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RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-23-2011
(04-23-2011, 01:01 PM)Spectrum Wrote: Jesus knew what was coming, he could see the future, he could see Judas' violet ray, and he could see Judas' thoughts.
Spectrum, congratulations on an excellent post.
I would like to however query as to how you were able to conclude that Jesus was able to behold Judas' violet ray configuration? I am just curious.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Thank you, Confused
Of all the works of mystics I've read, when they accessed intelligent infinity, although it isn't called that in other literature, I'm just using Ra terminology, they could always see a person from a 4th density metaphysical perspective, which I believe is all part and parcel of the absence of the veil. They could read their thoughts, they could see their auras, they could foretell the future and they understood the cosmos.
Maybe I'm mistaken on the violet ray thing, and seeing violet ray is maybe only an ability of higher than fourth density.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 04:01 AM)Spectrum Wrote: ...they could foretell the future...
Many a time, it comes down to this, doesn't it?
The conflict between freewill and predeterminism.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Yes, sources foretelling the future has always been a sticky subject for me to get my head around. I could never understand how knowing the future, and sharing it, does not abrogate people's free will.
I like the way Ra explains it, probability/possibility vortexes that collapses constantly, and new ones being created, with only certain things being 100% set, like harvest for example. We are all creators, and our actions affects all those possibility/probability fortexes becoming a reality or not.
But yes, I get what you're saying. There is an apparent paradox, in a sense.
I guess at the time Jesus foretold these things, it was past the stage of probability/possibility, I think it was playing out.
The trauma and inner conflict that Judas must have experienced when Jesus told him that he (Judas) would renounce him (Jesus) three times before sunrise, in front of the other disciples, must have been quite intense. Not to mention the abandonment from all those he loved, and feeling like a traitor and a murderer. Can you just imagine that night? High tension for all involved, and try and put yourself in Judas' shoes?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 04:22 AM)Spectrum Wrote: Yes, sources foretelling the future has always been a sticky subject for me to get me head around.
And then you have this about the higher self being the future self of an entity.
If it is the future self, then how did it become that? That is, how did it become future when apparently entities are still having experiences in the present continuum.
Very confusing. I think the mystery of time is one of the most advanced lessons in creation, which probably very high density entities learn.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Confused Wrote:And then you have this about the higher self being the future self of an entity.
If it is the future self, then how did it become that? That is, how did it become future when apparently entities are still having experiences in the present continuum.
Very confusing. I think the mystery of time is one of the most advanced lessons in creation, which probably very high density entities learn.
Yeah I think so too. To imagine that the whole grand design is set up this way as a school, for learning.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 04:41 AM)Spectrum Wrote: ...the whole grand design is set up...
That is again one of those other great questions.
It was set up, but who actually set it up. Who is the ultimate game-changer, if there seem to be infinite layers?
The fundamental questions are the most difficult, I guess.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Confused Wrote:The fundamental questions are the most difficult, I guess.
You're right. I always found it interesting in Ra when they said this or that is still something they don't understand, and then I think to myself that they are three evolutionary levels above us. Infinity is another thing that is really hard to get one's head around, that the universe has no end. How does one get one's head around that? How does one get one's head around the continuation of it all, that after 7th density, that 8th is also first again, on a level we can't even conceive of, and that that process also continues into infinity, and has no end. Or that every octave, has infinite sub-levels.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 05:00 AM)Spectrum Wrote: How does one get one's head around that? How does one get one's head around the continuation of it all, that after 7th density, that 8th is also first again, on a level we can't even conceive of, and that that process also continues into infinity, and has no end. Or that every octave, has infinite sub-levels.
I think that is what makes us the creator, the creator of the experiential nexus of our own lived universe.
May be the cells in our body, which are independently intelligent in their own right, look up to our entire being from inside and marvel at the mystery of what may seem infinity to them. Are we doing that as well? Are we the intelligent cells inside the supreme body of the One Infinite Creator? A being that is so vast and infinite, that all we can do is marvel, while going about our duties of acting as proper cells upholding the body.
May be it sounds stupid :-/
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Confused Wrote:May be it sounds stupid :-/
No, it sounds pretty good to me.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 05:35 AM)Spectrum Wrote: No, it sounds pretty good to me.
Continuing in the same vein, Spectrum, the following LOO exchange is relevant, I think -
Quote:81.33 Questioner: Actually, I don’t have much more on this except to make the assumption that there must have been some type of communication throughout the octave so that, when the first experiment became effective, knowledge of this spread rapidly through the octave and was picked up by other budding galactic spirals, you might say. Is this correct?
Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. To be aware of the nature of this communication is to be aware of the nature of the Logos. Much of what you call creation has never separated from the One Logos of this octave and resides within the One Infinite Creator. Communication in such an environment is the communication of cells of the body. That which is learned by one is known to all. The sub-Logoi, then, have been in the position of refining the discoveries of what might be called the earlier sub-Logoi. May we ask if we may answer any brief queries at this working?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Wow yes, that's an amazing bit from Ra. I sometimes am inclined to think that the creator stays the same, and just enjoys the show, which is of course wrong. All of us evolving, and the sub-logoi, and everything else 'is' the creator, continually evolving.
The way I see it, is since we all naturally strive to get closer to the creator, we go up through the octaves, and then to a new level, 8th/1st continuously, and somewhere really far down the line, our social memory complexes also become logoi, and create galaxies, and we experiment, and add our own laws to those galaxies, and we create all the physical vehicles in our galaxies, and so the universe just keeps expanding and expanding, and creation continues into infinity, and the variety is also infinite.
So right now we are little creators, but the responsibility keeps mounting as we evolve, and ooooone day we'll be big creators of big projects, always and forever creating, learning, experimenting, experiencing etc.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 07:41 AM)Spectrum Wrote: I sometimes am inclined to think that the creator stays the same, and just enjoys the show, ...
Let us not discount that yet. It could still be true. When you add lessons from infinity into infinity, it may appear as what is is only unchanged infinity.
(04-24-2011, 07:41 AM)Spectrum Wrote: ..., and somewhere really far down the line, our social memory complexes also become logoi, and create galaxies, and we experiment, and add our own laws to those galaxies, and we create all the physical vehicles in our galaxies, and so the universe just keeps expanding and expanding, and creation continues into infinity, and the variety is also infinite.
I agree to your entire point. If I may add, I think it is expansion in the sense of accretion to the existing state of consciousness/awareness after a period of thorough coalescence. It is expansion in a sense, but may be not in the conventional sense of the word. From 29.18 -
Quote:This point only becomes important when you consider that when all of creation in its infinity has reached a spiritual gravitational mass of sufficient nature, the entire creation infinitely coalesces; the light seeking and finding its source and thusly ending the creation and beginning a new creation much as you consider the black hole, as you call it, with its conditions of infinitely great mass at the zero point from which no light may be seen as it has been absorbed.
I do not understand what it means for the entire creation to infinitely coalesce. May be all that is enters into the womb of the zero point, the One Infinite Creator. Now then, the question may be asked as to where does this zero point lie. If space is the tangible expression of the ONE, then what is the intangible expression? May be it is like the difference between space/time and time/space.
(04-24-2011, 07:41 AM)Spectrum Wrote: So right now we are little creators, but the responsibility keeps mounting as we evolve, and ooooone day we'll be big creators of big projects, always and forever creating, learning, experimenting, experiencing etc.
I very much think so too. But at some point, we enter the allness of the creator. I do not understand what that means. But it seems like we will be assimilated into the neural networks of infinite creation, in that we cease to exist as a separate conscious entity. But our consciousness informs further creative impulse, in terms of energizing the potentianted kinetic of the flow of awareness into its various expressions.
All just my opinion. Some of it is being said just to appear informed. To be taken with the thought - 'who does this guy think he is'?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Confused, just before I respond to your latest post, with regard to the violet ray, I just remembered something from Ra which might indicate that 4D can't yet see violet ray:
Book I, Session 26, February 17, 1981 Wrote:Similarly, a mistaken Orion contact with highly polarized positive entities
can wreak havoc with Orion troops unless these crusaders are able to depolarize
the entity mistakenly contacted. This occurrence is almost unheardof.
Therefore, the Orion group prefers to make physical contact only with
the weaker-minded entity.
Am I right in thinking that such a mistake won't be possible if they could see the violet ray?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - zenmaster - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 09:18 AM)Spectrum Wrote: Confused, just before I respond to your latest post, with regard to the violet ray, I just remembered something from Ra which might indicate that 4D can't yet see violet ray:That's my understanding. But also note here they are referring to physical contact, and not mental (psychic) or 'astral' contact, which is more common.
Book I, Session 26, February 17, 1981 Wrote:Similarly, a mistaken Orion contact with highly polarized positive entities
can wreak havoc with Orion troops unless these crusaders are able to depolarize
the entity mistakenly contacted. This occurrence is almost unheardof.
Therefore, the Orion group prefers to make physical contact only with
the weaker-minded entity.
Am I right in thinking that such a mistake won't be possible if they could see the violet ray?
Apparently, there are also 'inner-plane' entities that can read violet ray.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 09:18 AM)Spectrum Wrote: ...with regard to the violet ray, I just remembered something from Ra which might indicate that 4D can't yet see violet ray...
I just ran the query "violet ray" in lawofone.info, in order to find some backing from the material. I found this -
Quote:29.28 Questioner: I see. Then if you are able to read the violet ray of an entity, to see that ray, is it possible to immediately determine whether the entity could use crystals to tap intelligent energy?
Ra: I am Ra. It is possible for one of fifth density or above to do this.
So, in essence, according to the words of Ra, it is not possible for any entity lower than 5D to read the violet ray configuration of another entity. Your supposition is very much correct, I guess.
(04-24-2011, 09:29 AM)zenmaster Wrote: Apparently, there are also 'inner-plane' entities that can read violet ray.
Hi, Z. I do not understand that statement. Can you expand more in words as to what you were referring to there, please?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - zenmaster - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 09:37 AM)Confused Wrote: Hi, Z. I do not understand that statement. Can you expand more in words as to what you were referring to there, please?I do not know too much about the nature of these entities, but the 'faeries' or 'little people' seem to be attracted to or prefer highly polarized individuals to contact. My guess is that this assessment ability is due to the time/space viewpoint they have.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 09:46 AM)zenmaster Wrote: I do not know too much about the nature of these entities, but the 'faeries' or 'little people' seem to be attracted to or prefer highly polarized individuals to contact.
I am now intrigued by this. In a generic sense, how do they contact and for what purpose normally? I have never come across this line of thought earlier, and thus would be grateful to receive some information.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - zenmaster - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 09:58 AM)Confused Wrote: I am now intrigued by this. In a generic sense, how do they contact and for what purpose normally? I have never come across this line of thought earlier, and thus would be grateful to receive some information.I think they tend to contact - or communicate - in something like a 'lucid dream'. The sleeping person gets a very clear telepathic contact - like a setting or dark background with clear images. The curious inner-plane entity, with the affinity to the person, can scan the person's memories for difficulties and address them, perhaps in an attempt to heal or to guide, or for the negatives - to influence. This would seem to be a much more direct and naive approach than the techniques used by the Confederation when working in dreams.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
I always wanted to ask this to some one. What exactly does the word complex 'inner plane' mean in esoteric literature, like the Ra material?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - zenmaster - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:32 AM)Confused Wrote: I always wanted to ask this to some one. What exactly does the word complex 'inner plane' mean in esoteric literature, like the Ra material?I think it means bodiless or non-genetic based consciousness such as we have with the time/space condition.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
Confused Wrote:Quote:29.28 Questioner: I see. Then if you are able to read the violet ray of an entity, to see that ray, is it possible to immediately determine whether the entity could use crystals to tap intelligent energy?
Ra: I am Ra. It is possible for one of fifth density or above to do this.
Ah! Great find!
Confused Wrote:When you add lessons from infinity into infinity, it may appear as what is is only unchanged infinity.
Mmm, lots to contemplate. So the creator may merely be experiencing itself, in all it’s various manifestations…
Confused Wrote:I agree to your entire point. If I may add, I think it is expansion in the sense of accretion to the existing state of consciousness/awareness after a period of thorough coalescence. It is expansion in a sense, but may be not in the conventional sense of the word. From 29.18 –
Quote:This point only becomes important when you consider that when all of creation in its infinity has reached a spiritual gravitational mass of sufficient nature, the entire creation infinitely coalesces; the light seeking and finding its source and thusly ending the creation and beginning a new creation much as you consider the black hole, as you call it, with its conditions of infinitely great mass at the zero point from which no light may be seen as it has been absorbed.
I see what you are saying – spiritual gravitational mass, although I think it might be a case of physical expansion and conscious/spiritual expansion, since the one is a manifestation of the other, in the illusion. I think at our current evolutionary level, these concepts are a little above us.
Confused Wrote:I very much think so too. But at some point, we enter the allness of the creator. I do not understand what that means. But it seems like we will be assimilated into the neural networks of infinite creation, in that we cease to exist as a separate conscious entity. But our consciousness informs further creative impulse, in terms of energizing the potentianted kinetic of the flow of awareness into its various expressions.
All just my opinion. Some of it is being said just to appear informed. To be taken with the thought - 'who does this guy think he is'?
He-he, you ‘do’ have a way with words, I’ll tell you that much. I think that’s pretty much as close as we can come with our current understanding, and the limitation of our language.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:37 AM)zenmaster Wrote: I think it means bodiless or non-genetic based consciousness such as we have with the time/space condition.
Interesting, very interesting. Does that it mean we have layers of consciousnesses within; apart from the predominant one that we feel/recognize and move around with, going about our life?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Spectrum - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:37 AM)zenmaster Wrote:(04-24-2011, 10:32 AM)Confused Wrote: I always wanted to ask this to some one. What exactly does the word complex 'inner plane' mean in esoteric literature, like the Ra material?I think it means bodiless or non-genetic based consciousness such as we have with the time/space condition.
Isn't the inner planes where we go between incarnations? I also think it's an ethereal realm.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:41 AM)Spectrum Wrote: He-he, you ‘do’ have a way with words, I’ll tell you that much.
so kind and sweet of you. Thank you.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - zenmaster - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:43 AM)Confused Wrote:As we learn, we tend to be drawn to systems that support our focus of consciousness - for example, the subdensities of 3rd density that we progress and transcend as we polarize. But more generically, many 'layers' exist that support the natures of different types of consciousness. Conscious (and unconscious) entities exist within those systems, and systems can interpenetrate each other - such as astral and physical.(04-24-2011, 10:37 AM)zenmaster Wrote: I think it means bodiless or non-genetic based consciousness such as we have with the time/space condition.
Interesting, very interesting. Does that it mean we have layers of consciousnesses within; apart from the predominant one that we feel/recognize and move around with, going about our life?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 11:00 AM)zenmaster Wrote: ...such as astral...
So it is at the astral level that inner-plane entities cooperate/infringe with respect to our dreams, is it?
Is that how astral travel is accomplished?
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - 3DMonkey - 04-24-2011
(04-24-2011, 10:43 AM)Confused Wrote:(04-24-2011, 10:37 AM)zenmaster Wrote: I think it means bodiless or non-genetic based consciousness such as we have with the time/space condition.
Interesting, very interesting. Does that it mean we have layers of consciousnesses within; apart from the predominant one that we feel/recognize and move around with, going about our life?
Hello Confused. Allow me to jump in here...
This expression of consciousness is a main factor in all the "sematics" we experience in this forum, and in general life. Consciousness is more than what we think of as our self-conscious perception. Consciousness is of itself, a thing. In all discussion and in all thought, we use a conscious awareness that is the biases we possess. The conscious is much more than awareness. The conscious is the birth place of all thought, and subsequent manifestation. It is a scientific starting point for anything that exists. We tend to get jumbled in our minds that conscious is awareness. It is, but not the general 3D idea of awareness.
All is born of consciousness, so I wouldn't say "layers". I'd just say in everything; here, there, everywhere. But, I think what you are recognizing is that our little awareness of conscious is quite minimal.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - Confused - 04-24-2011
Hi, 3, thanks for the post. But I think I did not understand the last sentence well. May be it simple logic, but I was not able to follow it. Quite a nice post in terms of depth, I must say.
RE: LoO Jesus & non-canonical gospels - kycahi - 04-24-2011
Thanks for the conversation. I enjoy it a lot. One teeny correction, though: back in post 34, Spectrum mentions Judas' denying JC three times. I thought that was another of the group, perhaps Peter. I think he denied Jesus three times out of simple fear--"Moi? I know nothing! I can't help you there."
About JC's foretelling the future, my thinking is that, just as he had a glimpse (or better) of the future, he also had a sensing of what he could say about it without disturbing the distortions very much. The scripture, written much later, gives him the image of adeptness that he also, in my view, must have accepted.
Maybe as he became determined to play out his execution, he gained this new perceptive ability, although just as likely he had it all along.
I vaguely remember reading an explanation of Judas' kiss. It said, I think, that under Jewish law a Jew who wishes to accuse a lawbreaker must clearly identify the person rather than just hint that somebody is up to something; thus the kiss. Also, law requires the person to accept a reward of those pieces of silver, no choice. Judas tossed them away because he didn't want or need the money.
I agree that Judas was swept up by an STS influence, but as we have no record of his wanting to be an STS master himself, he probably bumbled with his effort of forcing JC to seize power, not with any sinister intent. Unless, of course, he hoped that afterward JC would hand him over some of that power. That may have crossed his mind, I guess.