(05-12-2020, 09:25 PM)Diana Wrote: I have no idea if it would be better without the veil in terms of evolution of consciousness. 

Quote:105.17 Questioner: Now, as an example I would like to take the distortion of a disease or bodily malfunction prior to [the] veil and compare it to that after the veil. Let us assume that the conditions that Jim, for instance, experienced with respect to his kidney malfunction had been an experience that occurred prior to the veil. Would this experience have occurred prior to the veil? Would it have been different? And if so, how?

Ra: I am Ra. The anger of separation is impossible without the veil. The lack of awareness of the body’s need for liquid is unlikely without the veil. The decision to contemplate perfection in discipline is quite improbable without the veil.

(05-13-2020, 11:05 AM)sillypumpkins Wrote: I believe that, while the veil goes hand in hand with suffering, it is absolutely vital for the evolution of consciousness. Of course we don't like to see others suffer, but ultimately, it is the suffering and the "darkness" that often brings people to the light. And so, without the veil, it would be like the garden of eden. There would be no reason to grow. That's just how I see it.

I don't like to see my loved ones suffer. I have a close, close relative who is in the midst of a really dark time right now. It pains me on one level, on the emotional level perhaps. But on a higher level, I know that this is something that will aid his growth, in one way or another.

(05-13-2020, 11:47 AM)Diana Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 11:05 AM)sillypumpkins Wrote: I believe that, while the veil goes hand in hand with suffering, it is absolutely vital for the evolution of consciousness. Of course we don't like to see others suffer, but ultimately, it is the suffering and the "darkness" that often brings people to the light. And so, without the veil, it would be like the garden of eden. There would be no reason to grow. That's just how I see it.

I don't like to see my loved ones suffer. I have a close, close relative who is in the midst of a really dark time right now. It pains me on one level, on the emotional level perhaps. But on a higher level, I know that this is something that will aid his growth, in one way or another.

It is difficult to see others suffer. But my point included other life forms, which is at the center of my concern. The planet, plant life, animal life, and even insects (which are poisoned and sickened continually by people spraying pesticides in their yards. I used to have countless scorpions in my last back yard when I lived in an urban setting, because all of my neighbors sprayed. You can't kill scorpions with pesticide, they just sicken. So they would migrate to a spot where there was no poison). This is the sort of suffering that I find so unnecessary. It may be necessary for a 3rd-density human to suffer to evolve, but those same humans cause suffering for other life forms in order to learn. I comprehend that all is one, and in some way that learning flows to those other life forms, but the suffering humans cause just seems SOOO unnecessary to me just so they can learn faster.

Central to the question I have about control regarding the veil is this: Why must we evolve faster? Why isn't it just okay to limp along slowly (if that's the case) in the evolution of consciousness, without a veil? Toward what end? So the Creator can experience itself or something of that nature? Though all is one—it still feels like being a pawn. And that might be fine, except for the unnecessary suffering of real innocents.

I comprehend that my view here is so very limited, ironically due to the veil. I understand that the key is to make choices. But it seems to me that this is part of an outside plan, and that is what's at issue, and seems like control to me—that 3rd-density beings, here, are being experimented on with this particular control. 

Understand that I am just canvassing this subject, and I'm not trying to be right or be a cosmic conspiracy theorist.

Quote:79.27 Questioner: I was just wondering since this seems to be the crux of the experiment— this seems to be the large breaking point between no extension of the first distortion and the extension of the first distortion— what the result of this original experiment was with respect to that which was created from it. What was the result of that?

Ra: I am Ra. This is previously covered material. The result of these experiments has been a more vivid, varied, and intense experience of Creator by Creator.

(05-13-2020, 02:21 PM)flofrog Wrote: Lol, you’re  fine Silly !

I wonder if in our quest for helping Gaia, it might not make it easier to request first harmony and balance for first and second density entities, before we address the third density humans ...

(05-13-2020, 02:25 PM)Aion Wrote: The Universe was just bored, guys.

(05-13-2020, 02:57 PM)Aion Wrote: The suffering is samsara, but the truth is nirvana.

Quote:Dukkha (suffering, incapable of satisfying, painful) is an innate characteristic of existence in the realm of samsara
Samudaya (origin, arising) of this dukkha, which arises or "comes together" with taṇhā ("craving, desire or attachment")
Nirodha (cessation, ending) of this dukkha can be attained by the renouncement or letting go of this taṇhā
Magga (path, Noble Eightfold Path) is the path leading to renouncement of tanha and cessation of dukkha.

(05-13-2020, 11:47 AM)Diana Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 11:05 AM)sillypumpkins Wrote: I believe that, while the veil goes hand in hand with suffering, it is absolutely vital for the evolution of consciousness. Of course we don't like to see others suffer, but ultimately, it is the suffering and the "darkness" that often brings people to the light. And so, without the veil, it would be like the garden of eden. There would be no reason to grow. That's just how I see it.

I don't like to see my loved ones suffer. I have a close, close relative who is in the midst of a really dark time right now. It pains me on one level, on the emotional level perhaps. But on a higher level, I know that this is something that will aid his growth, in one way or another.

It is difficult to see others suffer. But my point included other life forms, which is at the center of my concern. The planet, plant life, animal life, and even insects (which are poisoned and sickened continually by people spraying pesticides in their yards. I used to have countless scorpions in my last back yard when I lived in an urban setting, because all of my neighbors sprayed. You can't kill scorpions with pesticide, they just sicken. So they would migrate to a spot where there was no poison). This is the sort of suffering that I find so unnecessary. It may be necessary for a 3rd-density human to suffer to evolve, but those same humans cause suffering for other life forms in order to learn. I comprehend that all is one, and in some way that learning flows to those other life forms, but the suffering humans cause just seems SOOO unnecessary to me just so they can learn faster.

Central to the question I have about control regarding the veil is this: Why must we evolve faster? Why isn't it just okay to limp along slowly (if that's the case) in the evolution of consciousness, without a veil? Toward what end? So the Creator can experience itself or something of that nature? Though all is one—it still feels like being a pawn. And that might be fine, except for the unnecessary suffering of real innocents.

I comprehend that my view here is so very limited, ironically due to the veil. I understand that the key is to make choices. But it seems to me that this is part of an outside plan, and that is what's at issue, and seems like control to me—that 3rd-density beings, here, are being experimented on with this particular control. 

Understand that I am just canvassing this subject, and I'm not trying to be right or be a cosmic conspiracy theorist.

(05-13-2020, 04:24 PM)Aion Wrote: Never mind those of us who make it out and then come back to help the others.

(05-13-2020, 05:26 PM)Aion Wrote: All that wonderful blue light.

(05-13-2020, 06:05 PM)Aion Wrote: For some reason that brings to mind the concept of Rigpa in Tibetan Dzogchen.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rigpa

(05-13-2020, 08:41 PM)Asolsutsesvyl Wrote: In large part, what people do on this physical level is just like paint on a canvas. In that sense, there's no bullshit - only bits and pieces which add up to a larger painting. The veil prevents viewing the painting, however it may look, and all impressions within the veil of how the painting looks are actually things included in the painting.

Almost everything which people imagine about the meaning of what they do mainly has the value of influencing what they do. Because the gap between imagination at this level and reality is almost complete, almost nothing in imagination works as an accurate description, no matter how much happens in connection with it. It is only a game when people, for a little while, think otherwise. As I very often do myself.

Almost all descriptions we can come up with are false. Almost everything which people have believed in over the entire course of human history has been pure bullshit. Almost everything which, for the time, is presented as an exception, is not. There's no end to the games of that kind being played as long as the veil is there.