In regards to eating meat

[unity100]

You're right that it cannot be proven that such an agreement exists. I am basing this on my own experience with herbs and with my garden, as well as reading of others' experiences with plant devas, such as the beautifully written Findhorn Garden. I have also visited Findhorn and have seen this relationship in action. It is something beautiful; not grisly like a slaughterhouse.

However, I am well aware that some people claiming to be shamans or psychics, claim to have communicated with animals, and they claim to have the same relationship with animals. I don't see how this could be possible, being that animals have clearly, indisputably, communicated their pain and distress to us. I think those psychics are simply justifying their desire for meat, because their opinion directly conflicts with simple observation (by going to a slaughterhouse).

My opinion is subjective. When it comes to plants, it cannot be proven one way or the other.

both channelings and information, can be considered subjective.

I disagree here. I think it does matter. Different beings have different life cycles and different agendas for physical incarnation. Being that plants provide food for all higher lifeforms on this planet, it is reasonable to surmise that being consumed by higher lifeforms might be part of their normal life cycle.

Not provable, but reasonable as a possibility.

it is stated in Ra material that the purpose of 1d is learning to move, progress without dissemination. 2d is development of self.

ending bodily incarnation of an entity, which stops both the development of incarnated self, and also ends any possibility of that manifesting self from moving/developing without dissemination (red ray activity), in the end means ending the incarnation purpose of that entity into 2d experience.

the only thing that can be argued, is, by ending the other entity's self-experience in physical realm, the other entity is providing a catalyst. but that goes both ways.

Yes. Key word here being in their own style. Which is precisely the point I made in my last comment. We don't really know the objective of plants. We can only speculate. It would be just as inaccurate to say we know they desire to be eaten, as it would be to say we know they don't. Either one is a viable possibility.

Whereas, with animals, we can safely say that one of those possibilities has been eliminated.

as based on the meaning of 2d, orange ray, we can easily say that ANY kind of incarnation, would not like being killed. because, it ends the purpose of orange ray activity.

its not something complicated. orange ray is the ray of self, self progress, needs, desires, enjoyment, pains and so on. once the body is killed, there is no more orange ray activity manifested.

based on the information we are given, this is valid for any existence in this creation. orange ray experience, does not differentiate in between any kind of lifeform.

lifeforms we know here, lifeforms we dont know elsewhere, use and develop with orange ray, because it is the same orange ray everywhere.

It is less tangible as to when their incarnation ends. Does a lettuce incarnation end when some leaves are harvested? Is a new soul born when a strand of ivy is cut from the plant and planted on its own, growing into a new plant?

Is the plant even an entity at all, if it's not yet self-aware?

This is the crux of the issue. As I asked previously in this thread, at what point does elemental life become an entity?

Is a rock an entity? If I crush a rock, is each little shard an entity?

any given entity in 2d, stands on whatever level they are at orange ray. that is, they are as aware as their level. after all, ra tells us they are an octave of consciousness, in 2d. there is no distinction named at any point, even impliedly, for any possibility of being any kind of relevance in between bodily incarnation forms, and self awareness level.

so, whatever level in orange ray a living entity is, its at that level.

at what point elemental life becomes an entity ? firstly, we need to remember that the term 'entity' is used for a lot of things, even for thought-form bigfoots, in Ra material. i will suppose that you have meant 'self aware entity'.

self awareness is something that builds up towards 2d. and at the end of 2d, the entity is so aware of its own desires, needs that, it is now able to cross the threshold of 3d, and realize that, it is an independent entity with its own will. up till this point, the self awareness of entity is still there, building up. it has needs, desires, pleasures, dislikes and so on. it develops and progresses. as said before, 2d is an octave of consciousness. there is no 0 at the start of the density, and a sudden 1 at the end. it comes from 0, to 1.

and even more, apparently places, leave aside rocks, stones, 1 d material etc, can pass the threshold into 3d, by being aware that they exists as an independent, self-willed entity, in the Ra material. even if rare, it is possible. a place, not even a rock, or a collection of rocks, a certain place can become self aware as an independent entity. where is its body ? where is its mind ? but it can become self aware as an independent entity.

that means, in the duration that it reaches that independent self awareness, it will be moving towards 2d, and becoming increasingly aware of its own self, its desires, needs and so on. a very very provoking piece of information.