Can the human infringe by doing the learning for another?

[Steppingfeet]

Hey, βαθμιαίος, great post! I'd like to respond but spent the last of my life energy on the behemoth below. I'll try to respond tomorrow. In the meantime....

Dear Unity100,

GLB wrote: If I remember correctly, Ra never said that wanderers have greater access to information than do natives to third density. Can you direct me to where in the Law of One Ra says this?

Unity100 wrote: this piece is not from about Ra. this is my own conclusion, […] my conclusion is, and i think rightly so too, because wanderers have bazillions of years in between their belts working on, in and with quite delicate aspects of existence, if they havent particularly limited themselves heavily not to be able to do so, the should have easier time penetrating the veil.

and it is probably so, because from the percentages Ra tells us about the differing ranks of awareness to their situation, wanderers seem to be starting already with some kind of penetration out of the box. had there been no penetration, they would already start with perfect fit within the societal mind as they are born.

I concur about wanderers having bazillions of years of experience under their belt, but I don't see how accumulated experience would be available to them such that penetrating the veil would be easier. In the excerpt below, Ra defines the extent to which the forgetting process can be penetrated.

65.19 http://lawofone.info/results.php?session_id=65&ss=1#19
The forgetting process can be penetrated to the extent of the Wanderer remembering what it is and why it is upon the planetary sphere. However, it would be an infringement if Wanderers penetrated the forgetting so far as to activate the more dense bodies and thus be able to live, shall we say, in a god-like manner. This would not be proper for those who have chosen to serve.

Two things result from this remembering: 1) That the wanderer is a wanderer. 2) Why the wanderer is on Earth.

It is exactly this remembering which Ra also discusses in the percentages of differing ranks of awareness of their situation that you mention above. The percentages they give do not, in my thinking, necessarily indicate that the wanderer, because of its vast pool of experience, has penetrated the veil more easily than the third-density native.

On the contrary, there are I am sure millions of native third-density entities who naturally, like the wanderer, remember something about their past lives, perhaps a specific lifetime, or a particular event within a lifetime, or a sense that lived in ancient Rome or harvested guano in New Guinea.

The wanderer, yes, has millions of years of experience. Their contract also required that the put those millions of years of experience into a locked box, placed on a shelf in a dark corner that is out of reach and out of view.

Unity100 wrote:it is also highly possible that most of these wanderers go to scientific or spiritual pursuits. […] actually, the very factor making wanderers such easy thinkers and inventors should be the closer ties to the roots of the mind itself.

So you are saying that the fact that wanderers (at least those named in the Law of One) tend to pursue scientific and/or spiritually oriented paths is evidence of the fact that the wanderer has easier access to subconscious information?

I would disagree here. What you see manifesting is, I believe, simply pre-incarnational programming. This operates the same in the native third-density entity who pursues a life path in accordance with their own pre-incarnational programming without perhaps consciously knowing why they follow such a path during their incarnation.

Unity100 wrote: firstly, we dont have sufficient information to talk about what kind of information atlantean students, egyptian students and south american students received. these are unknowns to us, we only know some about the late work of Ra in egypt with the tarot cards in order to teach the Law of One. this was way after the atlantean episode.

Agreed. So then we add an asterisk to my previous statement about their being no other source of information similar to that which was channeled by the L/L group in the early 80’s which says:

*As far as we know.

Unity100 wrote: secondly, there is this - it seems that whatever sources are governing this planet lately, have been under the opinion that they should use already existing thought, belief patterns existing on the world in order to teach/learn. ie,

What gave you this idea that the prevailing Confederation policy is to use existing terrestrial systems of thought?

Unity100 wrote: there are already religions , a wanderer incarnates, s/he awakens, and then starts to disseminate information/philosophy within the framework of that religion.

This may or may not happen in the life pattern of a wanderer. You describe the situation though as if this is part of some larger plan enacted by the Confederation in which multiple wanderers played a pre-coordinated part.

In my understanding, Ra divides the function and purpose of the wanderer along these three broad lines:

1) Lightening the planetary vibration through the doubling affect of love and light
2) Serving as “beacon” or “shepherd”
3) Offering the outer gifts of service unique to the individual wanderer

65.12 http://lawofone.info/results.php?session_id=65&ss=1#12

65.11 http://lawofone.info/results.php?session_id=65&ss=1#11

The first and most important two roles of the wanderer indicate not that the wanderer is here to disseminate “information” (though an individual wanderer may certainly do so), but rather to disseminate energy, to open the heart, breathe, and allow the Creator’s love and light through.

Unity100 wrote: a good example of this is, how various wanderers have reinforced various religious hierarchical organizations, giving it more authority and power through the work they have done. their good deeds, miracles were used by these organizations. there was some good done, but, these led to the hierarchy gaining more power.

Are you referring to saints and notable religious figures within Roman Catholic orders? Though certainly corrupt and mixed in polarity, Catholicism I would argue is not without virtue. It being the monolithic institution of its day, devoted (ostensibly, at least) to the worship of and devotion to God, I am not surprised that Creator-oriented wanderers were attracted to work within its structures. Where else could one live as a monk or a nun in a framework which supported the contemplative life?

Further, it seems to me that you speak of these hierarchical organizations as if they are purely service-to-self in orientation. In my opinion, the churches of all religions have been forces of mixed polarity.

Unity100 wrote: tho this would be a very advanced topic in itself, i would say that there is actually no free will.

I would agree in the sense that there is no anything. There is no individual entity, no multiple entities, no space, no time, no Logos, no Third Distortion, no Second Distortion, even no First Distortion.

Of what relevance does this have to the question of infringement, though? We could discuss anything under the sun which could be brought to an abrupt end by saying, “In actuality, that which we are discussing does not exist.”

You would kind of make for a bad date in that regard, Unity100. : )

Unity100 wrote: basically, if existence is an infinite sea, it is impossible for any focus point's vibrations, waves, not to affect the whole picture itself, and all other focal points.

Good thought. I like how you put that.

Unity100 wrote: and when i look at the concepts of higher self, parallel universes, and mind/body/spirit complex totality as a higher self of the 6d higher self, all it seems to me that the whole question is which part of the fragmented ultimate totality will shoulder the burden of living what part of the total experience to be lived ; one may be taking the responsibility to live in a negative experience set, one a positive, one may be taking on the path of nonveiled 3, 4 to direct 8 d route etc.

That may be.

I’ll get abstract with you! I tend to see all the manifested, illusory, created material as energy in motion. Everything is moving, bumping into one another, affecting one another. Karma is in motion, past conditioning and tendencies are in motion, thinking is in motion, actions are in motion, galaxies are in motion, incarnation itself is in motion. It’s all a moving, shifting, interacting, infinite sea of holographic portions of the One in motion.

How these moving energies interact is the infinite variety of the Creator watching itself live. Will a rock be worn to nothing by a river? Will a family of birds survive the storm? Will this individual choose love or fear? Will this complicated set of collective ideas and emotions work with or collide with the complicated set of collective ideas and emotions of the neighboring culture?

But there is something that is not moving. There is a constant. A permanent. A real. And all that moves, moves within Its awareness. And that awareness is present in both you and I, looking out through our eyes here and now. The whole dramatic and grand play, EVERYTHING, is happening in that awareness, in that unity which, because it contains all things, cannot abhor anything – that which we call compassion or universal love. The moving energies, set in motion by free will, are embraced in this non-dual awareness.

Those moving energies are possessed of free will. In the less conscious entities – those of first and second densities, that free will is, at first, seemingly random, then somewhat directed though unconsciously so, and then free will is seen for the resource that it is and is used and directed by the conscious entity.

And the whole time, there is an awareness within that is unchanged, that is watching and embracing and loving the whole play. It is unmoved and, I guess you could say, without will as we would conceive it. It IS.

Unity100 wrote: this, is just a simple case example in which how the message of wanderers, even if planned very carefully and even having support of a whole societal complex behind it (remember the case of yahweh and the annunaki business), can easily be cramped by elites and rendered to their own end.

Definitely. According to the Law of One, Earth is a battleground between positive and negative forces. In such an environment, even the purest positive truth will be corrupted and utilized by negative forces and vice versa.

Unity100 wrote: its not philosophical only, delivering obscure and generic, broad stuff that you can fit anything into, like 'your poo is zen'. it straightly, plainly, directly tells what it wants to tell. it talks about creation as it came to be from what Ra has learned, and it talks about paths and non paths, and what was before those paths.

LOL on the Zen allusion! And I loved your assessment of the Law of One books in your following paragraphs, cataloguing its many topics of discussion and deriving meaning from the existence of the various multi-layered, multi-dimensional, multi-faceted, multi-purposed information.

Unity100 wrote: how much mileage do you think it is left to being able to create lifeforms ? pyramids given, energy information given, archetypical mind of logos given ?

Is this rhetorical or are you asking me something? Either way, I’m not understanding the questions.

Unity100 wrote: that gives our second angle of approach ; ra material is not for those who are not needing, not seeking, or not wanting to take the responsibility of it. if an entity is reading Ra books, s/he should already have done the metaphorical 'death and rebirth' choice in his/her mind, dedicating himself or herself to seeking that kind of information. leave aside being here.

Why should there be a “should” in there? Why a qualifying criteria?

I would add refinement to your thought here by saying that perhaps one who comes to the Law of One having already experienced the metaphorical (and metaphysical) “death and rebirth” will find great utility.

Either way, the entity who has gone through such a process, once or multiple times, should in the general sense be able to derive aid for the spiritual journey in the same way the less initiated entity does.

Unity100 wrote: actually, being here may be more secure for an entity because there are other people who actually can remedy some of the impact of the information in the books because they may have lived the same experiences before. while alone, its you and the books. and whatever kind of link opens to the subconscious, or any other kind of channel that can do anything, in whichever way its possible.

Where is “here”? The forums?

I definitely agree about the benefit of fellow seekers. Though the spiritual quest is ultimately a solo one, friends along the journey are invaluable and, in actuality, accelerate and catalyze the journey.

Unity100 wrote: unfortunately, there seem to be many people who have not done this death and rebirth choice. for many, it seems to be a kind of hobby, a way to feel some needed energies, a curiosity, or an extension of the existing love-subject-only spiritual literature/channelings. there is nothing wrong in that, except that there are times in which they are unfortunately attempting to prevent the teach/learning of advanced information because they want their biases to be accepted as paramount, or want them to be included, or want them to be the basis, or want them in anywhere in the framework.

I have existed at what might be termed a “spiritual center” for seven years now and have had the opportunity to cross paths with many spiritually oriented seekers, the majority being students of the Law of One. I have noticed that there are certainly gradations to the intensity of focus and desire on the mystical journey. Some pursue it more wholeheartedly than others. This is to be expected.

But what you are saying sounds as if you are issuing a complaint. Do I understand you correctly? If so, do you have a specific target for this complaint? Are you saying that this is happening on the forums?

Unity100 wrote: they are wanting their views to be accepted, instead of their own selves be accepted. and, they are expecting others to change their views to suit with their own biases. it is not only wrong, its also spiritually unwise - anything they prevent successfully from being shared, knowingly or unknowingly, will become an inertia for them to fix. directly or indirectly. with all its consequences.

Maybe you’re right about the consequences which such actions have for others, maybe you’re wrong. But why so concerned? Isn’t the self our domain and jurisdiction? Work on the self, I say, work on the self and let others be as they are, so long as they are not infringing, or, in the case of the forums, violating the guidelines.

Unity100 wrote: in actuality, anyone is responsible with any choice they make. as per the law of attraction and law of responsibility, if someone is here, s/he is responsible with his/her choices. and all their consequences. s/he is responsible himself/herself if what s/he reads in Ra text or here engages in any kind of paranormal experience that may not be so desirable for himself/herself, responsible for being able and advanced enough to be able to discern any truth that resonates to him/her, than anything that does not, or any kind of phoney information or condescending, patronizing, patriarchical or paternal sounding, belovingly coercing kind of views/communique, or those who reinforce existing societal biases by bundling them with love or knowledge - actually any kind of minimum requirement and dedication for going on an advanced journey.

tho, actually, these merry wanderers probably already have sufficient protection from whatever sources that are aiding them in their journey, and therefore will be protected from any kind of extreme results, unless they are actually sufficiently advanced inside to be held responsible and to do things by knowing them. so, this would reduce the second angle to the biases/conditionings preventing advanced seekers from seeking issue.

I’m not quite getting what you’re saying in these two paragraphs. Seriously, I’ve reread them a few times and just as it seems meaning begins to dawn on my feeble brain, it dissipates. Could you rephrase and sum up these two paragraphs? I apologize but but I’m just not getting it.

Unity100 wrote: if we take Ra's material, any entity that has incarnated through the veil and penetrated the veil is free to do anything with it. it doesnt become an infringement, if one does it by incarnating, and penetrating the veil. else, the activities of all wanderers in the 200 year long wanderer wave, and all the activities past and present of the 65 million + wanderers incarnated circa 1980 (and probably on, more and more) would be infringement. and, the very fact that the Ra material being published in godknowshowmany countries, would be also infringing beyond imagination.

Haha!! Finally! I’ve read many interesting thoughts from you in this post, but nothing which directly spoke to my question which you were ostensibly responding to.

SO, your conclusion and response to my question is that the veiled third-density entity is not in the same position as Ra in terms of being able to infringe on others by sharing information.

Why, I agree.

And thanks for the cardio, Unity100. : )

Love/Light,
GLB