(03-18-2021, 02:12 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote:  
Surely, it is well to protect the young from predation and misfortune, but the time arises when each must venture out into the cold unknown to find one's "pearls of great price," those things for which one would give all, and thus enter into the dark tunnel of transformation.

Perhaps this leads to an extremely negative environment?  Perhaps it leads to something else?  The pathways to the heart of self are multifarious, to be sure.

Yes, indeed. we need comfort along the way, and sharing a good cry or a good song (or a good sermon) may suffice for a little while.  But then the personal journey recommences.

Can outer circumstances distort the mature being?  Certainly so.  Am I wrong, or do Confederation sources not teach that seeking the deeper self in such a context is the basic reason for taking incarnation in 3D?  Do they not aver that the riches thusly found far outweigh the burdens of the seeking?  Do they not say that coming to a clear understanding of what one truly seeks helps to refine the balance of one's soul stream?  Do their sermons not typically end with an exhortation to find pure Divinity within self (not in a group)? 

Perhaps I've misunderstood this?

  

(03-18-2021, 02:29 PM)Ymarsakar Wrote: So long as you remain in this incarnation, no matter how many mistakes you make, you can choose again.

Besides, the universe would have used someone else even had you not volunteered. In that sense, there are no mistakes. In the long term, it all fita together like a puzzle from the future.

Cats can drop things from high up when figuring out puzzles.

(03-19-2021, 07:26 PM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote:

(03-19-2021, 10:47 AM)Ming the Merciful Wrote:

(03-18-2021, 02:29 PM)Ymarsakar Wrote: So long as you remain in this incarnation, no matter how many mistakes you make, you can choose again.

Besides, the universe would have used someone else even had you not volunteered. In that sense, there are no mistakes. In the long term, it all fita together like a puzzle from the future.

Cats can drop things from high up when figuring out puzzles.

Another area that has been overlooked, are the teachings of Madam Blavatsky and Alice Bailey. The "Missing Link". Compared to the current strata of thinking, both parties seem to be Primordial and not current, (yet), the information they acquired at the time was phenomenal. Their teachings and philosophy is. (indirectly), related to current day thinking. In the writings of Madam Blavatsky, there are indirect connotations to Ra and Higher Beings, (implying otherworldly). Has anyone read Isis Unveiled" or the "Secret Doctrine". Highly recommended reading. There are more things in Heaven and Earth than you realize. Once again, everything is connected, (is it not). Don't look at the obvious, but the sublime. The God(s) work in mysterious ways?

Both excellent books

(03-19-2021, 09:13 PM)meadow-foreigner Wrote:

(03-19-2021, 07:37 PM)Ohr Ein Sof Wrote:

(03-18-2021, 02:12 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote:  
Surely, it is well to protect the young from predation and misfortune, but the time arises when each must venture out into the cold unknown to find one's "pearls of great price," those things for which one would give all, and thus enter into the dark tunnel of transformation.

Perhaps this leads to an extremely negative environment?  Perhaps it leads to something else?  The pathways to the heart of self are multifarious, to be sure.

Yes, indeed. we need comfort along the way, and sharing a good cry or a good song (or a good sermon) may suffice for a little while.  But then the personal journey recommences.

Can outer circumstances distort the mature being?  Certainly so.  Am I wrong, or do Confederation sources not teach that seeking the deeper self in such a context is the basic reason for taking incarnation in 3D?  Do they not aver that the riches thusly found far outweigh the burdens of the seeking?  Do they not say that coming to a clear understanding of what one truly seeks helps to refine the balance of one's soul stream?  Do their sermons not typically end with an exhortation to find pure Divinity within self (not in a group)? 

Perhaps I've misunderstood this?

  

Well, of course! Yes. If I may, it is well to be with likeminded individuals or individual for protection if one can swing it. It just depends where the seeking is leading I suppose. If one is becoming an adept then it would be safer if he were surrounded by others who can protect him with love or at the least by one more. Even an initiate or a disciple should consider study or spiritual practices involving another likeminded individual. If for no other reason than to increase the power. But, as always, proper discernment is key.
There are some things in which no one else can be a part of in our journeys.
Best to you Sacred!!!  

(03-20-2021, 01:03 PM)Patrick Wrote: I think that the ways of Love can be learned in many different fashions.  A Choir singing in love and about love being but one manner.

A soul alone in the desert with an open heart vibrating in love is also a song that the planet hears.

(03-19-2021, 10:28 PM)Ming the Merciful Wrote:

(03-19-2021, 09:13 PM)meadow-foreigner Wrote:

Pas op voor de slang in het gras (het kan een steek in de staart hebben).

(03-20-2021, 03:17 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote: I'm probably making too much out of this, but the point I was labouring to make is about the surrendering of self to the endeavour.  For example, you can't just "have children," you have to dedicate a good chunk of self, not to yourself, but to the "project."  For a soul alone in the desert, this may be more apparent.  The verbiage in that quote--the putative subject of this thread--doesn't carry that depth for me.  That's my feeling about it.   That's all.

(03-20-2021, 07:00 PM)Patrick Wrote:

(03-20-2021, 03:17 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote: I'm probably making too much out of this, but the point I was labouring to make is about the surrendering of self to the endeavour.  For example, you can't just "have children," you have to dedicate a good chunk of self, not to yourself, but to the "project."  For a soul alone in the desert, this may be more apparent.  The verbiage in that quote--the putative subject of this thread--doesn't carry that depth for me.  That's my feeling about it.   That's all.

I guess that for wanderers at least, coming down here is pretty much that, whatever one does.  The whole incarnation being such a dedicated endeavor.

(03-20-2021, 10:55 PM)Patrick Wrote: It may not be what I'm saying. I wouldn't know. Because I don't know what I'm saying anymore.

Maybe this thread is actually about the Law of Squares? Learning to sing about love together?

(03-20-2021, 06:35 PM)meadow-foreigner Wrote:

(03-19-2021, 10:28 PM)Ming the Merciful Wrote:

(03-19-2021, 09:13 PM)meadow-foreigner Wrote:

Pas op voor de slang in het gras (het kan een steek in de staart hebben).

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...when you show up for rehearsal or a performance, do you tell people, "I'm a wanderer, so I'm just going to radiate my high vibration self and not do the work of learning the music?"  I kinda doubt it...

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...Anyhow, this is sort of what I'm trying to get at.  That quote in the OP is about validation from others just for showing up...

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...That's fine, but if you really want to do the work of making music, you must "pay your dues," no? Ergo, a wanderer can just show up and hang out...

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...and maybe that was a carefully chosen pre-incarnative choice, for example, sometimes you just need an easy lifetime to balance out the rougher ones--you can just show up and vibrate casually, or maybe you wanna do serious work in consciousness?  Maybe you want to go so deeply inside the music that your sense of self becomes transparent?  Maybe not.

(03-22-2021, 11:29 AM)Patrick Wrote:

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...when you show up for rehearsal or a performance, do you tell people, "I'm a wanderer, so I'm just going to radiate my high vibration self and not do the work of learning the music?"  I kinda doubt it...

I don't tell people that no.

Although, that is closer to reality than you might think.  I'm not a musician or a singer per se.  There is a minimum of technique involved, I cannot read partitions but I do look at it for the words and the notes going up or down gives me an idea of if my pitch should be going up or down, etc...  But if I record myself alone, it's very much lacking.

In the choir, I just sing from my heart.  Together it's no longer lacking, it becomes beautiful.  After a public performance, I've had people from the audience tell me they could feel it coming from the heart.  There was even a new member that joined specifically because of this.

So I never felt the need to do the work of learning how to make proper music.  We learn to make music together.

(03-22-2021, 12:26 PM)Diana Wrote:

(03-22-2021, 11:29 AM)Patrick Wrote:

(03-21-2021, 12:43 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: ...when you show up for rehearsal or a performance, do you tell people, "I'm a wanderer, so I'm just going to radiate my high vibration self and not do the work of learning the music?"  I kinda doubt it...

I don't tell people that no.

Although, that is closer to reality than you might think.  I'm not a musician or a singer per se.  There is a minimum of technique involved, I cannot read partitions but I do look at it for the words and the notes going up or down gives me an idea of if my pitch should be going up or down, etc...  But if I record myself alone, it's very much lacking.

In the choir, I just sing from my heart.  Together it's no longer lacking, it becomes beautiful.  After a public performance, I've had people from the audience tell me they could feel it coming from the heart.  There was even a new member that joined specifically because of this.

So I never felt the need to do the work of learning how to make proper music.  We learn to make music together.

Honestly, that's just beautiful Patrick and I can feel the heart even behind your words here. I think this is a great example for this thread.

I can relate to what Sacred Fool says, too. As an artist (most of the time, illustrator), I have natural talent and the desire to create art, but I also have extensive training which polished my ability to express myself in the best possible way—in a way that would be received with more clarity and the maximum of impact by others. I have instilled in me the basic skills of perspective, light and shadow, form and structure, color theory—all of which is now beneath the surface of my conscious mind and does not have to be thought about. I learned a great deal as well when I first began as an advertising illustrator. My illustrations became very effective as I strove for excellence. And I feel that while I may not have a direct, face-to-face connection to the people who are viewing any art I do, that there is still a connection between us, perhaps because I put my heart into my work.

So I think there can be heart in an infinite number of expressions. I remember one night when I was at my sister's whose daughter at that time was about 14 or 15. She had two friends there. We decided to do karaoke. There were some songs on disc that the three girls loved, and one in particular that they repeatedly sang because they loved it so much (for whatever reason). After I got the basic tune, and of course the words were there on the screen, I just sang my heart out with those girls. All four of us were just singing as loud as we could and it was like the law of squares amplifying everything about the expression. I could literally feel my chest expanding with heart energy. It is a delicious memory and the connection I felt to those young girls while we were singing together was also part of that seemingly mundane but awesome experience.

(03-22-2021, 01:59 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote:   
P&D:  Those are both very sweet stories and I appreciate where you're coming from.  I certainly felt that way singing along in my high school choir.  It was such a pleasant shift to be participating in something beautiful that was bigger than self and, frankly, better organized than self.  It's a cool experience of subordinating (or lending) individual primacy to the conductor and to the group as an whole for a "greater purpose."

Rather than continuing to stumble over trying to make a general point, I'll just say personally that from there I took a very different path.  Singing along wasn't enough for me because, in my being, it just let off hints of the far more satisfying experience of perfecting the instruments of body and soul in order to much more deeply interweave self with the medium in a more self-directed way: as soloist and as composer.

So, it's kind of like a translation problem for me.  For me a phrase like "learning to sing together" doesn't mean "singing along," it's a far more complex vibratory experience which engages self on many subtle levels.  And there's an underlying current of yearning to "return to the waters of my birth," metaphysically speaking, that can carry me away when these kinds of issues come up.

I'm sorry I troubled you with my biases.  Be well and carry on!!!
  

(03-22-2021, 10:14 PM)Ymarsakar Wrote: "I'm sorry I troubled you with my biases."

I think trying to figure out why you feel the way you do, is useful and beneficial for the collective. Assuming things about other people, projecting, and focusing on other selves, can be the distraction that leads to discord and hurt feelings.

If a cat is minding its own business and looking at things from on high, that is ok. But if it tries to knock things over so it falls on the humans below, that's not ok.

(03-18-2021, 02:12 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: Surely, it is well to protect the young from predation and misfortune, but the time arises when each must venture out into the cold unknown to find one's "pearls of great price," those things for which one would give all, and thus enter into the dark tunnel of transformation.

(03-18-2021, 02:12 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: Can outer circumstances distort the mature being?  Certainly so.  Am I wrong, or do Confederation sources not teach that seeking the deeper self in such a context is the basic reason for taking incarnation in 3D?

(03-18-2021, 02:12 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: Do they not aver that the riches thusly found far outweigh the burdens of the seeking?  Do they not say that coming to a clear understanding of what one truly seeks helps to refine the balance of one's soul stream?  Do their sermons not typically end with an exhortation to find pure Divinity within self (not in a group)?

Quote:Ra: It is impossible to help another being directly. It is only possible to make catalyst available in whatever form, the most important being the radiation of realization of oneness with the Creator from the self, less important being information such as we share with you. - 17.2

Quote:Questioner: Could you expand on what you mean by that interaction of polarized entities in piercing the veil?

Ra: I am Ra. We shall state two items of note. The first is the extreme potential for polarization in the relationship of two polarized entities which have embarked upon the service-to-others path or, in some few cases, the service-to-self path. Secondly, we would note that effect which we have learned to call the doubling effect. Those of like mind which together seek shall far more surely find. - 83.17

(03-20-2021, 03:52 AM)Sacred Fool Wrote: Rereading my own text, I think I might have overstated my case.  I'm guessing now that my reaction to the Eisenstein quote in the OP was more that I see the sentiment expressed there emphasizing comfy social acceptance more than I feel it to be fundamentally seeking to know the Creatrix in all her unguarded nakedness.  Maybe it feels too facile?

(03-20-2021, 10:46 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote: I'm probably making too much out of this, but the point I was labouring to make is about the surrendering of self to the endeavour.  For example, you can't just "have children," you have to dedicate a good chunk of self, not to yourself, but to the "project."  For a soul alone in the desert, this may be more apparent.  The verbiage in that quote--the putative subject of this thread--doesn't carry that depth for me.  That's my feeling about it.   That's all.

Quote:Ra: Let us continue the metaphor of the schooling but consider the scholar as being an entity in your younger years of the schooling process. The entity is fed, clothed, and protected regardless of whether or not the schoolwork is accomplished. Therefore, the entity does not do the homework but rather enjoys playtime, mealtime, and vacation. It is not until there is a reason to wish to excel that most entities will attempt to excel. - 82.28

Ra: Those entities which do not do their homework, be they ever so amiable, shall not cross [the boundary of third density into fourth]. It was this situation which faced the Logoi prior to the veiling process being introduced into the experiential continuum of third density. - 82.29

Quote:Questioner: Then I am guessing that the crossed legs of the entity in Card Four have a meaning similar to the cross of the crux ansata. Is this correct?

Ra: I am Ra. This is correct. The cross formed by the living limbs of the image signifies that which is the nature of mind/body/spirit complexes in manifestation within your illusion. There is no experience which is not purchased by effort of some kind, no act of service to self or others which does not bear a price, to the entity manifesting, commensurate with its purity. All things in manifestation may be seen in one way or another to be offering themselves in order that transformations may take place upon the level appropriate to the action. - 94.26

(03-22-2021, 01:59 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote: P&D:  Those are both very sweet stories and I appreciate where you're coming from.  I certainly felt that way singing along in my high school choir.  It was such a pleasant shift to be participating in something beautiful that was bigger than self and, frankly, better organized than self.  It's a cool experience of subordinating (or lending) individual primacy to the conductor and to the group as an whole for a "greater purpose."

Quote:Ra: There are societies wherever there are entities conscious of the self and conscious of other-selves and possessed with intelligence adequate to process information indicating the benefits of communal blending of energies. – 83.10

(03-22-2021, 01:59 PM)Sacred Fool Wrote: Singing along wasn't enough for me because, in my being, it just let off hints of the far more satisfying experience of perfecting the instruments of body and soul in order to much more deeply interweave self with the medium in a more self-directed way: as soloist and as composer.