[split] "Some people eat animals, some don't."

[Monica]

Monica.  I want to.
I've been plotting how to expend my income in a manner that is raw vegan oriented towards a major lessening of overall consumption...
As...crazy as that sounds.

Hemp Seeds
Bananas (or Banas) :3
Mangos
Oranges
Lemon-Lime-Cucumber infused water
Coconut Oil
Avocados
And I'm still devising nutritionally what I'll need to eat to replace whatever I'm missing...

I'd like to cease all consumption of meat and most vegetables.  I wasn't lying when I said I felt pain too, at the prospect of harming that which sustains me.  Foodstuffs or otherwise.  Its what my body wants...  Its just not my top priority and it does hurt my feelings How you basically call me many things I define as the literal Horrors of Hell because I eat a sandwhich with deli meat or cheese, I basically dont even want to make my chicken enchiladas anymore because of how you've made me feel and can't even listen to a McNuggets ad on the radio anymore without gagging.

So yeah, You hurt my feelings, here's the purse and me dumping it on the floor in.an attempt to be honest with you and in an attempt to be friendly...

So, I'm sorry.  Please consider that you can hurt feelings.  You might argue back a killer doesn't deserve that.

To which point you have killed me with the gavel.  As I have asked you to do if you desired.

I am NOT responsible for anyone feeling guilt over THEIR actions just because I point out the reality of THEIR actions. Nor am I responsible for anyone feeling hurt when I point out that xyz actions are causing suffering to others, and they happen to engage in xyz actions.

I NEVER called YOU anything at all. You know I didn't.

I called certain actions - supporting the enslavement, rape, torture and killing of sentient beings - inherently STS actions. If you happen to engage in supporting those things, then you are extrapolating from what I said, but I never said anything about YOU directly.

Do you see the difference?

I DO have compassion for you. I know how hard it is. You might be surprised, but I struggled a lot to give up cheese.

Giving up meat was very easy for me. I read The Essene Gospel of Peace, and Survival into the 21st Century at the same time, back in 1983, and that was that. I never looked back, and never again did I ever consider meat to be food.

I was, for the most part, vegan for many years, though I thought of cheese and eggs as 'by-products' of the meat industry and therefore not as serious to avoid as actual dead animals. I rarely ate any dairy or eggs, but didn't have a strong stance if there happened to be dairy or eggs in some food offered. Whereas, I wouldn't eat ANY food with even a tiny bit of meat or broth. That's where I drew the line for many years. (Keep in mind that this was before the internet, and before we had any vegetarian, much less vegan, options at any restaurants.)

Ironically, it was the meat threads here on B4 that got me to finally make a commitment to full vegan. It was researching the meat/dairy industry, in order to post facts about it here on the threads, that opened my eyes. Then, the kicker was B4 member Pablisimo, who is now a dear friend in real life. He too was a vegetarian, but not vegan, but it was something he shared with me about the spiritual and emotional aspects of eating dairy, as well as the physiological aspects of it containing opiods, that got me to go totally vegan.

Going to vegan pot-lucks didn't do it for me. I considered them kin. We were, after all, working for the same cause! I just thought they were more hardcore than I was. I thought it was enough to just be vegetarian, and going totally vegan was optional. Believe it or not, I was actually on the receiving end of some serious reprimand if I forgot and showed up wearing leather shoes!

Avoiding eggs and dairy wasn't a big deal to me, until I experienced some serious stress in my life, including serious illness. That's when I allowed a health practitioner to convince me to start eating 'organic' chicken and fish again, and raw goat's milk. I was very, VERY desperate and had tried everything else: Every diet, herb, supplement, etc. So of course the practitioner immediately seized upon my veg diet and was convinced that was the culprit.

It was VERY hard for me! I had to smother the chicken/fish in hot sauce and pretend it was tofu!! I nearly gagged, I was so grossed out. But I didn't feel guilty because I knew it was 'to the extent necessary for individual metabolism' and I was trying to save my own life.

Well, guess what? It did NOT help AT ALL!!!! Zero.

So after awhile, I went back to being vegetarian, mostly vegan, like I was before. It wasn't until about 10 years later that I found the answer to my health problems (but that's another story). It had absolutely nothing to do with my diet.

But, because of the stress of being sick and other stresses, I began to eat cheese as a comfort food. It didn't help the health problems at all, and in fact made them worse, but it did help me cope with the stresses I was dealing with.

This continued until just a few years ago, right around the time I was very involved in the meat threads. It was Pablisimo who gave me THE missing piece I needed to make the connection about why eating dairy harms animals just as much as eating meat. I went vegan just a few weeks after Pablisimo did, and I have him to thank for that.

I still think that, for some people, just going vegetarian first can be a huge first step. Trying to change to 100% vegan might be daunting. Many people go vegetarian first, then vegan a little later. Others just do it 'cold turkey' and quit all of it overnight.

Had I known back in 1983 what Pablisimo shared with me a few years ago, I surely would have quit all of it at the same time. (As it happened, I quit other vices at the same time I quit meat, all overnight. That's just how I tend to do things.) But some people end up backsliding when they make big changes all at once.

Having said all that, OF COURSE I am happy to help you!!!  

You might want to start with this:

Bring4th Forums Two > Health & Diet  v > Vegetarianism Made E-Z (Recipes and Stuff - NO debate allowed here!)

If you wish to quit eating most vegetables too, that is called Fruitarianism. That is the ultimate karma-free diet because it relies only on fruits, nuts and seeds, all of which fall from the plant so nothing is ever killed.

That's considered very advanced, and many vegans aspire to do that someday. But, in all honesty, it's much more difficult to be healthy if you aren't also eating vegetables. (I consider that a clue! It's interesting how meat and dairy are associated with increased disease risk, whereas fruits and veggies are associated with health and healing.)

Personally, where I'm at right now is 'high raw' vegan meaning it's mostly raw fruits and veggies, with some nuts and seeds. I do still eat some cooked vegan food (rice, beans, tofu, tempeh, etc.) but I feel much better when I'm raw.

If you go raw, you need to make sure you're getting enough calories. That is easily done with lots of fruit! (and/or grains, potatoes, beans, nuts, seeds, etc.) Usually, whenever people have trouble going vegan, it's because they aren't eating enough calories. Veggies have almost No calories, so it's important to include lots of grains, potatoes, beans, etc. OR, if you're high-raw, lots of fruits, nuts and seeds, to get your calories and essential fatty acids (healthy oils).

Here's another thread you might find helpful:

Bring4th Forums Two > Health & Diet  v > Ultimate 4D Diet

Bananas are a good standby because they're cheap. (Rice and beans are also very cheap! Being vegan is much cheaper than eating meat and dairy.) High-raw vegans typically eat anywhere from 10-30 bananas per day.

Sort of like gorillas... We resemble them the most physiologically.

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