In regards to eating meat

[Monica]

Just to clarify, the chicken is awake the entire time, just completely docile. Even in the face of complete danger, such as a fox or possum sneaking into the chicken house, the chickens make no noise or movement. This is one reason it is so important to have a protective housing for chickens at nighttime.

OK now I will play devil's advocate back.

If this docility is being used to argue that the chicken wants to be eaten by the fox, then why would you want to intrude on that arrangement by protecting the chicken from the fox?

At any rate, unless some farmers add the label "killed at night while in their docile state" to their packaging, it's moot, because most farm animals aren't slaughtered in their docile state.

By that logic, a rapist would get a more lenient sentence if he raped only drunk women, who are awake by less likely to say no. Yet, rapists who rape drunk women are considered even more heinous, because they are taking advantage of the woman's vulnerability.

Just as an entity who would not want to be vulnerable to being eaten at night would not incarnate as a chicken, no?

I see where you're going with this.

Apparently, on some level, we have all chosen to incarnate in positions of vulnerability, suffering, being victimized, etc. Human victims of murder, rape, war, etc. have all chosen those experiences as catalyst.

But no one here will say that it's ok to murder or rape another human.

Isn't the chicken's docile state during the night an inherent design? Like I said, these chickens are awake. I don't know what sort of programming causes them to be so docile at night, but it exists, and has existed long before any of the chickens alive today "decided" to incarnate as chickens. If a carrot is a carrot because it plans on being eaten, why would a chicken choose to be a chicken knowing it would become docile and vulnerable at night, even in a waking state? Even further, why would any meat animal choose to incarnate as a meat animal, knowing its fate were to be eaten, if it did not desire this experience?

The same reason a human would choose to be born in poverty, or in a war-torn country, or to an abusive father, or as a murder victim. Catalyst.

That doesn't mean we have to participate. That's what the STS path is for: their job is to provide catalyst. Someone's gotta do the dirty work.

Just because there is a purpose to catalyst, doesn't make it ok for STO entities to knowingly provide catalyst.

The chickens on our farm are completely self-sustained, eating leftover veggies we have, and all the bugs and worms they can. So by your logic, isn't it just as efficient and suffer-less to humanely (supposedly painlessly) to consume chickens, killed at night, raised on a sustainable farm?

How is slaughter ever humane?

I'm much more playing devil's advocate than actually arguing my own opinion...I feel there is much to contemplate in this debate. I believe becoming vegetarian and then fruitarian will be a natural evolution for humanity.

I too see it as an evolution. I see the sustainable farm as you describe, to be a step in that evolutionary process. There is no question that such a farm incurs less suffering than factory farms, so I commend your efforts to give the animals a good life!

Contrary to the opinions of vegans, who refuse to use any animal products at all, I consider the use of eggs produced by chickens so raised, to be a power-packed and humanely produced food. I have no issues with the use of eggs from free-ranging hens. What a wonderful protein food! Perfect for filling in the nutritional blanks for those who might feel they require animal protein, but no animal suffered.

Where I disagree is in the act of slaughter itself. I consider the term humane slaughter an oxymoron.

I thought I could offer an unique perspective working on a sustainable farm which produces veggies as well as meat.

Thank you for sharing your perspective.