Canceling the Scholar's Edition of the Law of One material

[isis]

http://bring4th.org/news/index.php?newsid=138

I'm interested in knowing everyone's thoughts & opinions on this very sad situation. Please share!

[AnthroHeart]

I probably would have never read the scholar's edition as the regular books are complex enough.

[1109]

I would love a big fat leather bound hard cover version worthy of the material. It's my dream that such a version will be released.

[sunnysideup]

http://bring4th.org/news/index.php?newsid=138

I'm interested in knowing everyone's thoughts & opinions on this very sad situation. Please share!

Sad situation indeed. Who is Tobey by the way?

[native]

I probably would have never read the scholar's edition as the regular books are complex enough.

Haha..you are hilarious sometimes without even trying.

[AnthroHeart]

I would love a big fat leather bound hard cover version worthy of the material. It's my dream that such a version will be released.

I'd prefer silk-bound, as I don't want to kill extra cows for the material.

But then I don't like killing trees for the paper either.

[AnthroHeart]

I probably would have never read the scholar's edition as the regular books are complex enough.

Haha..you are hilarious sometimes without even trying.

On second thought I might read it when it's available in PDF. It might be even more comprehensive and explain more.

[native]

On second thought I might read it when it's available in PDF. It might be even more comprehensive and explain more.

You already can..the sessions were updated as Tobey worked on them. When you click on a session at lawofone.info, make sure you select "Relistened" near the bottom of the page. Or when you're searching the sessions, click the "Relistened" option.

[native]

Sad situation indeed. Who is Tobey by the way?

Forum member βαθμιαίος

isis - To answer your question I was disappointed at first, but realize it's a disagreement between them and so I can't really have an opinion on it. I just don't see it being my business. Besides I would only want the relistened version anyway.

[AnthroHeart]

Are there times when the relistened makes a world of difference?

[1109]

I would love a big fat leather bound hard cover version worthy of the material. It's my dream that such a version will be released.

I'd prefer silk-bound, as I don't want to kill extra cows for the material.

But then I don't like killing trees for the paper either.

Of course I meant faux leather, didn't think that was necessary to make explicit.

I'm hoping all parties will come to an agreement and the book will be unleashed upon the world.

[isis]

"There is no question, in terms of justice or legality, that Tobey deserves absolutely nothing except our thanks for volunteering, just as we thank all of our volunteers from the bottom of our heart. Our offer of royalties is simply an attempt to go as far as we possibly can to meet his demands. We would love to see that book in print. However, Tobey is still withholding his blessing, and since there's not a chance in Purple Hades of his ever receiving any ownership of the Law of One, that seems to put things at a standstill." -Carla

[rva_jeremy]

I've known Tobey for over a decade--we first befriended one another on David Wilcock's list.  This material is very special to Tobey.  He's the one who runs http://lawofone.info which is an incredible scholarly resource.  It's kind of a lexus nexus for the Law of One material, indexed by topics and keywords.  Tobey deserves nothing but respect for that site and the painstaking re-listening work he has performed.

I think it's really sad that Tobey's work will not culminate in what many of us have wanted for some time: a new, up-to-date, re-transcribed edition of the LOO with high-quality production value reflecting the centrality of this material to us.  Tobey has always struck me as a forthright and honest dude, and if he's withholding his blessing I will assume it is not simply out of greed.

When we get a hold of the PDF, there's always the possibility that we could get a version printed via a service like Lulu or even find a bookbinder on Etsy who could do a small run of high quality, hand bound books according to our specs.  This would route around the dispute and get us the hard copy we want on our own terms, and we could simply agree to all make a donation to L/L in lieu of buying this from them.  I would also encourage everybody to donate to Tobey's lawofone.info work here.

I do wish I knew what was going on here, as I'd much prefer L/L to be in control of all this.

[Bluebell]

i don't know Tobey's motivations, but... Carla, Don & Jim bled, literally & figuratively for the Ra Material. it belongs to them, period. they generously shared it w us because it's their mission. they risked & sacrificed & suffered & all for humanity.

[Bluebell]

i just think because of how much they gave us, out of love, any volunteers could at least keep that same spirit of giving w/o expecting stuff in return. because it's peanuts compared. if it was some other material i'd understand but here, i don't.

btw i don't think we should glorify any book by making it all fancy. always remember humblity... Ra is an humble messenger after all. 

[andreazzi]

http://bring4th.org/news/index.php?newsid=138

I'm interested in knowing everyone's thoughts & opinions on this very sad situation. Please share!

So, he did not give his blessings because of royalties?

Well, it's so weird that someone touched by the LOO would have this kind of interest. I thought he would be very honored to be of service.

I really don't want to judge anyone here, but that is so weird, I just can't understand. The lawofone.info website is great, it would have been awesome to have it published.

[rva_jeremy]

btw i don't think we should glorify any book by making it all fancy. always remember humblity... Ra is an humble messenger after all. 

Good point, I think I've come around to this.  My only concern is that my paperback copies are worn out!  Something hardbound would be great.  I'm not asking for gold leaf, but there's a reason bibles are so well made: because they're intended to be used year in, year out.

[rva_jeremy]

So am I correctly made to understand that the dispute here has been resolved and a new version will, in fact, be printed?  Paging @Bring4th_GLB and @Bring4th_Austin!

[The_Tired_Philosopher]

Do tell! I have wanted a hardcopy of the Ra Material for a while for the exact reason given regards a bible, so it'll last through much use.

[APeacefulWarrior]

I dunno, maybe I'm just a child of the digital age, but I really don't see the point of making a big expensive artifact out of the Ra Materials. There's no physical index of a book that could ever be more complete and easier to use than hyperlinking. I know a lot of people are very fond of books, but they're cumbersome and hard to use when dealing with very dense material. Why even use a physical index when a keyword search on LOO.info can create custom indices for ANY query a reader might have, with instant direct links to the relevant passages?

I also find it a little worrisome that people were talking about treating it like a Bible when Ra probably would not have wanted such a comparison. After all, It's very easy for people to start attaching too much significance to a form/object, rather than to the actual ideas within. (See also: Anyone who's ever uttered the words "But the Bible says...") Ra never wanted his messages to be taken as scripture, but rather as inspiration and a jumping-off point for people to cultivate their own ideas.

Digital materials, by being more ephemeral, don't inspire the same level of attachment or sense of objective permanence.

[Jade]

Ra did use the Bible as one of the group's appurtenances, recognizing the symbolic meaning of a well-loved book of study. Also, the value of lack of electrical interference during workings was also highlighted.

[APeacefulWarrior]

I didn't say that Ra was anti-Bible, just that he wouldn't have wanted his words to be treated as scripture. He emphasized repeatedly that he was a messenger, and merely presenting his own perspective on higher-level issues, rather than speaking absolute truth. For example:

97.9: ...We wish not to form that which may be considered by any mind/body/spirit complex to be a complete and infallible series of images. There is a substantial point to be made in this regard. We have been, with the questioner’s aid, investigating the concept complexes of the great architecture of the archetypical mind. To more clearly grasp the nature, the process, and the purpose of archetypes, Ra provided a series of concept complexes. In no way whatsoever should we, as humble messengers of the One Infinite Creator, wish to place before the consideration of any mind/body/spirit complex which seeks its evolution the palest tint of the idea that these images are anything but a resource for working in the area of the development of the faith and the will.

While it's of course not inevitable, in my view creating a "Holy Artifact" of sorts out of Ra's teachings greatly increases the chances of a reader making the exact mistake Ra warns against here. Ra wanted us making up our own minds, just with his words adding additional perspective to consider.

[The_Tired_Philosopher]

What if I told you I read the Ra Material 3 times on a 6"x4" screen and would rather read it on a bigger medium?

I treat Carla's Living the Law of One book like a spiritual bible,all that means is I go to it in faith and love during free times, hard times, and happy times.

To have the actual MATERIAL by my bed, to sleep next to it.  To have it in my arms, The Philosophy of one Materialized.

Just.  I desire it. What more justification do you desire?  Its not sanctumonious, its psychological.  Its comforting.  I'm in an illusion without answers starring into a world of mirrors without answers or knowledge of doing such as I am.

This material gave me about 90% of the answers I was looking for.  It is to me a very dear 'book', since you've prejudice of the label 'Bible' or so I perceive.

[APeacefulWarrior]

TPP, I'm quite happy you find so much meaning in the Ra Materials, and I'm certainly not trying to take that away from you.  But I would still worry that referring to a printed book version of Ra's thoughts as "The Philosophy of one Materialized" is missing the point of that quotation I posted, as well as various other similar warnings throughout the work.

It is not The Philosophy of One.  It is merely A Philosophy of One.  It is a single interpretation out of uncountable billions upon billions of interpretations, and all of them are also true, at least to those holding that interpretation.   Ra's thoughts do not become any more (or less) true simply by being put into material form.  It's a purely 3D distortion to think physicality in any way confers additional relevance.  It risks making the book the object of your faith, rather than the reality of Oneness itself, which stands apart from any physical manifestation or any attempt to render/distort it into words.

That is the point I'm trying to make.  I just find that the Bible is an excellent illustration of this principle specifically because too many Christians seemingly place their faith in that book, as a physical object, ahead of the higher knowledge contained within it. Rather than seeking to touch God, they only touch the Bible instead.

The answers you seek ultimately lie within and beyond, not in a repurposed dead tree.  They lie in your own mind, and in the guidance of your higher selves.  Any collection of philosophy is merely a set of signposts pointing towards this.  So my advice is to look past the physical, and not to cling to an artifact just because you find its material nature to be comforting.   "Security blankets" may sometimes be useful psychologically, due to our stressful world, but they're still fundamentally a crutch.

Or put another way:  Ra can be with you when you sleep, whether you have a book or not.  So I ask, would holding that book truly bring you closer to Ra's vibrations (if that is what you seek) or would it just be another distortion separating you from him? This is, of course, something you can only answer for yourself, but I'd still suggest giving the question some thought. It goes directly to the more primal question of where one's faith is truly focused, and how useful that focal point is for one's spiritual development.

[The_Tired_Philosopher]

Ah, I see the disconnect.

It is indeed not THE philosophy.  But I did as Ra said in Work in Consciousness and found it to truly happen.  Thus it IS, 'my' Philosophy, 'my' belief.  And it os not stone, it is amorphous, I add to it and subtract as I go. Sometimes multiply and divide (sometimes by 0).

Please try to understand.  I just want it as a book to read, not as an item to THUMP down onto a table and be like, "YOOUU, CRACK THIS BOOK AND LEARN, THE TRUUUTH."

I don't know what your concern is beyond me putting inappropriate meaning to this material, I try not to, but I love the Ra Material.  I want it in my hands, not just my mind.

It is a purely physical want, not religious or corrupted.  Just as one might desire to own The Stand, or Firestarter, or maybe even Twilight and a manual to bdsm abuse (50 shades), I want Living the Law of One, I want the Aaron\Quo dialogues, I want the Ra Material.

If I had a library, spiritual and religious works would be in it, specifically because I regard them openly.  Even the Ra Material

My biggest want here is all 5 books in 1.  I can't afford them all seperately and would prefer one giant encyclopedia styled book of the Material, like a paper version of lawofone.info.  Plainly put, apply your logic to yourself regarding this towards the lawofone.info site.  Why bother?  There's already pdf's to download and search through electronically.

Its for convenience. Plus L/L could probably use the money.

[APeacefulWarrior]

Please try to understand.  I just want it as a book to read, not as an item to THUMP down onto a table and be like, "YOOUU, CRACK THIS BOOK AND LEARN, THE TRUUUTH."

I'm not trying to harp here or turn this into a protracted argument, but I would suggest this conflicts with what you said earlier about the psychological importance of having a book next to you while you sleep.  That would seem to imply you're attaching more importance to the physical book than mere convenience.  That's where my concern stems from.

And I do want to point out, I'm only talking in terms of generalized risks here, not certainties.  I just find it risky to attach too much faith\importance to physical objects, because they can become a distraction from higher non-material realizations.  How risky it is for you, personally, is not something I can say.

 Plainly put, apply your logic to yourself regarding this towards the lawofone.info site.  Why bother?  There's already pdf's to download and search through electronically.  Its for convenience.  Plus L/L could probably use the money.

Well, I certainly won't argue with the need for income.  But otherwise, I find that the non-material nature of websites helps prevent the sort of material attachments I was talking about in the previous post.  Ra's talks are there, and the ideas are unchanged, whether I'm reading them on a phone or a tablet or a computer.  The ideas themselves become the object of my interest, not the physical medium carrying them.  

Also, as I said, electronic indexing/hyperlinking is by far the fastest and most convenient way of exploring materials of this depth and density.  (Pun kinda intended. )  Like just a couple hours ago when I was searching for one of the bits where Ra slaps a big disclaimer on himself.  It took me maybe 30 seconds of keyword searching before I found one of the passages I was remembering.  Physical indexes don't offer nearly the same speed or absolute freedom in creating searches.  They are limited entirely by whatever the author of the index chooses to include.  

Or what if the indexer didn't think to list the times Ra warned us not to take his words as unfettered truth?   Then I'd really have a hard time finding such passages!

While the general debate between the merits of physical vs digital media can't be resolved simply, I would say that electronic media gives each individual more personal control in what they see, and how they see it.  They allow us to custom-craft our experience of ideas, rather than relying on others to curate those ideas and thus impose their interpretation upon us.   Digital searches ensure no such oversights (or deliberate omissions) can distort a person's attempt to explore the materials in their own way.

[The_Tired_Philosopher]

Its a ritual thing, sleep beside a book with knowledge you desire to better assimilate it at night.  I don't see some attachment as bad, while being attached but detached is basically what is asked, we are human.  Attachments abound
Therefore some is good, its human, its like a lifeline when I wander into hellish places of my mind.  Is faith not also an attachment?

While I personally.agree with your thoughts on digital vs paper, that's not my focus.  I just want the book.

Its like when I saw Fallout 4.  I just want to play that.

A book is a different experience, you'll process it differently than reading from a screen, its healthier on the eyes and spine.

Preferences abound, there is a way to provide further.  Why deny that over your preferences?

Wait wait wait, are you denying this edition should even be bothered with, or just asking??

[APeacefulWarrior]

Just pointing out the potential ramifications of becoming too attached to a book, that's all. I can see why some people would want a book form, but I don't think it's something that should be uncritically accepted as a Good Thing without considering potential drawbacks. It's all about making decisions based on the most possible perspectives.

And yeah, I'm looking forward to FO4 as well, although personally I'd prefer another TES. Ah well. I find really complicated RPGs like Bethesda makes to be very good for allowing people to explore different polarities or ways-of-being without nearly so much risk of karmic buildup. They offer catalyst, of a sort, but greatly watered down and with less chance of unexpected outcomes. They're sort of a miniaturized version of the entire incarnative process. :-)

[The_Tired_Philosopher]

With a save and load function. xD
I want both, but on a PS3

I can agree with your perspective. I honestly thought you were saying so personally, not generally, sorry about that!

[rva_jeremy]

I dunno, maybe I'm just a child of the digital age, but I really don't see the point of making a big expensive artifact out of the Ra Materials.

Shoot, I was hoping we could force you to buy ten copies. ;-)

There's no physical index of a book that could ever be more complete and easier to use than hyperlinking.  I know a lot of people are very fond of books, but they're cumbersome and hard to use when dealing with very dense material.  Why even use a physical index when a keyword search on LOO.info can create custom indices for ANY query a reader might have, with instant direct links to the relevant passages?

Oh, man, that's an easy one: backlit screens are tough on the ol' eyes. Granted: the kindle, nook, and other e-ink displays go a long way on this. But reading a physical, tangible book is wholly different than reading on a device that has no "umph", no substance or gravity. It's totally a preference thing. I mean, I'm a big tech nerd but when it comes to things I really need to read carefully, printing to paper is still indispensable. There's something about the tactile experience that the digital has not yet approached.

I also find it a little worrisome that people were talking about treating it like a Bible when Ra probably would not have wanted such a comparison.  After all, It's very easy for people to start attaching too much significance to a form/object, rather than to the actual ideas within. (See also: Anyone who's ever uttered the words "But the Bible says...")  Ra never wanted his messages to be taken as scripture, but rather as inspiration and a jumping-off point for people to cultivate their own ideas.

Digital materials, by being more ephemeral, don't inspire the same level of attachment or sense of objective permanence.

The concern about bible-izing the Ra Material is well taken, and I'm on your side that the material should not be treated with the unquestioning reverence many reserve for that old sacred story of sex and violence (I actually wrote a blog post about that a few years ago). I was simply pointing out that high quality bindings allow for years of daily use. The goal is not to turn the Ra Material into the Bible, but to recognize it's usefulness to us as the Bible is useful to Christians, and to produce an edition that can stand up to the same physical rigors that most Bible bindings do. Additionally, those of us who like to collect and amass books tend to prefer hardcover editions.

I'm afraid I don't see any danger here inherent in the desire for a new edition of any kind of binding. I think, as usual, it's all about intentions, and you'll have to trust me when I say I have no intention of being a "Ra-Material-thumper".