Surrender

[Lukman]

Although I have read various books and articles about the chakra energy system, none of it ever resonated with me. It seemed like just so much metaphysical [read: intellectual] stuff, having little bearing upon practical, day-to-day living. Besides, meditation practices -- which seem to always be touted as the means for entering this system -- never have held much attraction for me. Nevertheless, earlier this year, I became spontaneously aware of these hierarchical centers and am beginning to learn how to utilize them in practical, moral and ethical ways. While I am sure there is much more to learn, yesterday I experienced directly how my physical body's metabolic fire supports and carries my spirit in this world; and how spirit transforms this world. It was an intense vibration that not only permeated my whole body, but extended outwards to encompass the whole field of my being.

I am telling this not to discount or put down anyone's spiritual practices. Rather, it is an indication to me that, because all of us are spiritual beings traveling in this density, we all are made up of energy riding around in these bodies. As such, everything is available to us. It is there for the asking. True, because of blockages we may have, all may not be immediately given upon our asking. Patience is needed. Perserverance is needed. Sincerity is needed.

God -- the Great Life Force -- just wants our surrender.

[Vince]

i've found meditation to be quite practical, although i was skeptical at first. it takes a certain amount of knowledge and discipline to perform it successfully. time and practice are vital.

[Monica]

Hi Lukman!

I think I understand your main point...that spiritual evolution will occur naturally, without all the props. I do think that sometimes we can get caught up in gadgets and techniques, and forget the most important thing: LOVE!

I don't consider meditation to be in that category, though I could see how maybe specific techniques of meditation might be considered as such. While specific techniques might be appealing and useful to some, others might prefer just some basic quiet time, or prayer in the form that they learned from a conventional religion. I don't think the style really matters so much, as long as there is some sort of attuning to Spirit.

Your experience shows that one can have spiritual experiences quite spontaneously! I too have had experiences that, at the time, I had no explanation for, and I realized that the experience occurring naturally was just as valid, if not more so, than intellectually seeking such experiences.

As for surrender, can you please clarify what you mean by that?

Here is a Q'uo channeling on the concept of surrender, which I found quite profound:

http://bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=70

Surrender was a strong component of my faith when I was a Christian. I have modified my view towards it since then, to be more about harmonizing with spiritual influences, recognizing the nudging and prompting from my Higher Self, and flowing with the River of Life, so to speak. So I am curious as to what 'surrender' means to you.

[Lukman]

i've found meditation to be quite practical, although i was skeptical at first. it takes a certain amount of knowledge and discipline to perform it successfully. time and practice are vital.

[Darn! I just lost my reply to you, Vince!]

Here goes, again!

Thank you for responding to my exploratory thread here. I agree with you that meditation can be useful and effective, and have known people for whom this is true.

My first brush with meditation came during my 2nd year of undergrad studies when I attended a lecture by a visiting rep of the then Student Meditation Society. He described how during the practice, one goes down into oneself, past all distractions, etc. -- and as he spoke, I followed into that place of spirit. Getting a mantra and following the SMS discipline seemed quite redundant to me at that point.

Also, discipline means being a disciple and, for better or worse, I've never been too good at that!

---

Hi Lukman!

I think I understand your main point...that spiritual evolution will occur naturally, without all the props. I do think that sometimes we can get caught up in gadgets and techniques, and forget the most important thing: LOVE!

I don't consider meditation to be in that category, though I could see how maybe specific techniques of meditation might be considered as such. While specific techniques might be appealing and useful to some, others might prefer just some basic quiet time, or prayer in the form that they learned from a conventional religion. I don't think the style really matters so much, as long as there is some sort of attuning to Spirit.

Your experience shows that one can have spiritual experiences quite spontaneously! I too have had experiences that, at the time, I had no explanation for, and I realized that the experience occurring naturally was just as valid, if not more so, than intellectually seeking such experiences.

As for surrender, can you please clarify what you mean by that?

Here is a Q'uo channeling on the concept of surrender, which I found quite profound:

http://bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=70

Surrender was a strong component of my faith when I was a Christian. I have modified my view towards it since then, to be more about harmonizing with spiritual influences, recognizing the nudging and prompting from my Higher Self, and flowing with the River of Life, so to speak. So I am curious as to what 'surrender' means to you.

Monica,,

Thank you for your reply to my post. You have indeed captured my meaning. Like you, I have been given many spiritual experiences -- always unbidden, sometimes frightening, but always in accord with what I seem able to handle. These include past/future/intrauterine life memories; having my heart stopped; being visited/possessed by other souls; visiting other worlds. And, despite all of this, still having to deal with my own emotional crap and shortcomings in this world!

I agree with your definition of surrender. It does not mean not trying or being passive but that we leave the results up to God/Allah/GLF.

[Vince]

Also, discipline means being a disciple and, for better or worse, I've never been too good at that!

i've been sorta lucky over the past year, i guess. i rent out a room to a meditation teacher who's been teaching a class over the last year that i sporadically attend.