Some Skepticism

[lightning]

I have been totally hooked on the LOO books since I first found them in the early 1980’s. I believe at the time I first discovered them, only The Ra Material had been published, and I found it through an ad in Fate magazine, if anyone can remember that. I remember awaiting the next volume almost without being able to stand having to wait. I’ve probably read the books dozens, maybe even hundreds of times over the years and rarely have them too far away from me. Yet at the same time, I’ve found myself at times becoming very skeptical and wondering about it all. It wasn’t until the advent of Bring4th that I was able to read comments and ideas from others regarding all of this. Let me just share a couple of things that seem to fuel my skepticism from time to time. It’s not that I’m a total skeptic at all. I still love the material, and every time I read it, it seems to renew my faith in it, but I’m just saying that these feelings surface from time to time. I’m interested to see if any others have felt the same way. This post isn’t aimed with anger at anyone in these forums. I’m merely being very honest about things within myself and questions I have. Here are some of the questions, and a few of them have more to do with the posters on the forum than with the material itself. I have only good intent in this post, and I’m not trying to begin an argument. BUT………..

Am I the only follower of LOO who has no interest in being a vegetarian? I tried it one time, and I never will again. It ain’t for me, and it never will be. I get somewhat unsettled at posts that seem to imply one can’t be spiritual without being vegetarian.

Am I the only follower who sees most (not all) conspiracy theories as a waste of time? Am I the only one who believes 911 was NOT an inside job? There probably are and have been conspiracies, but this can drift totally into paranoid and fanciful lunacy, and what difference does it make anyway? Does demonizing others fit well into “ looking into another’s eyes and seeing the Creator”, or something close to that? There seem to be people whose entire lives are fueled by a strange kind of adrenaline-driven high that comes from this kind of conspiracy thinking. I haven’t seen it to that degree in the forums, but this kind of thing is very easy to find most anywhere, and I could name some people that everyone would know, but I won’t. You probably know who I’m referring to anyway. What was it Ra said about “much talk about plots, conspiracies, etc.” or something like that

Channeling? Basically, I believe that most channels have little to say that is worthwhile. There are a handful that do, like Carla, who have done it through a kind of high calling that came from a pre-incarnative agreement. However, I do not generally seek guidance through the advice of channeled material other than LOO.

Am I the only follower that sees himself as somewhat politically conservative? This is a big one. I cringe at posts that seem to take a political position and imply or outright state that being politically liberal is essential for spiritual growth. What was it Ra said about “flowering in a political way” as being a temptation offered by the 4th density negatives?

As to the material itself, there are many instances where I have to pause and say, “wait a minute!” There are many such and some of these have been covered well in other posts, but the two that I’ve struggled with the most over the years concern the Easter Island moai having been created 60,000 years ago and the civilization on Mars. This info about Easter Island seems to be almost 100% refutable. The Rapa Nui who created the moai lived there less than 1000 years ago, and their history is well documented. They created the statues, and all of this has been documented by Captain Cook and others.

As to the Martians, one would think that a technologically advanced civilization from 75000 years ago would have left planet-wide evidence that was so glaring that it couldn’t be hidden. I am well aware of Hoagland’s analysis of it being….you guessed it, a conspiracy. Could this be true? I honestly don’t know, but I really wonder. But despite all that, and I truly apologize for the ranting, I remain committed to LOO, and I really am grateful for Bring4th.
PEACE

[Phoenix]

I'm sorry. But those first two questions reveal that you can't of read the Ra Material in any depth. I'm afraid I don't believe you.

[Monica]

Hi lightning! Welcome to Bring4th!

I see that you haven't spent much time on the forum yet. I invite you to explore the forum. You will find that there is actually a lot of diversity here. The answers to your questions are, respectively, No, No and No.

In fact, I got a chuckle out of the first one, after having recently participated in a verrrrrrrry heated discussion about the spiritual implications of eating animals! So no, not everyone here is a vegetarian. Quite the contrary; vegetarians seem to be the minority. No single member of this forum is representative of the views of all the others. Each member has his/her own opinions.

As to conspiracy theories and political ideologies, there too you will find members here at both ends of the spectrum, and likely many in between.

And, some of our members have even started threads voicing their skepticism about certain aspects of the Law of One. Like you, they have questioned some of it and chosen to not accept those parts. It isn't a prerequisite to accept all of the Law of One 100%. In fact, our Confederation friends have always encouraged us to use our own discernment, rather than just blindly accepting the info they offer.

Hence, not all of our members accept everything in the Law of One as absolute truth, and nor is that a requirement.

What we do have in common here is our willingness to explore the Law of One teachings, show love and respect to one another, and discuss our differences respectfully and lovingly!

So, I think Bring4th is a pretty cool place! I hope you stick around and get to know us!

[JoshC]

Well hiyas. Welcome to the forum, though you've probably been here longer than me :p

First on the skepticism: I think that a healthy dose of skepticism is good. A dollop of skepticism serves anyone in this world well, Lord knows that some people could benefit from trying some in moderation (whether that be doing more or less of it). Considering the nature of this material and that of the "New Age" field, I think that questioning is a very practical and valuable skill to have or work on.

Everyone has their own quirks. Some people are quiet, some are passionate, some are purple. Some are purple people eaters. I think that some passionate people may, from time to time, fail to be willing to be open-minded or empathetic. While that is completely their choice, I agree it can be a little bit unsettling. That said, yes you're the only spiritual person that isn't a vegetarian. Jk! Whether it be vegetarianism, debates about abortion, or anything else that is surrounded by strong convictions, the potential to offend is, to a degree, higher than with other subjects. I have my own beliefs about vegetarianism and they work for me, but I wouldn't preach them, just the same as no one else here would either (I think). That's why there's the thread that you can opt out of reading!

I don't know if you've seen it or not, but there's a weekly poll and all of our votes are placed on a spectrum of how much we believe in conspiracies. :p Nah, but really, I don't think it matters that much what conspiracies end up being right or wrong. Some people like those kinds of things, some people don't! Personally, I'm inclined to think that many conspiracies are right/true (including 9/11 being an inside job), but it really doesn't affect me if I'm right or wrong. They most likely won't be proved or disproved definitively in this lifetime, and afterward it won't matter so much.

Because of the nature of the illusion in which we all reside, matters that deal with faith, like channeling, will also never be proven or dis-proven. This in mind, I don't think more or less of any other channels, or of anyone that believes what they say. I'm only wary of channels other than Ra because of the potential for negativity to leak in.

Politics don't really matter in my opinion. I usually deal with each issue as they come up, rather than following one partisan ideology.

I dunno anything about the Easter Island bunny or about Mars :-/

So yea theres my 2¢...

Peace, Love, Light and Namasté

[jc2412]

I agree with Monica, there seems to be a fairly wide variety of experiences and views on this forum...If we were all had the exact same experience we would all end up with the exact same distortion and then what good would creation be?

I myself come from a fairly conservative background, not that I was raised that way, but heavily identified with conservatism ideals, especially in College (at a liberal university I might add). After studying the LOO I find my leanings a bit more balanced, but I'm probably still a hair to the right of center (if there such a thing).

Oh yeah, I just finished off a very nice Fillet Mignon and several shrimp and cheese stuffed jalapenos! Probably not the most healthy, but damn were they good!

[colorado]

Hi lightning

You and I have a lot in common. I am not a vegetarian. I don't believe in the vast majority of conspiracy theories (at the most I entertain the idea that some may at least be POSSIBLE), but I definitely think they are a waste of time to think about. As far as channeling, I don't really have much of an opinion on that. Some of it is real, some of it isn't. There were definitely instances where I had to step back and say "wait a minute" when I read LOO. I find it hard to believe the Martian and Maldek stuff in particular.

So you see, you aren't the only one who thinks these things. We differ in our political standpoints, as I identify myself as liberal, but I try not to get caught up in the politics game. I don't think any of it matters in the end anyway.

[Aaron]

Welcome to the forum, lightning!

You're not alone at all. You and I come from a similar angle of understanding. For example, I'm omnivorous because I listen to my body and its desires, while remaining aware and respectful of what exactly I'm consuming.

I don't think conspiracy theories are all true, or go chasing after knowledge of them. Yet I don't think our government always takes the effort or has the will to tell the citizens the full truth. I interpret things as I see them. For example, what happened on 9/11 was a huge loss of life brought about by hatred. Those who feel outcast from society, I believe, are usually the ones who spin the conspiracy theories in an attempt to be heard or gain respect. People with this mindset are apt to throwing information out there through channeling, even though it may not even really be channeling. It has the potential to be seen as a key to power/to gain followers.

I'm not involved in politics at all. I don't see politicians, I see people and their paths of learning.

But I find the channeled material that is the Law of One to be incredibly inspiring and it speaks to something deep within me. I think that's why we're all here. I'm amazed and grateful that this forum exists to connect those who are inspired by the information!

I think that whenever you read the teachings of another, you should use discernment. Whenever I pick up a new book or read anything, including channeled material, I always think "I don't have to identify with this material. It was out here in the world before I read it. It will be here after I read it. I am just picking up the information, seeing how it reflects within me, and moving along." So I use skepticism when Ra talks about bigfoot or martians. Those concepts simply aren't relevant to my spiritual path right now, so they "slide off". It's not that they're ignored. It's just like having a tool in the toolbox that's not used. Also, we have to take into account that Ra was lead by Don's questioning. Ra didn't choose the questions or preach.

I'll see you around, and please, continue to be honest with yourself! It's the fastest way to learn about yourself!

[Namaste]

Welcome lightning.

As others have said, it's healthy to ask questions. In fact, it is very important that you do so, as this yields a building of your own core truths, rather than blindly taking on those of others. Discernment is key, finding information that resonates with you.

Regarding chanelling, all the books/material I'm reading at the moment are along these lines. Ra, Latwii, Hantonn (AKA Q'uo), Abraham, Hosts of Heaven and recently Orin.

[dolphin]

Am I the only one who believes 911 was NOT an inside job?

Often times people believe, or disbelieve based on their preference rather than adhering to the objectivity of what they can know.

Particularly when we are facilitated by a conspiracy of media to believe lies over truth.

Anti-Conspiracy Kooks

If you get up one morning, stub your toe on a table, spill your morning coffee on your shirt, get a flat tire on the way to work, and have to fix it in the rain, that's called bad luck. The likelihood that a group of devious villains snuck into your house and moved your table a few inches to where they knew you would kick it, and then somehow sabotaged your coffee mug so you'd drop it, then did something to your tires to make them go flat ten minutes later, and then somehow made it rain, is pretty darn slim. And if you think all of that happened, I'd probably agree that you're a conspiracy kook.

However, it is not only possible, but quite common, for people to be "kooks" in the other direction: to not recognize conspiracies when they are obvious. For example, billions of dollars are spent by people conspiring to get you to buy a certain car. The car companies spend piles of money on crafting propaganda (advertising) to manipulate your feelings and emotions, because they want your money. Their magazine ads, TV ads, radio ads, the slogans they use, the images they choose--it's all a "conspiracy" to get your money. It happens to be a perfectly legal and moral conspiracy, at least most of the time, but it's still a lot of people CONSPIRING to get money for themselves.

The same is true of just about everything you buy, everything you see in the media, and everything you read. There are thousands of groups very deliberately trying to persuade you to give them your money. There are, after all, TRILLIONS of dollars at stake, and almost everyone would like to have lots of those dollars for themselves. So of course companies "conspire" to get you to give your money to them. I can't imagine anyone being ignorant enough to not realize that.

Another indisputable fact is that some people are not particularly honest or nice. We've all seen the example of the used car salesman doing his little psychological tricks and deceptions to dupe some poor guy into buying a lemon. And when two or more people cooperate on coming up with such a scam, that is, by definition, a conspiracy. It's as natural for bad people to do it as it is for good people to do it, if not more so. (Enron comes to mind.) When there are BILLIONS of dollars at stake, it's naive to NOT constantly be on the lookout for conspiracy, deception, and trickery. (The Wachowski Brothers' version of "Speed Racer" expresses this nicely.) Just about everyone has heard the saying, "Follow the money," yet people often seem to forget to do that. In any news story, ask yourself, who got money and power as a result of this?

Right now we have a HUGE example, involving numbers almost too big to even comprehend. Almost everyone talks as if the proposed $700,000,000,000 "bailout" is Congress irresponsibly bailing out lendors who, due to bad planning, gave out loans that couldn't be repaid. Lots of people object to the bailout, as well they should, but in doing so, they assume that the government's version of events is what really happened.

Suppose some very rich and powerful bankers were either buddies with those in Congress, had some blackmail leverage against them, or came up with some other bribe or deal which would involve Congress giving them lots of money. If Congress announced, "We're going to impose a new tax on everyone, so we can give billions of dollars to our rich banker friends," I don't think the public would be too thrilled about it. So how would they do it?

When deciding what "conspiracy theories" might be true, I like to use this simple test: What would YOU do if you were a nasty crook? It's a safe bet that anything I could think of, or anything you could think of, the nasty crooks already have thought of. For example, if I was a crook and I was in Congress (but I repeat myself), and I had some slimy deal with big bankers--foreign and domestic--that they'd do something for me if I gave them a huge pile of money, here's one thing I could do: Have them plan ahead to give out millions of loans, including to people who can't possible repay them--in fact, ESPECIALLY to those people. Once there is a nice big collection of people in debt that they'll never get out of, the bankers and the government can both say, "It's a crisis!" Then, in the name of saving the country from economic catastrophe (intentionally caused by us crooks), I send BILLIONS of dollars to my banker buddies and call it a "bailout." Where do I get the money? I take it from the people, of course, not only today, but in the future. The "bailout" is backed by my promise to keep right on taxing the poor working slobs for years to come. So in reality the scheme is a tax on everyone in the country, with the money going right to my rich and powerful buddies. But as long as it doesn't LOOK like that, and as long as most people think the "crisis" was accidental, and don't think it was a conspiracy between me and my banker buddies, they might get upset, but we'll get away with it anyway.

So is that what the "bailout" really is? It's hard to know what all happens behind closed doors, but if you ask me, the above scenario is a lot MORE likely than the banks and congress, with all their experts and advisors, going along for years having no idea that the lendors had made $700,000,000,000 in loans that would never be repaid, and then suddenly realizing it all at once. Now THAT is a kooky theory, but it is what the media presents as indisputable fact. This is no bailout, nor is it any emergency solution for some unforeseen crisis. It is a calculated, premeditated and preplanned way for a bunch of control freaks, in this country and elsewhere (don't forget the Saudi and Chinese bankers) to get lots more money out of the peasants. And they're sure that all of you will just put up with it. Yeah, you'll complain, and you might even whine to your congressman, but they couldn't care less about that. They get your money anyway. And the best part is that, if you suggest that any of the above is what really happened, most of your fellow fraud VICTIMS will ridicule YOU for it, because they're too gullible, or just too stupid, to use simple logic, taking into account human nature, to figure out what is really going on around them.




Published with permission of the author.

"My name is Dave, and I am a conspiracy theorist."


There. I did it. I finally took the first step on the long road to recovery. And it feels good. It will feel even better when I complete the program, at which time I will be able to (or so I'm told) read the morning newspaper and watch the evening news secure in the knowledge that I am being told the unvarnished truth. I will even, if I'm one of the lucky ones, be able to listen to Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly and marvel at their intellectually rigorous arguments.

Although I haven't yet been filled in on all the details of the program, I'm pretty sure that it involves the consumption of mass quantities of Prozac.

Which reminds me ... I have great news to report this week! The FDA has apparently approved Prozac for use on children as young as seven. Some talking-head on the evening news claimed that millions of depressed kids could benefit from this decision. But are there really millions of depressed kids out there in the 'land of the free'? And if so, then why are there millions of depressed kids out there?

What am I talking about? Who cares why they're depressed? Just drug them! Who cares if they're depressed? Drug them all! I foresee Toddler Prozac on the horizon. And then Infant Prozac, possibly to remedy Crying Baby Syndrome: "Does your newborn suffer from Crying Baby Syndrome? Symptoms include crying when hungry, wet, tired, or neglected. Talk to your doctor about new Infant Prozac ..."

And then ... the final frontier ... Pre-Natal Prozac: "Hello. Thank you for calling Clonaid. How may I help you? ... Yes, certainly we can create a clone for you. Would you like that with or without Prozac? ... Most people prefer the Prozac model. They're much easier to train."

Read on it gets better...
http://www.lawfulpath.com/ref/conspiracyTheory.shtml

[Lavazza]

Hello Lightning!

I haven't yet had a chance to read the other responses and I look forward to doing so soon. In short, no, you are not the only one. I have very often thought about the topics you have highlighted and you are in no way the only person to think on those lines nor do I think you are in any way off your rocker or spiritually less for holding the views you hold.

as regards vegetarianism - we have a couple good threads on this subject and although many conclude that eating meat is not for them, there are just as many that conclude that eating meat is for them. I think our forum here has been particularly friendly towards all in this regard, although I may have missed some threads. I know it can be a hot button issue for some... "How could you eat meat!" etc.

as regards conspiracy theories, I am with you my friend. I (personally speaking) do not have much patience for many conspiracy theories that are discussed at length on the internet. These include most 9/11 theories, stargate portals to Mars and other areas of the solar system, the Illuminati and others. Simultaneously I do not, and will not conclude that there is 100% no chance of those things being real. My personal opinion is that they are not, if I am wrong I'm ok with that, and who knows, perhaps it will even be proven to be the case eventually! The other reason I do not give much attention to conspiracy ideas is because inherently they promote feelings of negativity and separation within my being. I don't like that- and I can't see it as being helpful in my main 3rd density mission for this lifetime (continuing to polarize towards the positive). I should mention there are some ideas that I DO buy in to to some degree, for example that the US government has not been completely forthcoming with their position on and information of UFOs.

As regards channeling, I do believe this is a real thing, although I think there are varying degrees of it as you mentioned. I do not blame any for not believing in it though. Our culture and science is very materialistic and everything comes through that lens. This is one of the reasons, if not THE reason that parapsychology is such a fringe area of science. Not just that, but the notion of channeling comes across as very "out there". I can easily understand why someone would approach this area skeptically.

As regards politics, I haven't really thought about it much! I identify myself as left leaning if not liberal, but that's just me. I would be interested in hearing what others on this forum identify themselves as. In any case, you don't have to be left, right, in the middle or anywhere at all politically (as far as I am concerned) to be interested in these topics. And I don't think the left and right have to be like water and oil. In fact one of my good friends at work with whom I discuss philosophy all the time is a self admitted conservative. (makes for fun discussions too)

As regards Easter island statues, Mars civilizations and so forth, I think you are completely right on to be skeptical. I don't believe anyone should take information like that on in blind faith- there is no reason to in my opinion. Skepticism in general has a negative feeling attached to it on forums like this. But skepticism isn't bad. It's simply a middle ground where one says "I do not believe that without further evidence, nor do I believe that it's impossible. I simply have not made up my mind on that.". I think that's a very, very healthy place to be. I have put some thought in to some of the more fantastic claims in the Law of One books, and here is what I generally think.

There are a few possibilities. 1, the information is not true, and assuming we believe in channeling we conclude that the message was distorted (Ra confused, negative entity coming in, Carla garbling Ra's thoughts, etc.) Or 2, the information is true but we can't imagine how it might be so with our current understandings. It actually occurred to me once the very real possibility that Don wrote the entire Law of One series in an attempt to give more credibility or exposure to the area of spiritual ufology- he was certainly well trained enough in engineering / sciences and may have had the motivation. But I can't believe this was the case by the simple virtue of Carla continuing on and dedicating her life to the Law of One message- now more than 30 years in doing so. There are many other clues that the contact is valid, but Carla herself is the biggest one.

to respond directly about Easter island, I believe Ra mentions somewhere in there about later civilizations creating statues in replication of the other, older ones (there is even documentation of a statue that was mid-way through being carved). As to ancient Mars civilization having existed as late as 75k years ago- I agree. It's hard to swallow that information without wondering where all the signs of them are today. It could be that it's all buried under the surface of Mars today- or it may be that it was much longer ago than 75k years.

There are many other subjects I'm confused about too, and have written about, most prominently the construction of the great pyramid. Who knows about these things... not me. I try to suspend belief when I read these things in the Ra material. I mostly just focus on what I cannot deny rings with truth and clarity to me- the information about unity and an intelligent creator.

But I don't see why we shouldn't question or challenge some of the more amazing topics. I would welcome your creation of threads about specific ideas such as the Easter Island statues for example. Write what you think is credible, or non-credible about the claim and perhaps we could get a good discussion going. I would hate for any subject to become taboo- and I would hope we could all approach it with complete objectivity or at least complete empathy and understanding for other members who hold vastly different opinions than our own. It may end up helping everyone understand the subject more- and we might learn how to become more understanding and loving of each other in the process.

I'm glad you've joined in the forum.

[Monica]

Often times people believe, or disbelieve based on their preference rather than adhering to the objectivity of what they can know.

Good point, dolphin. It's just as easy to automatically disbelieve all or most 'conspiracy theories' as it is to gullibly believe them. Why not look at each one objectively? Of those I've bothered to research, I've found some to be outlandish and totally devoid of substance, while others were based on rock-solid, irrefutable scientific evidence.

Sometimes, the issue isn't whether there is evidence for that particular theory or not. The issue is whether people are willing to objectively look at the evidence, or are they quick to automatically assume it's a kooky 'conspiracy theory' just because it's outside the mainstream, consensually accepted belief. And why would most people even want to look at the evidence, if they don't even know it exists? 3D reality is an illusion, and we each have the right to maintain our chosen illusion. It has been speculated that we can each find the evidence to support or refute whatever we choose to believe.

At any rate, whether we accept or refute any given diet, theory, political view, etc. is not a pre-requisite for pursuing a spiritual path. And we are certainly not all in agreement about these volatile and controversial topics!

Just the fact that we're all here, discussing higher densities, beings from other planets, channeling, etc. puts us in the category of 'kooks' by mainstream standards, so it's all rather relative.

[Monica]

their history is well documented. They created the statues, and all of this has been documented by Captain Cook and others.

I can't help but comment on this. Why is the mainstream version of history so readily accepted? How do we know it's really true, just because someone wrote it down as such?

It's a well known fact that the victors write the history books. For example, take the European invasion of the Americas. The account recorded by the Europeans differs wildly from that passed down by the Native Americans.

Same with the Christian conquest of Pagan Europe.

In both of these cases, the vanquished were depicted as 'brutal savages,' while the victors were depicted as 'civilized redeemers.'

Which is true?

Then there are the religious texts. In the various 'holy' books, the authors thought that 'God' showed favoritism towards them. Does this mean it was true, just because they believed it to be true and recorded it as such?

Is it possible that some ancient people found those monoliths and gave themselves credit for building them?

Consider this: Suppose you were the leader of a primitive tribe, living in an area that had massive structures, and no one knew who created them. Now suppose a neighboring tribe invaded your land. Is it far-fetched to consider that you might have LIED about having built the structures, in order to frighten off the invaders?

And then the lie got passed down through the centuries...

Who knows? But it's a possibility. As for me, I personally trust Ra more than I do humans who lived centuries ago.

[crystl37]

I completely agree with Monica. I am new to Bring4th, I have been lurking for a month or so and I look forward to joining in the discussions here. I just finished reading an old thread titled 'unbelievable moon bases and wrong science', the subject of both of these threads are an active catalyst for me today. A friend from another site on which I comment and have contributed, upon googling a term from something I wrote, found lawofone.info and began asking me questions about the Law of One.

I should interject here that I only found the Ra sessions and the LOO about 6 or 7 weeks ago. Considering the amount of research, seeking, and purely synchronistic revelations I have experienced over the last 25+ years, it is beyond comprehension that I never ever ran across it before now. When I stumbled across the Ra Sessions, the resonance was so significant I was literally brought to tears by the intensity. The words 'that explains EVERYTHING' echo through my psyche still today. Systematically, (in the organic whole system sense) the knowledge necessary to lay the foundation for the Law of One has been planted, grown, cultivated, nurtured and finally matured in my eventual alignment with third density day to day life which has occured simultaneously with my understanding and psychic detachment from the construct on which it is built. Then I found the Ra Sessions.

As I have studied LOO it has occured to me that if a person did not have in their arsenal the vast and varied knowledge I have explored and come to terms with, it would be quite a leap of faith to delve into the Ra sessions. As I have read scattered posts in these forums, I had begun to think that people participating in wanderer discussions must all feel the kind of resonance I do; this notion was strengenthed by the idea expressed by Carla in the Wanderer Handbook and elsewhere, that if you have found this knowledge then you are probably a wanderer or you woulndt be here.

Back to the matter at hand; studying the Law of One has given me new vocabulary to discuss universal concepts that I have been developing over many years. This has become apparent in my comments on a site unrelated to the Law of One. I have discussed many concepts of the Law for a while now in that forum, before I actually found the Ra sessions, and I was unsure of the receptiveness of the group to the knowledge in the context of channeling sessions, thus I had not yet discussed the specifics of my newfound understanding. In email correspondence the founder requested more information about the material and how it has affected my life. I replied with some Ra material, links, and a little personal chatter-then today I got an email which blew my mind. He, in the same paragraph, says he would like to learn more, but that it seemed like some kind of spiritual class system, in which souls are at different levels and how that did not jive with the concept of infinity, and that he has issues with religion and 'things like this, that we should be weary of taking literally". And since I said the teachings were a deeper understanding of things I already knew, he had a problem with that too, how can some group say they know something that is already known, how can they claim to have answers.

I tried to direct him initially to sections that would give introduction, and I even gave him links to other sites which the information may be more easily read. I did however say that I knew with every fiber of my being that these are the answers for which I have sought, and that somehow got twisted around into him referring to the Law of One in a way which actually initially offended me. Not offended me, personally, but I was so hesitant to expose this knowledge that is so sacred to me to the critique of someone who does not yet have the groundwork laid for acceptance, and only began to at repeated request, and look what happened.

In a phenomenon that I have been experiencing almost daily on Bring4th, my first click on the recent posts took me right to a thread which directly addresses an active catalyst or responds to a theme which I happen to be entertaining at any given time.

While the posts have assured me that total acceptance is not required nor is it common, my original conundrum of how to proceed has become slightly more paradoxical. He obviously hasn't thoroughly examined the information I sent him, and I am unsure of how much of the sessions he has looked at, but it isnt much because he also asked for clarification on what harvest was. The whole angle of approach seems skewed by his comments, which are very different from any prior statements concerning LOO.

I started to respond starting by saying that the Ra Sessions don't seem to resonate with you at this time, because of the fact that you have referred to them as a type of dangerous religion to be weary of literal interpetration, I would not endeavor to convince you differently -(or something like that). He says in the email-I believe this, and I believe that, its all unknown totally and there is no way to find out. I guess it would have been helpful to learn of his position on communications from Confederation members prior to freaking him out-I think. It seems to me that arguing or debating over the core knowledge set of the Ra sessions with someone who does not accept the basic validity of the channel, is not only futile, but in violation of the Law of Confusion (free will).

Or is it a failure to perform service to others by not providing him more explanation on a subject that he has requested more understanding of?

[Aaron]

Crystl, all you can do is provide the seed of thought to be given attention by them if they wish. We who post here are a certain kind of open minded people, who, like you point out, have cultivated our path of awakened living before coming across this information. Our attitude allows us to accept and study this information with an open mind and an open heart. Others don't readily have that attitude which we have been developing our whole lives up to this point.

You should remember that he is just processing the Ra material in the only way he knows how. He is comparing and contrasting the new information with information he is already attached to in order to incorporate it into his worldview. This is how people normally think in our 3D society. This is how one thinks with the logical mind. Combine that with your eagerness to share what you know as information which points very closely to the Truth, and he may interpret you as being pushy about information that you're attached to. Even though you're thinking differently, with an open mind and no attachment to the information, he may not realize that.

No matter how much we want to wake others up, we can't do it for them. They have to wake up themselves. If the Creator has been providing the life experiences which you need to wake up, what makes you think that is the Creator not there for him with the same strength, providing the experiences he needs? He may speak another spiritual language. He may need the information presented to him in a different "flavor". But he has you as a gift! You can be the "interpreter". Answer his interest in spiritual truths in any way he needs. And then, when he's ready to hear the words "straight from the horse's mouth", he'll be ready to read the Ra material as is.

Here's an example of planting the seeds. In one of my workplaces, two of my friends have responded to the love I show. What I mean is, they are selfless enough to kind of "realize" what I'm doing in being more selfless everyday and they are able to see that same energy in themselves. They've "hopped on board" the love train and realized that they can emit this natural energy of co-operation like I am. In doing so, they've become closer to me and we do things outside of work. One day, after spending time together rollerblading in the park, I dropped them off at one of their houses and they accidentally took my copy of the book Living the Law of One 101 out of my car along with their things. They had nothing else to do that day, so I know that, in their curiosity, they must have read at least some of it before bringing it back to me at work a couple of days later.

I can see that a higher intelligence directed these events to occur. All I need to focus on is being here and being loving and awakening myself. As soon as they turned part of their attention towards loving like me, they were given the opportunity to learn of The Law of One, which could have springboarded their spiritual development. (I have a feeling that one of them is a wanderer.) But they didn't ask me questions about the book. That's fine. They're not ready yet. They'll receive more chances throughout their lives. All that you, and I, have to do, is just be and love. The Creator will take care of the rest. I can't tell you how many copies of The Power of Now by Eckhart Tolle have found their way out into the world from me. I can't seem to hang on to them! haha

[thefool]

Hey lightning ! welcome to the forum

No you are not alone. You may be in the minority though in some of the things you are raising and you may be with the majority with regards to some of the other topics you raised. But that is OK. We are not in a popularity contest, we are here to share love and truth

I think I resonate with you on most topics...

Vegetarian or no vegetarian no difference - Check
Conservative - Check
Channeling - Check
Conspiracy theories - Check (with some exceptions)
Healthy skepticism about this or any material - Check

As far as advanced civilizations leaving marks on our planet? I just finished reading a couple of books documenting physical evidence of advanced maybe alien civilizations leaving marks on our dear earth- Chariots of the Gods -Erich von Daniken, Fingerprints of the Gods-Graham Hancock

Incidentally, These books were brought to my attention after I asked my guidance of physical proof of all these metaphysical things being REAL. I am a really big 'show me missouri' types

On another note I think it is good to stir the pot a little bit from time to time like you did. This avoids complacency and group think

[Lavazza]

On another note I think it is good to stir the pot a little bit from time to time like you did. This avoids complacency and group think

Well put my friend.

[Monica]

On another note I think it is good to stir the pot a little bit from time to time like you did. This avoids complacency and group think

I would agree, as long as love and respect are the main ingredients in the pot, and the stirring spoon itself is made of love and respect.

[Richard]

The point of this website (as I understand it) was to bring everyone together to discuss probably the single thing all us of have in common…the Law of One. But you can’t take the baby without the bathwater. All of us also brought a lifetimes worth of personal baggage with us. So an occasional scuffle or disagreement is bound to happen…we are still human.

But maybe we can take the tenets taught in the Law of One and learn how to live with each other…since, technically…we are all each other.

Richard

[Bring4th_Steve]

I saw a point in Lightning's post that I wanted to weigh in on:

Does demonizing others fit well into “ looking into another’s eyes and seeing the Creator”, or something close to that?

When talking about conspiracies, I respectfully disagree that the basis of these theories revolves around pointing fingers and/or demonizing others.

Whether an event is true or not is not as important as when the time comes that humanity learns the one particular event "was" done with malicious intent or with the design to hide facts from the public. In LOO-speak, I strongly believe that conspiracies are closely related to the concept of catalyst; when we learn the truth of a matter, whether controversial or not, the truth then re-shapes (or even shocks) our perception about the event itself. It then gives us the chance to look at the event and decide if it's a positive energy we wish to accept and incorporate into ourselves, or if it is something negative that we wish to rise above and learn from. When many people go through this exercise, it changes our global vibration and alters humanity's group consciousness.

9/11 is obviously one of the more recent and memorable catastrophes that left emotional scars on humanity. Wouldn't you think that if the world learned that 9/11 was an inside job [let's suppose], that an extraordinary amount of people would sit up and vehemently protest the deception, false-flagging, and artificial hate that our government encouraged towards another country? Is that not an amazing mass catalyst to help many awakening souls to further polarize?

So despite the face that conspiracies may wear a transient hat and inconsequential mask in the greater scheme of life, I would argue strongly that the moment of learning the truth of any controversial matter makes the resulting catalyst that much more intense for the individual who is waiting for their wake-up call, and who wished for it to happen through something as emotionally-charged as 9/11.

Steve

[Monica]

Wouldn't you think that if the world learned that 9/11 was an inside job [let's suppose], that an extraordinary amount of people would sit up and vehemently protest the deception, false-flagging, and artificial hate that our government encouraged towards another country? Is that not an amazing mass catalyst to help many awakening souls to further polarize?

Well said, Steve! I would add to that list of negative results from 911 the violence via 2 illegal wars, still going on today, and justified in people's minds by 911.

Here are some comments by Q'uo regarding violence, in these days leading up to the Harvest:

So there is a spiritual entropy [1] that happens when progress is not made. Energies become less and less organized and more and more chaotic because the energy is unusable after a certain point. Further, there is the energy of inertia, which means that even those who are not particularly involved in the tendency to resort to violence to solve problems yet still do not have sensors that send up the red flags of warning when they hear thoughts of empire being discussed.

...The breaking forth of new life into this dark world is a common occurrence because the light cannot be put out by darkness. And person after person after person has moments of brilliant insight in which they see that responding to violence with violence is not a wise move.

More and more of your entities are investing time, talent and treasure in finding different responses to the surrounding darkness based not upon the darkness itself but upon the light that comes from within the darkness and which the darkness cannot extinguish. Entities focus upon that first candle of light. And that tiny illumination illumines more. And then that illumines more. And a process of lightening the consciousness of yourself begins.

The time is coming and indeed is nigh at hand when something you might call a tipping point is imminent. And indeed it stands before you at this time. What is that tipping point? That tipping point is a straw vote, shall we say, an informal poll, if you will, of the tribes of humankind, to see if the majority of entities want to separate themselves forever from any path except violence or if they want to progress into fourth density and beyond.

There are entities from fifth density on the service-to-self path that are attempting a coup, shall we say, of this train of humankind running along this parallel time track. They would like it not to rejoin the main track. The guardians of this planet and those light givers within your planetary forces, both seen and unseen, have all moved heaven and Earth, literally, to create a slowing of the forces of time so that every possible instant may be given to the development of planet Earth’s human population to the point where the vote of the straw poll is for service to others and not for service to self; for radiance, peace and harmony rather than contraction, war and hostility as a background to the everyday life.

We are very hopeful. If that last moment were this very day, the straw poll indicates that your planet will rejoin the typical, normal progression of space/time. What the negative entities would like to do is to have that tipping point go the other way and to have people say, “No, no, it’s important to war because we want to gain resources, because we want to defend our family,” and because of the whole laundry list of those things that the great apes are instinctually bound to consider priorities.

...We do not believe that the entities who attempted this coup will be able to convince the majority of entities upon planet Earth that a fear-based and violence-ridden solution is the correct solution to the ethical dilemmas of this time.

If entities convinced themselves that the forces of war are the correct forces in which to invest, your planet would be lost and would become a feeding ground for fifth-density entities who feed off of fear and suffering. This would be a slavery which all the slaves agreed was needed.

We believe that your people will throw off the yoke of slavery to violence and begin to sustain responsible efforts to become truly free, to evolve, and progress. It is, as always, the choice of those of planet Earth and none other may vote in this particular referendum.

So, it is in your hands. There are waves of energy coming at this planet that you so lovingly enjoy each and every day, every month, quarterly, yearly, and at times which are irregular but based upon time/space events rather than space/time events. In an irregular manner, however, they also offer unique and sometimes highly discomfiting waves of energy.

These are energies of the shining, glorious, honest truth. Embrace them insofar as you can. See how you might cooperate with these energies. If they bring things up in your life that you have not wanted to face, give yourself a smile, because you need it, and then sit down to do your work, my friends.

from Sessions in Focus > 2007.02.11 World Events, Failed STS Coup, Rejoining Time-Lateral

Thus, according to Q'uo, the decision to accept or reject violence as a way to solve problems is apparently part of the polarizing process. Violence is clearly a major catalyst here on this planet.

Now, without getting into a debate about the actual 911 controversy itself, just suppose you were to discover what you believed to be incontrovertible proof that millions of people are, right now, being killed, all because of a lie.

How could you not try to expose it? Wouldn't any well-intentioned person do that?

Perhaps, if we can attempt to view the controversy (whether it's 911 or any other controversy) thru the eyes of those who disagree with us, we might be able to have compassion for them, by realizing that they, too, are attempting to be of service, rather then writing them off as 'kooks.' Perhaps it is the so-called 'kooks' who will be instrumental in exposing truths that end up being important catalysts for all of us.

That's not to say that all conspiracy theories are true, of course! But maybe by reserving judgment on them, we leave the door open to utilization of new catalyst we might have missed otherwise. Just the process of examining some of these controversies, whether we accept them as true or not, can be a powerful catalyst.

[crystl37]

Though the proof is often right before our eyes, it is cloudy and always there seems to be alternate proof of the opposite. Like we at some point must take the leap of faith, or simply follow the resonance, that led us to the Law of One, so we must follow our energy to what resonates both spiritually and logically when studying so called conspiracies.

Sometimes I think the problem lies in the word conspiracy. The verbal complex evokes a reaction, unique to each of us, but polarized just the same. A piece of information labeled conspiracy theory, may not be viewed with objectivity, on its own merits.
This trust in government and law is so deeply ingrained in our psyche, even those who are not in agreement with policy or legislation, seem to have a giant problem getting past the fact that if the government says it, it must be true. After all, who has more resources to uncover the truth and present it to the public. I have run across this syndrome in otherwise extremely intelligent and open minded people.

I agree that it is of upmost importance to respond to the catalyst, investigate the theories, and form a position that is your own. I have long been a conspiracy theorist, even before the internet, I listened very carefully to the media,and if you pay attention, shortly after an event, or before it is stricken from the wire, bits of information leak through, unnoticed by most. It is an interesting paradox, that if we are to accept the Law of One and the words from Ra and Q'uo, we find resolution of many mysteries; but if adhering to closely to the constructs of the matrix, this knowledge will never be found.

The dismantling of the straw man, a thorough understanding of the workings of the machine in this country, and of monotheism as a force in all that has transpired globally was a crucial point for my advancement in understanding. After an intimate exposure to the various patriot groups and freedom fighters working in the shadows., I went through a period of idealistic optimism, holding high the bastion of truth. True catalyst was not realized though, until the futility of resistance came painfully clear into my life. So I stepped back from involvement and got on with living my life.

[dolphin]

[quote='crystl37' pid='14658' dateline='1274546582']
After an intimate exposure to the various patriot groups and freedom fighters working in the shadows., I went through a period of idealistic optimism, holding high the bastion of truth. True catalyst was not realized though, until the

futility of resistance came painfully clear into my life. So I stepped back from involvement and got on with living my life.

Brave New World
http://www.hermes-press.com/CCC/CCC_preface.htm

[LsavedSmeD]

There are a few possibilities. 1, the information is not true, and assuming we believe in channeling we conclude that the message was distorted (Ra confused, negative entity coming in, Carla garbling Ra's thoughts, etc.) Or 2, the information is true but we can't imagine how it might be so with our current understandings. It actually occurred to me once the very real possibility that Don wrote the entire Law of One series in an attempt to give more credibility or exposure to the area of spiritual ufology- he was certainly well trained enough in engineering / sciences and may have had the motivation. But I can't believe this was the case by the simple virtue of Carla continuing on and dedicating her life to the Law of One message- now more than 30 years in doing so. There are many other clues that the contact is valid, but Carla herself is the biggest one.

I've read so many stories and seen so many movies and trekked upon so many peoples beliefs; but never have I felt such a profoundly epic feeling when I encountered much of what the Ra channellings said.

If Don made it all up than he was beyond genius which I believe he did not.

How do we explain the newer channellings?

[Monica]

I've read so many stories and seen so many movies and trekked upon so many peoples beliefs; but never have I felt such a profoundly epic feeling when I encountered much of what the Ra channellings said.

That's exactly how I felt! To me, the info itself just couldn't have come from any human. It's so obviously from a higher intelligence. As contrasted with lots of other channeled stuff which seems flavored by bias, religion, etc.

[Lavazza]

but never have I felt such a profoundly epic feeling when I encountered much of what the Ra channellings said.

That's exactly how I felt! To me, the info itself just couldn't have come from any human. It's so obviously from a higher intelligence. As contrasted with lots of other channeled stuff which seems flavored by bias, religion, etc.

To be honest, I get those same feelings. If I didn't, I probably wouldn't be so excited by all of this. Of course being young in my spiritual learnings and having oh-so-recently come out of consensus "normal" reality, my left brain / intellectual side had a real hard time rectifying the source as valid. I attempted thought experiments with all possible explanations for such an anomalous collection of teachings. Ultimately my right brain / emotional side took priority. It resonated too well in other words!

[thefool]

also this is an ongoing process in my opinion. Yes the Ra changelings resonate clearly and very strongly to me. But at the same time you live in a solid physical world that seems to be not providing clear cut evidence of metaphysical . A lot of this information is then taken on faith. which is fine with me but the inner skepticism continues to some degree... Then there are layers upon layers of the faith and skepticism. I don't want to deny either. Accept all feeling and keep moving based upon the tiny inner light/compass. Even a journey of 1000 miles can be completed with a light that only shows one yard...One yard at a time baby !!!