smoked and breathed in an amazing variety of natural and manmade substances through the years of your history, working with outer things to attempt to achieve a result. And no result is found that is satisfactory. Meanwhile, quietly, humbly, invisibly, person after person after person has gone within and walked through the deserts of the self, climbed the mountains of the self, sailed on the oceans of the self, lost, wandering, exultant, cast down, and in every weather and in every situation the limitless potential of consciousness awaits.

The most effective spiritual practice is to believe in the spiritual practice and to seek it as does a lover its mate. It may seem trivial or unnecessarily emotional to encourage you to have intense personal, even intimate, feelings about the spiritual life, yet it is very helpful and healthy for the spirit to yearn and to crave for the presence of the one Creator. You have that presence within you, yet it is a journey over desert and mountain and ocean, finally to come to that magic island at the center of your heart where lives love, unrestrained, wild and free. We therefore encourage you to enjoy yourselves as you will.
We do not condemn marijuana, my friends; we are simply saying that for the serious seeker, that which he manipulates shall be within himself.

In olden times and in some tribes of those who live in the indigenous way to your present day, there would be the time of dying to the self in one way or another, whether it was a case of physically being immured in a cave or [whether it was being] buried alive for a certain amount of time. There were rituals in which there was the experience of death. And when that individual arose from the sweat lodge or the shaman’s quest, for the first time there was the true appreciation of the gift of life.

To have a keener, freer, wilder experience takes patience if it is done properly. Yet when you have come into states of mind that are altered and you have moved into them naturally, you are ready for the wisdom of the experience to impress itself upon you and you are ready for the responsibility of what you now know. As the one known as Ra said, “There are no mistakes but there are sometimes surprises.” To create an environment in which your surprises are likely to please you, we encourage you to seek within.

(09-09-2011, 10:18 AM)Ruth Wrote: GreatSpirit - seems you've already had plenty of wonderful advice and encouragement here. I would only add that somewhere inside yourself you must recognize your true self simply because of the user name you selected GREAT Spirit.

Ruth Wrote:Also, I understand your frustration with your relationship to your parents. What worked best for me was not to "stand up to" my challenging parent - but rather to step back and realize that he is just a person, like me, here to learn, and is doing the best he knows how to do. I just started sending him all the love and light I could muster. He is now one of my dearest friends.

(09-09-2011, 01:44 PM)kycahi Wrote: I was depressive most of my life and only thought that I was perennially tired or sleepy. I usually wore a neutral face or a frown. One day something clicked in me and I decided to smile to strangers and acquaintances. Most of them smiled back, even though many dropped the smile even before they were out of my view.

kycahi Wrote:So go ahead and pretend to be happy until you become happy. "Fake it until you make it!"

kycahi Wrote:I take supplements and meds for the depression, and am grateful for them. Side effects are minimal for me right now, thank One.