About Social Values-coufused

[Quantum]

I think we lost track of the original points of the thread in our verbal tennis match, which I am happy to concede at this point, as it seems that all the points are made and I'm not keeping score. As I recall, our original tangent was on the topic of karma. Is that exhausted as well?

I believe we are speaking to STS vs STO as a general principle, and karma as a specific? My intent is not to match, as much as explore? If explored together towards the higher goal and ground of understanding there are no points, as much as discovery?

I might challenge this by offering that wealth; ease of existence; and opportunity for power; combined with a high regard for the health of the physical body as a recipe for "charisma" is not the definition of charisma. A total sloth, devoid of personality and charm, and altogether a despicable individual, may exhibit all of the above, and be barren of charm or charisma. One such as described above may in fact repel rather than attract, and yet obtain and possess all of the wealth, ease of existence; and opportunity for power; combined with a high regard for the health of the physical body, as the mark explicitly defined by Ra as that of a potential STS, not as one for a signifier of charisma.

True, and one could take eggs, flour, oil, sugar and chocolate and make a great mess, but add in a little time and care, and one easily comes up with cake. Now, given the ingredients above, I propose that an entity interested in domination and control of others (especially) is much more likely to look tempting, shall we say, than sloth-like.

Should we wish to continue in drawing out the potential distinctions of STS vs STO, as you invite, I agree that an STS with charm "may" appear more tempting as you suggest, but needn't be "at all charming" as a rule, and am confident we could draw from an exhaustive laundry list of sloth like STS characters that history is replete with that had all or many of the qualities named by Ra as qualities of wealth, ease of comfort, etc, but that charm is not necessarily one required, and that the qualities of wealth, ease of comfort etc, in my humble opinion, were offered as signifiers of STS. Charm = equaling charisma, is not offered in this quote by Ra as a signifier of STS, as much as conjectured by your assessment that it may assist greatly in being tempting for an STS to utilize. Charm, I maintain, is a quality of a developed personality, and one that is not discernible as implying STS only, or even primarily, but one without question possessed by the developed STO personality without a desire to even consider as camouflage. His STO light would radiate to such an extent, that he indeed more so than his brethren the STS, would be hard to miss in a crowded room, and moreover he would freely give of his light/love, as opposed to potentially holding it as might an STS.

Were this true, as you seem to agree, then it stands to reason that he (STS'er in question) might in fact then be more than hard to miss as you stated in the earlier post, he would be impossible to recognize if so desired, and missed with intent altogether.

On the contrary, I said, and maintain, that they would stand out even in a crowded room,

If they may camouflage, as you seem to agree, then it stands to reason they may wish to not stand out, and thus would choose not to stand out

I'm merely questioning your assertion that you've never met one.

In my humble opinion, I've never met one. If I did, he may have chosen to camouflage, and thus operating on stealth mode such that I did not detect him?

I still propose that "a significant number of people in the public eye, as it were, are such harvestable STS entities." And I suggest that one can detect them with a discerning eye.

Same point...same response. I wouldn't know. I would offer one would instead know them with certainty by their fruit, as Jesus answered when asked "how may we know them?" As shared above, Charm is a quality of a developed personality, and one that is not discernible as implying STS only, or even primarily, but one without question possessed by the developed STO personality. His light would radiate to such an extent that he would be hard to miss.

I said: Here I agree to some extent, with exceptions. One following one's path of the light needn't fear or disparage his brethren following his path of darkness, as this would be contrary to STO in any case. But he may choose very strongly to avoid, perhaps as a result of the diverse paths walked as a consequence, as much as he may pity (love) for the choice his darker brethren makes as regards the often less than loving consequences to his fellow brethren, who the STO'er would pity (love) , as much as (love) pity the STS'er for having inflicted and chosen same. As STO, what other choice may he offer himself?

You said: I'm not sure that I follow your point of exception here, but I would offer the observation that the opposite of "love" is not "pity", as you seem to imply, it is "fear".

I imply not the antonym, but the synonym. Love and pity may be seen as congruent. The Brothers of Sorrow look down upon us of 3D out of love, and reacting from sympathetic (pity) vibrations, equal to empathetic vibrations (love), have no choice, but from both, to turn back and assist, if not become involved.

Q