03-04-2017, 07:58 PM
restitution
noun
1.
reparation made by giving an equivalent or compensation for loss, damage, or injury caused; indemnification.
2.
the restoration of property or rights previously taken away, conveyed, or surrendered.
3.
restoration to the former or original state or position.
4.
Physics. the return to an original physical condition, especially after elastic deformation.
equality
noun
1.
the state or quality of being equal; correspondence in quantity, degree, value, rank, or ability:
promoting equality of opportunity in the workplace.
2.
uniform character, as of motion or surface.
3.
Mathematics. a statement that two quantities are equal; equation.
And also...
Is that not the prerogative of every one to do as they freely will? Be frustrated, be moved, get mad! Express yourself, that's all I ever want from anyone, express yourself, that way we all gain.
I agree, but it begins paving the pathway to understanding which can lead to forgiveness which leads to...?
I have not refused to acknowledge the oppression of women, I have even pointed out that I do not understand how people can oppress anyone, we all have blood, we all bleed, we're all the same, we have bodies that bleed, minds that feel and think, emotions that move us all the same way, we're not nearly as different as we are similar.
I am not minimizing the severity of the oppression of women, including the loss of respect for them leading up their objectification and outright rape with justifications for rape being from everything as pathetic and lowly as 'because she was dressed a certain way' to something as asinine as 'I thought she wanted me to do it' while she was screaming and crying and thrashing about under your weight and force? No no, no, I don't appreciate being lumped in with those qualities. I simply want us to actually discuss these things, not argue about them, not get caught up in their turbulent emotions, but to figure out why, to discuss, not to accuse or point out or label one another.
I think I'm fulfilling this by continuing our discussion trying to clear up the many accusations we all have flying about while trying to continually find a bridge for us to agree upon.
Wow, okay. First, didn't read his blog, didn't felt I needed to to get what he was saying, but mostly I find it sad that he was censored in such a way without even being consulted to change his post first like what has once been done for me personally. I've been in some similar situations as you Jade, you shouldn't believe your experiences are so indifferent for a man to empathize with. I think your aggravation by my appreciation of the female qualities of existence is something you should consider exploring, I'm not talking about bodies. I'm talking about qualities. If you find my attraction to feminine qualities distasteful, then I can only say, may the shame you sell upon me be upon you instead. I am proud of my appreciations of the female everything. Without that love for something I believe myself to be more of than my own physical body can portray, I would be much more hateful and condescending, outright indignant towards women, that you call that very quality incendiary, I find just as incendiary.
I will not be ashamed for what I love, appreciate, and desire to know more of.
...Okay, um, I mean, for all I know I am all of those things, and anyone's view of me being such would be nice to be shared with me. I do learn a lot about myself from other's opinions about me. But I like to think equality is more than just acceptance of each other, and we're never going to get to even that point if we continue to assign ideas like 'this is for men' 'that's for women' 'only white people do that' 'black people do that'. We need to move beyond the labels and stick to the one that matters, we're all humans, let's treat each other the way we would treat ANY human.
Even men, sitting on our high throne, now suffer from the loss of the divine feminine. Did you ever notice how much the transgender community has grown lately? It's mostly men, and if you ask me, they're trying to make restitution's for what has been done to women on an unconscious level, reducing themselves to shameful humiliated crossdressers slutting themselves out among other things. Those are people harming themselves and their physical identities in their mind by pretending to be something they're not in a way that portrays poorly what they are trying to be. Women are not sluts, they are not there to be shamed or humiliated or objectified in disturbingly attractive attire. You are as I and I am as You.
Do you think it's not felt by the oppressor what they have done? That all nazi's were evil and none of them sat under their bunks with their heads tucked away bawling hot tears clenching their hands violently over their ears at the echoing sounds of screams of those people they genocided so directly? That the atrocities we commit on one another doesn't warp who we are??
Come on Jade, it's all there to be seen. Equality is inevitable, even if it's outright outlawed, it will still eventually be. Most specifically by design of evolution, I like to think considering the bias of our logos.
That quote has no bearing to 'Justice' that I can see. Restitution is not a form of Justice so much as the 'Justice System' with legally binding power to force such uses Restitution as one of it's tools of enforcement.
How do you link this quote to Justice? Why is restitution considered Justice to you?
Never said you were being more hateful, just that in your perception of hate, you've responded with hate by calling it hateful, which sums up about as much hate as I saw in e_s's post, and I should add, I did not read the blog links he posted, if they were as bad as you all make them out to be then is that valid reason to respond in kind for you?
I often feel like I'm assaulted on an energetic level in discussions like this for not being a women and thus unable to understand, but I try very hard to understand, I'm sorry if I've failed in that endeavor in your eyes.
Society raises men and women to be very polarized between one another, our perceptions of each other are then warped by what society broadcasts to us all. That attractive men are men with power and money and status who are tall, dark, and handsome, that attractive women are woman of gullibility, submission, who must mold themselves in specific attire and makeup with a specific kind of personality to be more appealing. Many other similar molds and schemes apply until finally we have a bunch of men who poorly treat women and a bunch of women who poorly treat men, viewing each other as failures and offensive to one another.
I think if you can't accept that women are just as capable of men at anything, then you aren't actually talking about women equality, but putting women on a pedestal above men as an example of how bad men can be, can saying men this and men that and us men and us boys, then us guys go, 'oh you ladies, you girls! Women, pah!' and then you go, 'Men! Ugh!' and we're polarized.
Tell me, do any of you act differently towards a very attractive man than you would a very unattractive man? What about if that attractive man was a woman, or the unattractive man a woman? How do these things like attractiveness and gender effect the way we interact with another? Why does this happen? Would the words said by the attractive man be taken the same way if said by an unattractive man? What if the man, attractive or not, was a woman?
Why do these things effect how people interact with one another? Why is it courteous to hold a door open for a woman, but not a man? Why is a man considered less capable of being a parent than a woman? Why are men not supposed to be the one who stays home and watches the children?
Gender equality starts with our removal of reducing one another to the pushed notions and qualities society assigns to the labels like 'Man' and 'Woman'. Women and Men are equal, and only with that attitude, without pushing it with the same turbulence as hatred, can we incubate the roots of equality.
When you meet someone who says man is above woman, you should say they're equal. When you meet someone who says woman is above man, you should say they're equal. Anyone saying the same of races should be met with, they're equal.
If someone disagrees with this premise, and says that they are not equal, you should stand by your belief, that they are equal, and be an example, that you can believe even in the face of disbelief and say 'that's okay if you think that, but I believe men and women are inherently more similar than different, because they are more equal than they are apart.'
You can bring all the depth into this, but the moment those reasons become pedestals to hold a portion of humans above the rest of humanity, even if to say they are stronger, better, more resilient, you have cultivated separation. No group of humans is better than any other, we all have our strengths and weaknesses and we all need each other to balance those attributes.
noun
1.
reparation made by giving an equivalent or compensation for loss, damage, or injury caused; indemnification.
2.
the restoration of property or rights previously taken away, conveyed, or surrendered.
3.
restoration to the former or original state or position.
4.
Physics. the return to an original physical condition, especially after elastic deformation.
equality
noun
1.
the state or quality of being equal; correspondence in quantity, degree, value, rank, or ability:
promoting equality of opportunity in the workplace.
2.
uniform character, as of motion or surface.
3.
Mathematics. a statement that two quantities are equal; equation.
And also...
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote:Quote:Jade, I especially believe that you are now just as much in hatred as you perceive e_s to be. My admiration of the female form is of its divinity. The body is a tool, I speak of admiring that which uses a tool so elegantly and eloquently and so powerfully in abstract and intuitive ways. I speak of an appreciation for the divine unconsciousness that is the feminine. Please understand... I'm being assigned traits others perceive of me. I just want us all to be treated with equality, and to not be inured or encumbered by the inequality perceived to be between us all...
You want to know what about this is frustrating? People would prefer to pretend things don't exist than to actually deal with problems. It's also a root illness in our society. Oh, I have a cold, better take some sudafed! Oh, a stomach ache? Drink that pepto bismol. We're all too happy to smooth over what may be perceived as "catalyst" by displacing it, numbing it, by taking a sip of the panacea of Oneness and moving on with our day.
Is that not the prerogative of every one to do as they freely will? Be frustrated, be moved, get mad! Express yourself, that's all I ever want from anyone, express yourself, that way we all gain.
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: Saying that we need to just focus on equality doesn't HEAL the problem. It forces an equilibrium that cannot be maintained without discussing thoroughly the underlying causes of the issue. To refuse to acknowledge these issues, to minimize them, invalidates people who have actually been hurt. We know as students of the Law of One that you can't just remove the tumor and hope the cancer goes away - you have to find the root cause (and it's probably not something so obvious as cigarettes). It takes hard, long work. You say you want to come to a common ground, but this takes many words exchanged and understanding towards those who you understand the least. I'm definitely working on the same goal that you are, whether you see it or not.
I agree, but it begins paving the pathway to understanding which can lead to forgiveness which leads to...?
I have not refused to acknowledge the oppression of women, I have even pointed out that I do not understand how people can oppress anyone, we all have blood, we all bleed, we're all the same, we have bodies that bleed, minds that feel and think, emotions that move us all the same way, we're not nearly as different as we are similar.
I am not minimizing the severity of the oppression of women, including the loss of respect for them leading up their objectification and outright rape with justifications for rape being from everything as pathetic and lowly as 'because she was dressed a certain way' to something as asinine as 'I thought she wanted me to do it' while she was screaming and crying and thrashing about under your weight and force? No no, no, I don't appreciate being lumped in with those qualities. I simply want us to actually discuss these things, not argue about them, not get caught up in their turbulent emotions, but to figure out why, to discuss, not to accuse or point out or label one another.
I think I'm fulfilling this by continuing our discussion trying to clear up the many accusations we all have flying about while trying to continually find a bridge for us to agree upon.
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: e_s posted a link to a blog that through around "rape" in such a cavalier way - in fact, this is probably what I found most "hateful": his endorsement of the blog links, of which I only got through one. I've actually been raped. I've been objectified more times than I can count, repeatedly called a "dyke" while out at bars with short hair but not paying attention to men, disowned by my father for supporting my husband financially in his creative pursuits, been told by strangers that I'm "too pretty to have tattoos". Do you see why it is incendiary to post things like "Well I do love the female form" when our aestheticism has been the thing that has the most value? Should I have felt honor that I was raped because he was just so attracted to me that he couldn't help himself? This is the type of rhetoric people unconsciously perpetuate when they try to force others to ignore societal imbalances. This is exactly what I'm talking about. I'm being labeled as hateful because I refused to validate a comment about my physical appearance.
Wow, okay. First, didn't read his blog, didn't felt I needed to to get what he was saying, but mostly I find it sad that he was censored in such a way without even being consulted to change his post first like what has once been done for me personally. I've been in some similar situations as you Jade, you shouldn't believe your experiences are so indifferent for a man to empathize with. I think your aggravation by my appreciation of the female qualities of existence is something you should consider exploring, I'm not talking about bodies. I'm talking about qualities. If you find my attraction to feminine qualities distasteful, then I can only say, may the shame you sell upon me be upon you instead. I am proud of my appreciations of the female everything. Without that love for something I believe myself to be more of than my own physical body can portray, I would be much more hateful and condescending, outright indignant towards women, that you call that very quality incendiary, I find just as incendiary.
I will not be ashamed for what I love, appreciate, and desire to know more of.
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: Here is a quote from Martin Luther King Jr that pretty much sums up my feelings on the subject. It's about racism, but I wasn't the first to draw the equivalency:
Quote:"First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."
Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."
...Okay, um, I mean, for all I know I am all of those things, and anyone's view of me being such would be nice to be shared with me. I do learn a lot about myself from other's opinions about me. But I like to think equality is more than just acceptance of each other, and we're never going to get to even that point if we continue to assign ideas like 'this is for men' 'that's for women' 'only white people do that' 'black people do that'. We need to move beyond the labels and stick to the one that matters, we're all humans, let's treat each other the way we would treat ANY human.
Even men, sitting on our high throne, now suffer from the loss of the divine feminine. Did you ever notice how much the transgender community has grown lately? It's mostly men, and if you ask me, they're trying to make restitution's for what has been done to women on an unconscious level, reducing themselves to shameful humiliated crossdressers slutting themselves out among other things. Those are people harming themselves and their physical identities in their mind by pretending to be something they're not in a way that portrays poorly what they are trying to be. Women are not sluts, they are not there to be shamed or humiliated or objectified in disturbingly attractive attire. You are as I and I am as You.
Do you think it's not felt by the oppressor what they have done? That all nazi's were evil and none of them sat under their bunks with their heads tucked away bawling hot tears clenching their hands violently over their ears at the echoing sounds of screams of those people they genocided so directly? That the atrocities we commit on one another doesn't warp who we are??
Come on Jade, it's all there to be seen. Equality is inevitable, even if it's outright outlawed, it will still eventually be. Most specifically by design of evolution, I like to think considering the bias of our logos.
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: What does Ra say about "justice" and healing our planet?
Quote:26.30 Questioner: And then, can you describe the mechanism of the planetary healing?
Ra: I am Ra. Healing is a process of acceptance, forgiveness, and, if possible, restitution. The restitution not being available in time/space, there are many among your peoples now attempting restitution while in the physical.
That quote has no bearing to 'Justice' that I can see. Restitution is not a form of Justice so much as the 'Justice System' with legally binding power to force such uses Restitution as one of it's tools of enforcement.
How do you link this quote to Justice? Why is restitution considered Justice to you?
(03-04-2017, 06:32 PM)Bring4th_Jade Wrote: C_A, if you still sincerely feel that I'm being more hateful than e_s
Never said you were being more hateful, just that in your perception of hate, you've responded with hate by calling it hateful, which sums up about as much hate as I saw in e_s's post, and I should add, I did not read the blog links he posted, if they were as bad as you all make them out to be then is that valid reason to respond in kind for you?
I often feel like I'm assaulted on an energetic level in discussions like this for not being a women and thus unable to understand, but I try very hard to understand, I'm sorry if I've failed in that endeavor in your eyes.
Society raises men and women to be very polarized between one another, our perceptions of each other are then warped by what society broadcasts to us all. That attractive men are men with power and money and status who are tall, dark, and handsome, that attractive women are woman of gullibility, submission, who must mold themselves in specific attire and makeup with a specific kind of personality to be more appealing. Many other similar molds and schemes apply until finally we have a bunch of men who poorly treat women and a bunch of women who poorly treat men, viewing each other as failures and offensive to one another.
I think if you can't accept that women are just as capable of men at anything, then you aren't actually talking about women equality, but putting women on a pedestal above men as an example of how bad men can be, can saying men this and men that and us men and us boys, then us guys go, 'oh you ladies, you girls! Women, pah!' and then you go, 'Men! Ugh!' and we're polarized.
Tell me, do any of you act differently towards a very attractive man than you would a very unattractive man? What about if that attractive man was a woman, or the unattractive man a woman? How do these things like attractiveness and gender effect the way we interact with another? Why does this happen? Would the words said by the attractive man be taken the same way if said by an unattractive man? What if the man, attractive or not, was a woman?
Why do these things effect how people interact with one another? Why is it courteous to hold a door open for a woman, but not a man? Why is a man considered less capable of being a parent than a woman? Why are men not supposed to be the one who stays home and watches the children?
Gender equality starts with our removal of reducing one another to the pushed notions and qualities society assigns to the labels like 'Man' and 'Woman'. Women and Men are equal, and only with that attitude, without pushing it with the same turbulence as hatred, can we incubate the roots of equality.
When you meet someone who says man is above woman, you should say they're equal. When you meet someone who says woman is above man, you should say they're equal. Anyone saying the same of races should be met with, they're equal.
If someone disagrees with this premise, and says that they are not equal, you should stand by your belief, that they are equal, and be an example, that you can believe even in the face of disbelief and say 'that's okay if you think that, but I believe men and women are inherently more similar than different, because they are more equal than they are apart.'
You can bring all the depth into this, but the moment those reasons become pedestals to hold a portion of humans above the rest of humanity, even if to say they are stronger, better, more resilient, you have cultivated separation. No group of humans is better than any other, we all have our strengths and weaknesses and we all need each other to balance those attributes.