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+--- Thread: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM (/showthread.php?tid=8458)
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RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-18-2013
Oh also, I am curious, what exactly signifies when an entity apparently gains free will? As far as I understand, second density isn't just one static plane but, like all densities, consist of sub-planes. Is an entity at the beginning of a second density cycle the same as one at the end of such a cycle?
What confuses me is that as I understand it the Logoi have free will, but can choose not to have it. It appears to me that Logoi produce or divide in to sub-Logoi but the Logos itself has free will regardless, even if it chooses to lack it, that is a free will choice. My point here being, how can the Logos have free will, but you say free will emerges as a result of progress through the densities?
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - zenmaster - 12-18-2013
Free will is a principle that exists for all densities. So no, free will does not emerge due to progress.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Cynthia - 12-18-2013
(12-18-2013, 04:40 PM)Adonai One Wrote: This is my fiancee's perspective, a very right-handed one. I take the left-hand distortion in this regard. I only disagree on the point of this being of polarity: I am not convinced animal's having any significant form of freewill or individuality. They are beings without polarity. They readily accept all that is given to them and thus cannot be infringed upon.I must be misunderstanding this post because this description of animal behavior, especially cats and dogs, bears no resemblance to that of the well over 100 pets I've had in this lifetime.
Could you rephrase your basis for believing you are not infringing on the animal's free will?
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
(12-18-2013, 06:30 PM)Tanner Wrote: What is material exactly?
Everything in this universe. The unified conciousness that created it all could be considered the essence, the "spirit" we strive for.
It is my distortion/belief, that programmed instinct and impulse are not choices but rather just evolved reaction to stimuli.
I shall also cite the following doctrine:
Quote:47.14 Questioner: Well then, does orange-ray activation after death occur very frequently with this planet?
Ra: I am Ra. Quite infrequently, due to the fact that this particular manifestation is without will. Occasionally an other-self will so demand the form of the one passing through the physical death that some semblance of the being will remain. This is orange ray. This is rare, for normally if one entity desires another enough to call it, the entity will have the corresponding desire to be called. Thus the manifestation would be the shell of yellow ray.
Quote:41.14 Questioner: Is this energy center, then, on a very small scale related to the orange energy center in man?
Ra: I am Ra. The true color is precisely the same. However, the consciousness of the second-density beginning is primitive and the use of orange ray limited to the expression of self which may be seen to be movement and survival...
(12-18-2013, 06:41 PM)Tanner Wrote: Oh also, I am curious, what exactly signifies when an entity apparently gains free will? As far as I understand, second density isn't just one static plane but, like all densities, consist of sub-planes. Is an entity at the beginning of a second density cycle the same as one at the end of such a cycle?
What confuses me is that as I understand it the Logoi have free will, but can choose not to have it. It appears to me that Logoi produce or divide in to sub-Logoi but the Logos itself has free will regardless, even if it chooses to lack it, that is a free will choice. My point here being, how can the Logos have free will, but you say free will emerges as a result of progress through the densities?
It is my distortion/belief, that the "will" of all early life is simply a state of acceptance of all catalyst that shapes it. Since it accepts all, infringement is not likely except in late second-density where a will to live is found. This is where infringement first becomes possible but highly hard to manifest except through the greatest abuse and murder.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-19-2013
You haven't really answered my question. You have described a mechanism but not really explained what material actually is. The word material is completely undefined here except as another word for "the all" it seems. Perhaps I am not quite grasping your implications. It just seems like the word material is just convenient because of its relation to the physical sciences.
Also, in the first quote there, it seems Ra is saying that the orange ray activation after death occurs without the will of the entity, but that doesn't mean the same is true for in life.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
Is this what you are looking for? It's all photons.
Quote:41.9 Questioner: Then what is the simplest being that is manifested? I am supposing it might be a single cell or something like that. And how does it function with respect to energy centers?
Ra: I am Ra. The simplest manifest being is light or what you have called the photon. In relationship to energy centers it may be seen to be the center or foundation of all articulated energy fields.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-19-2013
So material is that which is manifest?
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 01:40 AM)Tanner Wrote: You haven't really answered my question. You have described a mechanism but not really explained what material actually is. The word material is completely undefined here except as another word for "the all" it seems. Perhaps I am not quite grasping your implications. It just seems like the word material is just convenient because of its relation to the physical sciences.
Also, in the first quote there, it seems Ra is saying that the orange ray activation after death occurs without the will of the entity, but that doesn't mean the same is true for in life.
Does an early second-density/orange-ray entity such as a plant truly have a will?
(12-19-2013, 01:43 AM)Tanner Wrote: So material is that which is manifest?
Indeed.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-19-2013
So you then acknowledge that there is the immaterial unmanifest as well?
Also, yes, why not? That the will is used within the limited spectrum of the first few rays make the will no less will. Plants react to pain, to music, they have even discovered that plants can be creative and seem to enjoy doing so. I certainly believe all creatures have free will. It appears that they do not because of the area of the spectrum within which they work. I feel that animals are purely emotionally driven by not just survival, but comfort and contentment. Plants and animals recognize different treatment.
If you have checked out any of Dr. Emoto's work it appears that even water is responsive to a mood or treatment. My point is, it is just a matter of complexity. All will is the same, but with varying degrees of freedom built in to each level of its use.
What I am confused about is the way you talk about "programs" as though the programs are not also the programmer. It is the free will of the logos that permeates its creation.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
The immaterial to me is simply a unified conciousness that embodies what it manifests. It is what it manifests, nothing more. It is not separate.
I believe plants and animals at their earliest stages just react. I do not see how they are aware of their reactions or how they are capable of formulating them beyond the forces of natural selection and imprinting that shapes them. This to me is not a will but acting as a dynamic canvas that is being shaped gradually towards conciousness.
In short, response to me is a form of movement but not a will, with the will being what shapes it.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-19-2013
What is the difference between that and ourselves? So you do not believe animals and plants are capable of having a personal experience?
I just don't really see how reaction is different for entities which are using second density vehicles for experience through activation and those choosing third density. While the spectrum of awareness is wider, the basic feedback system between fields within the system of interacting entities is still fundamentally the same.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
What defines the third-density being is its ability to form its reactions by the acceptance and rejection of catalyst. The early-to-mid second-density being has no such choice. It simply reacts according to low-level material, genetic, imprinted biases. The experience of the early-to-mid second-density being is not one of an individual but one of the macrocosm. Individuality only begins when one is aware of itself.
Personal experience begins when the yellow-ray is activated.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Unbound - 12-19-2013
I thought third density was defined by the capacity to make the choice of the intended polarity one wishes to invest in to graduate to fourth. Perhaps I misunderstand you aha I believe there is personal experience before yellow ray because the macrocosm is still self recognizing itself as one. All experience is the personal experience of the unified consciousness, no?
Also, my point is that personal experience can exist with lack of free will and free will.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - reeay - 12-19-2013
Adonai, have you tried this spell already?
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 02:32 AM)rie Wrote: Adonai, have you tried this spell already?
After much contacting of my higher self and attempts at connecting with my cat's conciousness, I am doing it consistently. All signs point to this being a responsible act as long as it is not done after full activation of the yellow-ray. My cat seems to be coming to me more, I've noticed.
In my intuitive capacity, I believe it may take upwards of 5 years for it to fully activate a soul within an animal.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Parsons - 12-19-2013
I would consider any animal which consciousness is advanced enough to understand training from a 3rd density being to be high enough to be 'late second density' (or put more simply, a pet). IMO any being at that level would be capable of making the leap to 3rd density the next incarnation and also be able to be infringed upon due to them exhibiting many 3rd density traits. Just as a 3rd density being with a great awareness can work on lessons of 4th density or higher, I believe a 2nd density has the ability to work on some rudimentary 3rd density lessons.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - ChickenInSpace - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 05:39 AM)Parsons Wrote: I would consider any animal which consciousness is advanced enough to understand training from a 3rd density being to be high enough to be 'late second density' (or put more simply, a pet). IMO any being at that level would be capable of making the leap to 3rd density the next incarnation and also be able to be infringed upon due to them exhibiting many 3rd density traits. Just as a 3rd density being with a great awareness can work on lessons of 4th density or higher, I believe a 2nd density has the ability to work on some rudimentary 3rd density lessons.
This reflects my own views very well which is why I would rather not impose the limitational framework discussed in the OP.
They are already chosing a path of progression for their soulspark to individualize more and enable 3d incarnations. There is differences between helping a lift and forcing a lift in regard to this. Too much assuming will become a forcing and in the state many animals are today they are helpless before our power when we focus the will. They simply chose to obey because to them it feels like there's no alternative. Some animals are individualized enough to respond in a counter-reaction as time goes along but many simply keep obeying. This could of course, in itself, be a chosen path of progression in preparation of 3d.
My point is that it's very hard to find out a 'best course of action' but ultimately anything you do will be favorable. Just interacting with a being of higher conciousness will raise your own. This goes for exactly all levels, as far as understood today.
Having an open relationship with animals and as little power structure as possible is rewarding but hard. I hope we will, in the future, be better at this in general.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
Most pets do not have yellow-ray activation. Mine has none. The leap to the yellow-ray is not gradual but comes in a single moment of self-awareness. I will not touch a pet beyond this threshold. I will still hold I am not limiting any self-aware, freewilled being.
Thank you all for caring for animal life.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Jade - 12-19-2013
Interaction with a mirror is an interesting tool to gauge a pet's self-consciousness.
In addition, I think most pets probably *are* yellow-ray activated, or at least extremely close, which is why they incarnated into a pet and not a coyote or a squirrel. The amount of "extra" dogs/cats that get killed every single day in shelters just shows the amount of late 2D entities begging for an opportunity for human investment. I think when you rely on a 3D being for survival, you can't help but be consciously learning from them to a point where self-awareness becomes undeniable.
I also do think that some animals might return to 2D bodies/incarnations to help lighten the load, so to speak, just as we return to 3D as wanderers to do the same. I mean, if I can bring just a small fraction of the planetary joy that Grumpy Cat and Shibe doge have given to us all, then I think everything is going to be okay.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Cynthia - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 02:41 AM)Adonai One Wrote:Ok, I'll say it. No, all signs do not point to this being a responsible act. It is abhorrent. As someone said earlier, animals can not stand up to this sort of power being imposed on them by a human. The sort of act this thread is about I view as vile.(12-19-2013, 02:32 AM)rie Wrote: Adonai, have you tried this spell already?
After much contacting of my higher self and attempts at connecting with my cat's conciousness, I am doing it consistently. All signs point to this being a responsible act as long as it is not done after full activation of the yellow-ray. My cat seems to be coming to me more, I've noticed.
In my intuitive capacity, I believe it may take upwards of 5 years for it to fully activate a soul within an animal.
And to what purpose? That's another thing I haven't seen answered is exactly why are you doing this? The reason stated in the OP is not congruent with LOO and all the reasons/explanation in additional responses do not appear to be StO so that leaves only one option.
As an aside - my cat was sleeping at my side for the past half hour or so. As I started to type this message, she woke up, sat up (which got my attention), looked me in the eyes for about 15 seconds, then lay down again and back to sleep.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
All I will cite is that my spell does not work if it infringes on any freewill the animal may possess.
I believe enabling souls to exist is a service. I am willing to consider otherwise.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Cynthia - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 12:58 PM)Adonai One Wrote: All I will cite is that my spell does not work if it infringes on any freewill the animal may possess.Whether the spell works or doesn't isn't the issue. The catalyst/polarity is in your motive, your reason, for doing this.
I believe enabling souls to exist is a service. I am willing to consider otherwise.
Count the number of "I" in the spell for a clue.
Even if enabling a soul to exist is a service (I disagree with that premise, but that's beside the point), whose service is it in? And why is it sufficient to override that animal's life journey? Think of it like putting an average 4 yr old into highschool - without all the growth in between. Does more harm than good.
Motive becomes especially problematic if you know the spell isn't going to work.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Parsons - 12-19-2013
I would also like to note that we have 2 other pets, a cat and a small dog. I do not see the faintest spark of 3D consciousness in their eyes or demeanor. They do not hold eye contact with me and don't seen to recognize me as an other self. So, while I give attention to them, I feel Screwdriver has much more potential to make the leap to 3D soon, so I only go out of my way to treat her more like a 3D individual.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-19-2013
(12-19-2013, 02:31 PM)Cynthia Wrote:It is my distortion/belief the journey is just random catalyst that only function as an eventual spark of self-awareness. This journey has beauty... as my fiancee continues to espouse. I will ponder this.(12-19-2013, 12:58 PM)Adonai One Wrote: All I will cite is that my spell does not work if it infringes on any freewill the animal may possess.Whether the spell works or doesn't isn't the issue. The catalyst/polarity is in your motive, your reason, for doing this.
I believe enabling souls to exist is a service. I am willing to consider otherwise.
Count the number of "I" in the spell for a clue.
Even if enabling a soul to exist is a service (I disagree with that premise, but that's beside the point), whose service is it in? And why is it sufficient to override that animal's life journey? Think of it like putting an average 4 yr old into highschool - without all the growth in between. Does more harm than good.
Motive becomes especially problematic if you know the spell isn't going to work.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - reeay - 12-19-2013
Might be helpful to explain how your magic works and explain how you came up with it in OP… and go further to explaining limitations (that's usually expected but seems new age communities don't really delve so much in this). That's more helpful than reading the magic spell itself. Just a suggestion.
As it is now it seems this is for experiment or testing out one's skills or something… unless this is all about playing??
Added: tie in w/ Ra would be nice too.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - AnthroHeart - 12-19-2013
That quote on us being here to love the illusion really hits home every time. I am glad I can be of service through love.
(12-18-2013, 06:37 PM)Horuseus Wrote:Quo, July 31, 2007 Wrote:That which you know of the higher planes, that which you remember in a dim or not so dim way, bring into your heart and let it bless the environment that you see before you, just as it is. You are not here to clean it up. You are not here to make it right. You are not here to fix it. For all of the outer world is an illusion. You are here to love it. Take the world in your arms and embrace it. This is how you came to serve. This is your glory and your crown. Wear it well and rejoice in being here.
http://www.bring4th.org/forums/showthread.php?tid=6654
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - Adonai One - 12-20-2013
(12-19-2013, 04:54 PM)rie Wrote: Might be helpful to explain how your magic works and explain how you came up with it in OP… and go further to explaining limitations (that's usually expected but seems new age communities don't really delve so much in this). That's more helpful than reading the magic spell itself. Just a suggestion.The spell is simply a raising of the polarity and balancing of my interpretations of the Matrix and Potentiators of the Mind/Body/Spirit. In other words, I want the thought-form to raise universal conciousness and the mind's potential inspiration to where free will can be enabled. Additionally, I ensure the spirit has the capacity to begin to have faith/hope and direction in seeking.
As it is now it seems this is for experiment or testing out one's skills or something… unless this is all about playing??
Added: tie in w/ Ra would be nice too.
I can only go so far without delving further into my interpetation of the archetypal mind. I apologize for this heavy abstraction.
This is about testing ability and watching my animal grow.
The limitations only go so far as enabling conciousness before a choice can be made. Once the animal is truly capable of choice, the spell doesn't apply anymore.
RE: A spell that gives freewill to animals or other 2nd-density beings: TRUCENDUM - AuYemRa - 12-23-2013
the 2nd Distortion of One, is the Law of Free will / Confusion. . did not The Humble Messengers of the Law of One breach this law? i think there are two definite ways to take this , as complete divine perfection happening as it happens, or and infringement. either or conflict is provided and creates. i think the intent in this is wonderful. and if so happens to be brought up into someones life, i would follow through with the higher selfs hints and such
