women communicating to men

[norral]

dear ladies

i just wanted to say. if u want your man to do something tell him. dont assume that he gets it. he being a man does not get it. his mind is on the
a. football game
b. basketball game
c. baseball game
d. beer and potato chips
e. all of the above.

men are dense . it is a requirement in this density if u are a man to be dense. just because he has been putting out the garbage for 30 years dont expect him to put it out tomorrow. he is a man. he will forget . we are not bad people as men but we are men and we cherish our denseness. we revel in it actually. so if u want something from him tell him and tell him repeatedly. usually after hearing hit the tenth or eleventh time we get it. usually. howerver if it is superbowl weekend we probably wont get it no matter how many times u tell us. it is our dna our genetics, gods will for us,, whatever. remember we dont do this intentionally it is just programmed into our dna

[Pablísimo]

Hey Norral,

I know you intended this as a lighthearted joke. And I certainly did get a good laugh out of your post, brother. Thanks for that levity in a sometimes too-serious world!

But I felt like I should mention that these kinds of statements reinforce gender stereotypes, as was briefly touched upon in a couple of recent threads. I believe that though we have physiological differences, our souls are beyond race, culture, and even gender. I always feel slightly uncomfortable when I come across something like this -- about either men or women. Or, worse, racial stuff.

I am a man, but I don't consider myself dense, and competetive team sports hold absolutely no interest for me AT ALL. I just don't care for them, or beer for that matter. A couple of specific passages in the Ra material helped me better understand this aversion to sports, for me at least, but I digress. I know many men are into sports, but I know first-hand that we don't all share this interest any more than all women love to shop. Nor do I think we're all really that dense -- at least, no denser than the average 3D being of any gender.

You do make a good overall point about communication, though, and I'd like to recognize that. Whether it's woman to man, man to woman, or within the same gender, I totally agree that it's better to communicate rather than assume the other person knows what you want. I love what you said -- "Tell him!!". It seems to me a great many misunderstandings are caused by one party assuming the other should "just know" and not communicating. We really can't read minds -- yet! So, thanks very much for raising this point!

As an aside, I view a love relationship as a wonderful opportunity for mutual service. My wife makes such an effort to help me with the things I need and consider important, that I am awed and humbled by her example of Service. It really inspires me to do the same for her. That's my natural inclination anyway, but this shared mutual service somehow strengthens that natural desire. Whether that means remembering to take out the garbage or something more complex.

Though of course we both forget sometimes or drop the ball... and that's where the communication comes in. By communicating, lovingly and kindly, we get back on track and the mutual service starts flowing again. I appreciate you reminding me of this today.

I hope this didn't come off as preachy. I know you didn't mean any insult with this, I just felt moved to speak up about the gender stereotype thing.

All that said, you got me on the potato chips. I try not to eat them too much but on some days ....I love em

Love to all

[norral]

dear pablissimo

i was done in a light hearted manner. i definitely dont mean to reinforce gender stereotypes and if it made u uncomfortable i apologize. and yes we are subject to stereotypes all the time. racial stereotyping, religious,gender, u name it we have it. it was more of a statement about me personally as i admit i can be very very dense at times and oblivious to stuff that is hitting me in the face. but i'll be more sensitive in the future as my goal is to make no one uncomfortable .

norral

[Pablísimo]

No worries, Brother, it's all good!! I feel better having said something about it, and I really appreciate your kind and respectful response. I'm also glad you understand what I meant about the stereotypes. I would have reacted the same way if it had been about women only caring about shopping and hairstyles and being bubble headed. I feel we are making great progress in getting rid of the gender stereotypes overall, but there's still a long way to go.

No need to apologize, or censor yourself in the future. These threads just provide food for thought and discussion for us all, and your lighthearted intent was clear.

But I do appreciate your kindness and understanding. It's folks like you, that care about the feelings and lives of others, that keeps me coming back again and again to this wonderful gathering place.

Thanks for being You!

Love to all

dear pablissimo

i was done in a light hearted manner. i definitely dont mean to reinforce gender stereotypes and if it made u uncomfortable i apologize. and yes we are subject to stereotypes all the time. racial stereotyping, religious,gender, u name it we have it. it was more of a statement about me personally as i admit i can be very very dense at times and oblivious to stuff that is hitting me in the face. but i'll be more sensitive in the future as my goal is to make no one uncomfortable .

norral

[Oceania]

well maybe you're a woman and i'm a man. i hate shopping and i love sports. what's on Norral?

[norral]

ha ha oceania , i like shopping and sports. so i thought i had a pretty clear picture of who i am but now u have me confused lol. anyway let me go watch espn while i do so on line shopping

[Ankh]

Thank you, Pablísimo, for speaking up, as I thought in the exact lines as you did. And thank you dear norral, for your kind answer, which made to understand to not take it personally anymore, but to see that each needs to follow its own path, and that it has nothing to do with me. And thank you, Monica. Love to you all!

[Diana]

Norral, what you say may have some basis in truth, but ultimately I reject it.

There are differences in female/male physiology, of course, which cannot be discounted as long as we have physical bodies (I said more about this in the female orgasm thread). This may account for some of the differences in thinking and behavior.

Our human history can be taken into consideration to discover the origins of the imbalance. Females may have a tendency to employ subtle ways of communicating based on many centuries if not millennia of being dominated (since they had no "say" and were, up until recent history considered chattel--property), and men may have entitlement issues (having everything concerning the home being done for them) due to being in power for so long (family, tribe leaders, religious leaders, and modern-day versions of them).

However, female and male behaviors, in my opinion, are not the way to look at this.

We all have a responsibility to communicate clearly. We all have a responsibility to be caretakers of integrity.

To speak to your main point:

1) It is no one's "job" to care for the environment in which 2 or more people live. No one should need to be asked to do anything. It is the responsibility of all who live there. It is an honor to be a caretaker, a steward, of whatever land, home, living space on Mother Earth we live. Spiritually speaking, if one is present, and loves what one is caretaker of, then one fills the space with love, and the space will love back. If we could all have this attitude, many problems would go away concerning marital disputes and environmental pollution.

2) If a spouse, or partner, or anyone, does not communicate clearly, it is the responsibility of both people involved in the communication. Communication is dependent upon all persons involved, not just the person trying to say something. The listener needs to LISTEN, and be PRESENT. If then, the listener does not really understand, it is the listener's responsibility to ask for clarification. The person attempting to communicate something has a responsibility to be clear and direct, not to imply, suggest, or manipulate, and expect the results she/he is looking for.

This may not be easy. As children, we manipulate continually (it is a survival directive). Many of us have portions of ourselves stuck, or fragmented, from childhood due to traumas, neglect, poor nutrition, etc. So adults often manipulate rather than deal with issues in a mature, healthy way because portions of ourselves may not have matured. Inner child work can help with this.

As a woman, I don't care if the man is not aware of his responsibilities, nor do I excuse him because of our human history. I personally, prefer to live with individuals who understand the concept of being a caretaker and steward, and who feel it is an honor. I also prefer to be around people who are willing to be present and listen, otherwise communication is debilitated or impossible.

I am stating the ideal here, and in everyday life little things come up. But if one has the underlying principles in place of stewardship and the desire to communicate well, the conflicts will be minimized.