There has been a discussion in between me and all others, except you and ali qadir. Due to philosophical difference, there is no way that i can bridge the concepts in between you two and me, because doing so requires me to see matters as you see. Because i was once from the religion, and the mindset Ali qadir is, - from what i have seen from his posts in numerous threads -, as far as i remember the format, there will never be any kind of understanding unless i concede 'god's greatness', unquestionability, and unfathomability. These are the traits of a religion once i was a member of, and have studied deeply for two years, and also all the sufist and other middle eastern philosophies following it. There is no way to concile with these philosophies.
With you, as far as i see, the situation is slightly different, but on a same parallel. You want me to 'humble' myself, and accept your viewpoint. You wont rest easy as long as i dont 'humble' myself, or my viewpoint. That is not a discussion. Moreover, you are projecting your views on me in not only this, but on other threads, despite it is not shared by 'others' as you so vulgarly generalize. Irrelevantly too, which creates a risk of people who havent discussed with me knowing me as 'arrogant', 'raining on others' parade' and whatnot. Which is also an added problem to the bridges in between you and me. I have numerous conclusions about you, and ali qadir, some of which i can easily identify from my own past experience from being in the same shoes, yet, i havent reflected any of these unnecessarily and irrelevantly.
And no, it cant happen. 'Humbling' oneself means accepting various incapabilities, which in turn brings a lessening in worth/worthlessness balance, which then in turn impedes numerous things, ranging from mental, spiritual capabilities, connections to self-esteem. These are all needed after a certain point, in evolution, and cannot be risked. However this is a VERY long discussion, in which discussion of related concepts would be required, and i dont think it will be possible to discuss these with you at any given point.
This thread, proposing a possibility of the failure of some plan that is perceived to be of the so great creator that certain philosophies praise and gratify, is very offensive to that kind of philosophy. Hence, the discussion with two of you deteriorated towards 'my capacities' and 'my headstrongness', my inexistent 'humbleness', ie - concepts based on personality, rather than the general concepts, for that very reason. For, humbling or discrediting of me, will be perceived by the nullification of that offensive proposal that 'god can fail'. Which is a common pattern when you discuss anything so open minded with such philosophies. It is not the first time for anyone voicing such opinions, it wont be the first time. It will repeat. Due to the nature of this forum, its participants and their education level, so far the reaction from people who hold such philosophies had been quite civil. It is quite aggressive and rude in general, in other places.
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as i said, i wont be discussing this with you two, for, i know that there can be no agreement. we cant even disagree civilly, for i must concede that god is great, and cant be fathomed and cant possibly fail, before you two can rest easy. therefore, i wont be replying to you in this thread anymore. Alternatively, from my experience with other people of similar philosophies, locking of the thread would also put your minds at ease, since the 'offense' will not continue anymore, however, it would also be to the detriment and dislike of me, and similarly open minded people.
With you, as far as i see, the situation is slightly different, but on a same parallel. You want me to 'humble' myself, and accept your viewpoint. You wont rest easy as long as i dont 'humble' myself, or my viewpoint. That is not a discussion. Moreover, you are projecting your views on me in not only this, but on other threads, despite it is not shared by 'others' as you so vulgarly generalize. Irrelevantly too, which creates a risk of people who havent discussed with me knowing me as 'arrogant', 'raining on others' parade' and whatnot. Which is also an added problem to the bridges in between you and me. I have numerous conclusions about you, and ali qadir, some of which i can easily identify from my own past experience from being in the same shoes, yet, i havent reflected any of these unnecessarily and irrelevantly.
And no, it cant happen. 'Humbling' oneself means accepting various incapabilities, which in turn brings a lessening in worth/worthlessness balance, which then in turn impedes numerous things, ranging from mental, spiritual capabilities, connections to self-esteem. These are all needed after a certain point, in evolution, and cannot be risked. However this is a VERY long discussion, in which discussion of related concepts would be required, and i dont think it will be possible to discuss these with you at any given point.
This thread, proposing a possibility of the failure of some plan that is perceived to be of the so great creator that certain philosophies praise and gratify, is very offensive to that kind of philosophy. Hence, the discussion with two of you deteriorated towards 'my capacities' and 'my headstrongness', my inexistent 'humbleness', ie - concepts based on personality, rather than the general concepts, for that very reason. For, humbling or discrediting of me, will be perceived by the nullification of that offensive proposal that 'god can fail'. Which is a common pattern when you discuss anything so open minded with such philosophies. It is not the first time for anyone voicing such opinions, it wont be the first time. It will repeat. Due to the nature of this forum, its participants and their education level, so far the reaction from people who hold such philosophies had been quite civil. It is quite aggressive and rude in general, in other places.
......................
as i said, i wont be discussing this with you two, for, i know that there can be no agreement. we cant even disagree civilly, for i must concede that god is great, and cant be fathomed and cant possibly fail, before you two can rest easy. therefore, i wont be replying to you in this thread anymore. Alternatively, from my experience with other people of similar philosophies, locking of the thread would also put your minds at ease, since the 'offense' will not continue anymore, however, it would also be to the detriment and dislike of me, and similarly open minded people.